EJ Manuel Reflects On His Career As The Bills Future QB

[Phil The Thrill]

If you haven’t checked out Eric Wood’s interview with EJ Manuel yet, it’s a good listen for any Bills fan.  

https://www.stitcher.com/s?eid=68066663&autoplay=1

 

I’ll say this - EJ sounds like a great guy.  He was very positive about Buffalo, though you sense he feels thing would’ve turned out better in a different situation.  He says his career didn’t work out but believes it happened for a reason and he thinks his story can help others.  
 

Some interesting notes:

 

- He said the Doug Whaley/Buddy Nix plan was always to start Kevin Kolb and have EJ learn from him (bad idea).  One Kolb got hurt he had no one to learn from since Jeff Tuel (and later Thad Lewis) were inexperienced QB’s, so Wood was the player who tried to mention him at QB!

 

- After his in-season injury in 2013 he was privately tutored by legendary OC Paul Hackett (Nate’s dad) on reading defenses.

 

- EJ said his confidence was shaken after the infamous JJ Watt pick six.  Seantrel didn’t cut Watt resulting in the pick, but he said he takes the blame.   Doug Marrone sat him down and said he was their guy but they wanted him to take a step back and watch Kyle Orton play.

 

- He thought that Rex was trying to “bring in his own guys” at QB and felt he earned his roster spot with his preseason play.  Dressing as an inactive QB hurt his confidence and relationship with Buffalo and said he didn’t play well in the Jets finale in 2016, because his confidence was completely shot.  
 

- EJ said he did well in Oakland under Jack Del Rio.  When Gruden came in, he felt he wanted Conner Cook to be the backup.  While he played well in the preseason, Gruden cut him and he spent the rest of 2018 trying to get a job....it never happened.

 

- Oddly enough this year, he got a call from Andy Reid about backing up Patrick Mahomes once Chad Henne went down.  I think he said KC said “thanks but no thank,” and then later said he was beginning his job at the SEC Network and didn’t want to come back.  

Like I said, he seemed positive and excited about his broadcasting career, but I also sensed some disappointment over how his NFL career ended.  If you think about it, he went from 1st round draft pick to street FA with no offers in less than 6 months.  
 

So do you think EJ’s was a victim was a happenstance?

 

Or was he an over drafted QB with a limited ceiling?  I’m thinking it was more of the later, but it hard to listen to this interview and not like the guy personally.  

[Rico]

Should've gone to the Chiefs, he would've had a ring like Rob Johnson.

[Bangarang]

EJ isn’t a victim, he’s just a crap QB. 
 

He got his shot and made a good chunk of money. If he’s happy doing what he’s doing now then good for him.

Edited April 17, 2020 by Bangarang

[T master]

EJ was always a pro Bills type player & like our QB now had a lot of the same type of things said about him as they were said about Josh but unlike Josh had way to many coaching changes & support from those coaches to further his career in a positive way !

 

Josh & EJ were both athletic QB's with a good arm but their accuracy had issues but i think that Josh is in a much better position due to the stability McBeane & company have brought to the team . 

 

If Josh was in the same situation as EJ i think his future could very much resemble that of EJ's & other QB's that the Bills have brought in over the years .

[JaCrispy]

EJ’s throwing motion looked like a girl trying to throw a football for the first time...I would say that was his biggest downfall- throwing like a b!+<#...?

Edited April 17, 2020 by JaCrispy

[FireChans]

There goes the narrative that he could “still be in the league but doesn’t want to be.”

[Phil The Thrill]

2 minutes ago, T master said:

EJ was always a pro Bills type player & like our QB now had a lot of the same type of things said about him as they were said about Josh but unlike Josh had way to many coaching changes & support from those coaches to further his career in a positive way !

 

Josh & EJ were both athletic QB's with a good arm but their accuracy had issues but i think that Josh is in a much better position due to the stability McBeane & company have brought to the team . 

 

If Josh was in the same situation as EJ i think his future could very much resemble that of EJ's & other QB's that the Bills have brought in over the years .

While there are similarities, I think that Josh’s athleticism was a lot higher than EJ’s.  He also made some outstanding throws that I don’t believe EJ could ever make.

 

It seems to me that NFL analysts and coaches always get Allen had a much higher ceiling and potential which is why he was a unanimous first round projects.  EJ was projected as low as a 4th rounder.  
 

Would consistency help EJ?  Probably, but the question would still be whether he’s good enough to be the Bills unquestioned starter.... I’m not sure if he was that guy 

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

There goes the narrative that he could “still be in the league but doesn’t want to be.”

Oh I’m not defending him.  I do think there’s something to the fact that he’s out of the NFL after 6 seasons.  There’s probably a reason few teams have taken the time to kick the tires

[cage]

I'm not sure how difficult this would be, but I'd love to see some study that examines the affect of team culture, coaching, situation on QBs (lets just say 1st rounders).  There's a 50% bust rate, even in top 10 pics and you have wonder about some of these situations.  Would Manuel have done better elsewhere?  Would we have ruined Patrick Mahomes?  Or never played Brady if we had picked him in the 6th round?

[FireChans]

4 minutes ago, cage said:

I'm not sure how difficult this would be, but I'd love to see some study that examines the affect of team culture, coaching, situation on QBs (lets just say 1st rounders).  There's a 50% bust rate, even in top 10 pics and you have wonder about some of these situations.  Would Manuel have done better elsewhere?  Would we have ruined Patrick Mahomes?  Or never played Brady if we had picked him in the 6th round?

Mahomes and Brady would have been great anywhere. Manuel would have been a more successful bust in a different system.

[dbfla10]

5 minutes ago, cage said:

I'm not sure how difficult this would be, but I'd love to see some study that examines the affect of team culture, coaching, situation on QBs (lets just say 1st rounders).  There's a 50% bust rate, even in top 10 pics and you have wonder about some of these situations.  Would Manuel have done better elsewhere?  Would we have ruined Patrick Mahomes?  Or never played Brady if we had picked him in the 6th round?

 

I believe culture says a lot, especially at the QB position. EJ would've been better off sitting a yr or 2 behind a guy like Fitzpatrick. Not saying he would've been a stud, but would've had a better career IMO... Losing your confidence is killer. You start thinking to much, and not trusting what you see. Last thing a qb can do is second guess... I was a pro EJ guys and wanted it to work out. 

[MrEpsYtown]

Eh, we all know he was overdrafted, but he was terrible and all he did was regress. When coaches doubted him, you would thing he would push harder. A professional athlete without confidence is useless. He also probably should have started to learn to read defenses before half way through his rookie season. 

[T master]

18 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

While there are similarities, I think that Josh’s athleticism was a lot higher than EJ’s.  He also made some outstanding throws that I don’t believe EJ could ever make.

 

It seems to me that NFL analysts and coaches always get Allen had a much higher ceiling and potential which is why he was a unanimous first round projects.  EJ was projected as low as a 4th rounder.  
 

Would consistency help EJ?  Probably, but the question would still be whether he’s good enough to be the Bills unquestioned starter.... I’m not sure if he was that guy 

Oh I’m not defending him.  I do think there’s something to the fact that he’s out of the NFL after 6 seasons.  There’s probably a reason few teams have taken the time to kick the tires

 

I totally agree that EJ shouldn't have been taken where he was he was not a 1st round QB & because the Bills fan base was starved for a QB put a lot of expectations on him .

 

 i do think he could have benefitted from more stability but i don't think he was as good as Josh as far as talent but he was a team guy & when he got here you could tell he was excited to be a Bill unlike some other 1st round Bills picks !

[FireChans]

3 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

Eh, we all know he was overdrafted, but he was terrible and all he did was regress. When coaches doubted him, you would thing he would push harder. A professional athlete without confidence is useless. He also probably should have started to learn to read defenses before half way through his rookie season. 

When your first two games are your best two games, you’re *****.

[Lurker]

Great guy, lousy QB.   

 

Over the course of a lifetime, it's better to be the former than the later.   Best of luck with the broadcasting career...

[IgotBILLStopay]

EJ had the physical tools. He had all the throws. I had 3 problems with him:

 

1. He got rattled easily (the interview shows that). You never want the confidence shaken. That whole Fantex initiative, while smart for the player monetarily, screamed to me that he was not sure of his own abilities / earnings and was trying to hedge his bets.

2. He was a bit slow with his reads. 

3. Most importantly, he was not a gamer - not a competitor like Allen. Allen wants it - could never see it in Manuel.

 

While 2 was fixable with more gametime reps, ultimately 1 and 3 do appear a bit innate.

 

That being said, I would have liked to have seen him throw to Sammy more - I felt they were developing a connection. Marrone never believed in EJ and hated the Sammy trade up because he wanted that 2015 first rounder for a QB. Combine Marrone's position with the  EJ shortcoming #1 above - and one can see that EJ was set up for failure.

[C.Biscuit97]

39 minutes ago, FireChans said:

There goes the narrative that he could “still be in the league but doesn’t want to be.”

He was on the Chiefs last spring, retired,and got a job in tv.

[wvbillsfan]

Sounds like a lot of “it wasn’t my fault”. 
A Qb needs to take responsibility not only for his actions but the actions of his teammates. 
It just seems like EJ didn’t have the mental makeup to be an nfl qb. 

[C.Biscuit97]

43 minutes ago, JaCrispy said:

EJ’s throwing motion looked like a girl trying to throw a football for the first time...I would say that was his biggest downfall- throwing like a b!+<#...?

The funniest thing is he had a really strong arm.  I always thought he was too nice and tried to do exactly what his coaches told him but to a fault.  

[inthebuff]

I'm not defending EJ.  Just pointing out some things...

The guys like EJ do not get the coaching that they need to even get to be good, much less great.  EJ had such great QB whisperers as Doug Marrone and Rex Ryan as his HC.  Marrone brought with  him the wrong Hacket as OC.  The guys who get drafted and are developed by legendary coaches will almost always turn out great.  The system may fit their skill set or the coach sees something that others don't.    Examples - Joe Montana was a 3rd round pick, drafted by Bill Walsh, one of the greatest of all time.  We know all about Brady/Belichick.  Brett Favre was a 2nd round pick of the Falcons who was traded to the Packers and then schooled by Mike Holmgren.   Even Mahomes was not perceived to be great coming out of college as evidenced by being drafted overall #10.   

 

Would EJ have been much better under their tutelage?  Or like some here say...he'd still be a bust.  It's really difficult to say.   

Edited April 17, 2020 by inthebuff

[C.Biscuit97]

8 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Great guy, lousy QB.   

 

Over the course of a lifetime, it's better to be the former than the later.   Best of luck with the broadcasting career...

Right now, Allen has one point higher career qb rating than EJ.  Just saying.  And there have been way worse Bills qb.  Matt Barkley is currently on the roster. 

[eball]

My biggest takeaway with respect to EJ is that he just wasn't strong enough mentally.  This isn't the first time I heard him talk about "losing confidence" and it's pretty remarkable he got as far as he did.  An NFL QB has to be oozing confidence.

 

Super nice guy, just not mentally strong enough to play at the highest level.  He does a very nice job on the ACC network.

[stevewin]

1 hour ago, Phil The Thrill said:

If you haven’t checked out Eric Wood’s interview with EJ Manuel yet, it’s a good listen for any Bills fan.  

https://www.stitcher.com/s?eid=68066663&autoplay=1

 

I’ll say this - EJ sounds like a great guy.  He was very positive about Buffalo, though you sense he feels thing would’ve turned out better in a different situation.  He says his career didn’t work out but believes it happened for a reason and he thinks his story can help others.  
 

Some interesting notes:

 

- He said the Doug Whaley/Buddy Nix plan was always to start Kevin Kolb and have EJ learn from him (bad idea).  One Kolb got hurt he had no one to learn from since Jeff Tuel (and later Thad Lewis) were inexperienced QB’s, so Wood was the player who tried to mention him at QB!

 

- After his in-season injury in 2013 he was privately tutored by legendary OC Paul Hackett (Nate’s dad) on reading defenses.

 

- EJ said his confidence was shaken after the infamous JJ Watt pick six.  Seantrel didn’t cut Watt resulting in the pick, but he said he takes the blame.   Doug Marrone sat him down and said he was their guy but they wanted him to take a step back and watch Kyle Orton play.

 

- He thought that Rex was trying to “bring in his own guys” at QB and felt he earned his roster spot with his preseason play.  Dressing as an inactive QB hurt his confidence and relationship with Buffalo and said he didn’t play well in the Jets finale in 2016, because his confidence was completely shot.  
 

- EJ said he did well in Oakland under Jack Del Rio.  When Gruden came in, he felt he wanted Conner Cook to be the backup.  While he played well in the preseason, Gruden cut him and he spent the rest of 2018 trying to get a job....it never happened.

 

- Oddly enough this year, he got a call from Andy Reid about backing up Patrick Mahomes once Chad Henne went down.  I think he said KC said “thanks but no thank,” and then later said he was beginning his job at the SEC Network and didn’t want to come back.  

Like I said, he seemed positive and excited about his broadcasting career, but I also sensed some disappointment over how his NFL career ended.  If you think about it, he went from 1st round draft pick to street FA with no offers in less than 6 months.  
 

So do you think EJ’s was a victim was a happenstance?

 

Or was he an over drafted QB with a limited ceiling?  I’m thinking it was more of the later, but it hard to listen to this interview and not like the guy personally.  

These were all in one post: Doug Whaley/Buddy Nix, EJ Manual, Kevin Kolb, Thad Lewis, Jeff Tuel, Kyle Orton, Seantrel Henderson, Doug Marrone, Nate Hackett, Rex Ryan  *shudders*

[Hardhatharry]

54 minutes ago, T master said:

EJ was always a pro Bills type player & like our QB now had a lot of the same type of things said about him as they were said about Josh but unlike Josh had way to many coaching changes & support from those coaches to further his career in a positive way !

 

Josh & EJ were both athletic QB's with a good arm but their accuracy had issues but i think that Josh is in a much better position due to the stability McBeane & company have brought to the team . 

 

If Josh was in the same situation as EJ i think his future could very much resemble that of EJ's & other QB's that the Bills have brought in over the years .

He is nothing like Josh Allen.... 

[skibum]

He was a project from the beginning. Guys like EJ only become good if they sit a few years behind an entrenched franchise QB. He never had anything like that. It was just a dumb pick for the Bills at that time. 

[MJS]

1 hour ago, T master said:

EJ was always a pro Bills type player & like our QB now had a lot of the same type of things said about him as they were said about Josh but unlike Josh had way to many coaching changes & support from those coaches to further his career in a positive way !

 

Josh & EJ were both athletic QB's with a good arm but their accuracy had issues but i think that Josh is in a much better position due to the stability McBeane & company have brought to the team . 

 

If Josh was in the same situation as EJ i think his future could very much resemble that of EJ's & other QB's that the Bills have brought in over the years .

EJ isn't even in the same league as Josh Allen. Allen is so much better than him. He's better in every single facet of the game, including athleticism and scrambling.

 

I disagree emphatically. For one thing, Josh was well regarded in his draft and was a guy who was traded up for in the top 10. EJ was traded down for and still went too high.

Just now, skibum said:

He was a project from the beginning. Guys like EJ only become good if they sit a few years behind an entrenched franchise QB. He never had anything like that. It was just a dumb pick for the Bills at that time. 

I just remember Nix promising that he wouldn't retire until he found the Bills their franchise QB. Apparently he rally wanted to retire, because he reached in one of the worst QB drafts ever to take EJ.

[Buffalo716]

1 hour ago, T master said:

EJ was always a pro Bills type player & like our QB now had a lot of the same type of things said about him as they were said about Josh but unlike Josh had way to many coaching changes & support from those coaches to further his career in a positive way !

 

Josh & EJ were both athletic QB's with a good arm but their accuracy had issues but i think that Josh is in a much better position due to the stability McBeane & company have brought to the team . 

 

If Josh was in the same situation as EJ i think his future could very much resemble that of EJ's & other QB's that the Bills have brought in over the years .

EJ may have been big and athletic but he's nothing like the football player Josh Allen is

 

And I wanted the best for EJ but Josh came in heads and shoulders better. 

 

EJ was supposed to be this dual-threat quarterback who couldn't even run

[prissythecat]

49 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

He was on the Chiefs last spring but had little chance of making the roster, so he retired,and got a job in tv.

 

Edited that for you.

[RobbRiddick]

It always seemed to me like EJ would 'push' the ball towards his receiver, almost as though he were throwing a dart. I saw every game he played but remember very little about the guy. His game against the Panthers was great, and at the end I was leaping up and down like a lunatic, but there wasn't much else that got me excited about him.

 

And as a guy to watch he was just meh. Like how there are certain films you don't like or dislike, you just watch em and then forget about them. That was EJ to me. I preferred watching JP Losman to him. At least JP had that great deep ball he could unleash.

 

That's what I love about Allen. I'm not blind to his limitations so far, but holy ***** is he amazing to watch

[BuffaloBills1998]

This is when I had wished we never got rid of Fitzpatrick. Should’ve sat EJ and developed him on the bench while playing Fitz

[Phil The Thrill]

43 minutes ago, skibum said:

He was a project from the beginning. Guys like EJ only become good if they sit a few years behind an entrenched franchise QB. He never had anything like that. It was just a dumb pick for the Bills at that time. 

I will never understand why the Bills didn’t do better than Kevin Kolb as the answer to the play the “veteran mentor.”  He wasn’t exactly a grizzled veteran and there were better options.  It would have made sense if they signed Kolb (knowing his injury history) and another veteran, because they likely knew they were drafting a QB.  

Then...when Kolb got hurt, rather than signing a QB like Kyle Orton in 2014, they were like “ yeah our QB room is good with 2 rookies.”  
 

EJ was a failed pick and for that Whaley and Nix deserve a lot of blame.  But IMO they deserve MORE blame for not having any type of plan to develop the QB or not having the ability modify that plan on the fly.

 

Both Nix and Whaley were terrible GM’s.  Good riddance.

 

19 minutes ago, BuffaloBills1998 said:

This is when I had wished we never got rid of Fitzpatrick. Should’ve sat EJ and developed him on the bench while playing Fitz

I always thought he would be an excellent QB mentor and reliable if presses into action for short stretches

[InTheBuffAllTheTime]

1 hour ago, JaCrispy said:

EJ’s throwing motion looked like a girl trying to throw a football for the first time...I would say that was his biggest downfall- throwing like a b!+<#...?

My daughter throws a pretty spiral.....and she's really nice! I'm guessing social distancing hasn't much affected you....although those around you might be enjoying the break.?

[FireChans]

1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

He was on the Chiefs last spring, retired,and got a job in tv.

Do you want a list of QB’s who were “on a roster” last spring?

[Phil The Thrill]

1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Right now, Allen has one point higher career qb rating than EJ.  Just saying.  And there have been way worse Bills qb.  Matt Barkley is currently on the roster. 

QB Rating - great example of manipulating numbers without context to prove a false narrative.  
 

Josh has his issues.  His numbers aren’t pretty,  but he’s ahead of where EJ was in his second season.  

[4_kidd_4]

Fresh stuff.

[Seasons1992]

1 hour ago, stevewin said:

These were all in one post: Doug Whaley/Buddy Nix, EJ Manual, Kevin Kolb, Thad Lewis, Jeff Tuel, Kyle Orton, Seantrel Henderson, Doug Marrone, Nate Hackett, Rex Ryan  *shudders*

 

[Nextmanup]

2 hours ago, Phil The Thrill said:

If you haven’t checked out Eric Wood’s interview with EJ Manuel yet, it’s a good listen for any Bills fan.  

https://www.stitcher.com/s?eid=68066663&autoplay=1

 

I’ll say this - EJ sounds like a great guy.  He was very positive about Buffalo, though you sense he feels thing would’ve turned out better in a different situation.  He says his career didn’t work out but believes it happened for a reason and he thinks his story can help others.  
 

Some interesting notes:

 

- He said the Doug Whaley/Buddy Nix plan was always to start Kevin Kolb and have EJ learn from him (bad idea).  One Kolb got hurt he had no one to learn from since Jeff Tuel (and later Thad Lewis) were inexperienced QB’s, so Wood was the player who tried to mention him at QB!

 

- After his in-season injury in 2013 he was privately tutored by legendary OC Paul Hackett (Nate’s dad) on reading defenses.

 

- EJ said his confidence was shaken after the infamous JJ Watt pick six.  Seantrel didn’t cut Watt resulting in the pick, but he said he takes the blame.   Doug Marrone sat him down and said he was their guy but they wanted him to take a step back and watch Kyle Orton play.

 

- He thought that Rex was trying to “bring in his own guys” at QB and felt he earned his roster spot with his preseason play.  Dressing as an inactive QB hurt his confidence and relationship with Buffalo and said he didn’t play well in the Jets finale in 2016, because his confidence was completely shot.  
 

- EJ said he did well in Oakland under Jack Del Rio.  When Gruden came in, he felt he wanted Conner Cook to be the backup.  While he played well in the preseason, Gruden cut him and he spent the rest of 2018 trying to get a job....it never happened.

 

- Oddly enough this year, he got a call from Andy Reid about backing up Patrick Mahomes once Chad Henne went down.  I think he said KC said “thanks but no thank,” and then later said he was beginning his job at the SEC Network and didn’t want to come back.  

Like I said, he seemed positive and excited about his broadcasting career, but I also sensed some disappointment over how his NFL career ended.  If you think about it, he went from 1st round draft pick to street FA with no offers in less than 6 months.  
 

So do you think EJ’s was a victim was a happenstance?

 

Or was he an over drafted QB with a limited ceiling?  I’m thinking it was more of the later, but it hard to listen to this interview and not like the guy personally.  

He was over-drafted and never cut out to be a QB, of any caliber, in the NFL.

I remember watching his last bowl game at FSU and thinking he was just a terrible QB.

 

Unfortunately, the "pros" running the Bills at that time thought differently.

 

So what single factor could have made a big difference for EJ?  

 

Talent at the QB position.  He didn't have very much of that, despite being an athletically talented guy, generally speaking.

 

 

 

 

[TheCockSportif]

Oh god.  EJ is back on the board.

 

In any case, the Bills had to pick somebody for the position in 2013 (as they should have from 2010 on).  Whether it was EJ or whether it was Geno Smith, the team would be in the same spot with regard to yet another wasted pick.  Of course, we can all draw this conclusion with the benefit of hindsight.

 

Lost decades of competitive football due to horrible scouting and a horrible FO/coaching regime did this team in.  EJ was just the exclamation point on top of it all.

 

Just my $0.02 obviously.

[Rico]

Always appreciate EJ threads, thanks PtT!

[Phil The Thrill]

5 minutes ago, Groin said:

Oh god.  EJ is back on the board.

 

In any case, the Bills had to pick somebody for the position in 2013 (as they should have from 2010 on).  Whether it was EJ or whether it was Geno Smith, the team would be in the same spot with regard to yet another wasted pick.  Of course, we can all draw this conclusion with the benefit of hindsight.

 

Lost decades of competitive football due to horrible scouting and a horrible FO/coaching regime did this team in.  EJ was just the exclamation point on top of it all.

 

Just my $0.02 obviously.

They really didn’t have to use a high pick on a QB.  There probably were other options than Kevin Kolb.  They didn’t have to let Fitz walk and they could have always signed a vet to compete in 2012 and he did one of his legendary Fitzpatrick late season tanks.  
 

But they painted themselves into this situation and it turned out terrible - thank you Buddy Nix and Doug Whaley

Or maybe we should just post about 30 new threads about players the Bills will have no chance of drafting...you know?

[TheCockSportif]

2 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

They really didn’t have to use a high pick on a QB.  There probably were other options than Kevin Kolb.  They didn’t have to let Fitz walk and they could have always signed a vet to compete in 2012 and he did one of his legendary Fitzpatrick late season tanks.  
 

But they painted themselves into this situation and it turned out terrible - thank you Buddy Nix and Doug Whaley

 

I totally agree that this was a Whaley/Nix debacle.  Nix painted himself into a corner with Fitz's contract extension as memory serves, and when he asked Fitz to renegotiate after 1+ years, Fitz was like, "nope."

 

To your point, organizational ineptitude at the time brought us EJ.

Edited April 17, 2020 by Groin