Is Jerry Hughes worth a swap of ones with Tampa Bay?

[FeelingOnYouboty]

They have a chance at Bradley Chubb at #7. I think they'll stand pat. 

 

If I were a Bucs GM I'd laugh the Bills out of the room for offering that.

[Kirby Jackson]

9 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

If they can get second round value for Shaq........you absolutely gotta'.

 

Overcoming that first step and turning into someone worth committing to that fifth year option next offseason and/or extending seems highly unlikely from 2 years of tape.

 

Run stopping 4-3 DE market is usually PURDY CHEAP in FA.

 

He could actually improve and only be worth a 6th or 7th rounder in trade next season because of the contract status.........at least he may still have some original draft day shine left on him at the moment.    I don't think TB would bite but let's hope so.

I don’t think that they would either but they are bad at the position (and it is thin in the draft). Maybe they say, “we can get a starter that has some upside” and only slide down 5 spots? 

[DrDawkinstein]

The move is a little low for his value, but in reasonable range. That said, I wouldnt do it and I doubt McBeane does it. They spent FA focusing on building up the DL. I dont think we've added enough players/talent to move our best pass rusher.

[ColoradoBills]

I'm not in favor of getting rid of Hughes BUT Beane may need to make another move closer to 2 or 3 to seal the deal with NYG or IND.

We don't know what the options are but a move to 7 or 8 might need to happen first.

Both IND and NYG may not want to trade down as far as #12.

Maybe Beane has to use one of our 2nd's to get up there?

 

It's not about what we want on TSW it's about what NYG and IND want.

[blacklabel]

42 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

There is no benefit whatsoever to them implying they may want to move on from them.     That vote of confidence is equal to the vote of confidence for TT.   Could be,  but there is reason to believe otherwise.   Shaq was reportedly in McD doghouse at some point last season and failed to be available down the stretch.

 

Either way, McD is big on having plenty of DL for his rotations. DL is a major point of emphasis for this team going forward. Trading away one or both of your top two DEs doesn't make a whole lot of sense especially after they just went and paid good money for a big, space-eating DT that should help DEs get more 1-on-1 opportunities. 

[dave mcbride]

7 hours ago, cage said:

 

Anyone who follows Joe Buscaglia's weekly film study articles see that Hughes was the highest ranked player all year long.  Our best player.  Maddening when people just look at the top line tackle and sack numbers and then dismissively declare we should dump him.

 

https://www.wkbw.com/sports/bills/2017-buffalo-bills-all-22-in-review-defensive-ends

 

Preach on! He had 45 freaking pressures - fifth in the NFL. Too many people don't know squat about his play. 

[ColoradoBills]

7 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Preach on! He had 45 freaking pressures - fifth in the NFL. Too many people don't know squat about his play. 

 

Thank you, it is not worth creating another big hole to save a handful of millions in cap.

Hughes is a good DE that the Bill's need to keep.

[dave mcbride]

 

More on Hughes:

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2751016-nfl1000-ranking-the-top-4-3-defensive-ends-from-2017-season

 

"13. Jerry Hughes, Buffalo Bills

Pass Rush: 23/30
Run Defense: 15/20
Snap Quickness: 14/20
Tackling: 14/20
Position Value: 8/10
Overall Grade: 74/100

Jerry Hughes is one of the best speed/bend pass-rushers in the sport. After playing as a 3-4 outside linebacker for Rex Ryan, Hughes transitioned back to a full-time pass-rusher role as a 4-3 defensive end for Sean McDermott. With Lorenzo Alexander's move from 3-4 outside linebacker to 4-3 outside linebacker, Hughes had to be "the guy" for Buffalo this season. With little to no holes in his game, he should be considered an above-average starter for the position."

 

He finished fifth in the league in qb pressures with 45 in 2017 and had his best graded game as a Bill ever in the final game this past season:

http://buffalonews.com/2018/01/02/advanced-stats-jerry-hughes-erupts-for-bills-against-backup-left-tackle-vs-dolphins/

 

He finished 9th in pressures in 2016 too:

https://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/defensive-hurries/2016/

 

[buffalobloodfloridahome]

If we truly have our eyes on Rosen we will need to move up in the draft. We have been stockpiling FA DEs with Trent and Owu. I would send either Hughes or Lawson to move up and get in an even better position to draft. Lawson isn't the pass rusher I thought he could be but is still solid at setting the edge which has value.

[Reed83HOF]

I love Hughes and all, but who cares and how much does it really matter if we keep our 1st rounder next year? Honestly he isn't the player that is going to make or break a Superbowl for us this upcoming season. Maybe, at best, he wins us 1 game next year - meh...go get your QB. He is on the wrong side of 30...Thanks for the plays, flags and for being better than Kelvin Sheppard....

[dave mcbride]

10 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

I love Hughes and all, but who cares and how much does it really matter if we keep our 1st rounder next year? Honestly he isn't the player that is going to make or break a Superbowl for us this upcoming season. Maybe, at best, he wins us 1 game next year - meh...go get your QB. He is on the wrong side of 30...Thanks for the plays, flags and for being better than Kelvin Sheppard....

The Bills have to play defense too, and to play defense effectively you have to pressure the passer. The most important positions on a team are QB, pass rushing DE, CB, and LT. Hughes is the best pass rusher on the team and one of the better ones in the league judging from his production. Getting rid of Hughes isn't addition by subtraction; it's subtraction by subtraction. 

 

And he in fact won us a game last year that we had no business winning:

 

 

Edited March 16, 2018 by dave mcbride

[Reed83HOF]

58 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

The Bills have to play defense too, and to play defense effectively you have to pressure the passer. The most important positions on a team are QB, pass rushing DE, CB, and LT. Hughes is the best pass rusher on the team and one of the better ones in the league judging from his production. Getting rid of Hughes isn't addition by subtraction; it's subtraction by subtraction. 

I don't disagree with any of this by the way....

 

We have so many holes that aren't going to be filled this year anyways; if Lawson isn't enough to move up and Hughes can allow us to; do it by all means. Yeah it will hurt, but not as much as missing out on a QB...the most important position of them all is QB...

 

Edit:

58 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

And he in fact won us a game last year that we had no business winning:

 

I did say maybe, at best, he wins us 1 game 

 

Edited March 16, 2018 by Reed83HOF

[dave mcbride]

Just now, Reed83HOF said:

I don't disagree with any of this by the way....

 

We have so many holes that aren't going to be filled this year anyways; if Lawson isn't enough to move up and Hughes can allow us to; do it by all means. Yeah it will hurt, but not as much as missing out on a QB...the most important position of them all is QB...

 

 

I firmly believe that they have all the draft ammo they need to move up and grab the qb they want. No need to subtract your best pass rusher to do it. A lot of DEs have had their best seasons in their 30-33 years, btw - they've learned all the tricks of the trade by then.

[Fadingpain]

If Hughes can be converted into an asset that is valuable to us, long term, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

 

Hughes' playing window is going to close before we are going to emerge from this as a strong team, assuming we ever do.

It's like that 3 year (?) or so run-up to the Bills going to their first Superbowl in January 1991.  

 

We could all see we were good and going to be better, but it just took some time.  I'm thinking of the Cleveland game in particular and the Ronny Harmon drop...

 

By the time we could really benefit from a good Hughes, he won't be good anymore or even on the team.

So use him as a piece to get a future asset now! 

 

 

 

[dave mcbride]

2 minutes ago, Fadingpain said:

If Hughes can be converted into an asset that is valuable to us, long term, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

 

Hughes' playing window is going to close before we are going to emerge from this as a strong team, assuming we ever do.

It's like that 3 year (?) or so run-up to the Bills going to their first Superbowl in January 1991.  

 

We could all see we were good and going to be better, but it just took some time.  I'm thinking of the Cleveland game in particular and the Ronny Harmon drop...

 

By the time we could really benefit from a good Hughes, he won't be good anymore or even on the team.

So use him as a piece to get a future asset now! 

 

 

 

The Bills made the playoffs last season. The object is to improve on 9-7, not go backward.

[Reed83HOF]

2 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

I firmly believe that they have all the draft ammo they need to move up and grab the qb they want. No need to subtract your best pass rusher to do it. A lot of DEs have had their best seasons in their 30-33 years, btw - they've learned all the tricks of the trade by then.

 

Again I don't disagree. In keeping with the spirit of this thread, if that is what it took, yup  

 

I also think we have enough ammo to move up, besides Cleveland we have the most amount of ammo. I do think you run into some potential issues with our ammo though:

1.) The Jets are little scary though, because I still think 6>>(12+22) to NYG, when I have a strong hunch they want Quenten Nelson if Barkley is not there.

2.) Indy may prefer to have 12 & 22 though. They need many, many players...

3.) Not sure CLE also wants 12 & 22, since they could use another big impact player, much like NYG I think 7 would be a more comfortable swap with them. 

[Wayne Arnold]

We need to greatly improve our pass rush. Hughes is our only good pass rusher. Let's trade him!

 

#TBDLogic

[Reed83HOF]

2 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

The Bills made the playoffs last season. The object is to improve on 9-7, not go backward.

We made the playoffs because Cin won a game. The difference between 7-9 & 9-7 doesn't do much for us right now, we still have plenty of holes. To be a bit provocative; I would rather have Glenn over Hughes so we could get rid of Mills and not get our rookie QB killed by that turnstile...

[dave mcbride]

3 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

 

Again I don't disagree. In keeping with the spirit of this thread, if that is what it took, yup  

 

I also think we have enough ammo to move up, besides Cleveland we have the most amount of ammo. I do think you run into some potential issues with our ammo though:

1.) The Jets are little scary though, because I still think 6>>(12+22) to NYG, when I have a strong hunch they want Quenten Nelson if Barkley is not there.

2.) Indy may prefer to have 12 & 22 though. They need many, many players...

3.) Not sure CLE also wants 12 & 22, since they could use another big impact player, much like NYG I think 7 would be a more comfortable swap with them. 

I'm worried about the Jets too.

[ndirish1978]

8 hours ago, nucci said:

How?

 

Consider the poster you're speaking to - 100% troll. 

 

7 hours ago, joesixpack said:

Make it Lawson and you have a deal

 

He's not worth a 2nd rd pick. That said, if Beane found a way to trade a player to move up that high in the first he would be a legend in my mind. Imagine getting a franchise QB and drafting a sick LB in the first AND having both of our second rounders? Zero chance it happens if we move up IMO, but man that would be a crazy draft. 

[Reed83HOF]

Just now, dave mcbride said:

I'm worried about the Jets too.

Think about it in the perspective of the teams we are trading with & how far back they want to slide and the players that will be off the board. If we had a QB and were in #2 or #3; I would want to slide back to 6 or 7 and if the QB run was still happening during the draft, I would slide down a hair more if my guys were still there. If not, you bet I wouldn't trade and grab my guy....

 

I'm also not convinced that Denver is willing to pass on a QB at 5 either. Our best bet is to move to #3 if 12+22+53/56 or 65. if we can't do that, I really think we may have to move to 7. I would think that all options should be on the board...

[nucci]

2 minutes ago, ndirish1978 said:

 

Consider the poster you're speaking to - 100% troll. 

 

 

 

yep, thanks. 

[NewEra]

12 hours ago, mileena said:

I'd do it in a heartbeat. Hughes is worthless to us.

 

Do you watch the games?  

[njbuff]

Guys, those who are pro Hughes......... my take is you have to give up something to get something.

 

And to those who think the Bucs won't even bother..................... the Bengals took on an injured aging LT for the Bills to move up 9 spots. Hughes is about the same age as Glenn, without the injuries and I am advocating for the Bills to move up 5 spots by trading the Bucs Hughes.

 

I understand both sides of the argument. Mine is, you have to give up something to get something.

[LABILLBACKER]

8 hours ago, Estro said:

Precisely.  #22 and #7 is actually a little more valuable than the 3rd pick, so maybe the Colts give you their 4th or 5th back.

 

The point being the Bills wouldn't have to touch any picks next year, or any of their multiple 2nd or 3rd round picks this yr.  That's 4 picks in rounds 2 and 3 to find quality starters on CHEAP 4 yr rookie deals.  This is how smart teams build rosters.

Exactly! Moving to 7 would just be the stepping stone to 2/3. Hughes will be 30 and he's diminishing returns. I want sacks, not pressures. Freeing up some cap space would help also. I see Murphy & Odiggy being our starting DE's anyway. Thanks Jerry for your efforts but the process continues.....

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, blacklabel said:

 

Either way, McD is big on having plenty of DL for his rotations. DL is a major point of emphasis for this team going forward. Trading away one or both of your top two DEs doesn't make a whole lot of sense especially after they just went and paid good money for a big, space-eating DT that should help DEs get more 1-on-1 opportunities. 

 

 

C'm on man,  this is McD.

 

He literally fielded a team without a top 70 quality NFL receiver for the first half of the season and 3 of his 4 regular DT's post-Dareus ended up ranking in the 100's in terms of NFL DT productivity..........like it or not, he is not afraid to put bad football players on the field if he can't have talented ones that live the process.     We know about the ship Rex ran but I'd also guess that life at Club Dabo was a bit less structured for the Shaqster.

[GunnerBill]

2 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

I'm worried about the Jets too.

 

The Jets are not trading up.  They are not signing McCown, Bridgewater and then trading up giving up assets for a guy there will be pressure to start almost immediately.  I don't rule them out of taking whoever is there at #6 still, but I think more likely the Jets are going the take another shot at a 2nd round guy.... Rudolph if he falls there or Mike White. 

[dave mcbride]

46 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The Jets are not trading up.  They are not signing McCown, Bridgewater and then trading up giving up assets for a guy there will be pressure to start almost immediately.  I don't rule them out of taking whoever is there at #6 still, but I think more likely the Jets are going the take another shot at a 2nd round guy.... Rudolph if he falls there or Mike White. 

I really hope you're right. Neither of their qbs have anything close to long term contracts, however,  and this is a great draft for the position. We shall see.

[BADOLBILZ]

56 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The Jets are not trading up.  They are not signing McCown, Bridgewater and then trading up giving up assets for a guy there will be pressure to start almost immediately.  I don't rule them out of taking whoever is there at #6 still, but I think more likely the Jets are going the take another shot at a 2nd round guy.... Rudolph if he falls there or Mike White. 

 

9 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

I really hope you're right. Neither of their qbs have anything close to long term contracts, however,  and this is a great draft for the position. We shall see.

 

Me too.

 

I'd be pissed as a Jets fan if they sat tight and ended up with yet another second tier prospect...........that fanbase has been in tank-for-a-QB mode for the past 14 months.

[Kelly the Dog]

2 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Me too.

 

I'd be pissed as a Jets fan if they sat tight and ended up with yet another second tier prospect...........that fanbase has been in tank-for-a-QB mode for the past 14 months.

They have five QBs on their roster now, although the fifth is a nobody. After having to carry four last year and three the entire season, I'm not sure they are going to do that again. I doubt they are signing Bridgewater and then making him inactive, or Darnold/Allen/Rosen inactive.

[BADOLBILZ]

1 minute ago, Kelly the Dog said:

They have five QBs on their roster now, although the fifth is a nobody. After having to carry four last year and three the entire season, I'm not sure they are going to do that again. I doubt they are signing Bridgewater and then making him inactive, or Darnold/Allen/Rosen inactive.

 

 

I'd like to see them draft Rudolph at #6.     Imagine the Ken O'Brien selection but with social media.

[mileena]

6 hours ago, NewEra said:

 

Do you watch the games?  

 

How did he do last year?

6 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

I'm worried about the Jets too.

 

LOL! You're scared of the Jets? They just signed two QB's, one of whom is their franchise QB.

Edited March 17, 2018 by mileena

[BillsFanForever19]

Jerry Hughes will benefit greatly from the arrivals of Star Lotulelei and Trent Murphy. And like they said through Carucci - we need all the DE help we can get. 

 

We're not in the position to be ousting a talent like Jerry Hughes right now.

[dave mcbride]

19 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The Jets are not trading up.  They are not signing McCown, Bridgewater and then trading up giving up assets for a guy there will be pressure to start almost immediately.  I don't rule them out of taking whoever is there at #6 still, but I think more likely the Jets are going the take another shot at a 2nd round guy.... Rudolph if he falls there or Mike White. 

Um ...

[Reed83HOF]

21 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

I'm worried about the Jets too.

Welp....

[Elite Poster]

On 3/16/2018 at 6:36 AM, jr1 said:

I don't see anyone wanting  Hughes' salary and him being a flag magnet

 

He had 6 flags this year. 29 defensive ends had at least 4 flags this year. He wasn't even top 5 for flags for his own position. If we are talking the entire league, he's not even in the top 50 for flags. 

 

Can we stop with the fake news.

[Da webster guy]

any upward move for us is either the #2 spot or nothing

 

 

[GunnerBill]

2 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

Um ...

 

Yep. About as wrong as it is possible to be. Looks like it is #2 or bust for the Bills. 

[MrEpsYtown]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep. About as wrong as it is possible to be. Looks like it is #2 or bust for the Bills. 

This idea makes sense if you can get to seven, then jump to 2. Giants can still get Nelson at 7. Tampa was probably hoping Chubb fell to them if the Colts traded back. Now that the Colts are at six, Tampa isn't getting Chubb. They could trade down to 12 and get Davenport. 

[OldTimer1960]

Someone earlier summed this up well - why would TB want a 30 year old highly paid pass rusher who had 4 sacks last season?

 

Now, I’m not saying that Hughes couldn’t have a more productive year in 2018, but I don’t think TB would trade anything of value to take that gamble.