dulles Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Deion Sanders sucked at tackling too. Most corners suck at it outside of Aqib Taleb. And Antoine Winfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 If you are trying to not get hurt you don't bury your shoulder into a guy to tackle him, you weakly try to wrap your arms around him. That is not a don't get hurt play it's a crappy tackler play. Â Â Right I understand. Gilmore is just really soft and never tackles much... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 (edited) Darby is a pretty good tackler. And Robey actually. Edited December 25, 2016 by Big C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokestradamus Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Darby is a pretty good tackler. And Robey actually. Â The bonkers bit about this? Darby (in 250 less snaps), 7 missed tackles. Gilmore, 7 missed tackles. That's before today, according to PFF. Hand on my heart, they might be generous on Darby's MT's. possibly had 4 a couple weeks ago vs PIT, credit for 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Â The bonkers bit about this? Darby (in 250 less snaps), 7 missed tackles. Gilmore, 7 missed tackles. That's before today, according to PFF. Hand on my heart, they might be generous on Darby's MT's. possibly had 4 a couple weeks ago vs PIT, credit for 2. Well I'm happy to say I'm wrong there, but I think dating back to last year Darby was a guy I thought of as a reliable tackler and at minimum he at least displays proper form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest K-GunJimKelly12 Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 (edited) Deion Sanders sucked at tackling too. Most corners suck at it outside of Aqib Taleb. Deion Sanders was the best cover corner of all-time, had 53 career interceptions and 9 defensive TD returns. When you have a player like that, you forgive his lack of tackling because he allows you to do so many other things on defense. Stephan Gilmore is nowhere, and I mean nowhere near the cover corner Deion Sanders was. The comparison is ridiculous. Â Part of the appeal of having Stephon Gilmore is he has the size to match up against bigger receivers and play more physical. But what good is that if he doesn't use it? He is soft and doesn't want to put his body in a situation where he might feel the pain of making a hard nosed tackle. Wrapping up, head in the bread basket, hands behind their knees is tackling 101. Gilmore was in a perfect position to make a form tackle and he wimped out. He just threw a shoulder instead. Even if he didn't make the tackle he would have slowed up the receiver enough for someone else to get over and stop the receiver before a first down or at least a big play. Effort matters. Â Gilmore has all the talent and size you want in a corner. If he had the competitiveness of a guy like Steve Smith, he might be the best corner in the league. Unfortunately, he is a bit of a prima donna, and cares more about looking good than winning. I don't care how talented he is, I don't believe you are ever going to win anything big with Stephon Gilmore being one of your largest contracts. We will be fine without him. Talent matters but attitude matters as well. Use that money elsewhere and the Bills will be better off. Edited December 25, 2016 by K-GunJimKelly12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 No, your takes never have irritated me. Sure, we disagree from time to time. If anything, I'm glad because of the fine, upscale dialogue. Still, I stand firm wrt Gilmore. Imo he was a wasted pick. Hey I could be proven wrong down the road. Sometimes we are wrong with our opinions and sometimes we click. Btw, how is Spiller doing these days? :) I never heard of a player named Spiller? What sport does he play? Soccer maybe? Wasn't Spiller the nickname of the slovenly frat boy who would get obnoxiously drunk and end up knocking over the drinks of the more sober frat brothers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloFan68 Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 I'd keep him if the price is right. Go Bills!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Nope. He continues to suck at tackling and is not a top 5 type talent. Pass and replace, SG is exactly the kind of player you say goodbye to after the 5th year option is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 If he comes back at the $$$ he's making this year then fine. If he thinks he's getting Josh Norman money? ✌✌ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackFergy Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Well, I think we are all in agreement here. End thread? Lol  Next target: Carpenter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest K-GunJimKelly12 Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Even if Darby can't make the tackle on a guy, he is always willing to put his head in there and slow up the receiver/runner enough to prevent bigger plays. He is much more competitive than Gilmore. I don't see how your better off without Gilmore.He's a good cover corner. They don't grow on trees.Franchise him again if you have to. I would franchise him with the idea of trading him. You have to think you would at least be able to get a 3rd at the worst for him. I would be surprised if they got less than a second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 I don't see how your better off without Gilmore. He's a good cover corner. They don't grow on trees. Franchise him again if you have to. I think the franchise last year was 11.5. It will go up this year. The report was that the Bills offered him 10.5 m per year and he turned it down, which he should have. And they haven't talked since. I think I may franchise him, too. It depends on what they really think of Darby, Seymour, Robey-Coleman and White. Plus whether they think they need Zach Brown and or Lorax. All of those things enter into the equation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QB Bills Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 2012 draft..  the pick before gilmore? luke kuechly  the two picks after gilmore? dontari poe and fletcher cox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokestradamus Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Well I'm happy to say I'm wrong there, but I think dating back to last year Darby was a guy I thought of as a reliable tackler and at minimum he at least displays proper form. Â The difference is willingness. Stephon, God bless him, is a tad contact-phobic. Darby is a touch reckless, diving into contact a bit. Technique-wise, he's much more proficient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Even if Darby can't make the tackle on a guy, he is always willing to put his head in there and slow up the receiver/runner enough to prevent bigger plays. He is much more competitive than Gilmore. Â I would franchise him with the idea of trading him. You have to think you would at least be able to get a 3rd at the worst for him. I would be surprised if they got less than a second. Â Exactly . Gilmore plays the game with a losers mentality. He has zero attitude on the field and doesn't sell out to score if a pick does happen to come right to him. He will not wrap a guy up to limit yac. He just doesnt hate to give up a catch, to yield a single yard. He's what a franchise like the Bills doesn't need. To spend big $ on a CB that is not elite. So move on and get a guy that may be a more complete player. The D could be better for it. Those $ can be better spent elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klos63 Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 2012 draft..  the pick before gilmore? luke kuechly  the two picks after gilmore? dontari poe and fletcher cox Kuechly is a crybaby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koufax Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Guys, shoulder tackling is actually less safe than proper tackling. He was not playing to save his body. He just isn't very good at tackling. Still played decent in coverage. Â Deion wasn't good at tackling either. I evaluate him based on how he covers, and consider tackling a secondary part I would love him to be good at, but not something I would make a major consideration in whether I want him back or not. I definitely want him on this team, but am not sure what price gets too high and costs us elsewhere and makes it not worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 2012 draft..  the pick before gilmore? luke kuechly  the two picks after gilmore? dontari poe and fletcher cox Ugh . I'd take any of those guys over SG. He just doesn't appear to have the " want to" to go along with his coverage ability.. He's part of what's wrong with this defense more than what's good about it. Deion wasn't good at tackling either. I evaluate him based on how he covers, and consider tackling a secondary part I would love him to be good at, but not something I would make a major consideration in whether I want him back or not. I definitely want him on this team, but am not sure what price gets too high and costs us elsewhere and makes it not worth it. Deion Sanders? If only..... No Deion was not physical, but he was so freaking special as a cover guy , and when he got a pick there was a good chance he was taking it all the way. A legit HOF talent, in another universe from Stephon freaking Gilmore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QB Bills Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Kuechly is a crybaby. No he's not. It was allergies. Â https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1yIg7BxTUE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TANK2 Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 We should make him the highest paid corner in the league. 30 million a year for 10 years. Â Sincerely, Â The koolaid drinkers. Â Â P.S. If you dont agree with this you just have an agenda or clearly dont know the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 What are you going to say when when several teams offer him top 5 money? And no team offers him top 20-30 money? Â I'm not saying he is playing great. He's frustrating. He's not top 5 because he makes too many mistakes guys in the top 5 don't make as much (all CBs get burnt and miss tackles). But he's an excellent CB. Probably 6-10. top 5 money 2017 is top 8 money 2018 is top 10 money in. 2019 is top 20 money 2020 is middle 30 by 2021...Don't know the market outlook but traditionnaly that's the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChasBB Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 "... A case could be made that his attempt at a "shoulder tackle" cost us a game with playoff implications, on Christmas Eve...." I think what is overlooked is why wasn't he traded last off-season? Why go into the season with a guy the Bills front office did not believe enough in to give a long-term contract to? It creates an mistrusting environment with neither party knowing or believing the intentions of the other. If the front office didn't really believe in the guy, then see what you can do on the trade market. All this said, I didn't see the game (yet), but if what you say is accurate, then the guy is truly a disgrace - regardless of circumstances, contracts, or whatever. It's about having competitors on the field and he's been a weak link in that regard, it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Football fans are so funny.  A guy that plays very good for a long time no let him walk  A guy that plays Blah most of two seasons but has a game here and there, Cant live without him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 (edited) Kuechly is a crybaby.Trashiest post on the wall in years. Â Kuechly is amazing. Â He's a crybaby because of the concussions ? Edited December 25, 2016 by Ryan L Billz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klos63 Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Trashiest post on the wall in years. Â Kuechly is amazing. Â He's a crybaby because of the concussions ? grow up, it's a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 He's a solid corner and before this season I would have said yes, pay him. However, now...it's a much iffier question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BB2004 Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Deion Sanders sucked at tackling too. Most corners suck at it outside of Aqib Taleb. Â Antonie Winfield was an excellent tackler when he played for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 I went from thinking Gilmore sucked, to thinking he wasn't an actual football player.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 (edited) I once read Bill Walsh broke blocking down into 30 unique, individual skills and then developed multiple drills that 49er offensive linemen practiced relentlessly until they were mastered. Â Gilmore is a good cover DB but has exhibited poor tackling technique his entire career. I have to assume the Bills coaches are not good at teaching tackling techniques. Too often we have guys in the right places but not making the play because of poor tackling fundamentals. Edited December 25, 2016 by hondo in seattle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estro Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 He plaued much better the seconf galf of the season, but I still dont want to pay him big bucks. Â If this team is serious about starting over with a new coach and new qb, it mught be time to let some high priced guys walk and receive the high conpensatory picks that ho with that. Â Im noy sure signing defensive players yo massive deals is yhe eay yo go in this league. I certainly know Bill Bellechick doesnt believe in that philosophy. Id like to see some more money spent on the offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 I don't like his body language but he's an elite player on a roster with very few of those. Â Carolina is going to pay him top dollar and they won't mind about the tackling - they have actual NFL linebackers on that defense who do most of the tackling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Trashiest post on the wall in years. Â Kuechly is amazing. Â He's a crybaby because of the concussions ? Just a side effect of all the roids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterpan Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Gilmore has been over rated his entire career. Still good but not great, and he will get better thab great money, which the bills simply cannot afford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM57 Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 I don't like his body language but he's an elite player on a roster with very few of those. Â Carolina is going to pay him top dollar and they won't mind about the tackling - they have actual NFL linebackers on that defense who do most of the tackling. Carolina would make a ton of sense for Gilmore if the Bills let him walk and they can make it work under the cap. Very close to home for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 I once read Bill Walsh broke blocking down into 30 unique, individual skills and then developed multiple drills that 49er offensive linemen practiced relentlessly until they were mastered. Â Gilmore is a good cover DB but has exhibited poor tackling technique his entire career. I have to assume the Bills coaches are not good at teaching tackling techniques. Too often we have guys in the right places but not making the play because of poor tackling fundamentals. Â Good take Hondo. He is worth a solid contract vs. starting all over, but not the money he wanted at the beginning of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PO16FFS Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Good luck replacing a corner like Gilmore. It won't be easy, but let's run him out of town because he wants to get paid. Â I wonder which games you watch on Sundays. Â No one fears the Great Gilmore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Â I wonder which games you watch on Sundays. Â No one fears the Great Gilmore. Lot of players not feared on this team but some get protected I guess and others tossed under the bus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Just a side effect of all the roids. Lol. God forbid a white guy flies all over the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PO16FFS Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Lot of players not feared on this team but some get protected I guess and others tossed under the bus  No one on this team other than McCoy deserve to get protected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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