Buddy = Hypocrite

[Malazan]

I agree. Building through the draft means keeping your talented players, even letting Rinehart goes shows something has changed this year.

 

Yep, Chad Reinhart is the agent of change. There is no longer any hope for this team without Reinhart.

[Kevin]

I just came in here to fart.

 

haha. The more I read this the funnier it is.

[Hazed and Amuzed]

If I recall correctly on numerous times Buddy has stated one of the problems with this organization in the past is that they would let talented players leave instead of resigning them. Yet he let's Levitre walk without a contract offer. The lack of an offer screams of a Jeffrey Littmann decision (a la not paying Will Wolford). The cycle of failure continues at One Bills Drive......

Oh my freaking God, will you people stop? Maybe Levitre didn't want to resign with a team that hasn't been to the playoffs in 13 years. Maybe to play here he wanted 9+ a year and if Nix wasn't willing to pay that then good for him. Neither you or I know the circumstances.

[Kevin]

I just came in here to fart.

 

Still laughing. Best post EVER!

[qwksilver]

Wait... What happened to Levitre? Did I miss something?

[JohnC]

You realize how naive that statement is, right? You don't believe the player's agent has already looked at the landscape of who will be available when his client hits the market, and already has an idea of the contract $$ he'll be seeking?

 

Please.

 

As you noted many of the delusional "what if" critics don't want to accept the fact that the Levitre departure is simply an invevitable product of the cap system. Levitre and his agent were well aware of what his status was probably going to be on the market, and so did the Bills. That is why he wouldn't sign an early deal and give up his enticing free agent status. Levitre isn't a sentimental dope in a brutal business who would forgo his market value.

 

The bottom line is that Levitre did what was right for himself and Nix did what was right for the franchise. Nix also did what he had to do with the Fitz situation. Keeping him at his current contract would have been a mistake. Fitz understandably acted in his own interest, as did Nix.

 

I'm certainly not a fan of Buddy Nix. But he has acted very responsibly and smartly in the way he has handled his recent personnel transactions. If he comes up with a quality qp prospect in this year's draft I will be a little less harsh in my evaluation of him.

Edited March 14, 2013 by JohnC

[Rob's House]

OP,

 

Grow up. Thanks,

 

Rob

[Orton's Arm]

We offered him a contract, he just didn't take it... and lest be honest, 8 million a yr for a guard was not money we really had for that position.

 

We have offered other FA's contracts too, but we aren't over paying and i'm ok with that. The majority of Nix's mistakes will be erased almost entirely by the time next yrs draft comes. Be patient, we're not in that bad a spot for a team that's is rebuilding and finally doing it with a youth movement.

 

> 8 million a yr for a guard was not money we really had for that position

 

This is true. There would have been another problem as well. Players playing similar positions on the same team compare their contracts to each other. One of the reasons Jason Peters held out was because he realized he was significantly more valuable than any of our other offensive linemen, but wasn't being paid more than some of the other guys on the line. Overpaying for guys like Derrick Dockery and Langston Walker drove up Jason Peters' price.

 

Levitre is a good, solid offensive lineman. But Glenn looks like he could be a good, solid offensive lineman as well, and he plays a much more valuable position than LG. When healthy, Wood is also a good player, and plays a more valuable position than LG. If we'd paid Levitre $8 million a year, then later on we might have to choose between either paying each of those guys considerably more than $8 million a year, or letting them walk.

[Jeff Wright's Mullet]

This theory has been debunked. Both sides knew long ago that Levitre's price tag was more than the Bills wanted to pay. Everybody says, "lock him up a year ago" but it's just not that simple.

 

From Levitre's interview with the San Diego press:

 

"The money they had to spend and the market money my agent had me at didn't match up," Levitre said of failed negotiations.

 

Again it has not been reported that the Bills offered a contract to Levitre. Levitre stated he had not received an offer from the BIlls the week prior to the draft. The point is mute if you are finally offering him a deal right at the start of free agency. People seem to think Levitre is easily replaceable which he is not. The guy was durable, versatile, and young. John Glennon (reporter for the Tennessean) reported last season the Bills ran 49 times over LG for an average on 6.43 yards which was tops in the NFL. If a year ago you new he was going to test free agency trade him for some compensation. If Byrd isn't going to sign a long term deal trade him for compensation. You simply cannot let talented players walk. I know they resigned Williams, Stevie, and others but we just let one of our best players walk for nothing and we are a worse team because of it.

[nucci]

If I recall correctly on numerous times Buddy has stated one of the problems with this organization in the past is that they would let talented players leave instead of resigning them. Yet he let's Levitre walk without a contract offer. The lack of an offer screams of a Jeffrey Littmann decision (a la not paying Will Wolford). The cycle of failure continues at One Bills Drive......

You can't re-sign everyone!!!!

[BRAWNDO]

> 8 million a yr for a guard was not money we really had for that position

 

This is true. There would have been another problem as well. Players playing similar positions on the same team compare their contracts to each other. One of the reasons Jason Peters held out was because he realized he was significantly more valuable than any of our other offensive linemen, but wasn't being paid more than some of the other guys on the line. Overpaying for guys like Derrick Dockery and Langston Walker drove up Jason Peters' price.

 

Levitre is a good, solid offensive lineman. But Glenn looks like he could be a good, solid offensive lineman as well, and he plays a much more valuable position than LG. When healthy, Wood is also a good player, and plays a more valuable position than LG. If we'd paid Levitre $8 million a year, then later on we might have to choose between either paying each of those guys considerably more than $8 million a year, or letting them walk.

 

This

[Mango]

 

 

Again it has not been reported that the Bills offered a contract to Levitre. Levitre stated he had not received an offer from the BIlls the week prior to the draft. The point is mute if you are finally offering him a deal right at the start of free agency. People seem to think Levitre is easily replaceable which he is not. The guy was durable, versatile, and young. John Glennon (reporter for the Tennessean) reported last season the Bills ran 49 times over LG for an average on 6.43 yards which was tops in the NFL. If a year ago you new he was going to test free agency trade him for some compensation. If Byrd isn't going to sign a long term deal trade him for compensation. You simply cannot let talented players walk. I know they resigned Williams, Stevie, and others but we just let one of our best players walk for nothing and we are a worse team because of it.

 

I'd be curious of what the other stats are for this and how that is spread through out the rest of the line. I've heard people tout that Urbik is actually our most capable run blocker. We actually run right more often.

 

I'm on my phone so it is tough to find

[Dibs]

We actually run right more often.

 

Yes.....but we had a better Y/A running to the left.

[K-9]

Again it has not been reported that the Bills offered a contract to Levitre. Levitre stated he had not received an offer from the BIlls the week prior to the draft. The point is mute if you are finally offering him a deal right at the start of free agency. People seem to think Levitre is easily replaceable which he is not. The guy was durable, versatile, and young. John Glennon (reporter for the Tennessean) reported last season the Bills ran 49 times over LG for an average on 6.43 yards which was tops in the NFL. If a year ago you new he was going to test free agency trade him for some compensation. If Byrd isn't going to sign a long term deal trade him for compensation. You simply cannot let talented players walk. I know they resigned Williams, Stevie, and others but we just let one of our best players walk for nothing and we are a worse team because of it.

 

Is that from ProFootballFocus? I'd like to know because they don't think very highly of Levitre as a run-blocking G. They also don't think he's worth what he got. They have him as the 9th rated G. Which is funny because they rate him as the best pass blocking G. That would seem to say he REALLY SUCKS as a run-blocking G. So, how much of that left side success was due to Wood and Glenn reaching the second level? I can think of a few long Spiller gains to the left side when Glenn was at the 2nd and 3rd levels for instance.

 

Levitre: a good tactician with good feet who regularly gets overpowered at the POA. Good but not great. And certainly NOT worth what he got to the Bills.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Perk71]

Really dude exhibit A the Ravens. Give buddy a break

 

Exactly

[FireChan]

Wait, we owe Nix the benefit of the doubt. He knows a lot more than we do.

 

... oh, sorry, I'm in a time warp going backwards a year plus.

 

My bad.

 

On deck: Whaley, the next expert who's done all the right things during his stay in Buffalo while it'll have been Nix that did all the wrong ones.

 

We'll owe him the benefit of the doubt too.

 

The fans deserve this team for supporting the complete buffoons in the front office all these years.

 

Spray the place already and get rid of the lot.

 

Fire George Edwards, Wannstedt's a defensive genius!!!

 

Classic Bills fan, Whaley's now an unsung hero.

[ALF]

The year before a contract expires, negotiate a new one. If the player wants too much, trade him for a draft pick at least ,don't let him walk. If you don't want to resign a player, then let him play out his contract and walk.

[n3wyork13]

There's not a single franchise that can afford to keep all their talented players. Little thing called the salary cap. They've done a good job in keeping Stevie Johnson and Kyle Williams, gave Fred his money and made a mistake on Fitz. Jairus Byrd will most likely receive the next big contract.

 

For all Nix' faults, you can't say that he's been stingy in keeping the homegrown talent.

 

I hate to see Levitre walk, but if it means getting Byrd, Spiller and one more quality player on this team for years to come, then it was worth it.

No way Byrd Re-signs with the bills after this season. Dont you think hes tired of losing?

[ALF]

Sign Byrd to a long term contract now or trade him now.

[billsfan89]

Buddy has a good track record of signing interior linemen off the waiver wire. Urbik out starting RG and Reinhart a quality backup was also picked up off the waiver wire. Even Pears our RT was a low grade free agent and he was plugged in and very solid.

 

Buddy seems to be able to acquire quality guards on the cheap with regularity. Maybe paying nearly 8 million for a guard wasn't a prudent decision because they feel they can replace them with ease? Seems much more like a Nate Clements situation as opposed to a Pat Williams situation.

[DDD]

Buddy = Incompetent

[benderbender]

And yet another thread...

Oh no! Words!

[DrDawkinstein]

The year before a contract expires, negotiate a new one. If the player wants too much, trade him for a draft pick at least ,don't let him walk. If you don't want to resign a player, then let him play out his contract and walk.

 

GMing is really this simple.

[Never NEVER Give-up]

Levitre stated in a Santa Cruz newspaper report that negotiations with the Bills never took off because his agent had him slotted around one dollar amount and the Bills were at another. So it never got off the ground.

 

I have a hard time finding fault with Buddy here. Yes it creates another hole, exacrbated by Rinehart going to the Chargers for 1 year, but $7.8mm for a Guard? And the guy who played next to him at Center (who most think is better) is a FA after the 2013 season, will want even more than that, especially if Andy had been retained.

 

It is generally thought the cap will rise next year as well, further 'juicing' salary rates for the next FA period. I hope they extend Eric during 2013 to avoid the deadline angst.

[paupmvp1995]

Really dude exhibit A the Ravens. Give buddy a break

That is the dumbest thing I have ever read on this board-or at least close. Buddy gets no rope, no benefit of the doubt, no slack. The guy has been the captain of a ship that is sailing in circles in the harbor, and has no clue how to get out into the ocean. Comparing Buddy and the Bills to the Ravens is ridiculous. They just won the Super Bowl and are a top team every single year. Ozzie Newsome does get the benefit of the doubt because he ALWAYS finds talent for his team. Buddy has found some talent, but no chemistry. He overpaid for Mario Williams, who is a talented player, but is not a leader nor someone who plays with any type of inspiration. The Bills did not do their homework particularly well before signing him. And they completely misevaluated Fitzie's ability as well. But despite Buddy's inability to build a team, I believe that Marrone will take whatever dregs he is given and mold them into a reasonably inspiring group.

 

As for Levitre, I am not too concerned that we let him walk. He was a solid, but definitely not great player. The Titans will see that when he gets bulldozed back into Jake Locker at least 3-4 times per game. Watch film on Levitre. He very rarely dominates his man.

[djp14150]

If I recall correctly on numerous times Buddy has stated one of the problems with this organization in the past is that they would let talented players leave instead of resigning them. Yet he let's Levitre walk without a contract offer. The lack of an offer screams of a Jeffrey Littmann decision (a la not paying Will Wolford). The cycle of failure continues at One Bills Drive......

 

OT Will Willford was a totally different issue.....Willfords contract had escalater clauses in them that are illegal now. His clauses made him the highest paid offensive player on the team. Thus with a QB like Kelly he would get paid more than him so the cost to Buffalo with the contract was far higher than a rebuilding Colts team.

 

Levitre would have been nice to keep but for aGuard a team budgets $x/yr for and he was way beyond that.

 

Had they been proactive and signed him to an extension early on they could have paid him $4M per (which would have been around their price tag). Id pay him mor because he had versatility which is an asset in a pinch where a player goes down you could move him to cover.

 

Paying a guard $7M+ will cause the OTs and C to request much more. A team cant be paying $40+M on an OL and be able to compete.

Edited March 14, 2013 by djp14150

[Never NEVER Give-up]

Is that from ProFootballFocus? I'd like to know because they don't think very highly of Levitre as a run-blocking G. They also don't think he's worth what he got. They have him as the 9th rated G. Which is funny because they rate him as the best pass blocking G. That would seem to say he REALLY SUCKS as a run-blocking G. So, how much of that left side success was due to Wood and Glenn reaching the second level? I can think of a few long Spiller gains to the left side when Glenn was at the 2nd and 3rd levels for instance.

 

Levitre: a good tactician with good feet who regularly gets overpowered at the POA. Good but not great. And certainly NOT worth what he got to the Bills.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

I read on the espn site a day or two ago that Andy graded out at 15.7 for pass blocking and a -.07 in run blocking (yes a negative #). Because it was a few days ago, I have no link, nor do I know what the number scale is - sorry for that!

[MRW]

Had they been proactive and signed him to an extension early on they could have paid him $4M per (which would have been around their price tag)

I highly, highly doubt that.

[BringBackFergy]

That is the dumbest thing I have ever read on this board-or at least close. Buddy gets no rope, no benefit of the doubt, no slack. The guy has been the captain of a ship that is sailing in circles in the harbor, and has no clue how to get out into the ocean. Comparing Buddy and the Bills to the Ravens is ridiculous. They just won the Super Bowl and are a top team every single year. Ozzie Newsome does get the benefit of the doubt because he ALWAYS finds talent for his team. Buddy has found some talent, but no chemistry. He overpaid for Mario Williams, who is a talented player, but is not a leader nor someone who plays with any type of inspiration. The Bills did not do their homework particularly well before signing him. And they completely misevaluated Fitzie's ability as well. But despite Buddy's inability to build a team, I believe that Marrone will take whatever dregs he is given and mold them into a reasonably inspiring group.

 

As for Levitre, I am not too concerned that we let him walk. He was a solid, but definitely not great player. The Titans will see that when he gets bulldozed back into Jake Locker at least 3-4 times per game. Watch film on Levitre. He very rarely dominates his man.

 

Relax, breathe in, breathe out....

 

The comment was posed and comparison made to Ozzie because this thread is based on the false premise that Buddy is a hypocrite and doesn't believe in his own statement "keep the good players that you have"....if the Ravens are getting rid (or letting players walk) and the Bills are letting Levitre walk, it is a common problem in the NFL this day and age.

 

That is the only comparison between Nix and Newsome...as it relates to having to let some players walk away for bigger contracts.

 

You stated above that Ozzie knows how to spot talent and with the exception of Lee Evans, I think you're right. But no one is comparing the two GM's on talent awareness...just the idea that they need to cull the roster of higher paid players (they both have done it and Ozzie more so than Nix).

 

Go Bills.

[HeHateMe]

While Nix is a moron, you really can't blame him for Levitre moving on for the money he got. You simply cannot retain ALL of your players in today's NFL...

[Cson76]

My point is you don't let your talented players get to free agency because everyone is overpaid in free agency. You lock them up a year before they reach free agency.

 

there are two models to look at.

 

Philly, locks everyone up early to long term deals, to try to get the best they can

PIT-waits until the end and after they have proven themselves to get a contract.

 

With Whaley's PIT ties, I can see us using more the PIT model.

[eball]

Had they been proactive and signed him to an extension early on they could have paid him $4M per

 

Says who? The magical "would've, could've, should've" contract fairy? Levitre's agent knew what he would be worth on the open market, and anyone suggesting otherwise is incredibly naive.

 

Yes, players occasionally take a "hometown discount" but that is getting more and more rare -- particularly for guys going into their 2nd contract and finally having a chance to cash in.

 

Does anyone around here understand economics?

[DrDawkinstein]

Says who? The magical "would've, could've, should've" contract fairy? Levitre's agent knew what he would be worth on the open market, and anyone suggesting otherwise is incredibly naive.

 

Yes, players occasionally take a "hometown discount" but that is getting more and more rare -- particularly for guys going into their 2nd contract and finally having a chance to cash in.

 

Does anyone around here understand economics?

 

Its like everyday I think "Ok, now the board has hit rock bottom" and before I can even finish that thought, someone proves me wrong.

[FLFan]

Says who? The magical "would've, could've, should've" contract fairy? Levitre's agent knew what he would be worth on the open market, and anyone suggesting otherwise is incredibly naive.

 

Yes, players occasionally take a "hometown discount" but that is getting more and more rare -- particularly for guys going into their 2nd contract and finally having a chance to cash in.

 

Does anyone around here understand economics?

Excellent response. Unfortunately, you could post it a hundred times on different threads and not make a dent in the hysteria.

[swnybillsfan]

I just came in here to fart.

aw man, that was you?!?!

i think i can taste that, you had ketchup, right.

[ganesh]

If I recall correctly on numerous times Buddy has stated one of the problems with this organization in the past is that they would let talented players leave instead of resigning them. Yet he let's Levitre walk without a contract offer. The lack of an offer screams of a Jeffrey Littmann decision (a la not paying Will Wolford). The cycle of failure continues at One Bills Drive......

 

Or it could be that Marronne had a say on it and would prefer to use that money to shore up his LB corps rather than spend it on a guard. It is ok to have a plan to retain many of your best players, but don't have to do it on all. Levitre was a good player and sure would like to have him in Bills Red/Blue/White. But this is business.

 

Says who? The magical "would've, could've, should've" contract fairy? Levitre's agent knew what he would be worth on the open market, and anyone suggesting otherwise is incredibly naive.

 

Yes, players occasionally take a "hometown discount" but that is getting more and more rare -- particularly for guys going into their 2nd contract and finally having a chance to cash in.

 

Does anyone around here understand economics?

 

Also, Levitre might think that the Titans give him a better chance to make the playoffs than the Bills.

[NoSaint]

Sign Byrd to a long term contract now or trade him now.

 

Or let him play and tag and trade him next year?

[Hammered a Lot]

If I recall correctly on numerous times Buddy has stated one of the problems with this organization in the past is that they would let talented players leave instead of resigning them. Yet he let's Levitre walk without a contract offer. The lack of an offer screams of a Jeffrey Littmann decision (a la not paying Will Wolford). The cycle of failure continues at One Bills Drive......

What where the terms of Will Wolfords contract?

[ganesh]

there are two models to look at.

 

Philly, locks everyone up early to long term deals, to try to get the best they can

PIT-waits until the end and after they have proven themselves to get a contract.

 

With Whaley's PIT ties, I can see us using more the PIT model.

 

In Pittsburgh that works because the Backups are constantly pushing the starters and also have viable replacements if the starter departs. (This may not be how they are today, but in general they have operated that way the last decade). That allows them to delay paying the starters. I don't think the Bills have built sufficient depth for our backups to compete with our starters. Heck our former coach wouldn't even allow the backups to *COMPETE* with the starters. We never developed our depth players into starters.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

And after woods will be Glenn due. Likely in another two years with the going rate going up every year for everyone and him being a left tackle, likely to sign him would be over $10 mil., So take Probably 8 or 9 for wood plus 10 for Glenn, had they signed AL, you'd easily have $40 mil on your O-line. Everyone here keeps hoping to sign a franchise QB, if they ever get lucky and do find someone, that will likely cost another $20 mil by then. If they were one player away from goign to Super bowl can see over paying.

 

Levitre stated in a Santa Cruz newspaper report that negotiations with the Bills never took off because his agent had him slotted around one dollar amount and the Bills were at another. So it never got off the ground.

 

I have a hard time finding fault with Buddy here. Yes it creates another hole, exacrbated by Rinehart going to the Chargers for 1 year, but $7.8mm for a Guard? And the guy who played next to him at Center (who most think is better) is a FA after the 2013 season, will want even more than that, especially if Andy had been retained.

 

It is generally thought the cap will rise next year as well, further 'juicing' salary rates for the next FA period. I hope they extend Eric during 2013 to avoid the deadline angst.