Pass Interference in the NFL is a complete joke

[muppy]

Watching the Bills, and then redzone for the late games. I counted 10 PI calls that were either missed,  or called PI and absolutely horrible calls.

 

The Bills game had 3-4 by itself. The missed PI on Diggs bing one, and then the awful PI Diggs drew the next drive (or same drive) that was a terrible call on the defender

 

What can the NFL do to solve this? I'm a fan of letting them play, but then you leave it as an arbitrary decision to the guy throwing the flag, which circles back to where we are now. Is the uncatchable ball rule even exist anymore?

 

I cant remember the last time I watched an NFL game (Bills or other) where there wasn't absolutely brutal penalty calls that had a major impact on the game itself.

 

Have a ref upstairs.......If someone misses a penalty like PI buzz down and throw the flag. If someone calls a ridiculous holding penalty on the backside of a play where it had absolutely no outcome, Buzz down, and tell them to pick it up

 

/rant 

 

#ForwardLateral

Edited September 29, 2021 by Muppy

[Buffalo_Stampede]

I just wish pass interference wasn’t a spot foul. I don’t really get upset over missed calls anymore because I expect incorrect or missed PI calls to affect the game.

Edited September 29, 2021 by Buffalo_Stampede

[Gugny]

1 minute ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

I just wish pass interference wasn’t a spot foul. I don’t really get upset over missed calls anymore because I expect missed PI calls to affect the game.

 

It'd be tough for it not to be a spot foul.  WRs would be getting tackled early on every pass over 15 yards (assuming the penalty would be a 15-yard penalty instead of a spot foul). 

 

I expect missed PI calls to happen in every game.  It's only the egregious ones that piss me off.

[eball]

Almost every penalty in the NFL that involves action during the play (as opposed to false starts, Offside, dead ball fouls) is subject to interpretation.  PI is no different than offensive holding.  I've stopped worrying or complaining about penalty calls...you know going into every game that they will occur -- you just hope a bad call doesn't truly impact the result of the game (unless it is in the Bills' favor).

 

All in all the referees do a pretty remarkable job.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

5 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

It'd be tough for it not to be a spot foul.  WRs would be getting tackled early on every pass over 15 yards (assuming the penalty would be a 15-yard penalty instead of a spot foul). 

 

I expect missed PI calls to happen in every game.  It's only the egregious ones that piss me off.

No they wouldn’t.

[nucci]

5 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

It'd be tough for it not to be a spot foul.  WRs would be getting tackled early on every pass over 15 yards (assuming the penalty would be a 15-yard penalty instead of a spot foul). 

 

I expect missed PI calls to happen in every game.  It's only the egregious ones that piss me off.

DBs grab players now when they get beat and it's a 5 yd holding penalty.

[uninja]

4 minutes ago, eball said:

Almost every penalty in the NFL that involves action during the play (as opposed to false starts, Offside, dead ball fouls) is subject to interpretation.  PI is no different than offensive holding.  I've stopped worrying or complaining about penalty calls...you know going into every game that they will occur -- you just hope a bad call doesn't truly impact the result of the game (unless it is in the Bills' favor).

 

All in all the referees do a pretty remarkable job.

 

We need to stop having some unrealistic expectation that refereeing is some binary black/white thing where we expect games to be officiated perfectly and everything to be perfectly picked up and flagged. The NFL rulebook, almost by design, is massively complicated and very open to subjective interpretation if you read some of the rules. The idea that you'd perfectly call and flag any holding that happens in the trenches is laughable. The idea that you'd perfectly call any illegal contact, holding or pass interference calls for an entire game is equally laughable.

 

Bad calls, missed calls etc are part of the fabric of the game. They're amazing when they bounce in our favor and fill us with rage when they don't. It's part of the excitement, the anger and the passion that we feel as we watch our team play every week. I like how soccer has kind of leaned into this aspect of refereeing and said "yeah we mostly call the game to keep things under control and let it flow, yeah we're going to make some bad calls, miss some others and it might impact the game one way or the other. That's just the way it is in the beautiful game."

[Stank_Nasty]

Wilcotts and Diehl on “The opening drive” right now on NFL radio talking about how wr’s are “getting away with murder” this year. 

[ProcessYaDigg]

20 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

It'd be tough for it not to be a spot foul.  WRs would be getting tackled early on every pass over 15 yards (assuming the penalty would be a 15-yard penalty instead of a spot foul). 

 

I expect missed PI calls to happen in every game.  It's only the egregious ones that piss me off.

I have to disagree.  College doesn't give a spot foul for this penalty

[Gugny]

3 minutes ago, ProcessYaDigg said:

I have to disagree.  College doesn't give a spot foul for this penalty

 

I don't watch college football, so this is interesting to me.

 

On deep passes, what is stopping a defender from tackling a WR while the pass is on its way?

[BisonMan]

Not that I'm upset about it but...the Hail Mary play at the end of the Chiefs-Chargers game was some of the worst officiating I've seen when it comes to pass interference. The Chiefs' players were being completely mugged as the ball came down with no attempt to play the ball on the play. 

 

 

 

[HereComesTheReignAgain]

Just now, Gugny said:

 

I don't watch college football, so this is interesting to me.

 

On deep passes, what is stopping a defender from tackling a WR while the pass is on its way?

I'm guessing the fact that a team could just run a fast receiver on a go route and wait for him to get tackled every time if that was the defender's strategy.  Take the 15 yard penalties.  Once you get to red zone, run a normal offense. 

[PaoloBillsFanFromItaly]

In my opinion we are in a time when DB are very penalized by DPI, in order to get back to a fair game:

 

- Don't allow the WR/TE to push (extending the arms) to get separation at the top of the route, call OPI damn it! [in the rules but rarely called]

- Allow the DB to play through the receiver if DB is playing the ball. Of course DB cannot HIT before the ball arrives, but some contact (basketball style) must be allowed. This will allow DB to defend taller and heavier TEs on curl routes. [update the rules]

- Allow the DB to defend his position  [in the rules, but sometimes DPI is called when contact occurs]

- Don't call DPI if offender initiates contact and DB is not playing the ball (the infamous call on Levi in Steelers game) [I think it is in the rules, but most of the times it goes the other way]

- Allow the DB to guard the offender without playing the ball and without initiating contact [it's in the rules, but sometimes DPI is called]

- Don't call DPI if ball cannot be received [it's in the rules, but very rarely applied]

- Allow hand-checking and hand-fighting, call DPI only if DB grab the jersey and/or lock the arm, and/or block the receiver (one block is allowed no more than 5 yards downfield) [I think rules are not clear]

- LB are allowed to hit the receveivers less than 5 yds downfield (usually on crossing patterns) ? Time ago was a big part of the game. I want to see this again.

[pennstate10]

If you think about it, the logic for a spot foul is flawed. The assumption being made is that the receiver would have caught the ball if not for PI. 
 

by that same logic, OPI should be an interception. 
 

DPI should be a 15 yd penalty. 

Edited September 29, 2021 by pennstate10
Clarify DPI

[BisonMan]

4 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

I don't watch college football, so this is interesting to me.

 

On deep passes, what is stopping a defender from tackling a WR while the pass is on its way?

Nothing stops this strategy but...

 

On a lot of deep throws in college, the receivers are "college open" so these deep throws are not contested. On plays with better coverage, like the NFL, the DBs try to make a play on the ball to avoid the penalty and potentially make an INT. So, only the situations where the receiver has a couple of steps on the DB are when that strategy would be typically employed. So, the situation doesn't actually come up as often as you might think, IMHO.

[PaoloBillsFanFromItaly]

1 minute ago, pennstate10 said:

If you think about it, the logic for a spot foul is flawed. The assumption being made is that the receiver would have caught the ball if not for PI. 
 

by that same logic, OPI should be an interception. 
 

DPI should be a 15 yd penalty. 

 

Hmmm no, I agree on the spot foul.

 

I don't agree that when the ball is contented between the receiver and the DB, a catch is called.

It shouldn't be an interception either.

It should be called an incomplete pass.

[Careca]

At a certain point you have to accept that the refs can (and do!) easily determine how any given game goes based solely on what penalties they do and do not call.

 

Personally I just try to make jokes about it when I am watching with folks, but otherwise it has kind of made the sport a lot less interesting for me. Enjoy the camaraderie and whatnot you get from talking about the games... but do not take it too seriously. Otherwise the fact that refs will call penalties that even the announcers are completely mystified by can easily grow to be a real sore spot.

[PaoloBillsFanFromItaly]

3 minutes ago, Careca said:

At a certain point you have to accept that the refs can (and do!) easily determine how any given game goes based solely on what penalties they do and do not call.

 

Personally I just try to make jokes about it when I am watching with folks, but otherwise it has kind of made the sport a lot less interesting for me. Enjoy the camaraderie and whatnot you get from talking about the games... but do not take it too seriously. Otherwise the fact that refs will call penalties that even the announcers are completely mystified by can easily grow to be a real sore spot.

 

Thing is that most calls can be easily reversed by watching on replays.

But when challenging the PI was a thing, the refs simply refused to overturn the calls.

[dollars 2 donuts]

51 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

I just wish pass interference wasn’t a spot foul. I don’t really get upset over missed calls anymore because I expect incorrect or missed PI calls to affect the game.

 

48 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

It'd be tough for it not to be a spot foul.  WRs would be getting tackled early on every pass over 15 yards (assuming the penalty would be a 15-yard penalty instead of a spot foul). 

 

I expect missed PI calls to happen in every game.  It's only the egregious ones that piss me off.

 

 

I am not saying I am even for this idea, but giving it consideration maybe 15 yards, but a spot foul in the last two minutes of the half and game.

 

You could really destroy some potentially exciting finishes by just PI-ing every single play to kill clock and run the game out.  

[BIGFOOTspaceman]

This is a touchy subject for because PI is such a game changer. Aaron Rodgers is the GOAT of getting this call. Watch a Packer game, his MO, when all receivers are covered, he throws it long, just out of the reach of everyone and hopes for a PI call. On Monday night he got several of them. 
 

With all the time it takes to throw the flag, have a conference, talk with the coaches and then announce the penalty, we’ve already seen the replay at least twice and could be determined in the booth. 

[Rocky Landing]

One word: Robots.

[Jobot]

Might be an unpopular opinion.. but that Knox TD was maybe the most blatant no-calls for offesnsive PI that I've ever seen. I felt bad for the defender.

[muppy]

16 minutes ago, BIGFOOTspaceman said:

This is a touchy subject for because PI is such a game changer. Aaron Rodgers is the GOAT of getting this call. Watch a Packer game, his MO, when all receivers are covered, he throws it long, just out of the reach of everyone and hopes for a PI call. On Monday night he got several of them. 
 

With all the time it takes to throw the flag, have a conference, talk with the coaches and then announce the penalty, we’ve already seen the replay at least twice and could be determined in the booth. 

this is why I thought this topic would broach some great discussion. The booth reviews and such after 2 replays is usually pretty obvious one way or the other or they are overturned. If PI type calls/noncalls still can directly determine game outcomes I think something could be done to Rectify an obvious missed or blown call. Period. Booth referee?

 

Fulltime NFL officials is a fact right?  perdon if Im wrong there. 

 

EDIT WRONG still part time to be an NFL official.  Interesting....

Edited September 29, 2021 by Muppy

[Damian]

Gilliam got mauled trying to catch the TD pass and they didn't call it.  Johnston, the announcer who was a fullback for the Cowboys, said they didn't call it because fullbacks are too tough.

[LeGOATski]

To be a great team, you have to overcome the refs too. Just a fact of life in the NFL.

[Jobot]

7 minutes ago, Damian said:

Gilliam got mauled trying to catch the TD pass and they didn't call it.  Johnston, the announcer who was a fullback for the Cowboys, said they didn't call it because fullbacks are too tough.

 

Yeah, such an idiotic comment. Diggs also got tackled while he was mid-air and got a no call.

[PaoloBillsFanFromItaly]

25 minutes ago, Jobot said:

Might be an unpopular opinion.. but that Knox TD was maybe the most blatant no-calls for offesnsive PI that I've ever seen. I felt bad for the defender.

 

I agree, Knox pushed to get separation.

Receivers get away with OPI more often than not.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

I’m always amused that people think CBs that get beat deep are just going to take a 15 yard penalty. It makes no sense at all. 

[TBBills]

So basically you want a flag on every play of the game?

[Thurman#1]

2 hours ago, Muppy said:

Watching the Bills, and then redzone for the late games. I counted 10 PI calls that were either missed,  or called PI and absolutely horrible calls.

 

The Bills game had 3-4 by itself. The missed PI on Diggs bing one, and then the awful PI Diggs drew the next drive (or same drive) that was a terrible call on the defender

 

What can the NFL do to solve this? I'm a fan of letting them play, but then you leave it as an arbitrary decision to the guy throwing the flag, which circles back to where we are now. Is the uncatchable ball rule even exist anymore?

 

I cant remember the last time I watched an NFL game (Bills or other) where there wasn't absolutely brutal penalty calls that had a major impact on the game itself.

 

Have a ref upstairs.......If someone misses a penalty like PI buzz down and throw the flag. If someone calls a ridiculous holding penalty on the backside of a play where it had absolutely no outcome, Buzz down, and tell them to pick it up

 

/rant 

 

#ForwardLateral

 

 

It's as good as any system to deal with this problem can be. Any corrections would create their own problems.

 

Those ten PI calls you counted, would probably be disagreed with about half the time by reasonable people.

[muppy]

1 minute ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

It's as good as any system to deal with this problem can be. Any corrections would create their own problems.

 

Those ten PI calls you counted, would probably be disagreed with about half the time by reasonable people.

very reasoned take but I still think game changing incorrect/bogus playcalls will exist and if your attitude is cie le vie than we will agree to disagree.

[DQW87]

I agree with a lot of the posts on how ridiculous some of the pass interference calls are getting.  What drives me crazy the most is how touchy they will call them all season, then comes the playoffs and it's totally different and you have to actually mug someone to get a flag.  I wish they'd at least keep in consistent all season long.

 

Edited September 29, 2021 by DQW87
double post

[Don Otreply]

Well, in which that the entirety of the reffing officials and their administration is a joke, this does stand to reason.
 

The real problem is that the owners (who are the league) don’t actually care very much, as long as half azsing this department doesn’t disrupt the cash flow.

 

Always remember, in the NFL,  money is first, football comes in a distant second.

 

Yes it sucks but it is the truth…,

 

Go Bills!!!

[Jobot]

10 minutes ago, DQW87 said:

I agree with a lot of the posts on how ridiculous some of the pass interference calls are getting.  What drives me crazy the most is how touchy they will call them all season, then comes the playoffs and it's totally different and you have to actually mug someone to get a flag.  I wish they'd at least keep in consistent all season long.

 

 

This could arguably be a brilliant strategy for a team... Instill strict discipline all regular season, then get the reputation for being the least penalized team in the league, play overly aggressive with holds in the playoffs which legitimately destroys a game's level of fairness, Win super bowl!

[Direhard Fan]

Most of these calls do not get called in the playoffs.  Let them play like in the playoffs and ref all season like they are in the playoffs.

[Utah John]

There is a perfectly logical explanation for all the bad calls or non-calls.  Whether we like to think about this or not, the refs could be doing this on purpose.

 

-- First deep ball Allen threw to Diggs in the Miami game.  The defender tackled Diggs before the ball arrived.  No call.

-- Last deep throw from Brady to a WR at the end of the Bucs-Cowboys game.  The WR blatantly pushed off.  No OPI.  Pass caught, Bucs in FG range, FG made, Bucs win.

 

There are at least 2-3 games a year where an egregious call or non-call is made with a ref RIGHT THERE WATCHING.  Are they trying to shape the flow of the game?  Are they trying to help a home team win?  Or (God help the NFL) are they thinking about the point spread?

[Mr. WEO]

4 hours ago, nucci said:

DBs grab players now when they get beat and it's a 5 yd holding penalty.

 

Not if the ball is in the air beyond 5 yards.

 

Complaining about these things serves no purpose.  No one complains when a bad call goes their team's way.

9 minutes ago, Direhard Fan said:

Most of these calls do not get called in the playoffs.  Let them play like in the playoffs and ref all season like they are in the playoffs.

[CircleTheWagons99]

OPI should be a loss of downs on top of 15 yards. 

[Patrick Duffy]

4 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

It'd be tough for it not to be a spot foul.  WRs would be getting tackled early on every pass over 15 yards (assuming the penalty would be a 15-yard penalty instead of a spot foul). 

 

I expect missed PI calls to happen in every game.  It's only the egregious ones that piss me off.

I agree....however while the PI calls can be frustrating, it's the BS holding calls along with the "no calls" for holding when they just threw the flag earlier  for the same exact type or very similar. 

 

Lol, it drives me mad....they will flag a minor nonsense type of hold that basically happens every play, then next thing ya know, you see an OBVIOUS, Brutal, man handling type hold and will let that one go. 

[Paup 1995MVP]

5 hours ago, Muppy said:

Watching the Bills, and then redzone for the late games. I counted 10 PI calls that were either missed,  or called PI and absolutely horrible calls.

 

The Bills game had 3-4 by itself. The missed PI on Diggs bing one, and then the awful PI Diggs drew the next drive (or same drive) that was a terrible call on the defender

 

What can the NFL do to solve this? I'm a fan of letting them play, but then you leave it as an arbitrary decision to the guy throwing the flag, which circles back to where we are now. Is the uncatchable ball rule even exist anymore?

 

I cant remember the last time I watched an NFL game (Bills or other) where there wasn't absolutely brutal penalty calls that had a major impact on the game itself.

 

Have a ref upstairs.......If someone misses a penalty like PI buzz down and throw the flag. If someone calls a ridiculous holding penalty on the backside of a play where it had absolutely no outcome, Buzz down, and tell them to pick it up

 

/rant 

 

#ForwardLateral

I feel your pain Muppy.  Watch the college game and the same thing exists.  Way too many Def pass interference penalties being called.  And the targeting calls are absolutely out of control.  Any hit above the chest is going to be looked at.  I thought the rule was supposed to be about helmet to helmet contact.  Not hitting someone in the face or the side of the head w your shoulder.