Josh Allen is the NFL's Ultimate "Ultimate Weapon": What's Next? (Great article, paywall)

[eball]

1 minute ago, LeGOATski said:

This is where I'm at. I just want to watch great football. Their accomplishments don't really mean anything to me.

 

I want to be proud of my team and my QB.  I’ve got that.  Now it’s all about having fun watching them.

[machine gun kelly]

15 hours ago, Logic said:

I've always sort of wondered how Madden would feel about Josh Allen. It's cool to hear that he was a big fan.

 

If we only go by wins and longevity, it's quite possible that no one will ever touch Brady.

In terms of sheer physical skill and statistical production? It's quite possible that guys like Josh Allen and Patrick Mahomes will have the chance to catch and surpass him.

The thing that I always come back to with Josh Allen is this: He has the physical skillset, the will, the work ethic, and the mindset to go down as the greatest quarterback to ever play football. A lot goes into collecting Lombardi trophies, and a lot of that is out of his control. Strictly in terms of his skillset and his intangibles, he has a legitimate chance to be the greatest of all time. The mere fact that he possesses the potential to achieve that lofty goal is mind boggling, but I don't see how anyone can refute it. Pro football has never seen anyone like Josh Allen before.

50, 60, do I hear 65; 65, 65, do I hear 70.  Just kidding Logic.

 

Allen if not seriously injured someday and I don’t think he will get hurt is going to be a 1st ballot HOFer.  I just can’t believe we will have him as our leader of the Bills for another 13 years or more.

[Niagara Dude]

15 hours ago, Logic said:

Excellent article on The Athletic today. I'll post just the opening, but it's a long and great read. Highly recommended.

https://theathletic.com/3546121/2022/09/01/josh-allen-bills/


 

The NFL had never seen anything like him.

Randall Cunningham was all sinew and slither, a human elastic band who could loop and snap on every run or pass. Sports Illustrated labeled him “The Ultimate Weapon.” Vapor trails whooshed from the Eagles quarterback as he leaped, arm cocked, across the cover of its 1989 NFL preview edition.

“He was a nightmare,” Hall of Fame quarterback Dan Fouts said.

Make Cunningham two inches taller, 25 pounds heavier and willing to truck a linebacker and you’ve got Josh Allen. Thirty-three years after Cunningham’s skill set was deemed nonpareil and the future of the sport, Allen has looked ultimate-r.

“John Madden was fixated by Josh Allen,” said Los Angeles Times reporter Sam Farmer, who communicated regularly with Madden until the football icon’s December death. In texts, Madden referred to Allen as “an animal,” “a beast” and “worth the price of admission.”

“Josh Allen is unusual,” said Hall of Fame coach Bill Parcells, the NFL’s all-decade coach for the 1990s. “There are not many who come along like this guy.”

Allen wasn’t voted to the Pro Bowl last year and never has led the league in a conventional passing statistic, but he enters 2022 as the Super Bowl favorite’s wickedest weapon and the leading candidate for MVP. But what if Allen is more than that? What if his unique combination of rocketry, elusiveness and verve can transcend being the man of the moment to become a quarterback for the ages?

He is already part of a young quarterback generation that has made coaches reimagine the game.

Patrick Mahomes won an MVP Award at 23 years old, Lamar Jackson at 22. Joe Burrow led the Bengals to the Super Bowl in his second season. Justin Herbert, also entering his third year, is a popular choice in the “what one player would you build your team around” conversation.

Within that group, however, Allen might possess the most complete array of desired traits: size, arm strength, accuracy, running ability, football IQ, character and ambition.

“We’ve seen moments where Josh has put that all together,” said Hall of Fame quarterback and NFL Network analyst Kurt Warner. “When he does, I mean, he’s as unique as anybody that we’ve seen play the position.

“When you add the unicorn running skills and the size that goes with it, your mind’s blown at all the possibilities with Josh.”

 

I am glad we drafted him and have him,  end of the day he still needs to win a chip or they will never include him among the greats.  Last season in the playoffs he played better than any QB in Bills playoff history including Jim Kelly.

 

I do believe he finally has a defense that can make plays upfront and get off the field. Fans crying about losing coin flip should be complaining about our defense not getting a stop in both final 13 sec and OT. Our defense was fake news last year with stats pumped up against bad QB'S during the regular season. As for Josh,  I prefer they call less designed runs and save those calls for the playoffs when it really matters.

[wjag]

14 hours ago, The Wiz said:

Because people look at his stats and don't watch him play is my guess. 

Buffalo played in more bad weather games than any other team last year.  That never gets taken into consideration.  Imagine what his stats might look like if he played in decent weather most weeks. 

[Son of a K-Gun]

16 hours ago, Gene1973 said:

He really needs to win a SB to match all this praise.

 

Funny how Maddem thought of him. His kind of QB I imagine.

 

Josh Allen would 100% be on the All-Madden Team if that was still around...a QB that throws around LB's and DL's?  Hell yes.

 

14 hours ago, LeGOATski said:

Money isn't the only factor that keeps top athletes away from football. In football, you have to take hits. It's more of a physical fight than any other ball sport outside of rugby.

 

Boxing and MMA might have an argument as more of a physical fight since they actually are physical fights...but yes, good point.

 

13 hours ago, notwoz said:

John Madden's been dead since December 2021. He dug up those quotes from some long-ago story. 

 

Perhaps Tim reached out to Oda Mae Brown for the Madden quotes?

[starrymessenger]

3 hours ago, Niagara Dude said:

I am glad we drafted him and have him,  end of the day he still needs to win a chip or they will never include him among the greats.  Last season in the playoffs he played better than any QB in Bills playoff history including Jim Kelly.

 

I do believe he finally has a defense that can make plays upfront and get off the field. Fans crying about losing coin flip should be complaining about our defense not getting a stop in both final 13 sec and OT. Our defense was fake news last year with stats pumped up against bad QB'S during the regular season. As for Josh,  I prefer they call less designed runs and save those calls for the playoffs when it really matters.

Defence matters needless to say. Defence might be the real reason why Tom is by many considered « better » than Peyton Manning. Had a top 10 defence every Super Bowl season in NE. Peyton not so much.

2 hours ago, Son of a K-Gun said:

 

Josh Allen would 100% be on the All-Madden Team if that was still around...a QB that throws around LB's and DL's?  Hell yes.

 

 

Boxing and MMA might have an argument as more of a physical fight since they actually are physical fights...but yes, good point.

 

 

Perhaps Tim reached out to Oda Mae Brown for the Madden quotes?

Well he did say ball sport. Not taking anything away from Brady’s longevity but Sonny Liston was 44 years old when he first fought Ali.

[Tanoros]

18 hours ago, Buffalo68 said:

Freaking Athletic charges to access the article. Already pay for Buff News...

The Athletic is hands down the best sports writing service around. Just saying. It’s worth the subscription. 

[Son of a K-Gun]

15 minutes ago, starrymessenger said:

Well he did say ball sport. Not taking anything away from Brady’s longevity but Sonny Liston was 44 years old when he first fought Ali.

Ah missed "ball" completely...sorry for doubting you @LeGOATski

[julian]

4 hours ago, Niagara Dude said:

I am glad we drafted him and have him,  end of the day he still needs to win a chip or they will never include him among the greats.  Last season in the playoffs he played better than any QB in Bills playoff history including Jim Kelly.

 

I do believe he finally has a defense that can make plays upfront and get off the field. Fans crying about losing coin flip should be complaining about our defense not getting a stop in both final 13 sec and OT. Our defense was fake news last year with stats pumped up against bad QB'S during the regular season. As for Josh,  I prefer they call less designed runs and save those calls for the playoffs when it really matters.

It’s the greatest playoff performance by any QB in league history not just Bills history

[ddaryl]

19 hours ago, Logic said:

If we only go by wins and longevity, it's quite possible that no one will ever touch Brady.

 

 

 

They say this record, that record, or that player will never be topped then somebody comes along and does. 

 

I've hear pundits proclaim these things throughout the years... 

 

Most of them have been proven wrong already,  I'm sure the rest will be proven wrong... eventually

[The Wiz]

43 minutes ago, julian said:

It’s the greatest playoff performance by any QB in league history not just Bills history

And you know, he's already in the hall of fame as the 1st and only qb to throw for 100 tds and rush for 20 in his first 4 season. 

 

No biggie though. 

[GoBills808]

6 hours ago, Niagara Dude said:

I am glad we drafted him and have him,  end of the day he still needs to win a chip or they will never include him among the greats.  Last season in the playoffs he played better than any QB in Bills playoff history including Jim Kelly.

 

I do believe he finally has a defense that can make plays upfront and get off the field. Fans crying about losing coin flip should be complaining about our defense not getting a stop in both final 13 sec and OT. Our defense was fake news last year with stats pumped up against bad QB'S during the regular season. As for Josh,  I prefer they call less designed runs and save those calls for the playoffs when it really matters.

Not for nothing but last season in the playoffs he played better than any QB in history period

[Gugny]

2 hours ago, Tanoros said:

The Athletic is hands down the best sports writing service around. Just saying. It’s worth the subscription. 

 

Just re-upped for $19 for the year (last year was $12).

[Niagara Dude]

6 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Not for nothing but last season in the playoffs he played better than any QB in history period

The point is he still never won a chip,  the moment was stolen from him by his defence.  Playing lights out for two games and only winning one is not going to considered the best in league history because many others played great in 4 games including the Super Bowl

[ToGoGo]

1 minute ago, Niagara Dude said:

The point is he still never won a chip,  the moment was stolen from him by his defence.  Playing lights out for two games and only winning one is not going to considered the best in league history because many others played great in 4 games including the Super Bowl

 

Whenever I think about the Chiefs letdown I think about how Allen and McDermott have always stepped up their game to an even higher level after every letdown. 

 

Remember Sugar High Josh? Remember when we couldn't get past the Pats? Remember no 300 yard games? Remember no playoffs? Then no wins in the playoffs since 1995? No AFC East in 20 years? You can't teach accuracy? 

 

At some point, you got to give these guys the benefit of the doubt. 

 

I think "it was stolen from him!" Is the wrong energy when it comes to winning championships. A great guy to look at for championship energy is Von Miller. 

 

He's relaxed. Has high expectations. Doesn't get too high or low. That's what a true winner looks like. They don't sulk, point fingers, scream at everyone, blame the defense, etc. That's Josh Rosen/Ryan Leaf stuff. 

 

I know the Bills will overcome the Chiefs loss and ignore the fans that want blood. I guess it's just annoying for me when fans have a "punish everyone" mindset. Maybe I'm just being selfish when I want that loser crap to stop. They're really just projecting. I guess I just want the fans of Buffalo to act like winners and not like losers. 

[The Wiz]

13 minutes ago, ToGoGo said:

 

Whenever I think about the Chiefs letdown I think about how Allen and McDermott have always stepped up their game to an even higher level after every letdown. 

 

Remember Sugar High Josh? Remember when we couldn't get past the Pats? Remember no 300 yard games? Remember no playoffs? Then no wins in the playoffs since 1995? No AFC East in 20 years? You can't teach accuracy? 

 

At some point, you got to give these guys the benefit of the doubt. 

 

I think "it was stolen from him!" Is the wrong energy when it comes to winning championships. A great guy to look at for championship energy is Von Miller. 

 

He's relaxed. Has high expectations. Doesn't get too high or low. That's what a true winner looks like. They don't sulk, point fingers, scream at everyone, blame the defense, etc. That's Josh Rosen/Ryan Leaf stuff. 

 

I know the Bills will overcome the Chiefs loss and ignore the fans that want blood. I guess it's just annoying for me when fans have a "punish everyone" mindset. Maybe I'm just being selfish when I want that loser crap to stop. They're really just projecting. I guess I just want the fans of Buffalo to act like winners and not like losers. 

The only thing I will say against this is that Miller has done it all over a long period of time. 

 

He's allowed to want blood and say he does because he has proven he will taste it. 

 

In terms of the rest of our big names, they can't come off as cocky because they haven't done it all.   

 

Think of Brady and Rodgers how they can get away with anything they want to say because they are them. 

 

Allen's not there yet, neither is Diggs. The rest of the team? They can't say anything at all. 

 

I get where you are coming from though and can't disagree with the rest.  

[Niagara Dude]

23 minutes ago, ToGoGo said:

 

Whenever I think about the Chiefs letdown I think about how Allen and McDermott have always stepped up their game to an even higher level after every letdown. 

 

Remember Sugar High Josh? Remember when we couldn't get past the Pats? Remember no 300 yard games? Remember no playoffs? Then no wins in the playoffs since 1995? No AFC East in 20 years? You can't teach accuracy? 

 

At some point, you got to give these guys the benefit of the doubt. 

 

I think "it was stolen from him!" Is the wrong energy when it comes to winning championships. A great guy to look at for championship energy is Von Miller. 

 

He's relaxed. Has high expectations. Doesn't get too high or low. That's what a true winner looks like. They don't sulk, point fingers, scream at everyone, blame the defense, etc. That's Josh Rosen/Ryan Leaf stuff. 

 

I know the Bills will overcome the Chiefs loss and ignore the fans that want blood. I guess it's just annoying for me when fans have a "punish everyone" mindset. Maybe I'm just being selfish when I want that loser crap to stop. They're really just projecting. I guess I just want the fans of Buffalo to act like winners and not like losers. 

Cliches are great,  he needs to win a chip.  I was a huge fan of those great Super Bowl teams,  just one chip and that would have been one of the greatest teams ever

[ToGoGo]

7 minutes ago, The Wiz said:

The only thing I will say against this is that Miller has done it all over a long period of time. 

 

He's allowed to want blood and say he does because he has proven he will taste it. 

 

In terms of the rest of our big names, they can't come off as cocky because they haven't done it all.   

 

Think of Brady and Rodgers how they can get away with anything they want to say because they are them. 

 

Allen's not there yet, neither is Diggs. The rest of the team? They can't say anything at all. 

 

I get where you are coming from though and can't disagree with the rest.  

 

I'll believe it when I see it. 

 

VS

 

I'll see it when I believe it  

 

 

 

Let's agree to disagree. 

1 minute ago, Niagara Dude said:

Cliches are great,  he needs to win a chip.  I was a huge fan of those great Super Bowl teams,  just one chip and that would have been one of the greatest teams ever

 

Then I guess the only thing we need to do is wait. 

[Forlorn hope]

40 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

The point is he still never won a chip,  the moment was stolen from him by his defence.  Playing lights out for two games and only winning one is not going to considered the best in league history because many others played great in 4 games including the Super Bowl

The moment was stolen by McDermott. Can we please just be honest 

[Chaos]

People love Beane and McDermott.  But the truth be told, if Allen had been a bust, both would be out of Buffalo.  Josh Allen is a career maker. 

[The Wiz]

30 minutes ago, ToGoGo said:

 

I'll believe it when I see it. 

 

VS

 

I'll see it when I believe it  

 

 

 

Let's agree to disagree. 

Not sure I disagreed with you on anything. Just saying Miller can run his mouth about stuff all he wants because he's done it all, the rest haven't so they are pitching the company line of "one game at a time" while Miller is saying "I want another 'ship"

 

I agreed with everything else you said prior. 

[Forlorn hope]

30 minutes ago, Chaos said:

People love Beane and McDermott.  But the truth be told, if Allen had been a bust, both would be out of Buffalo.  Josh Allen is a career maker. 

I'm not 100% sold on that. 

 

2017 bought them a lot of time 

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

47 minutes ago, Forlorn hope said:

The moment was stolen by McDermott. Can we please just be honest 

Do we really have to do this again ???

[Forlorn hope]

2 minutes ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Do we really have to do this again ???

Do what again

 

You can't have Josh Allen as your QB and not win a couple super bowls dude. Period

 

Doug Collins was fired by the bulls, a good coach. But it is what it is. Eventually you must win chips if you have a talent like mj

 

Marty schottenheimer 

 

Dan reeves 

 

It happens man. You can't have Josh Allen as a talent and screw up that bad. He's under a lot of pressure and rightfully so. I'm not worried about Josh Allen. I am concerned about McDermott in pressure situations 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 3, 2022 by Forlorn hope

[Chaos]

16 minutes ago, Forlorn hope said:

I'm not 100% sold on that. 

 

2017 bought them a lot of time 

Its 2022. 

[Forlorn hope]

1 minute ago, Chaos said:

Its 2022. 

I think he's saying if Allen was a bust, McDermott and Beane would've been gone. I'm not sure about that. I think Terry would've given them a few more years to find the guy

[ganesh]

On 9/2/2022 at 6:06 AM, Steptide said:

Isn't it crazy how many of us (myself included) thought the bills made a horrible pick in that draft? Gotta hand it to beane and the staff for having that foresight. 

The credit goes to Allen for working hard and becoming the best in his craft

the Bills coaching staff for being patient with him and then putting him in places to succeed

Beane and his team for surrounding Allen with some top talent

1 hour ago, Chaos said:

People love Beane and McDermott.  But the truth be told, if Allen had been a bust, both would be out of Buffalo.  Josh Allen is a career maker. 

That is how it goes in the NFL.  However, see my other post....It is coming together of all things....Beane and McDermott have a strong role to play in Allens success and hence vice versa

16 hours ago, eball said:

I encourage Bills fans to take a step back and simply enjoy whatever run we have with Josh.  The “we have to win the SB this year or the season is a failure” mentality is, in my own insignificant opinion, unhealthy.

 

As the article suggests, JA is probably a once-in-a-lifetime talent — not a trend of NFL QBs into the future.  If things progress as they should, the championships will follow given the strong organizational structure in Buffalo.

 

I’m going to enjoy the hell out of this.

 

+1

[Doc]

1 hour ago, Chaos said:

People love Beane and McDermott.  But the truth be told, if Allen had been a bust, both would be out of Buffalo.  Josh Allen is a career maker. 

 

That's true for any team.  You don't draft well and/or win, you get booted.

[The Wiz]

10 hours ago, Forlorn hope said:

You can't have Josh Allen as your QB and not win a couple super bowls dude. Period

Sure you can.

 

Super bowl wins:

Manning: 2 (2 different teams)

Brees: 1

Elway: 2

Kelly: 0

Marino: 0

 

I understand Allen is a freak of nature compared to most of these guys but yea, it's definitely possible for it to happen.

[Boatdrinks]

15 hours ago, Chaos said:

People love Beane and McDermott.  But the truth be told, if Allen had been a bust, both would be out of Buffalo.  Josh Allen is a career maker. 

There’s truth in this, but that’s almost always the case in the NFL. Being right with a high draft pick QB buys you a lot of time. A bust and you’ve got one foot out the door. 

[Doc]

Just now, Boatdrinks said:

There’s truth in this, but that’s almost always the case in the NFL. Being right with a high draft pick QB buys you a lot of time. A bust and you’ve got one foot out the door. 

 

The thing is, they didn't give up a lot to get Josh.  They traded up from 21 to 12 with Cordy Glenn, who was done.  Then they traded 2-2nd rounders to move to 7.  Contrast that with what the 49'ers and Bears gave up to get their QBs.  Now those are guys on the hot seat.

[Dukestreetking]

 

23 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Not for nothing but last season in the playoffs he played better than any QB in history period

 

Ok, I'll beat this horse to death: JA actually has highest passer rating in NFL PLAYOFF history at at 106.6. He stands above Mahomes, Bart Starr, Kurt Warner and everyone else.

[Chaos]

2 hours ago, Boatdrinks said:

There’s truth in this, but that’s almost always the case in the NFL. Being right with a high draft pick QB buys you a lot of time. A bust and you’ve got one foot out the door. 

yes which means we all mainly love Josh. 

[Boatdrinks]

7 hours ago, Chaos said:

yes which means we all mainly love Josh. 

True. I mean I’ve never seen anyone with a Beane jersey in the stands. Still, he deserves some credit for the pick. In Trumpian fashion, I like GMs that don’t miss on 1st round QBs. 

[ToGoGo]

Wow. How fast did some fans go from "this coaching staff made Josh Allen" to "Josh Allen made this coaching staff". 

 

Just admit everybody is good here. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

On 9/2/2022 at 8:29 PM, Chaos said:

People love Beane and McDermott.  But the truth be told, if Allen had been a bust, both would be out of Buffalo.  Josh Allen is a career maker. 

McDermott broke the franchise drought with Tyrod. If Josh were a bust they would’ve moved on quickly. 

10 hours ago, Dukestreetking said:

 

 

Ok, I'll beat this horse to death: JA actually has highest passer rating in NFL PLAYOFF history at at 106.6. He stands above Mahomes, Bart Starr, Kurt Warner and everyone else.

something about him…. This bigger the game the more he balls out. 

[Dr.Sack]

20-0. Go get it!

[AlfaBill]

On 9/2/2022 at 6:29 PM, Chaos said:

People love Beane and McDermott.  But the truth be told, if Allen had been a bust, both would be out of Buffalo.  Josh Allen is a career maker. 

This is a popular yet silly argument. If, maybe, but….blah blah. Fact: the did draft JA when 6 other teams passed. Fact: they made the playoffs after 17 years in their first season. Fact: they have drafted or traded for star players aside from JA. 
 

 

[Chaos]

23 minutes ago, AlfaBill said:

This is a popular yet silly argument. If, maybe, but….blah blah. Fact: the did draft JA when 6 other teams passed. Fact: they made the playoffs after 17 years in their first season. Fact: they have drafted or traded for star players aside from JA. 
 

 

You are entitled to your opinion. No matter how wrong it is. 

[AlfaBill]

24 minutes ago, Chaos said:

You are entitled to your opinion. No matter how wrong it is. 

As are you. No matter how stupid you sound.