This place has become poisonous

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

In a nutshell, if you lived through the climb from mediocrity to contention, to the 4 superbowl loses, then the erosion into has beens, and eventual drought, you recognize what missed opportunity looks like, you know what a team peaking looks like and you’ve seen what repeating the same thing hoping for a different result looks like. 
 

Fast forward to today….  This franchise was arguably ascending until late season this year…add the playoff no show on both sides of the ball, the fact Allen could well be 50% through his career and seems to have regressed mentally, the cap situation, the lack of contribution (no excellent players seemingly) from the recent drafts, the money tied up in mediocre defensive front, and an apparent stead fast commitment to stay the course…. The “we understand what tweaks we need and will be there next year” lost credibility it used to have

 

none of the reactions and overreactions are surprising 

[Augie]

1 hour ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

Same here, but my vasectomy in '86 was successful.  Still have the damned cough. 🤨

*
Blessings and good karma to you on the rescue. 🙂

 

Please, tell us more about your vasectomy! 😋

 

I’d rather read about that than another “proposed trade” that will never happen, or who we should have drafted two years ago in the third round now that some poster got to see “the other guy” make a riveting Pro Bowl appearance. Oh, and don’t get me started on the “fire everybody” crowd. 

 

Good luck with the cough. Try turning your head, it may help. Doctors seem to think so. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

16 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

Please, tell us more about your vasectomy! 😋

They weren't happy with the quality of my self esthetician skills.

*
The doctor must have been getting paid by the job, not the hour.  The local freezing hadn't even taken effect before he picked up the scalpel and diagonal cutters, and 'KA-KLUNK', there goes the polywog conduit. 😳

"That wasn't so bad was it?" says the doctor.  "Jesus, couldn't you wait for the local to take hold?!" says I.  Then, as most of us are blessed with two, repeat the process, with even more haste on the starboard side. 😳😬😮

Edited February 11, 2023 by Ridgewaycynic2013

[Augie]

4 minutes ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

They weren't happy with the quality of my self esthetician skills.

*
The doctor must have been getting paid by the job, not the hour.  The local freezing hadn't even taken effect before he picked up the scalpel and diagonal cutters, and 'KA-KLUNK', there goes the polywog conduit. 😳

"That wasn't so bad was it?" says the doctor.  "Jesus, couldn't you wait for the local to take hold?!" says I.  Then, as most of us are blessed with two, repeat the process, with even more haste on the starboard side. 😳😬😮

 

Well, that was a lovely diversion. I didn’t really expect…….oh, never mind.

 

Maybe @mead107 would like to inspect the Doc’s handiwork? 

[4th&long]

A lot of us off most have been on message boards for more than a decade, some even longer. This is nothing new. Why people need to get on here and cry about it, it’s worse than anything else. Let people vent, ignore it and move on. 

Edited February 11, 2023 by 4th&long

[strive_for_five_guy]

1 hour ago, Aesop said:

“Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, and weak men create hard times.”

So are we in the midst of hard times or good times right now?

[Eastport bills]

5 hours ago, Dr. K said:

I've been a member of this community since the very beginning, in 2001. 

 

Through the depths of the drought, I've never seen so much whining and anger and lashing out as what goes on daily on this board right now. Not everybody is guilty of this—there are a good number of eminently sane people who post here frequently—but the percentage of people acting like three-year-olds having temper tantrums is as high or higher than it has ever been.

 

I went away for the last weeks since the loss to the Bengals thinking that of course people are going to act out their disappointment; it's natural, I thought, let them get it out of their system. But it's as bad this morning as ever. I've tried blocking the worst offenders but the list would be too long to comprehend at this point. If the Bills were to take one fifth of the hysterical suggestions that are made every hour on this board, they would be out of the playoffs for the next twenty years. 

 

I realize this is likely my problem, not yours. So I'm giving it a pass at least until the draft, and maybe until training camp.

 

I hope some of you will get out of the house now and then and breathe some fresh air. 

Your problem is that you are perfectly fine with the level that the team has reached and it is beyond your capacity to understand the perspective of devoted, long suffering fans who understand the urgency in winning a championship while our franchise QB is under our control. The complaint that most objective observers have is that progress stopped after Dabol left. Our offense has become Joshcentric and predictable. Our defense was formidable when Von and the threat of his pressure made everyone better. When he went down, we couldn’t pressure and our young injury riddled secondary was exposed. Coaching and personnel couldn’t make things better. Now things are not great because other teams are getting better and we are fully dependent on Beane improving the roster with cap restrictions. So between questions about our coaching and making the roster better, they’re things to be concerned about. When you’ve experienced decades of lean times you realize how short lived this huge opportunity with Josh can be. Don’t be misled with playoff berths and early rd wins. We’re not there yet.

[Freddie's Dead]

 

[wppete]

56 minutes ago, 4th&long said:

A lot of us off most have been on message boards for more than a decade for more than a decade some even longer. This is nothing new. Why people need to get on here and cry about it, it’s worse than anything else. Let people vent, ignore it and move on. 

Yup agree. It’s amazing to hear people cry about people venting and giving an opinion they don’t like. It is a message board after all. 

[Dr. K]

6 minutes ago, Eastport bills said:

Your problem is that you are perfectly fine with the level that the team has reached and it is beyond your capacity to understand the perspective of devoted, long suffering fans who understand the urgency in winning a championship while our franchise QB is under our control. The complaint that most objective observers have is that progress stopped after Dabol left. Our offense has become Joshcentric and predictable. Our defense was formidable when Von and the threat of his pressure made everyone better. When he went down, we couldn’t pressure and our young injury riddled secondary was exposed. Coaching and personnel couldn’t make things better. Now things are not great because other teams are getting better and we are fully dependent on Beane improving the roster with cap restrictions. So between questions about our coaching and making the roster better, they’re things to be concerned about. When you’ve experienced decades of lean times you realize how short lived this huge opportunity with Josh can be. Don’t be misled with playoff berths and early rd wins. We’re not there yet.

I attended my first Bills game in 1966. Though I don't know how old you are, I suspect I've suffered with this team for longer than you've been alive. I recognize that the team has problems--a person would have to be blind not to see that.  Find a post anywhere here when I ever said anything even approaching the words you are putting in my mouth. 

 

Read what I wrote, not what you assume about me. 

 

 

I wish you the best. I'm not interested in fighting with you about any of this. 

 

[Maynard]

Should have kept Daboll!!! 😆

[Augie]

2 minutes ago, Dr. K said:

 I attended my first Bills game in 1966. Though I don't know how old you are, I suspect I've suffered with this team for longer than you've been alive. I recognize that the team has problems--a person would have to be blind not to see that.  Find a post anywhere here when I ever said anything even approaching the words you are putting in my mouth. 

 

Read what I wrote, not what you assume about me. 

 

 

I wish you the best. I'm not interested in fighting with you about any of this. 

 

 

I think I remember seeing you there!!! You were short? With hair? 

 

 

People are getting mad like somebody stole something from them. I want to address our obvious shortcomings, improve, and advance further in the playoffs. But I also appreciate a team that can be expected to win 12 or more games on a regular basis.

[Eastport bills]

10 minutes ago, Dr. K said:

I attended my first Bills game in 1966. Though I don't know how old you are, I suspect I've suffered with this team for longer than you've been alive. I recognize that the team has problems--a person would have to be blind not to see that.  Find a post anywhere here when I ever said anything even approaching the words you are putting in my mouth. 

 

Read what I wrote, not what you assume about me. 

 

 

I wish you the best. I'm not interested in fighting with you about any of this. 

 

Alright, I understand you’re sensitive to the wild knee jerk ideas that are irrational. The reality is that most fans are pretty passionate and objective, but even the over the top crowd deserve a forum to vent frustration. That’s what these boards are about . We’re a community and some residents are given to extreme and immediate fixes. It will all be forgotten when we win it all.

[Augie]

6 minutes ago, Eastport bills said:

Alright, I understand you’re sensitive to the wild knee jerk ideas that are irrational. The reality is that most fans are pretty passionate and objective, but even the over the top crowd deserve a forum to vent frustration. That’s what these boards are about . We’re a community and some residents are given to extreme and immediate fixes. It will all be forgotten when we win it all.

 

Too much extremism can be a bad thing. I’m sure of that. 

[Einstein]

63 years and waiting.

 

It takes a toll.

[JohnNord]

6 hours ago, Dr. K said:

I've been a member of this community since the very beginning, in 2001. 

 

Through the depths of the drought, I've never seen so much whining and anger and lashing out as what goes on daily on this board right now. Not everybody is guilty of this—there are a good number of eminently sane people who post here frequently—but the percentage of people acting like three-year-olds having temper tantrums is as high or higher than it has ever been.

 

I went away for the last weeks since the loss to the Bengals thinking that of course people are going to act out their disappointment; it's natural, I thought, let them get it out of their system. But it's as bad this morning as ever. I've tried blocking the worst offenders but the list would be too long to comprehend at this point. If the Bills were to take one fifth of the hysterical suggestions that are made every hour on this board, they would be out of the playoffs for the next twenty years. 

 

I realize this is likely my problem, not yours. So I'm giving it a pass at least until the draft, and maybe until training camp.

 

I hope some of you will get out of the house now and then and breathe some fresh air. 

The emotion and overreaction in the Bills fan base is off the charts.  FIRE EVERYONE

[Augie]

25 minutes ago, Einstein said:

63 years and waiting.

 

It takes a toll.

 

It only takes the toll we allow it to take. Enjoy the ride. Soak in the great plays, the nice wins. There are far more wins than losses these days. And we have a team of “Good Ass Guys!”   😂    (JJ Watt reference there.)

 

Only one team walks away happy. That’s more than a cliche, that’s the truth. What then? I can live with being a top 5 team and having a shot every year. One year, it will be our turn. 

20 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

The emotion and overreaction in the Bills fan base is off the charts.  FIRE EVERYONE

 

Do I get two weeks notice? 

Edited February 11, 2023 by Augie

[Tanoros]

6 hours ago, Success said:

Fans in general get too negative.  

 

If you no longer have hope - why continue being a fan? If I was really hopeless about this team, or McDermott, or whatever, I'd just move on.  But I'm not; we got some bad breaks this year, but we'll be back.

 

I plan on enjoying every second of Allen's career, and feeling excited as long as we have him at QB.  We probably won't get another guy like this in my lifetime, and we're very fortunate to have him.

 

Exactly. Being a fan of course we want our team to win it all, but we became fans of a team that’s never won it all. Meaning we obviously enjoy the team/game enough despite not winning it all (much less the drought years), so there are plenty of things to enjoy while having Allen and team that’s winning the division year in and out. 
 

I know I’m personally loving the McDermott/Allen era. We know we have a chance to win any game, and it wasn’t always that way. 
 

Thank you to everyone who keeps a level headed perspective. I really enjoy reading the different perspectives, and analysis. 

[WideNine]

18 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

I think I remember seeing you there!!! You were short? With hair? 

 

 

People are getting mad like somebody stole something from them. I want to address our obvious shortcomings, improve, and advance further in the playoffs. But I also appreciate a team that can be expected to win 12 or more games on a regular basis.

 

It is an interesting phenomena and I would blame millienials because that is why they exist

BUT older fans seem to be chiming in as well about an inability to endure critical dialogue ... it is a bit mind blowing on a board because you literally can ignore posts or certain posters if they rub you the wrong way. Sure there are folks that just want to B-word and offer little else, ignore it or join in if you just want to vent. That is literally why folks are drawn to places to chat about their teams.

 

I like to look at player, coach, game, and draft planning, performance, and comparisons and don't mind saying this or that needs to be better, and like to find threads where folks can agree or disagree on those things. I have no issues saying this player is a great person and locker room presence, but I wish he did this better on the field. I think both can be true.

 

Of course I appreciate how many wins the Bills were able to scrape together and if that was the point of each season I guess I would walk away fairly satisfied, BUT if the goal is to position this team to win a championship I feel like we may have reached a point where we are spinning our wheels a bit as a franchise.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[wppete]

1 hour ago, Dr. K said:

I attended my first Bills game in 1966. Though I don't know how old you are, I suspect I've suffered with this team for longer than you've been alive. I recognize that the team has problems--a person would have to be blind not to see that.  Find a post anywhere here when I ever said anything even approaching the words you are putting in my mouth. 

 

Read what I wrote, not what you assume about me. 

 

 

I wish you the best. I'm not interested in fighting with you about any of this. 

 

Dr. K you need to take a break. This board is getting to you. 

[Augie]

4 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

It is an interesting phenomena and I would blame millienials because that is why they exist

BUT older fans seem to be chiming in as well about an inability to endure critical dialogue ... it is a bit mind blowing on a board because you literally can ignore posts or certain posters if they rub you the wrong way. Sure there are folks that just want to B-word and offer little else, ignore it or join in if you just want to vent. That is literally why folks are drawn to places to chat about their teams.

 

I like to look at player, coach, game, and draft planning, performance, and comparisons and don't mind saying this or that needs to be better, and like to find threads where folks can agree or disagree on those things. I have no issues saying this player is a great person and locker room presence, but I wish he did this better on the field. I think both can be true.

 

Of course I appreciate how many wins the Bills were able to scrape together and if that was the point of each season I guess I would walk away fairly satisfied, BUT if the goal is to position this team to win a championship I feel like we may have reached a point where we are spinning our wheels a bit as a franchise.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I believe “critical dialogue” is being used loosely. THAT may be where we differ. It’s a spectrum, for better, or for worse. 

[newcam2012]

7 hours ago, Dr. K said:

I've been a member of this community since the very beginning, in 2001. 

 

Through the depths of the drought, I've never seen so much whining and anger and lashing out as what goes on daily on this board right now. Not everybody is guilty of this—there are a good number of eminently sane people who post here frequently—but the percentage of people acting like three-year-olds having temper tantrums is as high or higher than it has ever been.

 

I went away for the last weeks since the loss to the Bengals thinking that of course people are going to act out their disappointment; it's natural, I thought, let them get it out of their system. But it's as bad this morning as ever. I've tried blocking the worst offenders but the list would be too long to comprehend at this point. If the Bills were to take one fifth of the hysterical suggestions that are made every hour on this board, they would be out of the playoffs for the next twenty years. 

 

I realize this is likely my problem, not yours. So I'm giving it a pass at least until the draft, and maybe until training camp.

 

I hope some of you will get out of the house now and then and breathe some fresh air. 

There are a variety of opinions on here. From very optimistic to very pessimistic. Personally, I think that's what makes this forum fantastic. I want to see a broad range of opinions, suggestions, and ideas. 

 

Professional banter back and forth is great. It's more than fair and acceptable to disagree to disagree so long as it doesn't get personal and unprofessional.

 

I understand this is a Bills fans forum. Most including myself find it more pleasurable to read positive optimistic posts.

 

However, criticism shouldn't be discouraged or looked at in a negative way. Unfortunately, many on here feel that way. 

 

Lastly, I think it's safe to say we fans want a Super Bowl appearance and a Super Bowl win.

 

The organization has come up short. They have a coveted franchise QB for 6 years and counting. Many thought by now they would have advanced further. There are obvious reasons for not achieving their goal. Of course fans especially knowledgeable and loyal fans are going to display and give their criticisms. That's what fans do! In the end, the fans always come back and cheer on their team. That's what we do. 

[WideNine]

4 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

I believe “critical dialogue” is being used loosely. THAT may be where we differ. It’s a spectrum, for better, or for worse. 

 

I can live with that, and perhaps that is where we agree.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 11, 2023 by WideNine

[Rocbillsfan1]

7 hours ago, Dr. K said:

I've been a member of this community since the very beginning, in 2001. 

 

Through the depths of the drought, I've never seen so much whining and anger and lashing out as what goes on daily on this board right now. Not everybody is guilty of this—there are a good number of eminently sane people who post here frequently—but the percentage of people acting like three-year-olds having temper tantrums is as high or higher than it has ever been.

 

I went away for the last weeks since the loss to the Bengals thinking that of course people are going to act out their disappointment; it's natural, I thought, let them get it out of their system. But it's as bad this morning as ever. I've tried blocking the worst offenders but the list would be too long to comprehend at this point. If the Bills were to take one fifth of the hysterical suggestions that are made every hour on this board, they would be out of the playoffs for the next twenty years. 

 

I realize this is likely my problem, not yours. So I'm giving it a pass at least until the draft, and maybe until training camp.

 

I hope some of you will get out of the house now and then and breathe some fresh air. 

If this coaching staff is inspiring hope for you I’d love whatever you are taking. I’ve seen this train wreck 4 straight times in the playoffs. 

[newcam2012]

2 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

In a nutshell, if you lived through the climb from mediocrity to contention, to the 4 superbowl loses, then the erosion into has beens, and eventual drought, you recognize what missed opportunity looks like, you know what a team peaking looks like and you’ve seen what repeating the same thing hoping for a different result looks like. 
 

Fast forward to today….  This franchise was arguably ascending until late season this year…add the playoff no show on both sides of the ball, the fact Allen could well be 50% through his career and seems to have regressed mentally, the cap situation, the lack of contribution (no excellent players seemingly) from the recent drafts, the money tied up in mediocre defensive front, and an apparent stead fast commitment to stay the course…. The “we understand what tweaks we need and will be there next year” lost credibility it used to have

 

none of the reactions and overreactions are surprising 

Very well said. This is so spot on and echoes everything I wanted to say. 

 

Thanks for such a sharp post and representing a more than fair opinion. 

 

👍👍👍

[QCity]

1 minute ago, newcam2012 said:

However, criticism shouldn't be discouraged or looked at in a negative way. Unfortunately, many on here feel that way. 

 

There are posters here that flip out at even the slightest hint of criticism. They act as if you are insulting one of their family members. You can't have an honest football discussion if everyone is cheerleading.

 

"Unfortunately, many regard the critic as an enemy, instead of seeing him as a guide to the truth"

[newcam2012]

1 hour ago, Eastport bills said:

Your problem is that you are perfectly fine with the level that the team has reached and it is beyond your capacity to understand the perspective of devoted, long suffering fans who understand the urgency in winning a championship while our franchise QB is under our control. The complaint that most objective observers have is that progress stopped after Dabol left. Our offense has become Joshcentric and predictable. Our defense was formidable when Von and the threat of his pressure made everyone better. When he went down, we couldn’t pressure and our young injury riddled secondary was exposed. Coaching and personnel couldn’t make things better. Now things are not great because other teams are getting better and we are fully dependent on Beane improving the roster with cap restrictions. So between questions about our coaching and making the roster better, they’re things to be concerned about. When you’ve experienced decades of lean times you realize how short lived this huge opportunity with Josh can be. Don’t be misled with playoff berths and early rd wins. We’re not there yet.

Fantastic synopsis here. I can totally relate to what you are saying. 

[newcam2012]

36 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

It only takes the toll we allow it to take. Enjoy the ride. Soak in the great plays, the nice wins. There are far more wins than losses these days. And we have a team of “Good Ass Guys!”   😂    (JJ Watt reference there.)

 

Only one team walks away happy. That’s more than a cliche, that’s the truth. What then? I can live with being a top 5 team and having a shot every year. One year, it will be our turn. 

 

Do I get two weeks notice? 

Aggie, I like your positive perspective. However, it does have short comings. There is no guarantee that "one year it will be our turn."  We've been saying that for decades. Many fans have passed with unfulfilled Bills achievements.

 

Truthfully, Bills fans deserve more. 

[Beast]

I’m just trying to figure out why I‘ve been banished from the 13 second thread?

Edited February 12, 2023 by Beast

[Augie]

1 hour ago, Eastport bills said:

 When you’ve experienced decades of lean times you realize how short lived this huge opportunity with Josh can be. Don’t be misled with playoff berths and early rd wins. We’re not there yet.

 

I apologize for deleting what you had above but I wanted this to stand out for a reason. I get the years of disappointment as hard as any. I was there for the hardest of times. Early in my marriage in the mid 80’s my young bride asked “WHY DO YOU DO THIS TO YOURSELF?”   😂 

 

But it’s not decades ago. We have new owners (for whom I pray), a new front office, a real HC and a commitment and expectation of winning football. I’m from the early days of Bills football, but these are new days. As Beane has said numerous times, they want to build for consistent winning football. I think they have a shot as good as almost any. 

[Augie]

19 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Aggie, I like your positive perspective. However, it does have short comings. There is no guarantee that "one year it will be our turn."  We've been saying that for decades. Many fans have passed with unfulfilled Bills achievements.

 

Truthfully, Bills fans deserve more. 

 

First, life does not come with guarantees.

 

And second, if that is what you need to go to your grave happy, then I’ll pray for you. As I just pointed out, what happened decades ago does NOT matter. We have new owners, and a different level of professionalism. A better chance. But still just a chance. 

 

Doesn’t EVERY fan base think they deserve more? MORE what? Can we ALL have more? There is only so much “more” to go around, and they all want it. 

[Dr.Sack]

I believe we are enduring a great resignation to the fact Allen is committing too many turnovers behind a porous line and an offense in decline at OL and skill positions, and to the fact we are in need of something to maximize Allen’s greatness and it isn’t there. The GM has butchered the past 4 drafts, the coach has blundered in the biggest moments and the DC has been schooled the past 3 playoff losses (27, 42, and 38 points). 

[uticaclub]

21 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

I apologize for deleting what you had above but I wanted this to stand out for a reason. I get the years of disappointment as hard as any. I was there for the hardest of times. Early in my marriage in the mid 80’s my young bride asked “WHY DO YOU DO THIS TO YOURSELF?”   😂 

 

But it’s not decades ago. We have new owners (for whom I pray), a new front office, a real HC and a commitment and expectation of winning football. I’m from the early days of Bills football, but these are new days. As Beane has said numerous times, they want to build for consistent winning football. I think they have a shot as good as almost any. 

Anyone hired by the Bills has said the same things Beane has said, Beane ended up with Allen that's the only difference

[Augie]

5 minutes ago, Dr.Sack said:

I believe we are enduring a great resignation to the fact Allen is committing too many turnovers behind a porous line and an offense in decline at OL and skill positions, and to the fact we are in need of something to maximize Allen’s greatness and it isn’t there. The GM has butchered the past 4 drafts, the coach has blundered in the biggest moments and the DC has been schooled the past 3 playoff losses (27, 42, and 38 points). 

 

Thank you for reinforcing the thread title!  😋

 

Being a Super Bowl favorite again next year may mean the world is not ending. Every team has issues, including the winner tomorrow. 

[IndyMark]

Ah, like anything in life you take the good with the bad.  I find it perfectly reasonable and expected to have a wide range of views.  I certainly would not visit this site if it was pure pollyana-ish trope delivered with child-like wonderment.  If I want that I would go visit the SHOUT podcast....talk about prattling on in an echo chamber.

 

I look forward to passionate fans that may or may not have a clue of what they watch or what they talk about.

 

Perhaps the problem is with some high volume posters whom think they have some clout or expertise just because they have created tens of thousands of posts....maybe even loop a moderator or two in there as being more of the problem than a solution.  Truly there are some "esteemed" posters here that have no idea what they talk about and are nothing more than week-end warriors and would be scouts....BUT I love reading their posts as it is really funny to see how excited they are with themselves.

 

Bottom line, I would never want to filter raw authentic thoughts or emotions and the reason this place is awesome is because it is real and not scripted or tightly filtered. 

[Augie]

2 minutes ago, uticaclub said:

Anyone hired by the Bills has said the same things Beane has said, Beane ended up with Allen that's the only difference

 

You present that as a fact, when in fact it’s an opinion. Just your opinion. 

[Dr.Sack]

Just now, Augie said:

 

Thank you for reinforcing the thread title!  😋

 

Being a Super Bowl favorite again next year may mean the world is not ending. Every team has issues, including the winner tomorrow. 

I’m sure a good percentage of Bills fan of which I’ve been one for 30+ years have serious doubts it will happen given the past performance of our GM, HC, DC. It’s more of a prove me wrong mentality. There is great disappointment amongst many in the fan base seeing the team they love continually get bounced from the playoffs. I’d love to see them win it all, watching Mahomes make a 3rd trip at age 27 leaves a bitter taste in my mouth. 

[Old Coot]

It's a bad case of disappointed expectations.

 

During the drought people expected the team to lose so when they did, expectations were fulfilled.

 

This year, people expected the Superbowl.  When that didn't happen people were left disappointed and angry.

 

This, too, shall pass.

[Augie]

7 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

I am just here to beg for money 

 

Everybody knows that!!! Do you have a sign or anything? Maybe you could put some effort into this? Just a little bit? Have some pride! 

[LABILLBACKER]

Eastport and newcam sum it up the best as far as responding to the OP.  It's the way I feel. We're all different and this board would be pretty boring if we didn't have different opinions on that "spectrum".  And in some regards there's something to take out of what Dr K and Augie say. It's just so incredibly hard at my age to keep the "wait till next year" montra going. I'm not going to be around forever and neither is Josh.  But I also can't let it give me ulcers and effort the other good things in my life.  Maybe I just need to check myself in to "Buffalo Bills therapy".......