DCofNC Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 You wouldn’t find a GM to trade Maholmes for Allen, Tre and 2 first round picks, so I guess the answer is pretty clear. The best player in the league, already w a SB win and MVP award at 24 years old. It’s not important, but no, having Tre and Allen is not as good as having Maholmes, let alone had you taken him you wouldn’t have had to give up all those picks and Cordy Glenn to get to Allen. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Watkins' Rib Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 It's still too early to answer this question. Mahomes very well may go down as the GOAT when it is all said and done. Which as a Bills fan, I'd love to see him take that tile away from Brady. Honsestly, because the QB position far outweighs the all other positions in importance, even premium positions like edge rusher and CB, I think ultimately and with all due respect to Tre, White is irrelevant to the discussion. Tre will not be a top 5 CB in the league 10 years from now. Both Mahomes and Allen could be the two best QB's in the league 10 years from now and possibly even 15 years from now. Either of the QB's or both could be the best in the league for 10-12 straight years. White could be the best for a few seasons and very good for a few more. A HOF career even is possible for White but the difference in hitting on a HOF QB vs a HOF CB is huge. The good part is, based on the development we have seen from Allen thus far, I wouldn't say the kid can't achieve whatever level of success he pushes himself towards. Assigning blame to McDermott for passing on Mahomes I feel has always been silly. We didn't have a GM with Whaley having one leg out the door already. I think we went into that draft 100% knowing the plan would be to not draft a QB early that year. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised at all if that was pretty much decided and agreed upon during his interview process before his official hire. In the end it looks like Beane and McDermott selecting Allen could end up being rated as one of the all time greatest draft picks in terms of scouting a player that had so much against him in turning into an elite franchise QB. The other thing helping the Chiefs is that they don't exactly have a bad defense. And that is ultimately how the trade is graded. Which is the better overall team? Even if Tre is an all-pro this year again it doesn't mean much if the Chiefs have the better defense. Let's hope our defense gets out of this funk they are in but right now the Chiefs defense is one of the better and more underrated units in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Hooks Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 (edited) Mahomes is going to be the best qb of all time if he can stay healthy. With that said I wouldn’t trade Tre and Josh for him. I like how fun and entertaining our team is now, I wouldn’t trade it for anything, Edited October 3, 2020 by Bobby Hooks 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Come on. It’s been 3 games. If The Bills win they SB and Allen is the MVP, then maybe we should discuss this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddy KGB Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 2 hours ago, eball said: Isn’t it just a wee bit early to say that? I will freely admit he’s had an unprecedented start to his career. Not ready to hand out the GOAT hardware just yet though. You gotta watch some Chiefs games. Effortless domination. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCofNC Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 13 minutes ago, Bobby Hooks said: Mahomes is going to be the best qb of all time if he can stay healthy. With that said I wouldn’t trade Tre and Josh for him. I like how fun and entertaining our team is now, I wouldn’t trade it for anything, Glad to hear you wouldn’t make the trade, because it will NEVER be available haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unclepete Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 I would say yes. Mahommes looks like the Jordan of the NFL. Books still out on Josh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{::'KayCeeS::} Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Allen right now is playing at an All-Pro level. We know that White is already an All-Pro. Would you trade two All-Pro's for one might-be-GOAT? I wouldn't. I'm assuming Allen keeps on like he is of course, but I still wouldn't. Allen is OURS. He was born for us. There's everything to be said for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 6 minutes ago, {::'KayCeeS::} said: Allen right now is playing at an All-Pro level. We know that White is already an All-Pro. Would you trade two All-Pro's for one might-be-GOAT? I wouldn't. I'm assuming Allen keeps on like he is of course, but I still wouldn't. Allen is OURS. He was born for us. There's everything to be said for that. I would trade Allen to win a Super Bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{::'KayCeeS::} Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Just now, FireChans said: I would trade Allen to win a Super Bowl. Ok, but that's a fantasy. I might give up my left nut for a super bowl, but would I really do it if push came to shove? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 1 minute ago, {::'KayCeeS::} said: Ok, but that's a fantasy. I might give up my left nut for a super bowl, but would I really do it if push came to shove? I would Also be willing to have you give your left 🥜 for the Bills to win a SB! Sacrifice for all of us! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Real McClappy Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Bobby Hooks said: Mahomes is going to be the best qb of all time if he can stay healthy. With that said I wouldn’t trade Tre and Josh for him. I like how fun and entertaining our team is now, I wouldn’t trade it for anything, Good luck passing Brady, let alone Peyton or Brees. Edited October 3, 2020 by Real McNasty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddy KGB Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 4 minutes ago, FireChans said: I would trade Allen to win a Super Bowl. Id trade him for Mahomes or Wilson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{::'KayCeeS::} Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 5 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: I would Also be willing to have you give your left 🥜 for the Bills to win a SB! Sacrifice for all of us! Bro, we joke, but for real.... I would totally do it. (I tried to find the right emoji for this but either there's just too many or the right one doesn't exist yet!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 23 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said: You gotta watch some Chiefs games. Effortless domination. Umm, ok. He didn’t dominate the Chargers two weeks ago. He didn’t dominate the 49ers in the Super Bowl. I admit he’s a great QB who has had a fabulous start to his career. Since when do we start pronouncing players the GOAT after 3 seasons? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 3 hours ago, papazoid said: josh allen cost the bills 2 extra 2nd round picks (#12, #53 & #56) to move up 5 spots to #7 edmunds cost the bills 1 extra 3rd round pick (#22 - KC pick & #65) to move up 6 spots to #16 had you drafted mahomes at #10.....there is no josh or tre......but you still have #12, #53 & #56 draft picks....you can undo the edmunds trade too if you like mahomes and all those draft picks are still better..... by a lot fortunately josh is closing the gap......but mahomes is arguably the best player in the league at the most important position. This is the correct analysis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 26 minutes ago, {::'KayCeeS::} said: Ok, but that's a fantasy. I might give up my left nut for a super bowl, but would I really do it if push came to shove? That’s between you and your left nut. I would really trade Allen for a Super Bowl. 14 minutes ago, eball said: Umm, ok. He didn’t dominate the Chargers two weeks ago. He didn’t dominate the 49ers in the Super Bowl. I admit he’s a great QB who has had a fabulous start to his career. Since when do we start pronouncing players the GOAT after 3 seasons? Since we started asking if a player who is playing like an All-Pro for 3 games and an All-Pro DB is worth more than him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{::'KayCeeS::} Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, FireChans said: That’s between you and your left nut. I would really trade Allen for a Super Bowl. I guess the difference is I can no longer envision a Super Bowl without Allen. That's how much he's got his claws in me. But would I want a Super Bowl without Allen? I mean, what's the "DUH" emoji. Edited October 3, 2020 by {::'KayCeeS::} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 It’s a moot point. We can make the same old argument if only Buddy drafted Wilson..... We took Tre, and then Allen, done. They were right in their guess on Mahomes. I’m happy for KC and I always liked Reid. He’s another Philly guy like McD and the great Jimmy Johnson (RIP). No one knows how well Mahomes plays if he goes to Buffalo, and we don’t know how good this defense would be without Tre. Allen is blossoming into a possible MVP year and our QB for the next decade barring injuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_In_NH Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 (edited) Mahomes 1 sb. Allen and white. 0 sb’s. For a hypothetical like this that is how I will judge it. So it’s a no brainer til the bills win the sb Edited October 3, 2020 by mattynh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott7975 Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 I don't know the answer to that. All I can say is I like the players we have. Allen and Tre are awesome. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 4 hours ago, cage said: Maybe the OP lives in Europe?? If so, the answer would be you for being awake to read it.... I blame my dogs. They go into a breakfast anticipation frenzy every morning around 4:00. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted October 3, 2020 Author Share Posted October 3, 2020 9 hours ago, Mickey said: I don't know what makes me more sad, that you are starting a thread at 4:30 am or that I am awake to read it. 😁 I live in Japan. It's 2:50 a.m. here now and I'm going to bed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted October 3, 2020 Author Share Posted October 3, 2020 2 hours ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said: It's still too early to answer this question. Mahomes very well may go down as the GOAT when it is all said and done. Which as a Bills fan, I'd love to see him take that tile away from Brady. It absolutely is too early. But it's also too early to know who'll win this week's game and yet we're talking about it. And puh-lenty of people who thought over the last two years that the answer was that there was absolutely no way the Bill had NOT made a huge mistake ... posted here again and again ... a year or two ago on the same subject. I mean, you're right, it's too early. But by the time it's not, the discussion won't be very interesting anymore. Let's say Allen spends the rest of his career playing at exactly this level or just a tiny fraction lower. What's the answer then? IMO the Bills win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 2 hours ago, Teddy KGB said: You gotta watch some Chiefs games. Effortless domination. Sticking to your guns on best ever, are ya? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Both Mahomes and Allen can be good for their respective teams. Allen getting better does not make Mahomes worse and vice versa. Honestly, I'm happy the trade worked out for both teams and both teams got their guy. Excited to see them both play for the foreseeable future. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 2 hours ago, FireChans said: I would trade Allen to win a Super Bowl. Besides Mahomes, who would you trade Allen for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Watkins' Rib Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 49 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said: It absolutely is too early. But it's also too early to know who'll win this week's game and yet we're talking about it. And puh-lenty of people who thought over the last two years that the answer was that there was absolutely no way the Bill had NOT made a huge mistake ... posted here again and again ... a year or two ago on the same subject. I mean, you're right, it's too early. But by the time it's not, the discussion won't be very interesting anymore. Let's say Allen spends the rest of his career playing at exactly this level or just a tiny fraction lower. What's the answer then? IMO the Bills win. You seemed to skip right over the main point of my reply Thurman which was that basically McDermott is unfairly criticized for passing on Mahomes regardless of how either Allen or Mahomes careers turn out. And second, with all due respect to Tre White he doesn't play a role in the debate IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Mahomes isnt better now, he. Is still throwing dirtballs on short wing passes. Allen has overcome this and got his deep game back and can run harder even if it isnt as pretty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigduke6 Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 nobody knew what Mahomes was. Chiefs took a chance, even they didnt really know. He came from a system not loved by the NFL. nobody knew what Tre or Josh would become. u take educated guesses when u draft, but theyre still guesses. comparing everybody, is pointless. different situations. u stick Mahomes in Miami, is he still the same player? u stick Josh in.....Cleveland, is he? too many variables. be happy with what u have, dont worry about the what ifs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 I'm looking out for the children, so glad we have Josh. Ratface is ugly af, too scary for little kids. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddy KGB Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 1 hour ago, inaugural balls said: Sticking to your guns on best ever, are ya? Sure, I’ll call it now. You can wait three more years to admit I’m right 🤣🤣 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWATeam Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 12 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said: Sure, I’ll call it now. You can wait three more years to admit I’m right 🤣🤣 Already giving up on your favorite QB from that class??? truth-bisky and the Switz-army knife even topped Sills V in the pantsed index. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullBuchanan Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, inaugural balls said: Besides Mahomes, who would you trade Allen for? Wilson is an obvious one. Do we get the player's whole career or just where they are now? If you ask me 3 weeks ago, the answer is probably 15 players. Now it's quite a bit more uncertain, but 3 great games does not make him superior to future HOF QBs. I just want to enjoy it for as long as it lasts. Edited October 3, 2020 by BullBuchanan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Tremaine Edmunds was acquired with the pick from the Mahomes trade........not Josh Allen........ and Edmunds is having a regrettable season. They need to get him outside and stop the charade. If you want him to move him around....fine.......but he's a massive target in the run game up the middle and if teams didn't know it before they sure seem to have gotten the memo this year. They are putting a lot of wear and tear and missing an opportunity to fairly evaluate a guy who could be special on the edge while they still have time to decide on his future as a potential $15M-$20M per year player. Tre White was a really good pick.......I was confident he would be.......... but they drafted him to replace Gilmore who went on to become the friggin' NFLDPOY and best player on a defense that lead his team to a SB win. So that wasn't even a net gain. A first round pick and a good CB contract are at best a wash in terms of chip value. Mistakes were made. Josh Allen doesn't look like one of them. As I said when he was struggling early on.........hopefully he and Mahomes can become the Kelly/Marino of this generation for Bills fans. It's earlier in JA's improvement but that's easier to envision now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 1 hour ago, bigduke6 said: nobody knew what Mahomes was. Chiefs took a chance, even they didnt really know. He came from a system not loved by the NFL. nobody knew what Tre or Josh would become. u take educated guesses when u draft, but theyre still guesses. Mahomes was a high profile college player............his dad was a long time pro athlete...........he had pedigree and a mountain of great plays on tape. But you are right about Josh.............the son of a melon farmer who couldn't get a scholarship offer from anyone and had to go to JC and start out there as the 3rd string QB. And he certainly didn't put a lot of good on tape at Wyoming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 34 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said: Wilson is an obvious one. Do we get the player's whole career or just where they are now? If you ask me 3 weeks ago, the answer is probably 15 players. Now it's quite a bit more uncertain, but 3 great games does not make him superior to future HOF QBs. I just want to enjoy it for as long as it lasts. Never said he was superior. Wilson is obvious? You'd trade Allen today for Wilson? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offsides#76FredSmerlas Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 I would say yes without hesitation. Patrick has done it consistently at the highest level possible for a long stretch and has a ring. Josh has played 3 good games and still makes some bozo plays. I love Josh but Patrick might go down as the best to ever play before his career is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Mahommes is pretty damn good Josh and Tre were the best for US Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said: Mahomes was a high profile college player............his dad was a long time pro athlete...........he had pedigree and a mountain of great plays on tape. But you are right about Josh.............the son of a melon farmer who couldn't get a scholarship offer from anyone and had to go to JC and start out there as the 3rd string QB. And he certainly didn't put a lot of good on tape at Wyoming. This is shallow. How many high profile QBs have busted? His dad? Yeah, that's a recipe for sure-fire stardom. Pedigree? More dad talk I'm assuming. Great tape - please. They all have highlight tape. Got something against melons? Or farmers? His story is more impressive because of this. Nothing - nothing was given to him. He's worked hard to be where is today. Perhaps harder than most. Character building background as I see it. Josh is proving all the naysayers wrong. I don't have a crystal ball, but I'm confident JA will be all we want a Buffalo Bills QB to be. Mahomes is unquestionably the best in the biz - no doubt. You don't have to piss all over our guy to validate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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