Bills Roster Discussion

[Straight Hucklebuck]

On 4/30/2023 at 2:28 PM, KDIGGZ said:

Kincaid has never played a down. He definitely doesn't solve the WR2 problem 

Once FA kicked off, the Bills had to restructure players to get under the cap.

 

If the Bills were going to get Hopkins they needed to get aggressive and make that the first thing they pursued.

 

And that comes at the expense of a good percentage other FAs.

 

Once the Bills started retaining their own talent, bringing back Poyer, that moment for Hopkins passed.

 

Podcasters and Bills fans kept bringing up pie in the sky scenarios about the Cardinals eating 80%’of the money and trading Ed Oliver and a 5th. In other words Bills fans wanted to give up their garbage and the Cardinals hand over Hopkins.

 

The Bills have no cap space. Beane said it again in his press conference. 
 

You saw how much it took to move up 2-spots for Kincaid.

 

To go from 27th to 19th and get ahead of all the WR group would have cost a 2nd and a 3rd most likely.

 

The Bills right or wrong love Gabe Davis, so with Diggs, Davis, Kincaid, Knox, it would have to be one heck of a WR to jump Knox, Kincaid and Davis to slot just behind Diggs. 

[BillsFanForever19]

8 hours ago, SCBills said:

In fairness, I posted that at noon on Saturday.. before we drafted Shorter. 
 

I still don’t know that I love our WR room.. but we have limited resources and chose to take give ourselves a potential monster TE tandem.  
 

Shorter does make me feel better about outside depth.  He’s all potential … the floor is really low, but at least we have another big body outside WR to develop long term behind Diggs and Davis as a potential option other than Harty, who is a very different skill set. 
 

Shakir and Sherfield both being inside/outside flex.   If I had to guess, Shakir will focus more on the slot now. 
 

WR room has potential and good depth, but until proven otherwise, is lacking at the WR2 spot for an elite pass heavy offense. 

 

Davis is technically the #2. But we didn't Draft Kincaid for him to put his hand on the ground. 

 

Kincaid was selected to be Josh's 2nd option, split out wide. And Harty will spell Davis at times in packages. 

 

Davis isn't Tee Higgins. But most teams don't have 2 Elite WR's on the field at the same time. Who did KC have last year? MVS? Kelce and Schuster (before him Hill) were there primary pass catchers. Kincaid was drafted to be that for us.

[KDIGGZ]

9 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Once FA kicked off, the Bills had to restructure players to get under the cap.

 

If the Bills were going to get Hopkins they needed to get aggressive and make that the first thing they pursued.

 

And that comes at the expense of a good percentage other FAs.

 

Once the Bills started retaining their own talent, bringing back Poyer, that moment for Hopkins passed.

 

Podcasters and Bills fans kept bringing up pie in the sky scenarios about the Cardinals eating 80%’of the money and trading Ed Oliver and a 5th. In other words Bills fans wanted to give up their garbage and the Cardinals hand over Hopkins.

 

The Bills have no cap space. Beane said it again in his press conference. 
 

You saw how much it took to move up 2-spots for Kincaid.

 

To go from 27th to 19th and get ahead of all the WR group would have cost a 2nd and a 3rd most likely.

 

The Bills right or wrong love Gabe Davis, so with Diggs, Davis, Kincaid, Knox, it would have to be one heck of a WR to jump Knox, Kincaid and Davis to slot just behind Diggs. 

Agree with that. WR2 is still a problem. Teams at the end of the year doubled Diggs which led to him blowing up on the sidelines. Expect more of that this year 

[Mat68]

10 minutes ago, KDIGGZ said:

Agree with that. WR2 is still a problem. Teams at the end of the year doubled Diggs which led to him blowing up on the sidelines. Expect more of that this year 

Having a chain mover on offense like Kincaid will get Diggs more opportunities.  Those few games where the offense couldn't find a rhythm caused the frustration.  

[KDIGGZ]

1 minute ago, Mat68 said:

Having a chain mover on offense like Kincaid will get Diggs more opportunities.  Those few games where the offense couldn't find a rhythm caused the frustration.  

Maybe but what I see is Josh Allen scrambling and whatever play they had called is off and it becomes a scramble drill with everyone focusing on Diggs. I haven't seen Josh do a 3 step drop and hit a receiver maybe ever, at least not since the height of Cole Beasley's career

[BillsFanForever19]

On 4/30/2023 at 2:28 PM, KDIGGZ said:

Kincaid has never played a down. He definitely doesn't solve the WR2 problem 

 

This is like saying any player drafted in the 1st Round to fill a role is meaningless.

 

Whether he has "played a down" or not is meaningless. He was by many the top pass catcher in the entire Draft. We traded up to get him to fill the role as one of the top 2 options for Josh split out wide.

 

Teams don't look at 1st Round picks and say "I can't rely on this, better get a vet too". Kincaid and Harty will make Davis have less on his plate than last season.

 

There is no #2 problem, outside of a few fans like yourself. Davis isn't Higgins. But 90% of the teams in the league don't have 2 Elite WR's on the field at the same time. Davis is high on the list of WR2 productivity. And Kincaid makes him option 2B or 3 now. And Harty may take Davis off the field in certain packages as well.

Edited May 1, 2023 by BillsFanForever19

[finn]

On 4/29/2023 at 11:34 AM, KDIGGZ said:

Maybe. I'm a "I'll believe it when I see it" when it comes to them actually utilizing him in an effective way. Seems like they draft these hybrid type guys and then don't use them like that. All last year we heard how badly they needed a pass catching RB and then they get Cook and Hynes and don't throw to either!

Not sure it's "they." Could be just Allen, who prefers going long, even if it's low percentage. That's why I think they were hoping for Addison in the draft. Last year, there seemed to be a disconnect between Beane and Dorsey, with Beane bending over backwards to secure a receiving back (settling on Hines) that Dorsey appeared to ignore. Or, again, it could have been Allen. He didn't want to check down, didn't even want to throw to Knox. He wanted to go deep to Diggs, and things didn't click very well when teams figured out they should double team him. 

 

So is Kincaid a check-down option or a deep threat? He may be something in between, like Shakir, Crowder, and Beasley. I'm just hoping someone will emerge as deep threat. Most likely possibility: Davis has a resurgence. 

[KDIGGZ]

7 minutes ago, finn said:

Not sure it's "they." Could be just Allen, who prefers going long, even if it's low percentage. That's why I think they were hoping for Addison in the draft. Last year, there seemed to be a disconnect between Beane and Dorsey, with Beane bending over backwards to secure a receiving back (settling on Hines) that Dorsey appeared to ignore. Or, again, it could have been Allen. He didn't want to check down, didn't even want to throw to Knox. He wanted to go deep to Diggs, and things didn't click very well when teams figured out they should double team him. 

 

So is Kincaid a check-down option or a deep threat? He may be something in between, like Shakir, Crowder, and Beasley. I'm just hoping someone will emerge as deep threat. Most likely possibility: Davis has a resurgence. 

Yes I agree it's Josh and also the OC not holding him accountable. You can't go bombs away every play. Take 3 steps, throw the ball. I can't even count the number of times it's like 3rd and 2 and he's throwing it 40 yards down field when I see 2 guys open at the bottom of the TV screen. I think Kincaid will be a RedZone threat but for all of you guys that think he's going to be Beasley with 80 catches for 1000 yards then prepare to be disappointed 

[ColoradoBills]

5 hours ago, chongli said:

 

Trying to figure out for the life of me what "CF" and "SF" mean?

 

CF means College Free agent.  In other words UDFA.

SF means a Street Free agent.  That could be a guy who didn't play the previous year or a released player (vet) released from a team

after free agency.

[Eastport bills]

The Bills must add an impactful DLineman.  It is a ? how and when Miller comes back and we have not put enough pressure on QBs. The LBs are weaker as a unit unless one of the depth guys step up. The secondary will be vastly improved with the return of Hyde and the safety we added who’s good. White will be 2 years removed from the ACL. The problem is without pressure these great QBs in the AFC will carve you up. I like the offense and they will score a lot, but the OC is critical. Incorporating Kincaid and a conventional running attack without keeping Diggs and Davis involved will be a challenge. Dorsey has looked like a rookie, becoming predictable  and making Josh vulnerable by overusing him in the run game. Overall, if the O-line is improved and that’s a big if because the O-line coach hasn’t improved the personnel as yet,we should be more explosive because Allen is arguably the best QB in football. Finally, I look for the defensive scheme to be better because Sean is better than Frazier. The roster needs a few more additions but with great special teams we’ll be as good as any team in the AFC.

[chongli]

1 hour ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

CF means College Free agent.  In other words UDFA.

SF means a Street Free agent.  That could be a guy who didn't play the previous year or a released player (vet) released from a team

after free agency.

 

Ahhh...got it. Thank you. I thought it meant something like that, with "CF" being UDFA from college, and "SF" meaning "signed free agent", but that is weird. I understand the OP perhaps wanted to save space in the chart, but I would have just used "UDFA" and "FA" for ease of understanding. 

[ColoradoBills]

12 hours ago, chongli said:

 

Ahhh...got it. Thank you. I thought it meant something like that, with "CF" being UDFA from college, and "SF" meaning "signed free agent", but that is weird. I understand the OP perhaps wanted to save space in the chart, but I would have just used "UDFA" and "FA" for ease of understanding. 

 

Pretty sure the OP used Ourlads' NFL Scouting Services Depth Chart.  I use it a lot for other teams.

They use a very large "key" to identify how players were acquired.  I kind of like the site.

Here is the key.

https://www.ourlads.com/nfldepthcharts/key.aspx

[Straight Hucklebuck]

On 4/29/2023 at 12:48 PM, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Epenesa and Basham must be the happiest guys on the roster. Neither are worthy of a roster spot yet the Bills have done nothing to address the edge situation.  Hopefully they can add a veteran post June 1 on a 1 year deal and move on from these two busts.

Still hate the fact we have a FB on the roster.  Wasted roster and cap space in my mind.  But I can't see that changing this year.

With Kincaid being added I would get rid of Morris and go with just two TEs again.  I'd rather use the extra roster spot to let one of these small LBs play STs, occasional 4-3 sets, or play some big-nickel.   

I think the final roster decisions will come down to how many safeties they want to keep on the roster.  I had Benson moving to S this year but it doesn't look like that will happen.  Now we have a bit of a glut at CB.  If White doesn't rebound fully he may be a cap casualty for 2024.  Probably too soon to think about it, but maybe Dane Jackson is a trade possibility?

This is a good post. 

 

I think the Bills are likely to flip-flop team approaches this year. 

 

I can see the Bills looking at the tape of 13-seconds and Cincinnati, and concluding as John Fina said - this Walt Corey, Death by 1,000 paper cuts style of defense is not going to work. 

 

Because they have strained and pulled the cap to bring back essentially the same personnel minus Edmunds, they could attempt to play the same scheme, but I think they're smarter on that. 

 

I think they trust White, Hyde, Poyer, Von Miller, Milano to run a more aggressive defense. I think they will conclude that they need to take more chances, cheat the Safeties closer to the line, play more press man. 

 

The Bills don't have a physically imposing defense. They just don't have many physical mismatch players. Who is scary on the Bills defense? No maulers on the defensive line, no linebackers that light people up, years of conservative play in the secondary. They are a defense ripe to get pushed around. And maybe that's why they've tried to hang back for years. But I can see a secondary in approach where they aren't as obsessed with getting beat over the top. Trying to create more turnovers, more confusion. 

 

But you're right here, the bottom end of the defensive line - Settle, Epenesa, Basham, they're poor and can only be used on a rotational basis based on the opposing teams look. Based on what Beane has said and the veterans still available, I do anticipate Beane trying to bring in at least one veteran to add some grit to an otherwise toothless defense. 

[chongli]

1 hour ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Pretty sure the OP used Ourlads' NFL Scouting Services Depth Chart.  I use it a lot for other teams.

They use a very large "key" to identify how players were acquired.  I kind of like the site.

Here is the key.

https://www.ourlads.com/nfldepthcharts/key.aspx

 

Perfect. This is what I was looking for!

[MrEpsYtown]

On 4/29/2023 at 11:34 AM, KDIGGZ said:

Maybe. I'm a "I'll believe it when I see it" when it comes to them actually utilizing him in an effective way. Seems like they draft these hybrid type guys and then don't use them like that. All last year we heard how badly they needed a pass catching RB and then they get Cook and Hynes and don't throw to either!

 

It's a lot more difficult to implemenet a pass ctahing running back into the offense becuase if affects pass pro. It is really easy to stick a tight end in the slot. 

 

I understand what you are saying, but somehow Kincaid and Knox will be on the field together. Does that take reps Morris and from Shakir, Harty, even Gabe? Probably. 

[Warriorspikes51]

Offense:  25

 

2 - QB: Allen, Allen

4 - RB: Cook, Harris, Murray, Hines, 

6- WR: Diggs, Davis, Harty, Shakir, Sherfield, Shorter

3 - TE: Knox, Kincaid, Morris

1 - FB: Gilliam

9 - OL - Dawkins, McGovern, Morse, Torrence, Brown, Bates, Doyle, Edwards, Broeker    (Boettger traded for a late pick)

 

Defense: 25

 

5 - DT: Jones, Ford, Phillips, Oliver, Settle

5 - DE: Miller, Rousseau, Lawson, Epenesa, Basham,

6- LB: Milano, Klein, Bernard, Spector, Williams, Matakevich

4 - S - Poyer, Hyde, Rapp, Hamlin

5 - CB - White, Elam, Benford, Johnson, Jackson 

 

Specialists: Bass, Martin, Reid 

 

Before UDFA's are officially announced  (Shavers, Gouraige, DJ Dale, J.Wayne could push for spots)

Edited May 2, 2023 by Warriorspikes51

[Airseven]

Not a lot of intrigue with this roster. The spots are rather clear, mediocre depth, and few true camp battles.

 

QB Josh Allen
QB Kyle Allen
RB James Cook
RB Damien Harris
RB Nyheim Hines
RB Latavius Murray
FB Reggie Gilliam
WR Stefon Diggs
WR Gabe Davis
WR Trent Sherfield
WR Khalil Shakir
WR Deonte Harty
WR Justin Shorter
TE Dawson Knox
TE Dalton Kincaid
TE Quintin Morris
T Dion Dawkins
T Spencer Brown
T Tommy Doyle
T David Quessenberry
G Ryan Bates
G Connor McGovern

G O'Cyrus Torrence
G David Edwards/Ike Boettger
C Mitch Morse
DE Greg Rousseau
DE AJ Epenesa
DE Boogie Basham
DE Shaq Lawson
(PUP Von Miller)
DT Ed Oliver
DT DaQuan Jones
DT Poona Ford
DT Tim Settle
DT Jordan Phillips/Brandin Bryant
LB Matt Milano
LB Tyrel Dodson
LB Terrel Bernard
LB Dorian Williams
LB Tyler Matakevich

LB AJ Klein/Baylon Spector
CB Tre'Davious White
CB Kaiir Elam
CB Taron Johnson
CB Dane Jackson
CB Christian Benford
CB Cam Lewis
CB Siran Neal
S Micah Hyde
S Jordan Poyer
S Taylor Rapp
K Tyler Bass
P Sam Martin
LS Reid Ferguson
(54)

[BlazinBill]

I really don't t like our WR room at all- was really hoping after not getting Hopkins we did something - I guess there's still time.

I don't see the Bills suddenly having 175 targets between 2 TE's bit hey Go Bills - 

I have no issues eating crow 

[Big Turk]

15 hours ago, Airseven said:

Not a lot of intrigue with this roster. The spots are rather clear, mediocre depth, and few true camp battles.

 

QB Josh Allen
QB Kyle Allen
RB James Cook
RB Damien Harris
RB Nyheim Hines
RB Latavius Murray
FB Reggie Gilliam
WR Stefon Diggs
WR Gabe Davis
WR Trent Sherfield
WR Khalil Shakir
WR Deonte Harty
WR Justin Shorter
TE Dawson Knox
TE Dalton Kincaid
TE Quintin Morris
T Dion Dawkins
T Spencer Brown
T Tommy Doyle
T David Quessenberry
G Ryan Bates
G Connor McGovern

G O'Cyrus Torrence
G David Edwards/Ike Boettger
C Mitch Morse
DE Greg Rousseau
DE AJ Epenesa
DE Boogie Basham
DE Shaq Lawson
(PUP Von Miller)
DT Ed Oliver
DT DaQuan Jones
DT Poona Ford
DT Tim Settle
DT Jordan Phillips/Brandin Bryant
LB Matt Milano
LB Tyrel Dodson
LB Terrel Bernard
LB Dorian Williams
LB Tyler Matakevich

LB AJ Klein/Baylon Spector
CB Tre'Davious White
CB Kaiir Elam
CB Taron Johnson
CB Dane Jackson
CB Christian Benford
CB Cam Lewis
CB Siran Neal
S Micah Hyde
S Jordan Poyer
S Taylor Rapp
K Tyler Bass
P Sam Martin
LS Reid Ferguson
(54)

 

Sure...but what could we expect from a source of constant negativity and a Fin fan?

 

Ignored.

[buffblue]

1 hour ago, BlazinBill said:

I really don't t like our WR room at all- was really hoping after not getting Hopkins we did something - I guess there's still time.

I don't see the Bills suddenly having 175 targets between 2 TE's bit hey Go Bills - 

I have no issues eating crow 

There's still some concern there for sure.

 

Sherfield is mainly a ST player. Harty could be a nice player for us, but I have a bad feeling that his diminutive size will lead to constant nagging injuries, like another Marquise Goodwin. Shakir is the guy who could really elevate this group. There is reason for optimism given the signs he flashed in his rookie season.

 

Overall I would rank the unit somewhere in the 10-15 range. Not bad, but you can certainly see why Hopkins has been a hot topic of discussion. 

[hondo in seattle]

1 hour ago, BlazinBill said:

I really don't t like our WR room at all- was really hoping after not getting Hopkins we did something - I guess there's still time.

I don't see the Bills suddenly having 175 targets between 2 TE's bit hey Go Bills - 

I have no issues eating crow 

 

After watching him last year, I'm not happy with Davis as our #2 either.  As a Bills fan, though, I hope I'm wrong and his apologists are right and his ankle was hurt and his catch percentage was negatively impacted by the longer routes he ran, and all that junk. 

 

But overall, I'm happy with our pass catchers.  I think Harty is a better version of McKenzie and Sherfield is a solid addition.  Kincaid will be a valuable addition as well and as Beane said, gives us an option we didn't have last year.  And we have two RBs - Cook and Hines - who can be good out of the backfield if Dorsey decides to use them that way.  

 

I wonder if Beane did enough for the OL but Dorsey has enough weapons to score points.  

[SCBills]

If Kincaid can become Kelce-lite as a rookie, then Davis is fine as WR2, but I just haven't seen a skillset from him that resembles that of a high-end WR2 in a pass-heavy offense.  

 

Limited route tree and doesn't look fluid enough to run certain routes you'd expect a WR2 to be able to run.  

 

If Kincaid becomes our default WR2, then Gabe Davis is a weapon at WR3, given his big play ability.  

 

Here's to hoping a healthy Gabe can be more than a deep threat who excels at off-schedule plays and provides the occasional come-back route. That's a nice, high-end WR3 skill set, but we need more from a WR2.

 

 

Edited May 3, 2023 by SCBills

[Straight Hucklebuck]

On 5/3/2023 at 11:44 AM, SCBills said:

If Kincaid can become Kelce-lite as a rookie, then Davis is fine as WR2, but I just haven't seen a skillset from him that resembles that of a high-end WR2 in a pass-heavy offense.  

 

Limited route tree and doesn't look fluid enough to run certain routes you'd expect a WR2 to be able to run.  

 

If Kincaid becomes our default WR2, then Gabe Davis is a weapon at WR3, given his big play ability.  

 

Here's to hoping a healthy Gabe can be more than a deep threat who excels at off-schedule plays and provides the occasional come-back route. That's a nice, high-end WR3 skill set, but we need more from a WR2.

 

 

Can Shakir play and win on the outside, or is he slot only?

 

Can he eat into Gabe’s snap count.

 

His role / path to the field is kind of a murky to me. 
 

Because Harty is right behind him and the Bills say he can play inside or outside.

 

All of this to say do the Bills have enough outside depth to not have Gabe at 95%+ snap count?

[hondo in seattle]

12 hours ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Can Shakir play and win on the outside, or is he slot only?

 

Can he eat into Gabe’s snap count.

 

His role / path to the field is kind of a murky to me. 
 

Because Harty is right behind him and the Bills say he can play inside or outside.

 

All of this to say do the Bills have enough outside depth to not have Gabe at 95%+ snap count?

 

I think both Harty and Sherfield will eat into Gabe's snap count.  I'm expecting/hoping for better target distribution this year.  

[ganesh]

On 5/3/2023 at 9:14 PM, SCBills said:

If Kincaid can become Kelce-lite as a rookie, then Davis is fine as WR2, but I just haven't seen a skillset from him that resembles that of a high-end WR2 in a pass-heavy offense.  

 

Limited route tree and doesn't look fluid enough to run certain routes you'd expect a WR2 to be able to run.  

 

If Kincaid becomes our default WR2, then Gabe Davis is a weapon at WR3, given his big play ability.  

 

Here's to hoping a healthy Gabe can be more than a deep threat who excels at off-schedule plays and provides the occasional come-back route. That's a nice, high-end WR3 skill set, but we need more from a WR2.

 

 

Gabe will command a $10-12M annual salary next year and we wil already be against the cap.  He is as good as gone next year.  

[Shemp]

Nobody's talking about Beasley. Is he finished as a Bill and/or an NFL player?

[John from Riverside]

On 5/3/2023 at 6:31 AM, BlazinBill said:

I really don't t like our WR room at all- was really hoping after not getting Hopkins we did something - I guess there's still time.

I don't see the Bills suddenly having 175 targets between 2 TE's bit hey Go Bills - 

I have no issues eating crow 

There is a true number one receiver on this team with diggs well over 1000 yards every year

 

The wide receiver that we’re all trying to replace was at 800 yards

 

Dalton Kincaid was considered the best pure pass catcher out of this draft and then included wide receivers

 

Shakur showed promise towards the end of last season

 

 

Trent Sherfield was good enough to be the third receiver on a talented Miami Dolphins squad

 

The rest of these guys are lottery tickets with high upside

[TOboy]

8 hours ago, Shemp said:

Nobody's talking about Beasley. Is he finished as a Bill and/or an NFL player?

It’s very possible. He retired last year, currently remains unsigned, and the team seems to have filled his role. 

[John from Riverside]

Have any of the main veteran defensive ends, signed with other teams yet?
 

Just keeping an eye on whether or not we’re going to get a Melvin Ingram, or a Justin Houston type

[BillsFanForever19]

On 5/9/2023 at 11:49 AM, Shemp said:

Nobody's talking about Beasley. Is he finished as a Bill and/or an NFL player?

 

Beasley's done here. Kincaid is a TE in name only and is actually a Big Slot. Deonte Harty will be playing Outside and Inside. Khalil Shakir is going to have the training wheels taken off and will be getting more Slot work. The slot is covered and crowded. 

 

Beasley was a Hail Mary in the slot late last season after Jamison Crowder went down, Isaiah McKenzie was underperforming, and McDermott wanted to bring Shakir along slowly in his Rookie year. 

 

He performed okay. But he wasn't his old self. That's why we addressed the position with Kincaid and Harty. There's no place for Beasley, unless he wants to be a Practice Squad guy. Our 53 WR core is set in stone already.

[Eastport bills]

On 4/29/2023 at 11:24 AM, KDIGGZ said:

I wouldn't put Kincaid over Knox. It sounds like Knox is the every down TE and Kincaid takes Morris' spot.

 

Also Bernard starting at MLB I don't see happening. I'd say Dodson is the starter at this moment, which is a scary thought.

 

Harris over Cook as the every down back.

 

I think Quessenberry will be starting at RT at some point this year if not now.

 

I see glaring needs at WR and MLB. I hope they are not done adding people.

If Quessenbury is starting at tackle because Brown has been injured or hasn’t performed, this team will be needing an upgrade in season.Torrence and McGovern will be immediate upgrades so I see improvement at the RB position and pass protection  with Brown being one year further into his development. Harris will provide a dimension of short yardage, between the tackles physicality in the running game we desperately need along with Murray.Cook and Hines are perfect complimentary backs for explosive runs. This receiving corp will be hard to deal with if Dorsey doesn’t light a match to this team by not competently incorporating a conventional running attack along with  making Kincaid a red zone and slot option, while keeping Diggs and Davis engaged. His play calling is probably the biggest? facing this team. The defense will be a work in progress until Miller comes back to form and the MLB position gets sorted, but the additions of Williams and Ford should be real positives. Look for the secondary to be much improved with Hyde and Rapp. If White and Elam can be better than last year, we might be formidable by week 6 or 7. All things considered this team will be a juggernaut on offense and if we can generate any pas rush, we could be a real SB contender. With Sean calling the defense, that’s might be the biggest upgrade.

[BillsFanForever19]

On 5/3/2023 at 9:31 AM, BlazinBill said:

I really don't t like our WR room at all- was really hoping after not getting Hopkins we did something - I guess there's still time.

I don't see the Bills suddenly having 175 targets between 2 TE's bit hey Go Bills - 

I have no issues eating crow 

 

Again, you're looking at Kincaid wrong. He's a TE in name only. He's actually a Slot WR, much like Kelce is in KC.

 

Kincaid and Harty will take the pressure off of Davis that existed last season. Shakir getting the training wheels taken off as well. If Davis is struggling, Harty will cut into his reps. And I expect Diggs, Kincaid, and Davis to be on the field most downs. Kincaid can easily be the #2 option to Josh and at the very least will require more coverage, taking coverage away from Davis.

 

Kincaid and Harty represent the insurance to Davis' underperformance last season. We were never going to Draft a Receiving weapon in the 1st Round as we had AND make another massive investment in another weapon - with Diggs and Davis here and with having signed Harty and Sherfield.

 

Long story short, with the additions of Kincaid, Harty, Sherfield, and Shorter (with Shakir given more reps) - the Receiving core as a whole is in MUCH better shape than it was last season. 

Edited May 11, 2023 by BillsFanForever19

[PrimeTime101]

On 5/7/2023 at 10:11 AM, ganesh said:

Gabe will command a $10-12M annual salary next year and we wil already be against the cap.  He is as good as gone next year.  

Spotrac is not the end of all means. Spotrac has Davis at WR Rank: 29. That means he can be another teams #1 in the nfl. I am sorry but that ranking is way to high so I did some research on pff and top 100 WR's? 

 

Gabes off is not even on the top 50. 

36th in targets, 52nd in receptions, 30th in yards (thanks JA) 12th in TDl. again (thanks JA) 

his last 5 games he averaged 60.56 yet Spotrac has him graded on the low end of the WR list at 29... makes ZERO sense. Spotrac has gabe at around 12 mil but lets play at your 10 mil 5 year deal at 50 mil? that would put him around 19th best paid WR in the league...

 

Just stupid. I personally put Davis at around 8-9m a year. Especially if he repeats last year. 

[GunnerBill]

10 hours ago, PrimeTime101 said:

Spotrac is not the end of all means. Spotrac has Davis at WR Rank: 29. That means he can be another teams #1 in the nfl. I am sorry but that ranking is way to high so I did some research on pff and top 100 WR's? 

 

Gabes off is not even on the top 50. 

36th in targets, 52nd in receptions, 30th in yards (thanks JA) 12th in TDl. again (thanks JA) 

his last 5 games he averaged 60.56 yet Spotrac has him graded on the low end of the WR list at 29... makes ZERO sense. Spotrac has gabe at around 12 mil but lets play at your 10 mil 5 year deal at 50 mil? that would put him around 19th best paid WR in the league...

 

Just stupid. I personally put Davis at around 8-9m a year. Especially if he repeats last year. 

 

Worth saying there will still be some #1 receivers on rookie deals. Chase obviously, but Olave and Wilson possibly too so it isn't quite as easy as 29th best paid so that means he is a #1. I have said before the best comp for Gabe Davis is Michael Gallup, in that he is a lower end #2 receiver who doesn't run a full route tree, is not a big separator and is mainly used on lower percentage down the field type routes. They have both had issues at time with drops. Gallup got $11.5m AAV. I think if Gabe has a year like last year - 800 plus yards and 7 touchdowns - that is where he will end up. 

[PrimeTime101]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Worth saying there will still be some #1 receivers on rookie deals. Chase obviously, but Olave and Wilson possibly too so it isn't quite as easy as 29th best paid so that means he is a #1. I have said before the best comp for Gabe Davis is Michael Gallup, in that he is a lower end #2 receiver who doesn't run a full route tree, is not a big separator and is mainly used on lower percentage down the field type routes. They have both had issues at time with drops. Gallup got $11.5m AAV. I think if Gabe has a year like last year - 800 plus yards and 7 touchdowns - that is where he will end up. 

these numbers lol... that will be a hard contract to swallow. 

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, PrimeTime101 said:

these numbers lol... that will be a hard contract to swallow. 

 

I don't think the Bills will pay him to be clear.

[PrimeTime101]

13 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I don't think the Bills will pay him to be clear.

No, I do not think he is worth that, put him on a team lets say... The Chargers. A team that just maybe makes a top 10 team. (trying not to be bias)  Gabe does NOT get close to these yards.. so no.. we should not resign him unless it is a team friendly deal. First big new contract.. he going to want the money

[newcam2012]

17 hours ago, Eastport bills said:

If Quessenbury is starting at tackle because Brown has been injured or hasn’t performed, this team will be needing an upgrade in season.Torrence and McGovern will be immediate upgrades so I see improvement at the RB position and pass protection  with Brown being one year further into his development. Harris will provide a dimension of short yardage, between the tackles physicality in the running game we desperately need along with Murray.Cook and Hines are perfect complimentary backs for explosive runs. This receiving corp will be hard to deal with if Dorsey doesn’t light a match to this team by not competently incorporating a conventional running attack along with  making Kincaid a red zone and slot option, while keeping Diggs and Davis engaged. His play calling is probably the biggest? facing this team. The defense will be a work in progress until Miller comes back to form and the MLB position gets sorted, but the additions of Williams and Ford should be real positives. Look for the secondary to be much improved with Hyde and Rapp. If White and Elam can be better than last year, we might be formidable by week 6 or 7. All things considered this team will be a juggernaut on offense and if we can generate any pas rush, we could be a real SB contender. With Sean calling the defense, that’s might be the biggest upgrade.

That's best case scenario. There are a lot of ifs, question marks, and unknowns to any season. We will have to see how it plays out. 

 

I think it's pretty safe to say the Bills are Super Bowl contenders. They have to be in the AFC discussion. 

[GunnerBill]

35 minutes ago, PrimeTime101 said:

No, I do not think he is worth that, put him on a team lets say... The Chargers. A team that just maybe makes a top 10 team. (trying not to be bias)  Gabe does NOT get close to these yards.. so no.. we should not resign him unless it is a team friendly deal. First big new contract.. he going to want the money

 

The Chargers are an actual option. Mike Williams is $33m on the cap next year, $12m dead if they get out. They aint paying him $33m. Likely Keenan Allen's last year too. Gabe is a level below Williams but they are similar players and the difference isn't huge. Tom Telesco loves bigger receivers. 

[NewEra]

8 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Worth saying there will still be some #1 receivers on rookie deals. Chase obviously, but Olave and Wilson possibly too so it isn't quite as easy as 29th best paid so that means he is a #1. I have said before the best comp for Gabe Davis is Michael Gallup, in that he is a lower end #2 receiver who doesn't run a full route tree, is not a big separator and is mainly used on lower percentage down the field type routes. They have both had issues at time with drops. Gallup got $11.5m AAV. I think if Gabe has a year like last year - 800 plus yards and 7 touchdowns - that is where he will end up. 

To me, paying Gabe 12M a year is an overpay I want nothing to do with. Just like Tremaine getting 18M in Chicago.  Nice players that I wish we could keep…. But not at that price

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The Chargers are an actual option. Mike Williams is $33m on the cap next year, $12m dead if they get out. They aint paying him $33m. Likely Keenan Allen's last year too. Gabe is a level below Williams but they are similar players and the difference isn't huge. Tom Telesco loves bigger receivers. 

Oh man- if they sign gabe they better draft another WR in the first next year.  Quinton and Gabe as wr1 and 2 = poor Herbert.  Can’t believe they didn’t take Kincaid (but so very appreciative).  I’m not a Mike Williams fan by any means, but that would be a downgrade imo.  Allen is getting up there but he can get open and catch.  Not quite sure Quinton and gabe can do either 😂