Peterman Works w/ Tom House, Adds Velocity

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Just now, billsredneck1 said:

well i does make me wonder. if mcbeane says "you have to get a franchise guy"...knowing he had the ammo to go to the top of the draft....why would they scoop up a.j.?  why wouldn't they just wait until after the draft or june 1st and sign a vet for a vet min. 1 yr./ 1 mil. deal?

 

i'm hearing trade rumors...or possibility of trade rumors, but i'm not gonna hold my breath that these guys are hell bent on getting one of the top 4. i would not at all be surprised if they stand pat and even possibly take a qb 22 or later.

 

Good question.

 

One, if you want your pick of the vets, you really can't wait.  Book early for best selection.

 

Two, and this is probably an important factor - if you really want to maximize the impact of a vet presence in your locker room, get him in early and get him the playbook.  Otherwise he and the rookie are learning the playbook at the same time.

 

Three, and I really welcome this - I think Beane isn't a one-plan guy.  I think he's a guy who wants plan A, plan B, and plan C.  If he can't come out of the draft with a QB he likes who is ready to start, he wants at minimum a vet who has a chance at playing through a season.  You aren't going to get that off the 1 yr/$1M pile.

[ndirish1978]

How considerate of Nathan, now the ball will make it into the hands of the opposing team's defenders quicker

[BadLandsMeanie]

3 minutes ago, billsredneck1 said:

well i does make me wonder. if mcbeane says "you have to get a franchise guy"...knowing he had the ammo to go to the top of the draft....why would they scoop up a.j.?  why wouldn't they just wait until after the draft or june 1st and sign a vet for a vet min. 1 yr./ 1 mil. deal?

 

i'm hearing trade rumors...or possibility of trade rumors, but i'm not gonna hold my breath that these guys are hell bent on getting one of the top 4. i would not at all be surprised if they stand pat and even possibly take a qb 22 or later.

I think it is because they need a guy who will work with a rookie qb and won't be trying to undermine him, or not help him. Mc Carron will try to beat the guy out, but if he doesn't he will be an asset to the rookie. 

 

I'm not somebody who believes that they just took McCarron because he was the cheap one left. I think he was one of the few that they wanted.

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, billsredneck1 said:

i said this because i for one do not want darnold or allen...or rudolph etc. having to come in due to injury any time after the first snap on opening day. not only do i not want to lose the season ,but for the rookie's sake.

 

i think rosen or mayfield could handle it, but they are the only 2.

 

Why?

 

I mean, fair enough about wanting the rookie not to have to start for a stretch unless they're ready - it's the reason why I personally was against picking up Bradford or Bridgewater. 

But a decent OC really should be able to modify his game plan to allow a rookie to game-manage completion of one game without too much harms, then if you think Peterman is still the better choice to start, you could activate him.

 

The real problem with Dennison (IMO) was total and complete lack of flexibility and willingness to modify his Holy Book of Plays to accommodate the abilities of specific QB.

[BadLandsMeanie]

5 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep.  Bills opening day 2019. He doesn't have to be active on gameday.... him being on a 53 is your win, but him being on a Practice Squad is my win.

Fair enough BUT, lets leave the "53" out of it please. He has to be on the roster, not practice squad, agreed. But if they increase the roster to more than 53 I still win if he makes a roster.

[North Buffalo]

2 hours ago, matter2003 said:

Well, strength in the areas you would think doesnt always translate 1:1...

 

Most of your strength regardless of what you are doing comes from your lower body and engaging your posterior chain properly and efficiently...

 

Its a combination of both. The most velocity will come from learning how to properly torque your hips and likely from doing hip flexor/posterior chain/lower body work. Watch Tom Brady...he has a very efficient motion where he basically twists his hips and is able to generate really good velocity on the ball.

 

He was one of the QBs with suspect velocity coming into the NFL

Core strength and hip rotation is important but not the only thing that improves velocity and accuracy.  Now I am not a great athelete, but do play hockey and have been working with a trainer the past four months to improve my shot, velocity and accuracy.  My core is not the problem and my latts have always been strong making for a pretty good heavy wrist shot which really isnt one.  More a pull shot from my latts, hips and legs.  Problem is I often dont have that time or space to get it off.  So I have been working on my snap shot by doing a variety of wrist curls and working on forearm lifts.  Its been paying big dividends.  Able too roof the puck easier with more velocity.  Sauce passes are more accurate and I can get a snap shot off, more wrist forearm action, quicker.  Just saying there are multiple fundalmentals that make stronger arms than you listed.  Depends on what is needed. Marino’s 60 yard flicks come to mind.  Dude had amazing forearm wrist strength.

Edited April 18, 2018 by North Buffalo

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, BadLandsMeanie said:

Fair enough BUT, lets leave the "53" out of it please. He has to be on the roster, not practice squad, agreed. But if they increase the roster to more than 53 I still win if he makes a roster.

 

That won't happen under the current CBA.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

Fair enough BUT, lets leave the "53" out of it please. He has to be on the roster, not practice squad, agreed. But if they increase the roster to more than 53 I still win if he makes a roster.

 

Haha. Okay. Yes.  I wasn't meaning to get you on a technicality.  Roster not PS is fine.  

[BadLandsMeanie]

Just now, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

That won't happen under the current CBA.

Oh good point, thanks 26.

[Elite Poster]

1 hour ago, Green Lightning said:

Brady worked this guy. And Brady didn't have a cannon and still doesn't. Accuracy is key. And Peterman can be accurate. I think you're under selling this guy.

 

The only QB is NFL history to ever throw 5 INT in a half. I'm underselling him. 

 

Go ahead and tell me about how the biggest flash in a pan, miracle of a QB selected in the 6th round compares to Peterman though. 

4 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Who was that? 

 

Trent

4 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Whatever else you want to say, this isn't a BS program. House is Brady's QB coach. Has also worked with Brees, Carson Palmer and Matt Ryan.

 

And speaking of Ryans, he's worked with Noley as well. Nolan credited House in his Hall of Fame induction speech.

 

House is very much for real. Doesn't prove anything about how much Peterman might improve, but who knows, maybe. A lack of zip has been a major problem for him.

 

Continue to mention Peterman in the same breadth as the others there. Helps the credibility factor. 

[billsredneck1]

11 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Why?

 

I mean, fair enough about wanting the rookie not to have to start for a stretch unless they're ready - it's the reason why I personally was against picking up Bradford or Bridgewater. 

But a decent OC really should be able to modify his game plan to allow a rookie to game-manage completion of one game without too much harms, then if you think Peterman is still the better choice to start, you could activate him.

 

The real problem with Dennison (IMO) was total and complete lack of flexibility and willingness to modify his Holy Book of Plays to accommodate the abilities of specific QB.

i'm sure they have planned for all scenarios, but they damn sure didn't bring a.j. in to sit and mentor a rookie.

 

there is another thread on trade rumors and i don't know what's up with that but, i'm really starting to get a gut feeling that they will let the draft come to them. it seems like with all the frothing at the mouth with the qb thing, i would not doubt that the top 4 go in the top 5 picks and the bills get locked out....to that extent.  i wouldn't count out the giants at qb.

 

maybe subconsciously, i'm hoping that we use all our picks...and i do like rudolph.

Edited April 18, 2018 by billsredneck1

[Elite Poster]

5 hours ago, fansince88 said:

This is what I was waiting to hear. Will watch this later to see what he had to say. Thanks for posting @Thurman#1

So your saying g you would have rather he saI'd he sat on the couch at home?

 

5 hours ago, fansince88 said:

This is what I was waiting to hear. Will watch this later to see what he had to say. Thanks for posting @Thurman#1

So your saying g you would have rather he saI'd he sat on the couch at home?

 

No what I'm saying is this message board needs to stop acting like the worst QB in the league hands down, bar none, deserves a 7 page thread.

 

This fan base is beyond stupid when it comes to QB. It wasn't too long ago a majority here thought getting Goff and Wentz was stupid. Well we will watch them play for championships while we argue over 5th round bums.

 

I sincerely do not understand why this happens. I grew up in a time where you get credit and the benefit of the doubt if you actually do something to warrant it. A few throws in the preseason? Give me a damn break. 

Edited April 18, 2018 by Elite Poster

[Hapless Bills Fan]

7 minutes ago, billsredneck1 said:

i'm sure they have planned for all scenarios, but they damn sure didn't bring a.j. in to sit and mentor a rookie.

 

Bwaha at myself, I'm starting to sound like Rosen's damn twitter feed: "Why"?

 

Seriously, though, why?  I don't see it as "damn sure" at all.  Beane was very clear that they want a vet in the QB room.  He told McCarron he has a shot to compete for the job.

He didn't say (as Hue Jackson did to Taylor) "Son, you're the starter".  They're paying McCarron $4.9M guaranteed, $3M cap hit this year.  That's within a reasonable range for a high-quality backup.

 

I think they signed McCarron because they wanted a guy they think they can start all season if they have to, but I actually don't think that's plan A or plan B.

 

7 minutes ago, billsredneck1 said:

there is another thread on trade rumors and i don't know what's up with that but, i'm really starting to get a gut feeling that they will let the draft come to them. it seems like with all the frothing at the mouth with the qb thing, i would not doubt that the top 4 go in the top 5 picks and the bills get locked out....to that extent.  i wouldn't count out the giants at qb.

 

I think there's a real chance they let the draft come to them.  I don't count out the Giants at QB (it all depends upon what they think of Eli and of the prospects).  I just read Eli sold his Hoboken condo for a record price, which could be interpreted as him knowing the Giants plan to move on. 

 

I don't think it's all that likely that the top 4 QB go in the top 5 picks.  That would actually be unprecedented in the last 20 years of the draft, and I don't think the experts see this as an unprecedented level of QB talent.  The closest was 1999, when 3 QB were drafted 1-2-3: Tim Couch, Donovan McNabb, and Akili Smith.  Not names to fill a FO with confidence in that strategy.

[John from Riverside]

4 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Gunner does as much work on QBs as anyone. He isn’t saying this in hindsight. I will guarantee that he saw MUCH more of these QBs than the average NFL analyst before the draft. FWIW, he has a very similar process of evaluating players to NFL teams.

 

Gunner also isn’t a prisoner of groupthink. That’s one of the things that I respect most about the draft experts on here (and we have some). They will base their opinions, right or wrong, on what they see on tape. Watson was Gunner’s guy last year. He looks pretty smart on that. He (and Blokes) despised Peterman as a prospect. So far their thorough evaluations appear much more accurate than the talking heads. These guys put in A LOT of work and share their thorough  and unbiased analysis. Just because it isn’t what we want to hear doesn’t make it wrong. 

I also respect Gunner's opinion on these things.....

 

I think that Peterman is better then he has shown (I know I know.....bar is low) and i would not write him off just yet.

 

Smart.....does have accuracy in his game.....REALLY needs work on putting the ball in there and not letting it float.  I still think he could be a capable backup in this league.

[Jauronimo]

6 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

http://www.buffalobills.com/video/videos/Nathan-Peterman-Exciting-To-Learn/857fc723-1a5f-4134-bb88-1856f1bc6943

 

6'55 and then again later near the end

 

Peterman worked this offseason with Tom House to add velocity and get better. He was asked if he'd added velocity, he said "Yup, absolutely, that's what it was all about Also keeping your accuracy, 'cause accuracy I think is the most important thing. So being accurate while also being able to zip the ball right in there was critical."

 

That ought to be interesting to watch.

Definitely interesting.  If this offseason program is everything its cracked up to be, Peterman is going to be breaking defensive backs fingers left and right.

[BADOLBILZ]

5 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I don't think he was accurate in college. His college film is filled with horrible inaccuracy.  To me he is a classic case of getting the accuracy badge because he doesn't have a big arm.  It is the classic cliche used to describe QBs with less than ideal arm strength "smart and accurate."  My personal view on his college tape was the arm strength wasn't quite as bad as reported and the accuracy was nowhere near as good as reported.  He played in a gimmicky college offense and you had talking head draft media calling him "pro-ready".  I mean I know it is a thing on here at the moment to say nobody on this forum knows as much as guys who do this working for the networks but the draft media were way off base on Nathan Peterman.  His college tape was horrible from the perspective of a pro-evaluation.  All the "smart, accurate and pro-ready" stuff was just cliched rubbish from people who hadn't put the work in.  He was borderline undraftable.  The way he played in the league was absolutely zero surprise to me.  

 

Yup.   There is a tendency for evaluators to get lazy on second/third tier QB prospects.    They don't do the work then just say that he has some developmental traits.   His tape sucked and his play also comes with the caveat that he entered the NFL at 23 so he was far from a raw product.   He also gets credit for being a keen reader of defenses but he's really just decisive........which played well with a fanbase in Buffalo who has seen a lot of careful passers.   Never seen someone get so much credit for being a 50% passer in the preseason.

[Mrbojanglezs]

Peterman deserves more than one bad game in his rookie year before we throw him to the wolves 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

5 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I am not worried about the backup.  The backup is AJ McCarron.  Nate Peterman isn't even a lock to be on the roster.  

It is my opinion that, albeit one season, McDermott will not start a rookie day 1 we've seen nothing to suggest that it is a move he would make.   

 

I see what your opinion is,  but it is still an opinion and not a fact. 

[BringBackFergy]

You guys argue about the craziest **** ever!

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

It is my opinion that, albeit one season, McDermott will not start a rookie day 1 we've seen nothing to suggest that it is a move he would make.   

 

I see what your opinion is,  but it is still an opinion and not a fact. 

 

Maybe he won't. But I'd be shocked if the rookie was 3rd string come opening day.

12 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Yup.   There is a tendency for evaluators to get lazy on second/third tier QB prospects.    They don't do the work then just say that he has some developmental traits.   His tape sucked and his play also comes with the caveat that he entered the NFL at 23 so he was far from a raw product.   He also gets credit for being a keen reader of defenses but he's really just decisive........which played well with a fanbase in Buffalo who has seen a lot of careful passers.   Never seen someone get so much credit for being a 50% passer in the preseason.

 

Agreed on all Badol.  

[Homey D. Clown]

I really hope he finishes pre-season as the starter, I really do.  I loved what he did last pre-season, and how well he was playing in the snowy Colts game.  McBeane is not going to sell the farm for a QB, get that notion out of your heads, none of these QBs at the top are a lock to be elite, none of them, period.  So start warming up the idea of McCarron or Peterman now so you're not all jumping off the ledge come September.

 

No, he doesn't suck, yes, he was a rookie, and after 1.3 games...really????  a late round pick and you wanted instant Joe Montana, just add water???  it's ridiculous how people crucify a player's career around here.

[LABILLBACKER]

It's still way too early to come up with any evaluation on Peterman. Obviously he's not as bad as the Charger debacle nor is he as good as the Colts snow game. Let this play out. If he improves, than keep him as a backup. If he struggles more down the road than release him. It's not like we invested a high pick anyway. I'm just glad the Bills are willing to take chances on QB's , just like the Patriots did on this guy in the 6th round.....

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, Homey D. Clown said:

I really hope he finishes pre-season as the starter, I really do.  I loved what he did last pre-season, and how well he was playing in the snowy Colts game.  McBeane is not going to sell the farm for a QB, get that notion out of your heads, none of these QBs at the top are a lock to be elite, none of them, period.  So start warming up the idea of McCarron or Peterman now so you're not all jumping off the ledge come September.

 

No, he doesn't suck, yes, he was a rookie, and after 1.3 games...really????  a late round pick and you wanted instant Joe Montana, just add water???  it's ridiculous how people crucify a player's career around here.

 

We are picking a Quarterback in the 1st.  You might want to "warm up" to that.  

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

5 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Gunner does as much work on QBs as anyone. He isn’t saying this in hindsight. I will guarantee that he saw MUCH more of these QBs than the average NFL analyst before the draft. FWIW, he has a very similar process of evaluating players to NFL teams.

 

Gunner also isn’t a prisoner of groupthink. That’s one of the things that I respect most about the draft experts on here (and we have some). They will base their opinions, right or wrong, on what they see on tape. Watson was Gunner’s guy last year. He looks pretty smart on that. He (and Blokes) despised Peterman as a prospect. So far their thorough evaluations appear much more accurate than the talking heads. These guys put in A LOT of work and share their thorough  and unbiased analysis. Just because it isn’t what we want to hear doesn’t make it wrong. 

I'm not trying to say Gunner isn't knowledgeable Kirby.  Far from it.     If I thought he was FoS I'd say so and you know I would.

 

At this time of the year a lot of people are armchair GM's. 

 

As I just stated and I bolded your quote.  Its an opinion.  It just funny when fans post a statement as "fact" .  

 

Peterman is (Bean's Yeah I screwed up) McDermotts first QB pick and I'm not so sure he'd throw the towel in so fast.    

Edited April 18, 2018 by ShadyBillsFan

[Success]

Glad he’s focusing on that.  His last pass of the season really highlighted that problem - that should have gotten to the wr with time to spare, but it floated and let the db close the gap.

[GunnerBill]

Just now, ShadyBillsFan said:

Peterman is Bean's first QB pick and I'm not so sure he'd throw the towel in so fast.  

 

Beane didn't pick him.  Beane was not here.  

[Homey D. Clown]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

We are picking a Quarterback in the 1st.  You might want to "warm up" to that.  

 

lol, nope.  get yourself prepared for colossal disappointment.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

12 minutes ago, BringBackFergy said:

You guys argue about the craziest **** ever!

it's the offseason.     did you expect any less?  

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

6 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I thought Lance Zierlein's profile of him on nfl.com was quite accurate:

"Weaknesses

Inconsistent delivery base causes some throws to sail. Has instances where he short strides and is forced to muscle it to his target. Will float some throws on seams and dig routes. Will have to be mindful to drive the ball on pro level to avoid the ballhawks who are lurking at safety. Has to prove he has enough arm to challenge the same tight windows he did in college. Ball handling a little sluggish in wide receiver screens, hitches and most RPOs (run, pass option). Wants to play hero-ball at times. Needs to learn when to air-mail throw and move to next play rather than trying to get too cute with sideline throws. Can improve overall touch. "

 

 

 

Its like he had a crystal ball 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

Peterman is Bean's first QB pick and I'm not so sure he'd throw the towel in so fast.  

 

Except Peterman is NOT Beane's first QB pick, is he?

After last year's draft April 30th, Pegula got out a broom and fired not only Whaley, but his entire scouting staff.

Beane was hired on May 9th, after last year's draft.

 

This will be Beane's first draft with the Bills.

 

Now, it's said that McDermott was actually making the draft picks last year based on a board put together by Whaley and the scouts with his input.

So maybe Peterman is McDermott's first QB pick and he's not gonna throw in the towel so fast?

 

But....I doubt Beane feels much "pride of selection" in him

And...while McDermott has very properly NOT thrown Peterman under the bus, the decision to give him a start did wind up making McDermott look very stupid on a very public stage.  We used to call that kind of thing "pissing in the boss's Wheaties".  PIBW, whether it's your fault or not, is not key to entrenching yourself in his loyalties.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

4 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Beane didn't pick him.  Beane was not here.  

You are correct,  my mistake.   Scratch the Beane name and I think my opinion still stands  -- 

 

 

I don't think that to many teams would willing to discard their 1st round pick in only 2 seasons.

 

[MrEpsYtown]

5 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

Its like he had a crystal ball 

Lance does a good job with his evaluations. People say he sucks when his evaluations doesn't match up with their illogical man crushes. 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

8 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

Now, it's said that McDermott was actually making the draft picks last year based on a board put together by Whaley and the scouts with his input.

So maybe Peterman is McDermott's first QB pick and he's not gonna throw in the towel so fast?

I corrected my blunder.   

 

see my edit 

Edited April 18, 2018 by ShadyBillsFan

[MrEpsYtown]

90% of the appeal of Nate Peterman is that he wasn't Tyrod Taylor. Now we have AJ and another shiny new toy coming next week. 

[billykay]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

You have to believe the odds of him becoming that are good though.... personally I never did and still don't. Is there still a chance he becomes an NFL backup that sticks in the league? Yes. Do I consider it likely? No. 

 

I honestly can't believe that the most controversial opinion I have ever had in 5 years here is that Nate Peterman sucks :D. 

 

And I think that in my mind sums it up.... I think fans want him to succeed and so have gor unneccessarily angry when I have given an honest assessment of why he won't. 

Gunner,

were you ever a QB or coach ?

3 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

That doesn't not refute the fact that most NFL teams these days only carry 2 QBs on the 53 man roster. 

I've always thought that the NFL ought to allow teams to designate one player on the Practice Squad,  - probably a QB - as untouchable. This would allow teams to carry a young QB, & develop him without fear that he will be signed away. Not trying to hijack the thread, but just a thought.

[26CornerBlitz]

8 minutes ago, billykay said:

Gunner,

were you ever a QB or coach ?

I've always thought that the NFL ought to allow teams to designate one player on the Practice Squad,  - probably a QB - as untouchable. This would allow teams to carry a young QB, & develop him without fear that he will be signed away. Not trying to hijack the thread, but just a thought.

 

I think there are too many teams in the NFL that are "Have Nots" with regard to capable QBs for teams to vote this in. 

[bills in oregon]

7 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

He isn't very accurate either.  He sucks.  2018 will be his last year in the NFL.  

 Watch your mouth you’re talking about our starting quarterback he’s very accurate if the old-line were to protect him you would’ve seen that no quarterback is worth a damn When they are on their back.

[C.Biscuit97]

48 minutes ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

Peterman deserves more than one bad game in his rookie year before we throw him to the wolves 

I agree that giving up on any young player too soon is stupid.  Especially qb.  

 

But thr problem is Some Bills fans had unreal expectations for him.  He wasn’t anything special in college. He was a 5th rounder.  His best quality was he was “pro ready” which looks silly now.

 

if he turns out to be a backup qb, then it was a good pick.

12 minutes ago, billykay said:

Gunner,

were you ever a QB or coach ?

I've always thought that the NFL ought to allow teams to designate one player on the Practice Squad,  - probably a QB - as untouchable. This would allow teams to carry a young QB, & develop him without fear that he will be signed away. Not trying to hijack the thread, but just a thought.

That is a really good thought but probably too progressive for the nfl.  The qb play would be so much better if these guys could game reps in places besides the nfl.  Think about all the qbs nfl Europe produced.  I don’t know why they couldn’t do that in the spring in America.

[BuffaloHokie13]

30 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

You are correct,  my mistake.   Scratch the Beane name and I think my opinion still stands  -- 

 

I don't think that to many teams would willing to discard their 1st round pick in only 2 seasons.

He was a 5th round pick, not a 1st round pick.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, billykay said:

Gunner,

were you ever a QB or coach ?

 

I wish. No I wasn't. I am British and the game over here is still very much a minority participation sport. We had a team at University and I did play a bit of Quarterback and a bit of safety but it looked nothing like what you guys would recognise. It would probably be about 7th grade standard. 

And while I am not a football coach I was a reasonably successful semi pro soccer coach over here and so have some natural coach in me and that is why the more I learnt about football the more fascinated I was with the detail.