Punching Bag Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 Can't wait until the next Chris Kelsay is the Bills' best player. So says the Chris Kelsay of TSW - lots of volume but little impact. I don't think it was a matter of "afford"ing $4m for MG. It was a matter of not valuing any backup RB being worth $4m when RBs are a dime a dozen. Dime a dozen? As taught to me in debate class "Exaggeration is the tool of the unarmed". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerseyBills Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 He needs to have a solid year,the new regime has zero ties to most of this roster. If they don't earn their paycheck they will be shown the door.. Is there any doubt he won't be phenomenal? 4 Oline starters going on year three together and a potential instant upgrade at RT. Throw in the best blocking FB in the NFL and what should be a much better pass game,if Watkins can stay on the field. Shady has no signs of slowing down and is a gym rat, I see at least two elite years ahead. He was amazing last year. Worth every penny So says the Chris Kelsay of TSW - lots of volume but little impact. Dime a dozen? As taught to me in debate class "Exaggeration is the tool of the unarmed". I don't want to take anything away from TD Mike but let's be real, the Oline was the main ingredient behind his success. Monster holes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 Sirius touched on this yesterday, don't be shocked if he is traded or cut this next offseason. How does one trade for a RB whose cap hit is 8.95 ? My thoughts is tha McCoy has a wonderful year and will play out the contract in 2018. He has been our best player the lsat two seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 I believe the point of the article was to say that stars can be developed, not signed as splash signings to bolsters ticket sales. If Vic wants to make that point he should stop writing click bait articles; it is hypocritical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dread321 Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 As long as he's the best player on our team I want him here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipster19 Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 When he starts slowing down this will be a discussion worth having. I agree with this but when McCoy was the only one to miss the voluntary workouts he couldn't have endeared himself too much with Capt Egghead. I think that when the Bills drafted Dion Dawkins they may have been laying the ground work for life after Richie as well. By this time next year you may not recognize the roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dat Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 Reggie Bush was able to set a record behind the same line last year for only 1.5 mil. Difference between dime a dozen and cut on a dime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 Reggie Bush was able to set a record behind the same line last year for only 1.5 mil. Difference between dime a dozen and cut on a dime. wtf....please tell me this is dripping with sarcasm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 The only star I want on this team is a young dynamic franchise qb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerseyBills Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 The only star I want on this team is a young dynamic franchise qb.Good chance we already have that!!!Tyrod sure has the potential to be that. Still young, extremely dynamic, and still has so much room to grow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dat Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 wtf....please tell me this is dripping with sarcasm Yes, I didn't say what the record he set was. It wasn't positive in more ways than one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 i'm not exactly endorsing this comment, but it's worth talking about. A no-star system works if you have Bill Belichick and Tom Brady. But look at most other teams; they have stars. Look Seattle, Atlanta, Green Bay. A lot of what seems to have been going on with the Bills is to model the organization after the Pats. That's all well and good if you have a Belichick, but McDermott hasn't coached one game yet, so I wonder whether it makes sense to go aggressively in that direction. Atlanta has two players this year with cap hits over $10 million. Pats and Bills have three. Steelers, Packers, Seahawks all have five or six. It's too early to tell where this team is headed so far as stars are concerned. But if they're going in the direction the Pats are going, McDermott and his new GM better be really good at figuring out who the athletes are that fit the system. And the system better be awfully good, because a mediocre system with mediocre talent ain't cuttin it in this league. My impression is that if Carucci actually meant no starts, he's wrong. Carolina has a few, Cam, Kelvin Benjamin, and one or two guys on defense as well, if I recall. Looked to me more like the article meant they aren't going to base the team's player acquisition strategy mostly around getting stars as they have in the past. Reggie Bush was able to set a record behind the same line last year for only 1.5 mil. Difference between dime a dozen and cut on a dime. Also the difference between 12 attempts and a bunch more. And it doesn't help if a couple of those attempts were trick plays that had Reggie get the ball way behind the LOS and not heading downfield. Not that I was thrilled with Reggie, but he wasn't given much of a chance. If Vic wants to make that point he should stop writing click bait articles; it is hypocritical. And again, the Buffalo News has no interest in clickbait. Nor do most newspapers. If they did, they sure wouldn't stop you from getting more than ten articles per month. They make their online money from digital subscriptions and thus need people to want and like their articles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 the point of the Article is that the new philosophy of McD might provide improved and sustainable long term results. building a team with a few high priced splashy big names (all your eggs in one basket approach used by whaley on Sammy, dareus, McCoy, hughes, clay, cordy) is not as good as building a team by spreading the risk of injury and salary cap over a greater number of players. trading down in the first round (like McD just did) is usually (but not always) better than paying a premium and trading up (like whaley did for Sammy). McD has the luxury of thinking long term.......whaley acted like he was trying to live and keep his job for one more year at a time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 I agree with this but when McCoy was the only one to miss the voluntary workouts he couldn't have endeared himself too much with Capt Egghead. I think that when the Bills drafted Dion Dawkins they may have been laying the ground work for life after Richie as well. By this time next year you may not recognize the roster. He missed 1 day of lifting weights. Stop making this a big deal....they have not started football practice. The only star I want on this team is a young dynamic franchise qb. Then we won't win much. Do you recall how many star players were on the Superbowl teams? It was more than just the QB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 And again, the Buffalo News has no interest in clickbait. Nor do most newspapers. If they did, they sure wouldn't stop you from getting more than ten articles per month. They make their online money from digital subscriptions and thus need people to want and like their article Completely wrong. They want clicks to tell advertisers how many visitors they have and nobody really pays attention to the 10 per month for they just clear (or block) the cookies. The sports department makes NO attempt to get anyone except who agrees with their slant to like their articles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 (edited) His salary is 5.11% of the Bills' cap number this season. If he is still performing at a level anywhere close to last year that is not at all exorbitant. Compare and contrast Charles Clay's 5.19% impact. Shady ain't your problem. Edited May 6, 2017 by eball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T master Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 (edited) Until Shady shows me a sign of slowing down, I'm keeping him and paying him. He is an elite RB in this league and he hasn't shown any sign of slowing down yet. Yes, we know it's coming at some point, but we should wait until then before we start considering moving on. If he looks as good as he did last year this season, then there is no way I get rid of him in 2018. Very few RBs are a cut above the rest, he is one of them and is a game changer. I Agree !! Edited May 7, 2017 by T master Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 (edited) the point of the Article is that the new philosophy of McD might provide improved and sustainable long term results. building a team with a few high priced splashy big names (all your eggs in one basket approach used by whaley on Sammy, dareus, McCoy, hughes, clay, cordy) is not as good as building a team by spreading the risk of injury and salary cap over a greater number of players. trading down in the first round (like McD just did) is usually (but not always) better than paying a premium and trading up (like whaley did for Sammy). McD has the luxury of thinking long term.......whaley acted like he was trying to live and keep his job for one more year at a time This point seems to be lost on virtually every post I've read. The point of the article is the philosphy of McD, and it fits right into everything that we've been reading, which is the contrast of Whaley and co. scouting approach to McD's vision of building a team. Edited May 7, 2017 by Magox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clemfield2622 Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 This year he has a cap hit of $8.875m Next year would be 8.95, but 5.25 if they cut him, a 3.7 savings. Of course they could designate him a post June 1 cut and spread that 5.25 over 2 years if they chose. 2019 his cap hit is 9.05. They'd save 6.4 million by cutting him. Right now cap room isn't a problem in 2018. They have a projected 32 million under the cap, using this years number which is bound to rise. Wood comes off the cap next year. Cutting Incognito would save over 6 million. If Alexander is done, he'd save another 3 , while cutting Hughes would save almost another 5. Let us not forget the extra 10 they'd save if they decided to move on from Tyrod. They could easily have 60+ million to spend next offseason. Plenty to keep Sammy if they so chose and get younger and cheaper at alot of positions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 This year he has a cap hit of $8.875m Next year would be 8.95, but 5.25 if they cut him, a 3.7 savings. Of course they could designate him a post June 1 cut and spread that 5.25 over 2 years if they chose. 2019 his cap hit is 9.05. They'd save 6.4 million by cutting him. Right now cap room isn't a problem in 2018. They have a projected 32 million under the cap, using this years number which is bound to rise. Wood comes off the cap next year. Cutting Incognito would save over 6 million. If Alexander is done, he'd save another 3 , while cutting Hughes would save almost another 5. Let us not forget the extra 10 they'd save if they decided to move on from Tyrod. They could easily have 60+ million to spend next offseason. Plenty to keep Sammy if they so chose and get younger and cheaper at alot of positions Of course they would have money to spend...you just cut 5 players that would need to be replaced.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webster Guy Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 Was high enough that New England knew there was no way we could afford to pay $4 mil for MG to be the backup. We had the room to pay $4M for Mike. After all the rook and FA signings there will still be $6 or $7m available and that's even if no deals are restructured. Overdorf and/or Whaley messed that one up badly. Mike wasn't just a backups he was a platoon runner and the best ypc average in the world these past two years. $2.76m we could have retained him with the 2nd round tender. Looks like a big mistake unless they can get someone to fill those shoes. Jonathan Williams needs to step up big time. Shady needs to be fresh when he gets his carries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 The Bills didn't make a mistake with the tender. They didn't want to pay him for than $2M/year. They could easily have matched the Cheaters' contract or tendered him higher but didn't. We'll see if it was a mistake or not (I think they did but hope not). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinii Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 (edited) Reggie Bush was able to set a record behind the same line last year for only 1.5 mil. Difference between dime a dozen and cut on a dime.I think the word you were looking for is chasm, but your point is well made. Edited May 7, 2017 by iinii Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_In_NH Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 He had a good contract that the bills tore up to make home ok with coming to buffalo. Stupid move. What he had was good for a top RB. That first season with Rex had a lot of bad contracts given out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigK14094 Posted May 7, 2017 Share Posted May 7, 2017 He needs to have a solid year,the new regime has zero ties to most of this roster. If they don't earn their paycheck they will be shown the door.. Shady worth the money if he gets 1200-1500 yards and 10 td's for the team....which he is fully capable of doing if healthy. Now, he is getting long in the tooth as they say, but, he can do it until he can't. When he gets going, he is incredible. and is a true home run threat when on the field. (just like Sammy is on better days) As long as he performs at an all pro level, he will stay. McD knows that talent doesn't come along often. As for TD Mike, a real loss to the Bills, and he will do fine w the Pats. Good on him, maximizing his income during his prime years. Regrets for the Bills and their fans, but not for MIke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattt9998 Posted May 8, 2017 Share Posted May 8, 2017 We grossly overpaid for a RB, Is he a great player yes. But his the 2nd highest paid RB in the NFL. Id rather use that money on other positions. You can draft a rookie RB and get solid production out of him. I'd be happy not having that contract on the books. I would have rather not had shady at that cost. Drafted a RB in the 1st this year, as we could have kept Gilmore with the $ saved on shady. Are a lot of RBs who could run behind our line. Are not a lot of #1 corners available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted May 8, 2017 Share Posted May 8, 2017 At least McCoy produces, and this thread talks about dumping him. When can we dump MD, or are we saddled with that contract forever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted May 8, 2017 Share Posted May 8, 2017 At least McCoy produces, and this thread talks about dumping him. When can we dump MD, or are we saddled with that contract forever? Let's wait until we see him back in the 4-3 where he belongs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 His salary is 5.11% of the Bills' cap number this season. If he is still performing at a level anywhere close to last year that is not at all exorbitant. Compare and contrast Charles Clay's 5.19% impact. Shady ain't your problem. OK e-man, but those numbers are a concern by any stretch. Those two would not, and should not be the highest paid players on virtually any team in the NFL. I am just so glad that they got rid of Whaley!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 OK e-man, but those numbers are a concern by any stretch. Those two would not, and should not be the highest paid players on virtually any team in the NFL. I am just so glad that they got rid of Whaley!!! Gotham Bill, McCoy was the best player on offense. He was the center piece of the offense, even more so than the qb. Our offense was built around the running game rather than the passing game because of the limitations of the starting qb and the archaic philosophy of our brash and fool talking HC. When you over pay for a player that is producing that is not catastrophic. You can absorb the imbalance between the cost and output. So your complaint about McCoy consuming too much of the cap doesn't seem to be a fair judgment. The Clay criticism has merit but it isn't due to him consuming too much cap. Whaley added a good receiving TE who could expand the restricted offense but he didn't have a qb who could maximize his talents. How dumb is that? The problem with Whaley was he was constantly searching for players who could buttress the play of his limited qb instead of searching for a qb capable of maximizing the talents of his receivers. He had his pants on backwards. Where I agree with you on Whaley is that he took a tactical approach instead of a strategic approach in building his roster and paying for it. He had a patchwork mentality that lacked foresight in the way he approached his job. In the end it came back to haunt him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 Where I agree with you on Whaley is that he took a tactical approach instead of a strategic approach in building his roster and paying for it. He had a patchwork mentality that lacked foresight in the way he approached his job. In the end it came back to haunt him.Well said. In terms of roster building, what many don't seem to grasp is that a draft isn't successful just because one or two are "good." Plenty of players are good but winning is the goal. That's why it usually takes time to really be able to evaluate a draft. For instance, Gilmore was good. A case could be made that Whitner was good as well but neither translated into winning football games. The absolute best way to build a winning team is through the draft, but it is a process. The Bills historically waste high (often very high) picks on defensive backs and running backs, and they lose football games. Now, Clay and Shady (free agent signings) are the highest paid players and the Bills are losing football games. Whether or not they are 'good" is not the issue. Like I said, Whaley was a rank amateur and had to go. Hopefully Brandon is next. We really do need a new system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HT02 Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 The 5 year deal he was given after being traded here is like most 5 year deals. Lots of dead cap if he's released in the first 3 years, not so bad after that. In this case LM would carry $5.25 mil in dead cap for 2018 if released after this year. But we would actually gain $3.7 mil in cap space for 2018. Keeping him around for 2018 and then releasing him would gain $6.425 mil in 2019 cap space. I think this is Shady's last year as a Bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 Well said. In terms of roster building, what many don't seem to grasp is that a draft isn't successful just because one or two are "good." Plenty of players are good but winning is the goal. That's why it usually takes time to really be able to evaluate a draft. For instance, Gilmore was good. A case could be made that Whitner was good as well but neither translated into winning football games. The absolute best way to build a winning team is through the draft, but it is a process. The Bills historically waste high (often very high) picks on defensive backs and running backs, and they lose football games. Now, Clay and Shady (free agent signings) are the highest paid players and the Bills are losing football games. Whether or not they are 'good" is not the issue. Like I said, Whaley was a rank amateur and had to go. Hopefully Brandon is next. We really do need a new system. Bill, You can make a lot of mistakes with the cap and on players when assembling a roster and still remain competitive. But what can't be overcome is not having a credible qb taking the snaps for your offense. It's so basic that it is perplexing how this bedraggled franchise has almost to the point of it being a neuroses has avoided the issue. Whatever issues you have with Gilmore or the positions that are being prioritized those issues fade when you have a good qb because that more than anything else allows you to compete. One weakness that has plagued Whaley to the point that it ended up in he sabotaging himself is his inability to judge talent for the position. Investing in EJ was as likely to be successful as investing in Rex to be a successful coach. It was a ludicrous position to stake your job on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDIGGZ Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 but we are the #1 rushing team in the NFL and everyone knows that the team that can run the football wins the Super Bowl! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 17, 2017 Share Posted May 17, 2017 Interesting graphic. @ESPNNFL Devonta Freeman is 2nd in the NFL in rushing over the last 2 seasons, but is making just over $1M in cash over that span on his rookie deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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