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Divisional Playoffs - Chiefs at Bills - Post game thread


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6 hours ago, Sandhill Mike said:

 

It looks to me like the NFL told the refs to sit on the offensive holding penalties this postseason.  I've seen LOTS of holding in all games I've watched, hardly any flags to speak of.

Yeah, Allen wasn’t pressured much either. Not even close to being sacked, really. 

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8 hours ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

I had no idea till I saw this angle that the corner literally falls down behind him and if he simply catches the ball he could have moonwalked into the endzone my goodness 

 

 

ya i seen that.  heartbreaking

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30 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

ya i seen that.  heartbreaking

 

WRs that don’t catch that with their hands have lost confidence or something. As a WR Diggs should be putting his two hands up and snatching the ball out of the air, not waiting for it to come into his body.  But he shoulda caught it anyway. Just a terrible job there by Diggs all around.

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On 1/21/2024 at 8:02 PM, Chugga said:

There were a million reasons why we lost this game.  And Josh willed this team to get as close to victory as we did.  Diggs drop, Sherfield drop, bad 1st down playcalling, defensive struggles, missed kick, etc.

 

But nothing will sit with me more from this game than the throw to Shakir in the end zone with a wide open Diggs streaking underneath.  Even if we hit that pass and take the lead, you give the chiefs 1:40 and two TOs against a defense that hasn’t really stopped them.  The Diggs pass runs the clock, shortens the kick if needed, but most importantly moves the chains.

 

Totally heartbroken…

💯 

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14 hours ago, Scott7975 said:

Diggs getting a first down on that play wasn't even guaranteed.  Two guys could have easily collapsed on him and KC was doing a great job of tackling and not allowing extra yards in the pass game as they tightened up throughout the game.  The time for Allen to throw that pass if he were to would have been right over the middle, 2 yards past the LoS.  Diggs would have had 7 yards to go with 2 chiefs in his way to stop it.

 

The throw to Shakir was the right read.

 

 


I don’t hate the throw to Shakir, but that’s a first down all day.

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Now that a day or two has passed, can we talk about getting Jason Kelce his own permanent box going forward? (Assuming he retires)

 

Is there a more famous Buffalo guy than him. Crushing beers, bowling ball shots, shirtless, helping little kids meet their hero’s. 

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On 1/21/2024 at 10:02 PM, Chugga said:

There were a million reasons why we lost this game.  And Josh willed this team to get as close to victory as we did.  Diggs drop, Sherfield drop, bad 1st down playcalling, defensive struggles, missed kick, etc.

 

But nothing will sit with me more from this game than the throw to Shakir in the end zone with a wide open Diggs streaking underneath.  Even if we hit that pass and take the lead, you give the chiefs 1:40 and two TOs against a defense that hasn’t really stopped them.  The Diggs pass runs the clock, shortens the kick if needed, but most importantly moves the chains.

 

Totally heartbroken…

 

This.  And it really wasn't hard to break it down in the real time moment.  At 2nd and 9 from the KC 27 at the two minute warning, the first down was MORE important than the TD right there.  It's hard to say that, but it was.  The Chiefs were allowing the middle of the field to some extent.  Take it, you have two plays to get 9 yards and they weren't really stopping the Bills short stuff on that drive.  Get the 9 yards, make them take the timeouts or bleed the clock.  Make it so Buffalo is either going to get a lead TD with little time left or at worst, kick the FG from closer in for a nearly a guaranteed OT.   The time was the key thing...to leave KC with almost no clock left for a comeback TD or a GW FG.  Buffalo really blew that and McDermott/Brady must be sick about it.

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It's the Bills that are overrated.  Every team in the league has at least a couple great players other teams would covet. 
But the Bills are simply also-rans.  Get to the playoffs, win a wild card round game and then go home.  That's great if your this years Green Bay Packers or Houston Texans doing it.  But doing it 3 years in a row just shows what a fringe team the Bills are. Whenever this team improves in one area, such as the running game this year, they fall back in another, such as the receiving corps under-performing.

We've seen Kansas City rise, also seen Cincinnati rise and get to SB, and Baltimore rising this year.  The Bills are just stagnant. This team hasn't grown, they haven't really tapped into their playoff experience and they just don't seem to want it as much as other teams. 

Edited by dakrider
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2 minutes ago, dakrider said:

It's the Bills that are overrated.  Every team in the league has at least a couple great players other teams would covet. 
But the Bills are simply also-rans.  Get to the playoffs, win a wild card round game and then go home.  That's great if your this years Green Bay Packers or Houston Texans doing it.  But doing it 3 years in a row just shows what a fringe team the Bills are. Whenever this team improves in one area, such as the running game this year, they fall back in another, such as the receiving corps under-performing.

We've seen Kansas City rise, also seen Cincinnati rise and get to SB, and Baltimore rising this year.  The Bills are just stagnant. This team hasn't grown, they haven't really tapped into their playoff experience and they just don't seem to want it as much as other teams. 

Their success the last 3 seasons can be directly tied to the great play of Allen. But ultimately football is a team game and the rest of the roster and coaching matters.  A guy like Allen should be the icing on the cake that gets you over the hump.  It is football malpractice how Bean & McD are wasting Allen's skills. 

 

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1 minute ago, dakrider said:

It's the Bills that are overrated.  Every team in the league has at least a couple great players other teams would covet. 
But the Bills are simply also-rans.  Get to the playoffs, win a wild card round game and then go home.  That's great if your this years Green Bay Packers or Houston Texans doing it.  But doing it 3 years in a row just shows what a fringe team the Bills are. Whenever this team improves in one area, such as the running game this year, they fall back in another, such as the receiving corps under-performing.

We've seen Kansas City rise, also seen Cincinnati rise and get to SB, and Baltimore rising this year.  The Bills are just stagnant. This team hasn't grown, they haven't really tapped into their playoff experience and they just don't seem to want it as much as other teams. 

 

 

we have, more or less, one premier player who is clutch, and that is josh allen.

 

the numbers of us folding hard in the offseason due to defensive failings are true and obvious, but unless we add a player or two who are clutch monsters on d, and that seems unlikely, our best chance to win it all is to support josh allen who has come close to winning it vs kc himself twice now.

 

our d is gonna fall off some next year w guys leaving, and it really doesn't matter.  they blew plenty of games including this last one.  when it comes to the big time stuff, josh allen is like no other and we need to build on strength.  i think the way we get over this hump is make our O as deadly as it can be adding via draft, trade, free agency, kidnapping, human cloning, i don't care; weapons.  WRs who give us things we dont have.  speed, size, hands.  we need to add a top flight guy, and other guys too.  

 

in 2020 we had zilch production from RB and from TE, and our Oline was pretty weak (cody ford, that dude from the jets at RT, we had some real slugs out there) but our o was massive because diggs and aging brown and beez gave allen too much to work with.

 

now that we have rbs, blocking, and TE play, we gotta go over the top and just boat race teams.  i trust mc corch to turn a less talented d into an equally effective d to what we've seen the last 5 playoff exits, at least.

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27 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

No Skip, Allen is not overrated.  58 yards in the air and right on the hands.  A huge moment in the game.

 

421500222_411156137917146_6486831551973871849_n.thumb.jpg.2fde904a941e989951b841d6b48f7a5b.jpg

 

The Sherfield drop has also gotten kind of lost in everything that happened.  That pass was a ROCKET - a truly unbelievably elite throw few can make

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12 hours ago, Success said:

Hadn't really thought about this - but every time the Chiefs have beaten us in the playoffs, they lost the following week.

 

Don't remember this first one as well mostly because I've tried to erase that moment from my mind. Second one was in particularly hilarious fashion, they took a good lead in the first half proceeded to not score any points in the second I believe allowing the Bengals to tie and go into OT, oh the horror another coin flip game after the last is it another classic. Mahomes gets the ball again how can he keep getting away with all this luck, oh he threw a pick 13 seconds in. 😭

30 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

This, all offseason. Thanks McDermott.

 

 

Yeah I don't give a ***** what any of these people say anymore, the fact that they can spew ***** like this after that game makes their opinions completely meaningless. They just want to hate on him to farm our clicks and I have no interest in being their ***** pigeon.

4 minutes ago, Gregg said:

Michael McCarthy on X: "WHOAH: Chiefs vs. Bills thriller was most-watched NFL Divisional Playoff game EVER, generating over 50M viewers for CBS Sports. Viewership peaked at more than 56M viewers. https://t.co/52ZG3H0tkC" / X (twitter.com)

The two best players in football went at it again and the game didn't disappoint fans without an interest in the outcome. Only one of them had to play at his best but they still both played great football.

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6 minutes ago, cgg716 said:

People are assuming WAY too many things if they want the Diggs route to have been the throw 

People are desperate for a different outcome so they're attaching themselves to a different open WR when really no sane person would say Josh chose wrong. Really think about it, if he had chosen that even if we got the first maybe things play out no TD kick the FG, we miss it Josh is killed for not throwing that TD that was open, we make the FG closer but there's time and Mahomes gets in range and they take the lead with a FG and we lose Josh is killed for not throwing that TD, same thing with the FG but we go to OT things play out however they do and we don't win and Josh is killed for not throwing that TD.

 

There is no winning scenario there unless we win that's all this is.

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52 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

This, all offseason. Thanks McDermott.

 

 

 

I saw the segment, oddly enough, Skip was 100% pro-Allen.  Basically said that he played a perfect game and his team let him down.  The other two yahoos on the panel just ball-washed Mahomes.

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25 minutes ago, dakrider said:

It's the Bills that are overrated.  Every team in the league has at least a couple great players other teams would covet. 
But the Bills are simply also-rans.  Get to the playoffs, win a wild card round game and then go home.  That's great if your this years Green Bay Packers or Houston Texans doing it.  But doing it 3 years in a row just shows what a fringe team the Bills are. Whenever this team improves in one area, such as the running game this year, they fall back in another, such as the receiving corps under-performing.

We've seen Kansas City rise, also seen Cincinnati rise and get to SB, and Baltimore rising this year.  The Bills are just stagnant. This team hasn't grown, they haven't really tapped into their playoff experience and they just don't seem to want it as much as other teams. 

Home run here. That's exactly why I'm advocating for change. There has been no progression with the team for three years. In fact, it may have gotten worse. That's debatable but it clearly hasn't gotten better. 

 

Your analogy is spot on. I'm not thrilled with running it back with McD again. He's had ample opportunity to make advanced only to come up short time after time after time. Last Sunday was a great example of that. 

 

I get that the Bills defense was decimented. That was a factor in the game. No doubt there. However, the offense was very healthy and they had their chances. Frankly, they blew their chances. Sure the KC D is very good but championship teams score under those conditions; especially with an Allen and at home. 

 

To fall short again is pretty demoralizing and frustrating. I just don't see how McD leads this team to greener pastures. His message of complimentary football is getting very old. I just wonder what level of confidence players have in him? Of course, publicly they will say all the right things but privately is a whole nother issue. 

 

Run it back and see Bills Mafia. 

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22 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

People are desperate for a different outcome so they're attaching themselves to a different open WR when really no sane person would say Josh chose wrong. Really think about it, if he had chosen that even if we got the first maybe things play out no TD kick the FG, we miss it Josh is killed for not throwing that TD that was open, we make the FG closer but there's time and Mahomes gets in range and they take the lead with a FG and we lose Josh is killed for not throwing that TD, same thing with the FG but we go to OT things play out however they do and we don't win and Josh is killed for not throwing that TD.

 

There is no winning scenario there unless we win that's all this is.

Well said. 

 

Really like the last sentence here. Here's my thought process on it. The Bills are at home playing another huge playoff game. They have a elite QB with experienced playoff coaches and players. Minus Davis the offense is healthy as can be. Under these circumstances, this Bills offense has to get it done! Should have got it done! Winners and championship teams get it done!!! We've seen the Patriots get it done time after time. Add Mahomes to the list. 

 

We can analyze it til we are blue in the face. The opportunities were there. Players and coaches failed to execute. The defending champs know how to win. The Bills frankly don't. That in a nutshell speaks volumes about this team and coaches. Is there really a winning culture that McD has built? 

 

I suspect next year the Buffalos, Chiefs, Bengals , Ravens, etc will be there again. Nothing in my mind suggests the Bills with their vast playoff experience, elite QB, and coaching staff will get over the hump. They've proven they can't. Until they can the criticism is 100% warranted. 

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1 hour ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

This, all offseason. Thanks McDermott.

 

 

 

And here it is.  The reason I tuned out after Sunday, and will remain tuned out on football coverage until September.

 

The sports media is TERRIBLE.  I can't even ask "are they overrated," because everyone rates them as TERRIBLE.

 

Clowns, hacks & hot-take artists.  Fools, all.

 

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17 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Home run here. That's exactly why I'm advocating for change. There has been no progression with the team for three years. In fact, it may have gotten worse. That's debatable but it clearly hasn't gotten better. 

 


The "progression" of a football team is not always linear. It's often more like a roller coaster, with peaks and valleys.

Take the Ravens. They're this year's number one seed and may well make the Super Bowl. Lamar was drafted the same year as Josh Allen.

In 2019, they went 14-2 and lost in the Divisional round.
In 2020, they went 11-5 and lost in the Divisional round.
In 2021, they went 8-9 and missed the playoffs.
In 2022, they went 10-7 and lost in the Wild Card round.

This year, they went 13-4 and are in the AFC Championship Game.

How about Peyton Manning's Colts?

Once they started making the playoffs, they lost in the:

Divisional round
Wild Card
- missed playoffs - 
Wild Card
AFCCG
Divisional round
Divisional 

...before finally winning the Super Bowl.

The progression of a football team is not always linear. I would say that's the exception rather than the rule, actually. 

If your thesis is "The Bills should move on from McDermott", then fine. I espoused that very idea midseason. I can't blame you for feeling that way. But if the thesis is "there should be a linear progression to a team's ascent to a championship", I disagree entirely. That rarely happens.

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3 minutes ago, Low Positive said:

This board, since about 11:00 on Sunday night, has been one big example of confirmation bias and absolute dichotomous thinking.


It's not likely to be much fun around here until about the week before free agency.

Between now and then, though? 

Happy Joaquin Phoenix GIF

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1 hour ago, Success said:

 

And here it is.  The reason I tuned out after Sunday, and will remain tuned out on football coverage until September.

 

The sports media is TERRIBLE.  I can't even ask "are they overrated," because everyone rates them as TERRIBLE.

 

Clowns, hacks & hot-take artists.  Fools, all.

 

I've avoided all sports coverage since the game, and walked into a room this am that had a tv my wife had left on that had espn Get Up on The subject was - was the loss Josh Allens fault.  Out of morbid curiosity I watched for a couple minutes and the horrible takes were enough for me to turn it right off.  I won't be watching any sports coverage until hopefully Baltimore beats KC

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Most in the media thought Allen was a big-armed bust when he was drafted.

 

Everything since is their lame attempt to justify their original prediction.  Allen can play a game like Sunday, where he carried the team and should have left that field w/ even more points if Diggs makes a catch and Bass makes a FG - but the narrative since Sunday is almost exclusively, "But that throw!  That throw to the EZ when he had Diggs underneath!  Hero ball!"

 

Meanwhile, Mahomes misses 2 guys who were wide open in the endzone, and has a defense that actually made stops.  But it's all "Mahomes magic - again!" for him.

 

Complete double-standard.  Even when Allen wins it all, they'll probably just compare him to Flacco or Gannon....that one "lucky" run.

 

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1 hour ago, Logic said:


The "progression" of a football team is not always linear. It's often more like a roller coaster, with peaks and valleys.

Take the Ravens. They're this year's number one seed and may well make the Super Bowl. Lamar was drafted the same year as Josh Allen.

In 2019, they went 14-2 and lost in the Divisional round.
In 2020, they went 11-5 and lost in the Divisional round.
In 2021, they went 8-9 and missed the playoffs.
In 2022, they went 10-7 and lost in the Wild Card round.

This year, they went 13-4 and are in the AFC Championship Game.

How about Peyton Manning's Colts?

Once they started making the playoffs, they lost in the:

Divisional round
Wild Card
- missed playoffs - 
Wild Card
AFCCG
Divisional round
Divisional 

...before finally winning the Super Bowl.

The progression of a football team is not always linear. I would say that's the exception rather than the rule, actually. 

If your thesis is "The Bills should move on from McDermott", then fine. I espoused that very idea midseason. I can't blame you for feeling that way. But if the thesis is "there should be a linear progression to a team's ascent to a championship", I disagree entirely. That rarely happens.

I get that. Point taken. 

 

At the same time, players and fans shouldn't be satisfied with continued lack of progression. Especially, with an elite QB. This is exactly the situation the Bills have been in for years under McD. Similarly, the Cowboy and Steeler fan is upset over the same lack of progression in the playoffs. The exception there is neither has a QB of the caliber of Buffalo. 

 

In theory, you are correct with regards to linear progression. In practicality, I think it's fair for a fan base to think linearly. I mean it's human nature. How many were just happy with making the playoffs? Looking forward to Allen's progression ? The young Buffalo team getting better? So on and so forth...

 

Fast forward to today and ask yourself are you satisfied with three straight divisional playoff losses? Two of them were in their own building to add injury to insult. 

 

I'm not here arguing with you. In fact, it's quite the opposite. I likely think we are in agreement here. 

44 minutes ago, Low Positive said:

This board, since about 11:00 on Sunday night, has been one big example of confirmation bias and absolute dichotomous thinking.

Winning solves everything. 

40 minutes ago, Logic said:


It's not likely to be much fun around here until about the week before free agency.

Between now and then, though? 

Happy Joaquin Phoenix GIF

I think it's fair to say much of the fan base is frustrated. Many reasons for optimism and pessimism. After a huge playoff loss I think it's reasonable that negativity outshines positivity.

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1 hour ago, Logic said:


The "progression" of a football team is not always linear. It's often more like a roller coaster, with peaks and valleys.

Take the Ravens. They're this year's number one seed and may well make the Super Bowl. Lamar was drafted the same year as Josh Allen.

In 2019, they went 14-2 and lost in the Divisional round.
In 2020, they went 11-5 and lost in the Divisional round.
In 2021, they went 8-9 and missed the playoffs.
In 2022, they went 10-7 and lost in the Wild Card round.

This year, they went 13-4 and are in the AFC Championship Game.

How about Peyton Manning's Colts?

Once they started making the playoffs, they lost in the:

Divisional round
Wild Card
- missed playoffs - 
Wild Card
AFCCG
Divisional round
Divisional 

...before finally winning the Super Bowl.

The progression of a football team is not always linear. I would say that's the exception rather than the rule, actually. 

If your thesis is "The Bills should move on from McDermott", then fine. I espoused that very idea midseason. I can't blame you for feeling that way. But if the thesis is "there should be a linear progression to a team's ascent to a championship", I disagree entirely. That rarely happens.

Similar is the "blow it up crowd" after we came within a couple minutes of making the afccg with scrubs and wounded playing LB and in the secondary.

 

What you need first is to make the tournament.  Then have the pieces in place to compete, and usually have some luck as well.

 

The 'tear it down' crowd is insane to me.  We have the QB (the most important piece) and foundation across other positions.  Sure there are holes that will need to be filled, but that is true for every team - every year.

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4 minutes ago, stevewin said:

Similar is the "blow it up crowd" after we came within a couple minutes of making the afccg with scrubs and wounded playing LB and in the secondary.

 

What you need first is to make the tournament.  Then have the pieces in place to compete, and usually have some luck as well.

 

The 'tear it down' crowd is insane to me.  We have the QB (the most important piece) and foundation across other positions.  Sure there are holes that will need to be filled, but that is true for every team - every year.

Honestly yeah, as much as all this hurts, back against the wall at 6-6 McDermott, Allen, and Brady took the team on a hell of a run to make it to that point under 2 minutes with a shot to get into the AFC Championship game. I don't particularly want to throw away what they've got going for them in terms of leading the team and finding a way to win no matter which way it is.

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16 hours ago, Bills!Win! said:


how does one drive home after that? I was at the Cleveland Monday night game where Lindell missed wide right and it was humbling. I can’t imagine it being the last game of the season and just walking away from that. 

I’ll tell you what it was tough. Traffic was bad. I was at the Cinci game last year too. Both were punches in the guts on different levels. I still have to watch the game back but… Go Lions I guess. Hope Baltimore destroys them then Lions destroy Baltimore or whoever is in it from NFC.

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6 minutes ago, stevewin said:

What you need first is to make the tournament.  Then have the pieces in place to compete, and usually have some luck as well.


Well said. This sums up the way the Bills season ended in very simple terms.

This season, based on the defensive injuries sustained, the lack of WR depth, and the instability at offensive coordinator, the Bills had what it took to meet condition one (make the tournament). They did not have what it took to meet condition two (have the pieces in place to compete), and also did not particularly benefit from the final factor you mentioned: luck (see Diggs drop and Sherfield drops, which also play back into "not having the pieces in place to compete").

It's as simple as that.

Seeing as though the Bills seem to have coach and QB in place that will allow them to continue to make the tournament on a regular basis, what we need now is for the GM to give them the pieces to compete once there (additional offensive weaponry, better depth), and for some luck to break our way for once. One of those things is within the Bills' control, and that's what this offseason will be about.

 

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5 minutes ago, Logic said:


Well said. This sums up the way the Bills season ended in very simple terms.

This season, based on the defensive injuries sustained, the lack of WR depth, and the instability at offensive coordinator, the Bills had what it took to meet condition one (make the tournament). They did not have what it took to meet condition two (have the pieces in place to compete), and also did not particularly benefit from the final factor you mentioned: luck (see Diggs drop and Sherfield drops, which also play back into "not having the pieces in place to compete").

It's as simple as that.

Seeing as though the Bills seem to have coach and QB in place that will allow them to continue to make the tournament on a regular basis, what we need now is for the GM to give them the pieces to compete once there (additional offensive weaponry, better depth), and for some luck to break our way for once. One of those things is within the Bills' control, and that's what this offseason will be about.

 

And you could also consider "not having the pieces to compete" due to injury bad luck.  Notable because the roster at LB and secondary was sound before the injuries.   There is not a team in the league that would have had the depth to overcome them and not lose a step

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6 minutes ago, stevewin said:

And you could also consider "not having the pieces to compete" due to injury bad luck.  Notable because the roster at LB and secondary was sound before the injuries.   There is not a team in the league that would have had the depth to overcome them and not lose a step


Right.

And going into matchups against Patrick Mahomes and Lamar Jackson with either a Klein/Dodsen or Dodsen/one-legged Bernard duo at linebacker and expecting victory is just asking an awful lot.

For that matter, going into matchups against the numbers 2 and 1 scoring defenses in the league with Trent Sherfield at WR2 and expecting victory is asking for an awful lot, too.

As much as it hurt in the moment to lose that game on Sunday, if one stands aside and looks at the team and the season with a reasoned, unbiased eye, one sees a team that lacked the horses to compete in the "second season", and very nearly overcame those deficiencies to make the AFCCG anyway.

Time to get to work, Beane.

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