Augie Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 The TO's are less of an issue than Tyrod scrambling, getting nowhere, and using up clock instead of throwing the ball away. Exactly! Tyrod made some poor decisions which made a bad situation worse. (And I'm not a complete Tyrod hater, though I fully acknowledge we need a replacement.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Fixing things that aren't broken is the Buffalo way. Offense is bad. Who would've thought after changing schemes from an already good offense and trading away your best receiver? Could've promoted Anthony Lynn to HC I guess. But he's 0-2 and who knows how the defense would be playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 This is a terrible thread, IMO. For three reasons: 1) we didn't lose because of clock management; it played actually no role whatsoever in the outcome of the game and so I don't get why this is a complaint. 2) in hindsight, the clock was actually managed correctly. If Zay catches that ball, we call TO and then easily have 3 Shots at the end zone while giving the panthers no chance to get the ball back. 3) if you can't appreciate how well coached the D was out there today and on the road, you are missing what coaching is all about. The game management stuff comes with experience; the fundamental coaching doesn't. ...and then there are these facts.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Exactly! Tyrod made some poor decisions which made a bad situation worse. (And I'm not a complete Tyrod hater, though I fully acknowledge we need a replacement.) Tyrod's poor decisions do not excuse McDermott's poor decisions. He's the head coach. The head coach is the game manager (unless he hires one to do it for him, which in light of this game may not be a terrible idea). ...and then there are these facts.... Actually none of those things are facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALLEN1QB Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 All I know is it is so nice to not see fat Rex I can't complain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Tyrod's poor decisions do not excuse McDermott's poor decisions. He's the head coach. The head coach is the game manager (unless he hires one to do it for him, which in light of this game may not be a terrible idea). Actually none of those things are facts. I guess we'll just disagree. I'm not saying it was perfect, but nothing ever is. It wasn't as bad as people make it out to be. Trade "truths" for "facts" and I fully stand behind that statement. All I know is it is so nice to not see fat Rex I can't complain And THIS I will agree with! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manther Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 The TO's are less of an issue than Tyrod scrambling, getting nowhere, and using up clock instead of throwing the ball away.Agreed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Time to fire McD already? Christ I need to get off this board. Whoever is responsible for keeping Taylor on this team needs to be fired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RalphWilson'sNewWar Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Typical DC mentality. "Oh it was a good team, proud of the effort and the team fought hard." See the thing with defensive coordinators are they love this type of nonsense they love keeping games low scoring and close and they feel that it's a good thing that it comes down to the end even though their own offense is settinging the game back by 30 years and a complete embarrassment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pirate Angel Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 had the game announcers not said anything about poor clock management would we have so many posts on it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 had the game announcers not said anything about poor clock management would we have so many posts on it.... ...and the announcers are generally idiots, so..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heitz Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Typical DC mentality. "Oh it was a good team, proud of the effort and the team fought hard." See the thing with defensive coordinators are they love this type of nonsense they love keeping games low scoring and close and they feel that it's a good thing that it comes down to the end even though their own offense is settinging the game back by 30 years and a complete embarrassment So your contention is McDermott wants to limit the opponents score, and then just HOPE to score more than them? I 100% guarantee you are wrong. had the game announcers not said anything about poor clock management would we have so many posts on it.... Truth. Pretty sure this thread was posted after the first mention (though, to be fair, I was on about my 5th seltzer by then!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Fixing things that aren't broken is the Buffalo way. Offense is bad. Who would've thought after changing schemes from an already good offense and trading away your best receiver? The Bills suffered no significant loss of offensive output with Sammy out of the lineup and actually won more games last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Dig a little deeper bud. And you've already been proven wrong on that. Tyrods production fell off with Sammy out of the lineup the last two years. Goodwin, despite his fragility is a terrific deep threat and the offensive play design last year was A LOT better and better suited for the players we currently have. Continuity there would've been ideal. I don't feel like going back to check Tyrod's production. But the W-L record is correct. Meaning that even if there was greater production with Sammy, it didn't translate to wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rochesterfan Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Maybe clock management would be better if tyrod wouldnt scramble for 3 yards every other play when you are trying to conserve time Truth! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan130 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 (edited) This is a terrible thread, IMO. For three reasons: 1) we didn't lose because of clock management; it played actually no role whatsoever in the outcome of the game and so I don't get why this is a complaint. 2) in hindsight, the clock was actually managed correctly. If Zay catches that ball, we call TO and then easily have 3 Shots at the end zone while giving the panthers no chance to get the ball back. 3) if you can't appreciate how well coached the D was out there today and on the road, you are missing what coaching is all about. The game management stuff comes with experience; the fundamental coaching doesn't. Respectfully disagree with your first 2 points. Clock management I believe played a factor, or at least should have played a factor in most NFL games. On Carolina's last drive, the bills let 33 seconds off before calling a timeout. 33 seconds! That is 3 plays in the NFL at least. If the bills had another 33 seconds, they would have had a better chance the last drive of course. I get that if Jones catches it they have plenty of time, but it is still inexcusable to let 33 seconds run off for no reason . Also completely miss manages the end of the first half- He is lucky the defence came up big- Not sure why he was trying to get a first down when it was 2nd and 27 at their own 5 yard line when there was 70 seconds left, when Carolina only had 1 timeout left.- All he had to do was run it twice and kill the clock Edited September 18, 2017 by billsfan11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Does defense come into the equation? Or you are strictly looking at W/L record and nothing else? Just W-L record. If a guy is out and the team does better, it's not the be-all-end-all, but it's another piece of information. Ultimately the question is "do you sign Sammy for $12M/year after the season is over?" If the answer is no, you move him. Do you think the Rams are going to offer him $12M/year, much less franchise him, if he keeps at his current level of production (56 catches for 704 yards)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Respectfully disagree with your first 2 points. Clock management I believe played a factor, or at least should have played a factor in most NFL games. On Carolina's last drive, the bills let 33 seconds off before calling a timeout. 33 seconds! That is 3 plays in the NFL at least. If the bills had another 33 seconds, they would have had a better chance the last drive of course. I get that if Jones catches it they have plenty of time, but it is still inexcusable to let 33 seconds run off for no reason . Also completely miss manages the end of the first half- He is lucky the defence came up big- Not sure why he was trying to get a first down when it was 2nd and 27 at their own 5 yard line when there was 70 seconds left, when Carolina only had 1 timeout left.- All he had to do was run it twice and kill the clock It was a strategic move to wait to call the TO. They wanted to see the Panthers' formation. And it worked. The Panthers did the same thing to the Bills near the end of the game. As for the end of the first half, they ran the ball on that 2nd and 27 so the clock ran. If they run the ball the next play, the Panthers likely stuff them, call a TO and still get the ball back with the same amount of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 We knew/know this is what Tyrod is. We knew this wasn't going to be a good offense. But I think we were hoping we finally had a coach that could manage the game properly. Clock management by McDermott was absolutely embarrassing. And I don't want to hear about how he's a rookie head coach, he's been around this game. He himself said he's been preparing for this for a long time. It's a tough reality to face that we have yet another head coach who has no idea how to manage the game. I hated the clock management today...however, I am also not in panic mode yet over it. Its still just his 2nd game where he had to manage a clock, and really his first where that clock management was critical at the end of the game. No one is great at everything their first outing, so while it was a disappointment, what he has done to this defense, the way he's taking control of the team and discipline, and other things I have seen from him leaves me very optimistic on McD still Dennison was the way bigger concern for me personally today. McCoy had 3 carries and he was on side line on first down running Tolbert. Tolbert should not be taking carries from McCoy unless to give him a rest or short power run situation. The play calling was puzzling, boring, and highly predictable almost the whole game and felt very conservative and uninspired. Best drive was the last drive where they finally opened up more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 We are two games in, and this is SO much better than Rex I'm thoroughly relieved. I'll give it some time. Geez! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offsides#76FredSmerlas Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 (edited) 2nd game ever as a head coach. 1st game on the road. Classic Bills fans overreacting. I actually blame Tyrod more for poor clock management at the end of the game. He needs to throw the ball away. McDermott was actually SMART to save the 2 timeouts. If Zay catches the ball it wouldn't be a TD, we would have needed a TO to have 2 shots at the end zone with about 9 seconds left on the clock. McDermott didn't do anything wrong in this game.It wasn't smart. The smart thing to do was call a time out and save yourself 20 seconds. It opens up your playbook and allows the threat of a run or a throw over the middle. Then you run up and spike the ball after a first down. Also, if that ball was thrown better Zay walks in for touchdown, crap throw. Zay had him ripped but Tyrod just did another choke job. Edited September 18, 2017 by offsides#76FredSmerlas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
100DollarBills Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 The TO's are less of an issue than Tyrod scrambling, getting nowhere, and using up clock instead of throwing the ball away. This, it is just unforgivable. Just like his putrid sub 25 yards passing 1st half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Goodwin, despite his fragility is a terrific deep threat and the offensive play design last year was A LOT better and better suited for the players we currently have. I'm going to have to strongly disagree with this statement. https://www.ninersnation.com/2017/9/17/16323914/49ers-seahawks-recap-marquise-goodwin-drop-week-2 I hated the clock management today...however, I am also not in panic mode yet over it. Its still just his 2nd game where he had to manage a clock, and really his first where that clock management was critical at the end of the game. No one is great at everything their first outing, so while it was a disappointment, what he has done to this defense, the way he's taking control of the team and discipline, and other things I have seen from him leaves me very optimistic on McD still Dennison was the way bigger concern for me personally today. McCoy had 3 carries and he was on side line on first down running Tolbert. Tolbert should not be taking carries from McCoy unless to give him a rest or short power run situation. The play calling was puzzling, boring, and highly predictable almost the whole game and felt very conservative and uninspired. Best drive was the last drive where they finally opened up more. None of us have any sort of NFL HC experience and at least 90% of us still knew that he needed to call a timeout at the 0:46 mark after Tyrod scrambled. On a more positive note, I am glad that he went for it on 4th down in the 3rd quarter. We are two games in, and this is SO much better than Rex I'm thoroughly relieved. I'll give it some time. Geez! How so? We just scored 3 points and are 1-1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan17 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 This is a terrible thread, IMO. For three reasons: 1) we didn't lose because of clock management; it played actually no role whatsoever in the outcome of the game and so I don't get why this is a complaint. 2) in hindsight, the clock was actually managed correctly. If Zay catches that ball, we call TO and then easily have 3 Shots at the end zone while giving the panthers no chance to get the ball back. 3) if you can't appreciate how well coached the D was out there today and on the road, you are missing what coaching is all about. The game management stuff comes with experience; the fundamental coaching doesn't. Bingo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auburnbillsbacker Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 The offense should have been fine this year. They were a top 10 offense the last two years. A downgrade at offensive coordinator and allowing our 2 starting WRs to leave is to blame for the lackluster performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Dennison was the way bigger concern for me personally today. McCoy had 3 carries and he was on side line on first down running Tolbert. Tolbert should not be taking carries from McCoy unless to give him a rest or short power run situation. The play calling was puzzling, boring, and highly predictable almost the whole game and felt very conservative and uninspired. Best drive was the last drive where they finally opened up more. I agree. McDermott shares in that blame too though for that poor offensive game plan. How can McDermott be so good at attacking Carolina's offense and so bad at attacking Carolina's defense? He should know Carolina defensive weaknesses better than anybody. And he didn't exploit any of them. That offensive game plan was a **** show. The Bills were woefully unprepared on offense. Horrible. Inexcusable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teef Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Sounds like most of you were listening to Gannon, who has no idea what's going on on the Bills' sideline. To me it seemed like they had a play set to go quick, but it took too long to get it in there and someone messed up so he was forced to burn a TO. this is exactly what i was thinking. if he didn't make such a big point over it, it would never have been mentioned here. was it perfect...no? i certainly don't think it was a much of a problem as the op makes it out to be. if it's a thing every game, let's bring this back up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Losing out on Mike McCoy was the most underrated event of the offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 this is exactly what i was thinking. if he didn't make such a big point over it, it would never have been mentioned here. was it perfect...no? i certainly don't think it was a much of a problem as the op makes it out to be. if it's a thing every game, let's bring this back up. I didn't even hear Gannon because I was yelling "WHAT ARE YOU DOING, MCDERMOTT?!" too loudly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straight Hucklebuck Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 (edited) To me it's disappointing to see another Head Coach like Rex, Marrone and Dick Jauron who are obsessed with Special Teams and Field Position. The real question is if we ever get a real QB, does the offense change? Or are we going to keep trying to win games by punting and sweeping runs? Edited September 18, 2017 by Straight Hucklebuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan130 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 It was a strategic move to wait to call the TO. They wanted to see the Panthers' formation. And it worked. The Panthers did the same thing to the Bills near the end of the game. As for the end of the first half, they ran the ball on that 2nd and 27 so the clock ran. If they run the ball the next play, the Panthers likely stuff them, call a TO and still get the ball back with the same amount of time. I would not say it worked. Newton missed a wide open Mccafery. It was the easiest 3 yard touchdown. Bills got very lucky on that one. And as for the end of the half, they were wanting to throw it, Tyrod took off and ran it for 10 yards out of bounds and then the next pass was incomplete. Then punt. If they run it twice, Carolina has the ball back with under 10 seconds and 0 timeouts. Against a good offence, that would have been at least a 3 point mistake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teef Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 I didn't even hear Gannon because I was yelling "WHAT ARE YOU DOING, MCDERMOTT?!" too loudly. lol! don't get me wrong...it wasn't fun to watch, but i'm not too concerned yet. at least you yelled yesterday. i think i was the most bored watching a bills game as i have been in a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 We knew/know this is what Tyrod is. We knew this wasn't going to be a good offense. But I think we were hoping we finally had a coach that could manage the game properly. Clock management by McDermott was absolutely embarrassing. And I don't want to hear about how he's a rookie head coach, he's been around this game. He himself said he's been preparing for this for a long time. It's a tough reality to face that we have yet another head coach who has no idea how to manage the game. Who is this "we"? You may have been hoping for coaching competence but after watching the fiasco that was the offense in the preseason, I knew that McDermott was most likely a Jauron-clone. I thought that the Jests game would have been a TD-less gem but apparently the Jests are more inept than even I thought, and Carolina not nearly as good offensively as I believed. The good news, of course, just like in the Jauron-era, was that the Bills beat the point spread as they were 7 or 7.5 dogs. PS: every QB needs protection and targets, even the greats like Brady or Rodgers. Taylor has neither ... and that's not his fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Wagon Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 We lost 2-3 plays AT LEAST on the final drive. It didn't really matter because we couldn't convert a 4th and 10, but the clock management was bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ricojes Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 We knew/know this is what Tyrod is. We knew this wasn't going to be a good offense. But I think we were hoping we finally had a coach that could manage the game properly. Clock management by McDermott was absolutely embarrassing. And I don't want to hear about how he's a rookie head coach, he's been around this game. He himself said he's been preparing for this for a long time. It's a tough reality to face that we have yet another head coach who has no idea how to manage the game. If it's a better throw or an incredible catch the Bills score with 6 seconds on the clock. Pretty good IMO... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddog69 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Well, yeah. But he is a Two-time state champion in wrestling so he must be a great football coach, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quinnearlysghost88 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 This. 3. especially. the team is disciplined, focused, and on the same page. it's clear we don't have the talent on offense to compete, but that's not on the coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 3. especially. the team is disciplined, focused, and on the same page. it's clear we don't have the talent on offense to compete, but that's not on the coach. Offense was not focused, on the same page nor prepared for the solid ass kicking they just took. And the offensive game plan flat out sucked. That is in fact McDermott's fault - at least a huge chunk of it is. And Dennison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simool Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Offense was not focused, on the same page nor prepared for the solid ass kicking they just took. And the offensive game plan flat out sucked. That is in fact McDermott's fault - at least a huge chunk of it is. And Dennison. Solid ass kicking? I guess those 9 points that Carolina put up *without a single TD* constitutes a solid ass kicking in your mind. In my mind I saw two defensive teams play a hell of a game yesterday. Carolina's front four is one of the better units in the league. #3 is right on in my book, if you disagree maybe you need to watch some games from last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 (edited) Solid ass kicking? I guess those 9 points that Carolina put up *without a single TD* constitutes a solid ass kicking in your mind. In my mind I saw two defensive teams play a hell of a game yesterday. Carolina's front four is one of the better units in the league. #3 is right on in my book, if you disagree maybe you need to watch some games from last season. Yes. The Bills offense took a solid ass kicking yesterday. Like I said. Unquestionably. Edited September 18, 2017 by PolishDave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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