Irv Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 Reading that the Bills are considering drafting Clemson RB Etienne. I'm sitting here trying to remember if we've ever drafted a decent player from Clemson. I can't think of any. Not one. Can you? Lawson, Spiller, Watkins, even going all the way to Perry Tuttle. All were high picks that did not work out. Would like to see the jinx broken if we take this kid. Based on the track record we're in trouble. 2 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US Egg Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 3 1 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brennan Huff Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 Smokescreen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fridge Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 (edited) So I looked up a list of all-time Clemson NFL players to see just how bad it was. I was thinking there's no way that there hasn't been some greats on there. I was wrong. It's bad. Like, real bad. Edited April 29, 2021 by fridge 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProcessYaDigg Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 2 minutes ago, fridge said: So I looked up a list of all-time Clemson NFL players to see just how bad it was. I e thinking there's no way that there hasn't been some greats on there. I was wrong. It's bad. Like, real bad. Maybe Jacksonville should reconsider their first overall selection 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 12 minutes ago, Irv said: Reading that the Bills are considering drafting Clemson RB Etienne. I'm sitting here trying to remember if we've ever drafted a decent player from Clemson. I can't think of any. Not one. Can you? Lawson, Spiller, Watkins, even going all the way to Perry Tuttle. All were high picks that did not work out. Would like to see the jinx broken if we take this kid. Based on the track record we're in trouble. Jerry Butler, but I agree, just say NO to Clemson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 How have other teams high Clemson draft picks turned out in the NFL the past 10 years? Sammy wasn't a complete bust but he certainly didn't live up to his draft status, same thing with CJ and Shaq. All of them had their moments in the NFL but were not consistently great or even good players in the league. I don't know if I believe that you should avoid players from certain school intrinsically but you do have to wonder about possible patterns. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 15 minutes ago, Irv said: Reading that the Bills are considering drafting Clemson RB Etienne. I'm sitting here trying to remember if we've ever drafted a decent player from Clemson. I can't think of any. Not one. Can you? Lawson, Spiller, Watkins, even going all the way to Perry Tuttle. All were high picks that did not work out. Would like to see the jinx broken if we take this kid. Based on the track record we're in trouble. One of my all-time favorite Bills, Jerry Butler was from Clemson. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irv Posted April 29, 2021 Author Share Posted April 29, 2021 1 minute ago, Buftex said: One of my all-time favorite Bills, Jerry Butler was from Clemson. Yes - he was good. After he retired, didn't own a bar on Bailey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 (edited) Good thing we wouldn't be using a "high" draft pick. Our 1st is a glorified 2nd Rounder. Big difference between taking ETN at 30 when the team doesn't really have any holes and taking Spiller at 10 or Watkins at 4 when the team has huge needs. Edited April 29, 2021 by BillsFanForever19 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Irv said: Yes - he was good. After he retired, didn't own a bar on Bailey? Hmmm...not sure about that. I remember he worked in the Bills front office in the 90's...then spent a lot of time in Cleveland as a WR coach, and then in their personnel department. I think he worked for the Broncos a bit after that. Wasn't aware of him owning any clubs. Edited April 29, 2021 by Buftex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vtnatefootball11 Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, billsfan89 said: How have other teams high Clemson draft picks turned out in the NFL the past 10 years? Sammy wasn't a complete bust but he certainly didn't live up to his draft status, same thing with CJ and Shaq. All of them had their moments in the NFL but were not consistently great or even good players in the league. I don't know if I believe that you should avoid players from certain school intrinsically but you do have to wonder about possible patterns. Fair analysis. I went to Clemson so I am not neutral in this, but even still I am reluctant for Clemson players to end up in Buffalo now in fear they don't work out and it ends up a being a double disappoint for me. It's actually funny because among Clemson fans, nobody wants the top Clemson players to go to Buffalo. They consider Buffalo the place where good Clemson players go to die! Despite this, I would be beyond excited if the Bills were able to get Etienne at 30. Watched him play every game the last 4 years, he is a threat every time he touches the ball, could put our offense over the top. Jury is still out on a lot of Clemson's high draft picks, as many were in the last 2-3 years. You have to remember that they have been really good for 10 years or so but really just started recruiting and competing at an elite level in the last 5 years. A few names I haven't seen mentioned in this thread though; DeAndre Hopkins was a home run pick for Houston, so was Deshaun Watson prior to these shocking legal developments. Dexter Lawrence and Christian Wilkins are doing well with NYG and Dolphins. Tee Higgins looked great for the Bengals last year. Vick Beasley had his moments in the league. McKensie Alexander has been a solid corner for a 2nd rounder, started a number of years in Minnesota. Jury is still out on first round picks AJ Terrell, Mike Williams, Isaiah Simmons, arguably Clelin Ferrel (although he was not worth the 4th pick in the draft). I'm still missing quite a few. There will be a lot more high round draft picks from Clemson in the next few years as well, particularly at QB, RB, WR and Dline. Edited April 29, 2021 by vtnatefootball11 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 More helmet scouting! I wonder if Jacksonville is having 2nd thoughts about Trevor! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 10 minutes ago, vtnatefootball11 said: A few names I haven't seen mentioned in this thread though; DeAndre Hopkins was a home run pick for Houston, so was Deshaun Watson prior to these shocking legal developments. Dexter Lawrence and Christian Wilkins are doing well with NYG and Dolphins. Tee Higgins looked great for the Bengals last year. Vick Beasley had his moments in the league. McKensie Alexander has been a solid corner for a 2nd rounder, started a number of years in Minnesota. Jury is still out on first round picks AJ Terrell, Mike Williams, Isaiah Simmons, arguably Clelin Ferrel (although he was not worth the 4th pick in the draft). I'm still missing quite a few. There will be a lot more high round draft picks from Clemson in the next few years as well, particularly at QB, RB, WR and Dline. Yea their recent crops have been better. Hopkins has been a star, Watson (onfield) has been a star, Higgins was great as a rookie and looks to me like a star, Dexter Lawrence is a beast. Grady Jarrett has been one of the most underrated players in the league the last half decade. DJ Reader got a big FA pay day from Cincy las year too.... so they have had their share of hits in recent years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: Yea their recent crops have been better. Hopkins has been a star, Watson (onfield) has been a star, Higgins was great as a rookie and looks to me like a star, Dexter Lawrence is a beast. Grady Jarrett has been one of the most underrated players in the league the last half decade. DJ Reader got a big FA pay day from Cincy las year too.... so they have had their share of hits in recent years. And Sammy is at least pretty good and has flashed some greatness. He won't have a career that measures up to his draft status, but he's probably going to end up with 500 receptions provided he stays reasonably healthy. 1 hour ago, fridge said: So I looked up a list of all-time Clemson NFL players to see just how bad it was. I was thinking there's no way that there hasn't been some greats on there. I was wrong. It's bad. Like, real bad. This has more info. Sort by AV and you'll see. Lots of good players. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/schools/clemson/index.htm 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 1 hour ago, fridge said: So I looked up a list of all-time Clemson NFL players to see just how bad it was. I was thinking there's no way that there hasn't been some greats on there. I was wrong. It's bad. Like, real bad. its funny— I did the same thing about a week ago and was sort of shocked. I used to have a “don’t draft a U of Texas player” rule— now I may change it to Clemson. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorquemada Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 (edited) I'm not sure of the dynamic but I do feel like the guys from the biggest programs (Alabama/OSU/ND/Clemson/LSU) tend to get overdrafted because of the success of their programs. Maybe because they get worked like rented mules while they're in school, maybe more than in lesser programs? Maybe not. Having said that, the draft really is a crapshoot. If i wasnt so lazy, i'd do some work in SAS or SPSS and figure out if there's any statistical correlation between draft position and success. My gut tells me that if there is a correlation, it's not real strong edit: ok maybe im not so lazy. some undergrad did a paper https://fisherpub.sjfc.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1064&context=sport_undergrad here's the conclusion, though it seems to be focused on offensive skill positions, i wouldn't be surprised if it applied teamwide: Conclusion Acknowledging that the sample for this research did not include every quarterback, running back, and wide receiver, the data may not accurately represent the NFL as a whole. However, the findings display evidence that individual offensive skill players that were drafted in the third through seventh round of the NFL draft do in fact have more successful careers than the individual skill players that were drafted in the first and second round. More specifically, this data illustrates that 60% of the third through seventh round running back and wide receiver sample have been more successful on the field than 40% of the same first and second round sample. With this information, NFL franchise front offices can re-evaluate their draft day selections and perhaps take more risks that could likely pay off in the future. Edited April 29, 2021 by dorquemada added study Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 1 hour ago, Irv said: Reading that the Bills are considering drafting Clemson RB Etienne. I'm sitting here trying to remember if we've ever drafted a decent player from Clemson. I can't think of any. Not one. Can you? Lawson, Spiller, Watkins, even going all the way to Perry Tuttle. All were high picks that did not work out. Would like to see the jinx broken if we take this kid. Based on the track record we're in trouble. You should edit this post and acknowledge Jerry Butler. 2 minutes ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said: its funny— I did the same thing about a week ago and was sort of shocked. I used to have a “don’t draft a U of Texas player” rule— now I may change it to Clemson. There are a lot of good NFL players from Clemson. People forget guys like Trevor Pryce, but he was a great player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streetkings01 Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 1 hour ago, fridge said: So I looked up a list of all-time Clemson NFL players to see just how bad it was. I was thinking there's no way that there hasn't been some greats on there. I was wrong. It's bad. Like, real bad. I made a post years ago on Billszone about Clemson players sucking in the NFL......looks like they haven’t done much to change that outside of a few players like D. Hopkins, D. Watson and M. Williams. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 39 minutes ago, vtnatefootball11 said: Fair analysis. I went to Clemson so I am not neutral in this, but even still I am reluctant for Clemson players to end up in Buffalo now in fear they don't work out and it ends up a being a double disappoint for me. It's actually funny because among Clemson fans, nobody wants the top Clemson players to go to Buffalo. They consider Buffalo the place where good Clemson players go to die! Despite this, I would be beyond excited if the Bills were able to get Etienne at 30. Watched him play every game the last 4 years, he is a threat every time he touches the ball, could put our offense over the top. Jury is still out on a lot of Clemson's high draft picks, as many were in the last 2-3 years. You have to remember that they have been really good for 10 years or so but really just started recruiting and competing at an elite level in the last 5 years. A few names I haven't seen mentioned in this thread though; DeAndre Hopkins was a home run pick for Houston, so was Deshaun Watson prior to these shocking legal developments. Dexter Lawrence and Christian Wilkins are doing well with NYG and Dolphins. Tee Higgins looked great for the Bengals last year. Vick Beasley had his moments in the league. McKensie Alexander has been a solid corner for a 2nd rounder, started a number of years in Minnesota. Jury is still out on first round picks AJ Terrell, Mike Williams, Isaiah Simmons, arguably Clelin Ferrel (although he was not worth the 4th pick in the draft). I'm still missing quite a few. There will be a lot more high round draft picks from Clemson in the next few years as well, particularly at QB, RB, WR and Dline. That recent list is definitely a very good list of players to come out. I didn't know Hopkins was a Clemson product and I forgot Watson was one too. Lawrence and Wilkins are also very good Pro-Bowl caliber players on that list. Thanks for the insight, not a huge college football fan myself so my draft knowledge tends to come from scouting reports and what people say on here which means I don't know ***** haha. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irv Posted April 29, 2021 Author Share Posted April 29, 2021 48 minutes ago, dave mcbride said: You should edit this post and acknowledge Jerry Butler. There are a lot of good NFL players from Clemson. People forget guys like Trevor Pryce, but he was a great player. Already did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cudi Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 2 hours ago, fridge said: So I looked up a list of all-time Clemson NFL players to see just how bad it was. I was thinking there's no way that there hasn't been some greats on there. I was wrong. It's bad. Like, real bad. So I guess according to the list Hopkins isn't considered good anymore? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 Guys how many phenomenal players have we drafted from Wyoming. If I have to tell you the reference you’re not a bills fan. this morning there was a debate on the radio who is QB U? No one. They come from everywhere. If you want me to keep going on Coe College etc., I can. kts about the player. Have their been years ago more solid linemen from Oklahoma, Nebraska, Illinois, sure. That’s not a predictor though. I know people are on edge for the draft. My feeling is finish you’re working day, kiss the kids, have you’re dinner, have a beer and enjoy or go to bed. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motorin' Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 57 minutes ago, dave mcbride said: You should edit this post and acknowledge Jerry Butler. There are a lot of good NFL players from Clemson. People forget guys like Trevor Pryce, but he was a great player. Brain Dawkins, Michael Dean Perry, Levon Kirkland... The Fridge, Dwight Freaking Clark. That top 10 list omits Hopkins, Watson.... Because these old guys were freaking great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 32 minutes ago, Motorin' said: Brain Dawkins, Michael Dean Perry, Levon Kirkland... The Fridge, Dwight Freaking Clark. That top 10 list omits Hopkins, Watson.... Because these old guys were freaking great. Yeah, Hopkins! He's obviously great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 (edited) If you’re a GM in the NFL, you really can’t not look a player cause he went to a certain school. If you’re a Bills fan on this board though playing GM (including all the serious GM wannabe’s), you live by your own rules. That’s why I won’t draft Ohio State QB’s, high-motor lunch-pail WR’s, or burn high draft picks on anyone from Clemson. Edited April 29, 2021 by Rico Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBBills Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 3 hours ago, Irv said: Reading that the Bills are considering drafting Clemson RB Etienne. I'm sitting here trying to remember if we've ever drafted a decent player from Clemson. I can't think of any. Not one. Can you? Lawson, Spiller, Watkins, even going all the way to Perry Tuttle. All were high picks that did not work out. Would like to see the jinx broken if we take this kid. Based on the track record we're in trouble. No they aren't so no need to worry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastport bills Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 Clemson never won championships with teams that sent previous draft choices to the NFL. Etienne and Lawrence won on the biggest stage. They were proven stars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soylent Green Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 These players would walk into the Bills starting lineup today: Nuk Hopkins Tee Higgins Christian Wilkins Dexter Lawrence Grady Jarrett DJ Reader AJ Terrell Travis Etienne These players would be at least perfectly acceptable squad depth: Mike Williams Hunter Renfrow (younger Cole Beasley) Mitch Hyatt Isaiah Simmons (bags of potential, poorly handled last season) Clelin Ferrell John Simpson Trevor Lawrence (ahem) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 8 minutes ago, Eastport bills said: Clemson never won championships with teams that sent previous draft choices to the NFL. Etienne and Lawrence won on the biggest stage. They were proven stars. Did you forget about the deshaun Watson Championship team? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 Trevor Pryce was a really good player for a long time, folks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastport bills Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 32 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: Did you forget about the deshaun Watson Championship team? Yea, we drafted Lawson from that team and he was productive enough to get a nice offer from Miami after his rookie deal. The other draft choices never played on good clubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaBillsFanSince1973 Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 (edited) run him until he pukes! Edited April 29, 2021 by A Firm Tree Does Not Fear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 4 hours ago, fridge said: So I looked up a list of all-time Clemson NFL players to see just how bad it was. I was thinking there's no way that there hasn't been some greats on there. I was wrong. It's bad. Like, real bad. Someone better get on the line & warn Urban Meyer before it's too late🤩 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 17 minutes ago, Eastport bills said: Yea, we drafted Lawson from that team and he was productive enough to get a nice offer from Miami after his rookie deal. The other draft choices never played on good clubs. Mike Williams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mat68 Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 Imo Spiller and Lawson became who many thought they would be. Spiller was a big play guy. Lawson is a strong edge setter who will get you hustle sacks. Watkins been injured and we didnt have a qb. Year 1 or 2 Watkins with Allen? He would have been an all pro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastport bills Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said: Mike Williams I responded to the post that called our drafting Clemson players underachievers and bad luck. Where does Williams enter into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 1 minute ago, Eastport bills said: I responded to the post that called our drafting Clemson players underachievers and bad luck. Where does Williams enter into it. He's on the LA Chargers having a pretty good career as a WR, he went to Clemson & is another of Clemson's NFL success stories. I can think of at least 3 Mike Williams, unfortunately the 2 who were with the Bills underachieved when they were here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 2 minutes ago, Eastport bills said: I responded to the post that called our drafting Clemson players underachievers and bad luck. Where does Williams enter into it. I responded to this - Clemson never won championships with teams that sent previous draft choices to the NFL. Etienne and Lawrence won on the biggest stage. They were proven stars. (No mention of Bills) I pointed out that deshaun’s team also won on the biggest stage and were proven stars. You responded with only mentioning Shaq. So I mentioned mike Williams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 6 hours ago, Irv said: Yes - he was good. After he retired, didn't own a bar on Bailey? 'Jerry Butler's Big Play' I think it was called. East side of Bailey Avenue, between the Kensington Expressway and Kensington Avenue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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