Greenberg - A Jets Fan - Pushing Back Against The Allen Hate

[C.Biscuit97]

2 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Unpopular alert: mahomes would have better stats with our weapons than he would in KC this year. Bottom 5 receiving core they doesn’t make you pay for doubling Kelce.

 

i know here (the only place) Mahomes isn’t better than Allen. They are both top 3 qbs and mahomes is having the worst season of his career. 

[Warcodered]

2 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Unpopular alert: mahomes would have better stats with our weapons than he would in KC this year. Bottom 5 receiving core they doesn’t make you pay for doubling Kelce.

 

i know here (the only place) Mahomes isn’t better than Allen. They are both top 3 qbs and mahomes is having the worst season of his career. 

Would that have come with Dorsey calling plays?

[C.Biscuit97]

2 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

But Allen doesn’t get credit cuz his team has failed him and not made a SB.  It’s crazy, never seen a player get so much hate for not having the same SB resume as the guy widely considered to be the best ever 

Can we define “hate.” He has consistently been talked about as MVP candidate.its weird how sensitive people are about Allen. He is routinely talked about as one of the best players in the nfl, has the most prime time games, and is in an insane amount of commercials. 
 

Hes not the inaccurate guy from Wyoming anymore. He is making $45 million for a team that had SB aspirations. His highs are as good as anyone in the nfl but to pretend like it hasn’t been inconsistent this year is not being truthful. Hopefully it was all Dorsey’s fault.

[Success]

4 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Unpopular alert: mahomes would have better stats with our weapons than he would in KC this year. Bottom 5 receiving core they doesn’t make you pay for doubling Kelce.

 

i know here (the only place) Mahomes isn’t better than Allen. They are both top 3 qbs and mahomes is having the worst season of his career. 

 

Yeah - you're right. That's unpopular.

 

[C.Biscuit97]

1 minute ago, Warcodered said:

Would that have come with Dorsey calling plays?

Does that come with Matt Nagy? Bieneny has mediocre sam Howell on pace for 5,000 yards. 

Just now, Success said:

 

Yeah - you're right. That's unpopular.

 

Haha, just imagine if Mahomes and Allen’s resumes were switched and we heard Chiefs fans argue that Mahomes was better. 

[Punching Bag]

1 hour ago, Punch said:

Agree and it can do brain damage as shown for those who voted Lamar as MVP.

[C.Biscuit97]

2 hours ago, Patrick Fitzryan said:

This has nothing to do with NYC producers disliking Allen because he plays in Buffalo.

 

Allen has always been treated poorly by the media because he had the audacity to be drafted ahead of Lamar Jackson, which idiots view as an act of overt racism. Kirk Cousins gets the same treatment because he unseated RG3. Let's be honest with what is happening here.

You’re the one who made it racist first in this thread. Great work!

 

always those guys who claim everyone is too sensitive to race who are the first to bring up race. 
 

Jackson won a Heisman and was talked about not being good enough to be a qb in the nfl. Allen had a far worse resume in college yet was an easy top 10 pick. Jackson has won 70% and a mVp. He proved those idiots who questioned him as a morons. Allen has also far surpassed his expectations and become a top 3 qb in the nfl. 
 

you made it about race, 

also imagine crying about Buffalo not getting respect when we play 15 prime time games and are maybe the most popular team in commercials. Dumb take. 

2 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

I dont think the point of that graphic is to say they are the best two QBS, as much as it shows Josh's numbers align very closely to (if not better than) Mahomes, yet Josh is constantly criticized and Mahomes is constantly worshipped.

You don’t understand why? And Allen gets criticized as a top 3 qb with crazy expectations. 
 

you really don’t think things would be the same for Mahomes if their careers were reversed?

6 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

Agree and it can do brain damage as shown for those who voted Lamar as MVP.

Haha, this Board crapping on Lamar as much as they claim others crap on Allen. 

[PatsFanNH]

3 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Ok, umm most are considering this a down year for Mahomes because of his WR issue. Also they have gone deep every year in the playoffs.. I wouldn’t be shocked if they were tired and or cruising till the playoff starts.

[Success]

3 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

Ok, umm most are considering this a down year for Mahomes because of his WR issue. Also they have gone deep every year in the playoffs.. I wouldn’t be shocked if they were tired and or cruising till the playoff starts.

 

Tired?

 

[FireChans]

3 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Hiding fumbles again.

[GoBills808]

3 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Hiding fumbles again.

4for Allen and 3 for mahomes right

[Success]

I try to be objective when it comes to Mahomes & Allen comparisons.  But since they both started, I think it's fairly obvious:  when Mahomes doesn't play well, it's excuse city. When Allen doesn't play well, it's, a ha!  We were right about him on draft day.

 

[Eastport bills]

3 hours ago, H2o said:

I found this interesting. And of course the rest of the ESPN 🤡's yuck it up a bit later in the segment, but this has been my stance on Josh for forever. All of the idiots with an ax to grind continually spew the same crap, on their same crap shows, pandering to their same crap audience. Josh is a top 2-5 QB in this league, 5 being the absolute basement. They constantly act like he is the one costing this team W's. They don't talk about the 3 games he's led his team to a lead in the final 2 minutes, only to have McDermott's defense piss it away. No, it's his 1 INT two quarters before that which caused them to lose. Idiots. This team would have, AT THE MOST, 3 wins this year without him. At the most. Allen is not blameless. He's not perfect. But let's not act like he's not out here setting records in history of the NFL for things like total TD's, completing 68% of his passes this year, and leading the league in total TD's. 

 

 

Don’t listen to these imbecilic empty suits. They’re are all just fans of other teams who would sell their kids to have Josh as their QB. The games that were stand alone Bills contests are all highly rated games because this guy is must see TV. He’s the most flamboyant swashbuckling athlete in professional sports. Our record should be better than 6 and 6. Sean’s defense has a lot to do with that. Any turnover by Josh he made up for by doing incredible things to get the lead again. Make a few stops on final possessions and Josh is a top 3 candidate for MVP.

[C.Biscuit97]

9 minutes ago, Success said:

I try to be objective when it comes to Mahomes & Allen comparisons.  But since they both started, I think it's fairly obvious:  when Mahomes doesn't play well, it's excuse city. When Allen doesn't play well, it's, a ha!  We were right about him on draft day.

 

Yeah no one makes for excuses for Allen here! 

[Success]

3 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Yeah no one makes for excuses for Allen here! 

 

I'm talking nationally.

 

[FireChans]

29 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

4for Allen and 3 for mahomes right

I’m not sure 

19 minutes ago, Success said:

I try to be objective when it comes to Mahomes & Allen comparisons.  But since they both started, I think it's fairly obvious:  when Mahomes doesn't play well, it's excuse city. When Allen doesn't play well, it's, a ha!  We were right about him on draft day.

 

If Allen had two SB’s and 2 MVPs, he’d get a media pass too. 
 

 

this is really, “why is Phillip Rivers criticized more that Tom Brady,” the post. 

[HOUSE]

I didn't watch or read any of this but sure sounds interesting 🤔 

[Drew21PA]

My mind set this season has fhsnged

 

im not even mad anymore it’s quite comical when McDermott blows the lead - Allen has been SPECIAL once again this season

 

im just in awe of the kid most games - glad he’s on my team I’m sure he is polarizing to competitors and other team fan bases 

[Success]

3 minutes ago, FireChans said:

I’m not sure 

If Allen had two SB’s and 2 MVPs, he’d get a media pass too. 
 

 

this is really, “why is Phillip Rivers criticized more that Tom Brady,” the post. 

 

Yes, yes. I forgot that we're talking about golf.

[Drew21PA]

Another note though

 

i think people are going to REALLY be mad when he doesn’t just finish his career in 7-8 years like everyone thinks and he plays longer than expected 

[FireChans]

1 minute ago, Success said:

 

Yes, yes. I forgot that we're talking about golf.

Riiiiiight, which is why your top 2 QB’s in NFL history are Kelly and Marino, not Brady and Montana.

[Success]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

Riiiiiight, which is why your top 2 QB’s in NFL history are Kelly and Marino, not Brady and Montana.

 

You can talk about perception. I'll talk about reality.

 

[FireChans]

6 minutes ago, Success said:

 

You can talk about perception. I'll talk about reality.

 

Okay. Here’s reality:

 

Winning matters in sports. Rightly or wrongly. It matters. 
 

Folks will never hold Marino, or Rivers, or Kelly in the same regard as Montana or Brady. I know it’s a team sport, but the ultimate goal is to win. maybe that’s unfair, but that’s reality.

 

Maybe once upon a time Chargers fans said, “hey, we think Rivers is at least as good or better than Brady, why is he criticized more!”

 

We all know why. It’s obvious. 
 

You think Brady and Montana are better than Kelly and Marino. I know you do. You know why, too.

Edited December 7, 2023 by FireChans

[TAinLack.]

4 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

I'm feel'n better about our game already!!!

[Success]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

Okay. Here’s reality:

 

Winning matters in sports. Rightly or wrongly. It matters. 
 

Folks will never hold Marino, or Rivers, or Kelly in the same regard as Montana or Brady. I know it’s a team sport, but the ultimate goal is to win. maybe that’s unfair, but that’s reality.

 

Maybe once upon a time Chargers fans said, “hey, we think Rivers is at least as good or better than Brady, why is he criticized more!”

 

We all know why. It’s obvious. 
 

You think Brady and Montana are better than Kelly and Marino. I know you do. You know why, too.

 

I think they are - for a LOT of reasons.  Kelly isn't really in the conversation, but I consider him top 10.  Marino has a real argument, for any fan of the game.

 

Clutch play is a big part of ranking - and both Brady and Montana won so much, because they were BOTH so clutch.  They made plays when it counted.

 

That, right now, is not a differentiator between Mahomes & Allen.  If anything, I think Allen was a bit more clutch in the 13 seconds game, though it's close.

 

Winning does matter - but not to the point where Dilfer is better than Marino, or Eli is better than Fouts.

 

We're still in the 1st third or so of both careers.  Mahomes has titles - but he has also had better coaching, more well-constructed teams, and more luck to this point.  Skill-wise, I'd still take Allen over Mahomes. And the time to really judge who is "better" is when they're both done.

 

[balln]

2 minutes ago, Success said:

 

I think they are - for a LOT of reasons.  Kelly isn't really in the conversation, but I consider him top 10.  Marino has a real argument, for any fan of the game.

 

Clutch play is a big part of ranking - and both Brady and Montana won so much, because they were BOTH so clutch.  They made plays when it counted.

 

That, right now, is not a differentiator between Mahomes & Allen.  If anything, I think Allen was a bit more clutch in the 13 seconds game, though it's close.

 

Winning does matter - but not to the point where Dilfer is better than Marino, or Eli is better than Fouts.

 

We're still in the 1st third or so of both careers.  Mahomes has titles - but he has also had better coaching, more well-constructed teams, and more luck to this point.  Skill-wise, I'd still take Allen over Mahomes. And the time to really judge who is "better" is when they're both done.

 

Kelly is probably on par w Donovan mcnabb . Which is really

weird to say.

 

jim Kelly was my hero as a kid and was the best qb in my mind. 
 

but now w time and stats. He really wasn’t that all Time great.

[FireChans]

16 minutes ago, Success said:

 

I think they are - for a LOT of reasons.  Kelly isn't really in the conversation, but I consider him top 10.  Marino has a real argument, for any fan of the game.

 

Clutch play is a big part of ranking - and both Brady and Montana won so much, because they were BOTH so clutch.  They made plays when it counted.

 

That, right now, is not a differentiator between Mahomes & Allen.  If anything, I think Allen was a bit more clutch in the 13 seconds game, though it's close.

 

Winning does matter - but not to the point where Dilfer is better than Marino, or Eli is better than Fouts.

 

We're still in the 1st third or so of both careers.  Mahomes has titles - but he has also had better coaching, more well-constructed teams, and more luck to this point.  Skill-wise, I'd still take Allen over Mahomes. And the time to really judge who is "better" is when they're both done.

 

To this point, who is higher in the QB pantheon of all active starting QB’s?

[Rew]

3 hours ago, Gregg said:

 

Then why haven't Mayfield and Darnold gotten this type of hate. Both were also drafted ahead of Jackson.

Not sure why the media is so hard on Josh, but neither of them need an excuse to be critical of them.

[Success]

8 minutes ago, FireChans said:

To this point, who is higher in the QB pantheon of all active starting QB’s?

 

I'd rank Mahomes higher right now.  But it's pretty close.

 

My original point was more that nationally, Mahomes gets much more leeway for bad play.

 

[Bills aPHILLYate]

He is the best qb this team has ever had imo and he is a historically elite talent in general.

I will defend him to the end of the earth with all he is asked to do. 

As a Philly native I personally look at what Hurts has at his disposal and say if Allen had that they would be unstoppable. 

I genuinely feel like he should have numerous SB rings on his resume when it's all said and done.

 

[Man with No Name]

4 hours ago, JohnNord said:

Shouldn’t this put on page 15934027 of the “talking head says something about Buffalo Bills” thread?   
 

This way a lot of people will be able to see it?

Trying to think of something witty to add to this. i guess i'll just say it's my favorite post in thread, outside of the OP. 

[finn]

49 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Okay. Here’s reality:

 

Winning matters in sports. Rightly or wrongly. It matters. 
 

Folks will never hold Marino, or Rivers, or Kelly in the same regard as Montana or Brady. I know it’s a team sport, but the ultimate goal is to win. maybe that’s unfair, but that’s reality.

 

Maybe once upon a time Chargers fans said, “hey, we think Rivers is at least as good or better than Brady, why is he criticized more!”

 

We all know why. It’s obvious. 
 

You think Brady and Montana are better than Kelly and Marino. I know you do. You know why, too.

You're making the case against your own position here. You admit that you might be wrong ("rightly or wrongly") and that Kelly and Marino might be better, but that winning "matters" somehow. Why? If I flip a coin and win, am I better than you because winning matters and you're a loser? Marino ends up on a team that sucks except for him, so he's not as good as Montana? Brady goes to the Bills under Dick Jauron and so he'll never be GOAT?

 

You can't separate the QB from their team and coaches, even if "folks" believe otherwise. "Folks" are also sexist, racist, and deeply ignorant. That doesn't mean they're right. 

 

 

[NoHuddleKelly12]

4 hours ago, NewEra said:

@Airseven what’s your take on this subject. 🙄, but no comment.  

[CincyBillsFan]

1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Yeah no one makes for excuses for Allen here! 

The horror that Bills fans on TWO BILLS DRIVE might defend Allen from unfair and unhinged attacks by a minority of Bills "fans".  The horror!

 

 

[buffblue]

1 hour ago, Success said:

 

I think they are - for a LOT of reasons.  Kelly isn't really in the conversation, but I consider him top 10.  Marino has a real argument, for any fan of the game.

 

Clutch play is a big part of ranking - and both Brady and Montana won so much, because they were BOTH so clutch.  They made plays when it counted.

 

That, right now, is not a differentiator between Mahomes & Allen.  If anything, I think Allen was a bit more clutch in the 13 seconds game, though it's close.

 

Winning does matter - but not to the point where Dilfer is better than Marino, or Eli is better than Fouts.

 

We're still in the 1st third or so of both careers.  Mahomes has titles - but he has also had better coaching, more well-constructed teams, and more luck to this point.  Skill-wise, I'd still take Allen over Mahomes. And the time to really judge who is "better" is when they're both done.

 

You really think Kelly is a top 10 all time qb? Love the guy, but that is just laughable

[Not Applicable]

5 hours ago, EasternOHBillsFan said:

 

That's ridiculous... got a legitimate source for that one?

The fact that is is clearly disliked for no real reason by, I don't know, 90% of black media members, maybe?

 

Christ, Dominique Foxworth said on an ESPN show that he didn't like Allen because the type of people who do "have American flags and pictures of their dogs in their Facebook profiles."

 

Pull your head out of the sand and read between the lines.

[Success]

13 minutes ago, buffblue said:

You really think Kelly is a top 10 all time qb? Love the guy, but that is just laughable

 

Should have said top 15. I used to think top 10, but that's changed w/ some of the great QB's over the past 15+ years.

 

But I think he's top 15.

 

[Solomon Grundy]

6 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Send this to Greeny!! 

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

3 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

its weird how sensitive people are about Allen.

 

What's up nerd. 

 

It's weird how sensitive people are about Lamar Jackson and Cam Newton - yet you're the most sensitive when people bring them up in their discussions.  You're no different than the posters you complain about.   There's three things guaranteed in life - Death, Taxes, and @C.Biscuit97 never missing an opportunity to criticize Allen.  It's no secret you're not a fan.  

Edited December 7, 2023 by Lieutenant Aldo Raine

[Not Applicable]

5 hours ago, Albany,n.y. said:

Go back & read the draft analysis by the Rosen supporters the day after the 1st round of the 2018 draft.  It started with the media members who were astonished that the Bills had the audacity to draft Allen over Rosen.  It was as if Beane questioned their manhood by choosing Allen over their boy, Rosen.  It had nothing to do with Lamar Jackson or your ridiculous assumption that Kirk Cousins gets treated badly because he beat out RGIII in Washington.  

There's nothing ridiculous about it. Compare how objectively good QBs with great stats like Allen and Cousins are criticized endlessly while a below-average one like Justin Fields is never held to the fire for poor performances and even gushed over.

 

The bias is real, despite it being a truth you find inconvenient.