The Lions chose to go after Tre White

[BullBuchanan]

17 minutes ago, BringBackOrton said:

There’s 32 NFL teams and Golladay is #22 in yards. How bout that?

Best WR in Buffalo doesn’t make him AJ Green.

 

And I love Woods.

You must've missed the part where he plays for the lions who consequently rank #22 in Passing - go figure. Believe what you want, your take is bad now and it will look ridiculous with age.

[HappyDays]

The rules make it impossible to shut everyone down every week. Receivers have the advantage. Sometimes the other team just makes a good play. White is still a top 5 CB and will be for a long time.

[Best Williams Available]

4 minutes ago, papazoid said:

I say tre is injured and hiding it

 

something is off

I think you’re right and that it could be a leg issue. I see him biting harder on nice WR cuts and getting out of position more than usual, like he’s worried about getting burned so he overcommits. He seems to be giving larger cushions too. Might explain his lack of ups during contested throws the past couple weeks too. Maybe all his time at the goalie academy is wearing on his ankles???

[YoloinOhio]

36 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

 

You shouldn't be starting Lions in fantasy. He's a second year player out of the MAC becoming an NFL elite player before our eyes. This isn't the first or the last time he'll beat an elite CB. He'll be a top 10 guy next season if the lions can figure out what the hell they're doing.

I actually didn’t start him at all this year. He was on my bench the whole season, still could see his points 

[klos63]

47 minutes ago, BringBackOrton said:

So does Woods, fine WR, not necessarily “top.”

whatever, he's really good, which is why Stafford throws to him a lot. Still shouldn't be a surprise that he gets targets.

[Mark Vader]

The Lions did target White, and they were successful.

 

White was beat today, but he wasn't toasted.

 

Golladay had the upper hand, literally.

 

When it was over, the Lions had 13 points and the Bills got the win.

[klos63]

49 minutes ago, BringBackOrton said:

So does Woods, fine WR, not necessarily “top.”

Why not? He's a top player on one of the best offenses in the league.

[Gugny]

2 minutes ago, Mark Vader said:

The Lions did target White, and they were successful.

 

White was beat today, but he wasn't toasted.

 

Golladay had the upper hand, literally.

 

When it was over, the Lions had 13 points and the Bills got the win.

 

You take those facts somewhere else, mister!

[Phil The Thrill]

1 hour ago, Gugny said:

 

This is what confuses me.  I remember watching McKelvin cover guys like glue, but he'd never turn around and look for the ball.  Tre White is covering guys like glue AND turning around, but he's still getting smoked.  I'm sure he'll figure it out and I'm glad he's on our team.

 

@Gugny is Jerry Sullivan

[Gugny]

7 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

 

@Gugny is Jerry Sullivan

 

Phil The Thrill, play to kill
Too many women with too many pills

[Phil The Thrill]

3 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

Phil The Thrill, play to kill
Too many women with too many pills

 

Typical Sully....quoting an 80’s song.  How are thinks going over at Buffalo Mavens?

[Gugny]

1 minute ago, Phil The Thrill said:

 

Typical Sully....quoting an 80’s song.  How are thinks going over at Buffalo Mavens?

 

Not bad.  We can spell words like, "things," pretty well.

[Phil The Thrill]

Just now, Gugny said:

 

Not bad.  We can spell words like, "things," pretty well.

 

Are you Jerry Sullivan?

[Buffalo Barbarian]

8 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

I find that interesting. I was listening to some fantasy football shows this weekend and they were talking about how Golladay is now their #1 WR but hasn’t really been targeted much or been productive. Now, he’s lined up vs White who’s supposed to be one of the better CBs in the league (which I agree with) and they go right to Golloday multiple times with great success. He definitely “ate off the Tre” so to speak. I know White didn’t have a great game vs Robby Anderson either but just found it odd they would choose to finally chuck it up to Golladay when he was lined up vs Tre White 

 

edit: Golladay is on my fantasy team which was why I was kind of following his production and he had really done nothing since Tate left 

 

White has been picked on the last few weeks hopefully he can overcome this or he will a third corner.

 

 

Golladay is a beast , would love to have him.

 

 

8 hours ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

Whites lack of ball skills showed today 

 

he has great ball skills but his lack of size and speed is a problem and was a concern to me at the draft. Thought McD's D helped him out but now he might be getting exposed. Hopefully he can get it figured out, dont want to be drafting corners all day.

 

 

[MJS]

He made some very contested catches, like a true #1 receiver should. White is a great cover guy, but doesn't play the ball well. He plays the man. That works most of the time, but when you have a QB with a big arm and a WR who can make contested catches, he can obviously be victimized.

 

He's a young player. He still has a lot to learn.

[Alphadawg7]

There is a unfair expectation of players by fans.  All DBs give up plays...Deion did, Revis did, etc etc.  100% of them do.  

 

A DB can only do so much.  If the ball is placed in the right place there is 0% chance they can prevent the completion without committing a penalty.  All a DB can do is try and blanket the coverage and hope the throw is to a place he can get to it.  

 

Tre wasn’t getting torched, Golladay made some amazing catches in some tight coverage.  It happens, I mean Stevie Johnson even had success against Revis and he wasn’t a very good WR.  

 

I dont think they chose to go “at Tre”, it was probably more they wanted to get Golladay more involved and had some one on one man matchups and gave him a chance to make a play.  I seriously doubt they were throwing to Golladay to “attack” Tre.  

[GoBills808]

9 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

I should mention that Golloday made great plays .... not saying it was white’s fault really. Just wondering why they looked at that matchup and thought, yup this is the week we start using Golloday! 

Golladay is a beast. He’s going to give a lot of corners trouble in the future.

[purple haze]

9 hours ago, Boatdrinks said:

He did pretty well vs Hopkins but the Bills got great pressure  vs that OL. They haven’t gotten much pressure since. You can go after White a bit if you’ve got things protected enough for a perfectly placed throw. 

You can do that to any other CB too.  Success in that instance wouldn't be unique to Tre White.  Pass rush

is as important to coverage success as the coverage itself.

20 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

There is a unfair expectation of players by fans.  All DBs give up plays...Deion did, Revis did, etc etc.  100% of them do.  

 

A DB can only do so much.  If the ball is placed in the right place there is 0% chance they can prevent the completion without committing a penalty.  All a DB can do is try and blanket the coverage and hope the throw is to a place he can get to it.  

 

Tre wasn’t getting torched, Golladay made some amazing catches in some tight coverage.  It happens, I mean Stevie Johnson even had success against Revis and he wasn’t a very good WR.  

 

I dont think they chose to go “at Tre”, it was probably more they wanted to get Golladay more involved and had some one on one man matchups and gave him a chance to make a play.  I seriously doubt they were throwing to Golladay to “attack” Tre.  

3

 I disagree on Stevie, but with you on the rest of this.  Folks are talking about Tre is getting picked on, but I don't see that at all.  He's given up a few plays and few penalties.  He's still better than most CB's in the league.  People expect something that is not real: the myth of the "shut down" corner.  No CB stops every throw. 

[GunnerBill]

While we are on the subject the least heralded elite corner in the league was on the other side today and was absolutely outstanding as per usual. The Bills did a really clever job of staying away from Slay for the most part and going at the other guys in that secondary. 

Edited December 17, 2018 by GunnerBill

[simpleman]

12 hours ago, the skycap said:

A la McKelvin

That is exactly what I thought today. Tre got his lunch stolen repeatedly today. The worst day of his career. McKelvin always was right there like Tre, but looked exactly like Tre did today. Hope it was just an off day. Wonder if there is something they can fix with coaching, or it just an unfixable size problem against bigger receivers. Gotta believe the film of today's game will quickly circulate to the offensive coordinators all around the league the next time their team plays the Bills.

[YoloinOhio]

So we can expect Josh Gordon to have a big day on Sunday? I need to see what he did last time we played them. 

 

Edit: 4 for 42 and 0 TDs. 

Edited December 17, 2018 by YoloinOhio

[blacklabel]

Honestly, the plays Tre has had made on him aren't really much fault of his own. He's been in position and most times QBs will throw elsewhere when seeing how well Tre has his man covered. But against the Jets and yesterday against the Lions, the throws were just unbelievable. Almost every CB is gonna get beat when the throw is in a position where only the receiver has a shot at it. 

 

Tre has been solid all season, despite a couple of big plays made on him the last couple weeks, it still isn't that bad compared to what he's done over the entire year.

[Alphadawg7]

7 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

While we are on the subject the least heralded elite corner in the league was on the other side today and was absolutely outstanding as per usual. The Bills did a really clever job of staying away from Slay for the most part and going at the other guys in that secondary. 

 

Slay owned Zay and basically punched him in the mouth with his play.  I mean, it was less about Slay making plays on the pass and more that he dominated Zay.  He had Zay always flailing and out of position.  Allen put some beautiful passes to Zay and he either flat out dropped them or Slay had him flustered where he didn’t make the proper move to catch the pass.  

 

Yeatersay showed that Zay is not a starting WR in the NFL.  It was a terrible game by him.  

 

The only 2 WRs that should still be here next year are Foster and McKenzie.  Foster as a starter and McKenzie as WR depth and ST.  

Edited December 17, 2018 by Alphadawg7

[WhyteDwarf]

So, that was White's worst game as a pro right?  

[BuffaLoko]

17 hours ago, HOUSE said:

And the Lions scored 13 points

 

Good point, getting only 13 scored on us, was quite an achievement! especially versus Stafford who can sling t everywhere in the field. It has been remarkable since ...forever... how well our DST adjusts in second half and blanks teams consistently.

[BillsSB2020]

18 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Slay owned Zay and basically punched him in the mouth with his play.  I mean, it was less about Slay making plays on the pass and more that he dominated Zay.  He had Zay always flailing and out of position.  Allen put some beautiful passes to Zay and he either flat out dropped them or Slay had him flustered where he didn’t make the proper move to catch the pass.  

 

Yeatersay showed that Zay is not a starting WR in the NFL.  It was a terrible game by him.  

 

The only 2 WRs that should still be here next year are Foster and McKenzie.  Foster as a starter and McKenzie as WR depth and ST.  

One of the few times they showed the downfield angle, Jones was running a go route matched up against Slay. It looked more like Slay was running the route and Jones was in coverage.

 

I would ditch the go route for Zay unless he's matched up against a safety or a LB. Certainly not gonna work against a top athlete.

[GunnerBill]

15 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Slay owned Zay and basically punched him in the mouth with his play.  I mean, it was less about Slay making plays on the pass and more that he dominated Zay.  He had Zay always flailing and out of position.  Allen put some beautiful passes to Zay and he either flat out dropped them or Slay had him flustered where he didn’t make the proper move to catch the pass.  

 

Yeatersay showed that Zay is not a starting WR in the NFL.  It was a terrible game by him.  

 

The only 2 WRs that should still be here next year are Foster and McKenzie.  Foster as a starter and McKenzie as WR depth and ST.  

 

Slay is elite. He gets very little props because he plays for Detroit but there are higher profile "name" corners - Jimmy Smith, Malcolm Butler, Marcus Peters etc who are nowhere near Slay. Even the Jags pair, who are very good, get way more hype but are not quite at his level. Shutting down Zay Jones is like child's play to someone of his level, he has owned far better players than Zay.

 

I do agree Zay is not an NFL starter though. To be honest I'd kind of resigned myself to that even before this season. He might stick as a cheap backup because he has experience inside and outside but backup level is where he is. Foster and McKenzie both have roles here for me next year but I want them as my 3 and my 4 with a high ceiling rookie and a proper, experienced, vet leader (because it is otherwise a very young room) as my #1 and #2. I've set out my ideal scenario in another thread so won't repeat in detail here.

28 minutes ago, WhyteDwarf said:

So, that was White's worst game as a pro right?  

 

Nah. I think he was worse last weekend. This week he was in position on pretty much every one of those plays. Just go beat by a beast. Robby actually worked him over properly last week to the point where he got grabby and panicky. It happens. Even to the best. The other guys get paid too and there are some great ones knocking around.

[YoloinOhio]

9 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Slay is elite. He gets very little props because he plays for Detroit but there are higher profile "name" corners - Jimmy Smith, Malcolm Butler, Marcus Peters etc who are nowhere near Slay. Even the Jags pair, who are very good, get way more hype but are not quite at his level. Shutting down Zay Jones is like child's play to someone of his level, he has owned far better players than Zay.

 

I do agree Zay is not an NFL starter though. To be honest I'd kind of resigned myself to that even before this season. He might stick as a cheap backup because he has experience inside and outside but backup level is where he is. Foster and McKenzie both have roles here for me next year but I want them as my 3 and my 4 with a high ceiling rookie and a proper, experienced, vet leader (because it is otherwise a very young room) as my #1 and #2. I've set out my ideal scenario in another thread so won't repeat in detail here.

 

Nah. I think he was worse last weekend. This week he was in position on pretty much every one of those plays. Just go beat by a beast. Robby actually worked him over properly last week to the point where he got grabby and panicky. It happens. Even to the best. The other guys get paid too and there are some great ones knocking around.

If i recall correctly, Anderson also beat him for a TD last year on TNF. That should be a good battle going forward with two good young players. 

[GunnerBill]

Just now, YoloinOhio said:

If i recall correctly, Anderson also beat him for a TD last year on TNF. That should be a good battle going forward with two good young players. 

 

I'd rather the Jets try and go cheap with the RFA tag on Robby and we pinch him and put him in blue! I doubt he is a McDermott type of guy, but still.

[YoloinOhio]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I'd rather the Jets try and go cheap with the RFA tag on Robby and we pinch him and put him in blue! I doubt he is a McDermott type of guy, but still.

He’s probably not but he is from Temple, so maybe there’s a chance

[Jerome007]

9 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

he has great ball skills but his lack of size and speed is a problem and was a concern to me at the draft. Thought McD's D helped him out but now he might be getting exposed. Hopefully he can get it figured out, dont want to be drafting corners all day.

I too thinks he's got great instincts, covers very well, can support the run D.... but lacks ball skills. When he's beat he's usually VERY close to the WR or even all over him, yet he doesn't time his jump well at all. He has rarely been beat as in a blown coverage or someone just passing him by/juking him. It's his ball skills.

[ctk232]

19 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 he’s a good player but I’m not sure he’s considered a top WR in the league. Whatever he is, they had not been throwing to him until today which is the whole reason for my question  

I've had Golladay all season with much success - granted I had Jones Jr. and just lucked out on which weeks I started either, but Golladay produced better when the top DBs were covering Jones and Tate. With Jones down Golladay was seeing some top DB coverage and had a bit of a learning curve but is now showing he is the receiver for them. 

 

Also affected by the RB carousel in Detroit of Kerryon Johnson, Blount, and Riddick - despite what we saw yesterday, with Johnson out especially, the lions rely on him for both handoffs and screens and live off both opening up the passing game. Without it they could only really rely on Golladay for postive yards yesterday.

[SoTier]

16 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

Bob Woods was the best WR on the Bills during his entire tenure in Buffalo.  He certainly is a top WR.

 

He's the best WR on the Rams, too -- and about as reliable and durable as any WR can be -- even if he wasn't Goff's favorite receiver when Kupp was healthy.

[teef]

2 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

He's the best WR on the Rams, too -- and about as reliable and durable as any WR can be -- even if he wasn't Goff's favorite receiver when Kupp was healthy.

and he was an outstanding blocker.  it's not hard to miss bob woods.

[Dadonkadonk]

Like clockwork for the fans to start picking on the Bills best players. Once again you guys picking apart White are amazing. Did the same thing to Gilmore and you were wrong then and you are wrong about White. He's a great player. All great players give up plays in this league. 

[Bfanlc]

Didn't watch the game....what changed in the second half? Did buff change coverages or switch players?