SNF Chiefs at Packers Game Thread

[Bob Jones]

Just read the box score….Lambeau Field holds over 78,000 people!? When/How did that happen? In the era of teams shrinking their stadium size to in the 60s, that is surprising.

[BeavercreekBillsFan]

3 hours ago, Jeffbigalls said:

Not beating SF, would get smoked by SF

They would be at least 6.5 to 7 point favorites and I would put a significant amount of money on them to cover that. No one is in their league. 

[eball]

3 hours ago, Jeffbigalls said:

Not beating SF, would get smoked by SF

 

SF would be dangerous if they had a real QB.

 

[Gregg]

17 minutes ago, eball said:

 

SF would be dangerous if they had a real QB.

 

 

Purdy is a real QB. When healthy they are the most complete team in football. They destroyed the Cowboys earlier this year and have now destroyed Philly on the road. The #1 seed in the NFC is officially up for grabs. Next Sunday Eagles at Cowboys should be one hell of a game.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

4 minutes ago, Gregg said:

 

Purdy is a real QB. When healthy they are the most complete team in football. They destroyed the Cowboys earlier this year and have now destroyed Philly on the road. The #1 seed in the NFC is officially up for grabs. Next Sunday Eagles at Cowboys should be one hell of a game.

Captain mediocre is the ultimate system QB

[Gregg]

Just now, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Captain mediocre is the ultimate system QB

 

He doesn't the talent of a Mahomes, Allen, Burrow, etc etc. But give him credit he is better than mediocre. So, what if he is a system QB. He does it very well and wins most of his games.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, Gregg said:

 

He doesn't the talent of a Mahomes, Allen, Burrow, etc etc. But give him credit he is better than mediocre. So, what if he is a system QB. He does it very well and wins most of his games.

Wins are not a QB stat 

[Gregg]

Just now, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Wins are not a QB stat 

 

He puts up impressive numbers as well. Granted he is surrounded with a lot of elite level weapons, but he takes advantage of it. 

[Livinginthepast]

8 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

We're going to steamroll them.

 

A lot of unlikely and weird things have happened to us this season to cost us wins.

 

That stuff eventually evens out or stops happening 

Yes that's true of every other team in every other sport but not the Bills but if the law of averages or karma does come around for us, we should expect an AVALANCHE of freakish good luck, great officiating and acts of God to help us!

[Sherlock Holmes]

4 hours ago, Jeffbigalls said:

Not beating SF, would get smoked by SF

 

1 hour ago, BeavercreekBillsFan said:

They would be at least 6.5 to 7 point favorites and I would put a significant amount of money on them to cover that. No one is in their league. 

 

1 hour ago, eball said:

 

SF would be dangerous if they had a real QB.

 

 

53 minutes ago, Gregg said:

 

Purdy is a real QB. When healthy they are the most complete team in football. They destroyed the Cowboys earlier this year and have now destroyed Philly on the road. The #1 seed in the NFC is officially up for grabs. Next Sunday Eagles at Cowboys should be one hell of a game.

 

49 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Captain mediocre is the ultimate system QB

Purdy is the 2nd best QB in the league behind Josh, we are lucky Josh has the ultimate cannon and athleticism to run the way he does and that Purdy wasn't blessed with the same set of wheels and guns or Josh would be sitting at #2. 

 

Having said the truth, Josh would put Purdy in his rightful place at #2 in the SB if they outduel the Lions by a point or two in NFCC game which they should. McCaffrey seeing this will request to come to our team finally and fix the muck up with the not drafting or trading for him. Purdy will also request to become Josh's proper #2 instead of his B word #2 and Kittle and Bits will follow to finally get his rings.

Edited December 4, 2023 by Sherlock Holmes

[Beck Water]

9 hours ago, Warcodered said:

If they're bemoaning a missed call anyway doesn't seem like that'd be the issue. It seems it's more like the whole framing the whole situation like this one bad call that went against Mahomes and the Chiefs is why it didn't go their way, when obviously a bunch of other calls were seriously in their favor on that drive. It's misleading and biased.

 

I understand the point you're making, but the counterpoint is, they're discussing the calls or no-calls as soon as feasible after they happen, then moving on.

The "unnecessary roughness" on Jonathan Owens was called and discussed earlier in the drive, so re-hashing it would look like debating the officiating game-long.

Meanwhile, they didn't have a pause to really discuss and replay the no-call DPI with their "officiating expert" before the game ended.

 

If you want agreement that Collinsworth and Co have a narrative and are biased, I absolutely can agree with that - all game long.

[Beck Water]

2 hours ago, eball said:

 

SF would be dangerous if they had a real QB.

 

 

Purdy is a real QB.  He is leading the league in completion % and Y/A, #4 in passing TD, and top 10 in total passing yards and YPG.  His TD/INT is >2.  He is executing the SF offense as it's designed to be executed and can make enough deep and sideline throws to take advantage of what he's given. 
 

Purdy is a real QB, just  more in the mold of Brady or Montana than Favre or Rodgers.

 

5 hours ago, Jeffbigalls said:

Not beating SF, would get smoked by SF

 

I remember you.  🧌

Edited December 4, 2023 by Beck Water

[BeavercreekBillsFan]

2 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Purdy is a real QB.  He is leading the league in completion % and Y/A, #4 in passing TD, and top 10 in total passing yards and YPG.  His TD/INT is >2.  He is executing the SF offense as it's designed to be executed and can make enough deep and sideline throws to take advantage of what he's given. 
 

Purdy is a real QB, just  more in the mold of Brady or Montana than Favre or Rodgers.

 

 

I remember you.  🧌

It’s no joke IMPOSSIBLE to evaluate Purdy with the weapons he has and the easy job he has. Compared to the rest of the league, he’s not even playing the same sport. Drop back and pick which wide open elite weapon to throw it to. He MAYBE has 1 to 2 tight window throws to make but everything else is so wide open that as long as he gets it relatively close to the WR, it’s got a chance to go to the house. It pisses me off to no end when you see the throws Josh has to make vs what Purdy is doing. At times it’s like he’s throwing against air while josh is trying to fit a football through the head of a needle. Purdy is doing what he’s asked to do but damn it’s as easy as it gets. This is all Kyle Shanahan. Best coach in the league by a pretty big margin. He’s the real MVP. CMC as well. 

[Beck Water]

4 minutes ago, BeavercreekBillsFan said:

It’s no joke IMPOSSIBLE to evaluate Purdy with the weapons he has and the easy job he has. Compared to the rest of the league, he’s not even playing the same sport. Drop back and pick which wide open elite weapon to throw it to. He MAYBE has 1 to 2 tight window throws to make but everything else is so wide open that as long as he gets it relatively close to the WR, it’s got a chance to go to the house. It pisses me off to no end when you see the throws Josh has to make vs what Purdy is doing. At times it’s like he’s throwing against air while josh is trying to fit a football through the head of a needle. Purdy is doing what he’s asked to do but damn it’s as easy as it gets. This is all Kyle Shanahan. Best coach in the league by a pretty big margin. He’s the real MVP. CMC as well. 

 

But by that same logic, it's impossible to evaluate Burrows with Chase, Higgins, and Boyd not to mention Mixon.  Maybe it's impossible to evaluate Tua with Hill, Waddle, Achane, and Mostert.  etc etc. 

 

These are all QB playing within a system that tries to make their job easier, and with top notch skill players.  They still have to make the right reads, choose the correct receiver, and put the ball in the right place while avoiding 'interceptable balls' and mistakes and anyone who thinks that's simple while 3-6 behemoths are chasing you full speed ought to strap one on.

It seems to me that you want to re-define "NFL QB" in a way that rules out some very competent, good players.

 

You know, Josh Allen has wide open players at times he doesn't choose to throw to, in favor of a higher degree of difficulty deeper throw.

[CincyBillsFan]

Purdy is a very good QB.  He reminds me of Ken Anderson with the Bengal's.  I would rate Purdy behind only Mahomes, Allen & Burrow.

 

 

[Process]

3 hours ago, eball said:

 

SF would be dangerous if they had a real QB.

 

Yea, with Purdy they are just an average football team.

 

Clown take. 

[Warcodered]

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

 

I understand the point you're making, but the counterpoint is, they're discussing the calls or no-calls as soon as feasible after they happen, then moving on.

The "unnecessary roughness" on Jonathan Owens was called and discussed earlier in the drive, so re-hashing it would look like debating the officiating game-long.

Meanwhile, they didn't have a pause to really discuss and replay the no-call DPI with their "officiating expert" before the game ended.

 

If you want agreement that Collinsworth and Co have a narrative and are biased, I absolutely can agree with that - all game long.

If they just went over it a bit sure, though as has been pointed out hailmary plays almost never draw PI penalties in either direction and they should note that, by the sounds of it though they above and beyond that which is where the issue would be.

[Yobogoya!]

30 minutes ago, BeavercreekBillsFan said:

It’s no joke IMPOSSIBLE to evaluate Purdy with the weapons he has and the easy job he has. Compared to the rest of the league, he’s not even playing the same sport. Drop back and pick which wide open elite weapon to throw it to. He MAYBE has 1 to 2 tight window throws to make but everything else is so wide open that as long as he gets it relatively close to the WR, it’s got a chance to go to the house. It pisses me off to no end when you see the throws Josh has to make vs what Purdy is doing. At times it’s like he’s throwing against air while josh is trying to fit a football through the head of a needle. Purdy is doing what he’s asked to do but damn it’s as easy as it gets. This is all Kyle Shanahan. Best coach in the league by a pretty big margin. He’s the real MVP. CMC as well. 

 

Put Josh Allen in that offense with those weapons and Shanahan as play-caller. 

 

Other teams may as well just forfeit. 

[eball]

11 minutes ago, Process said:

Yea, with Purdy they are just an average football team.

 

Clown take. 

 

Whatever.  It was mostly a joke, just like this board has become.

 

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

 

Purdy is a real QB.  He is leading the league in completion % and Y/A, #4 in passing TD, and top 10 in total passing yards and YPG.  His TD/INT is >2.  He is executing the SF offense as it's designed to be executed and can make enough deep and sideline throws to take advantage of what he's given. 
 

Purdy is a real QB, just  more in the mold of Brady or Montana than Favre or Rodgers.

 

 

I remember you.  🧌

 

Purdy is an outstanding QB until Deebo Samuel goes down.

 

Then he loses 3 straight and looks like JAG.

 

And yes,  all QB's need weapons around them but he also has a WR1 in Aiyuk,  the most dynamic RB in the league in McCaffrey and a stud TE in Kittle.........with Deebo its the most dynamic group of playmakers around any QB in the league.

 

When he starts winning with a cast like Brady so often did then we can start making comparisons like that.

 

[SWATeam]

34 minutes ago, Yobogoya! said:

 

Put Josh Allen in that offense with those weapons and Shanahan as play-caller. 

 

Other teams may as well just forfeit. 

I've thought about that.  Honestly I don't think Josh is a great fit for Shanahan's system.  He's not exactly a "point guard" making quick decisions and distributing the ball.

[BillsShredder83]

2 minutes ago, SWATeam said:

I've thought about that.  Honestly I don't think Josh is a great fit for Shanahan's system.  He's not exactly a "point guard" making quick decisions and distributing the ball.

shanny is smart. he would create a square hole to put his square peg... how many "good coaches" would either avoid a superior square peg, or just spit on the hole and hope square magically goes in lol exactly why id never want an aging coach ever again. that dinosaur mentality is finally dying from the sport

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

 

Purdy is a real QB.  He is leading the league in completion % and Y/A, #4 in passing TD, and top 10 in total passing yards and YPG.  His TD/INT is >2.  He is executing the SF offense as it's designed to be executed and can make enough deep and sideline throws to take advantage of what he's given. 
 

Purdy is a real QB, just  more in the mold of Brady or Montana than Favre or Rodgers.

 

 

I remember you.  🧌

He is.  He's a very cerebral QB who knows the Shanny system inside and out.

 

He's a touch/timing passer who throws the ball to a spot BEFORE the receiver makes their break.  That catches the defense completely off guard as they have no idea where the pass is going.  Thats why the passes he throws are wide open.  The defense can't predict where the pass is going.

Brady, Montana, Peyton were passers like that although it may be a little premature to compare Purdy to those greats.

 

Josh throws the ball AFTER the receiver makes the break which allows the defense to converge on the ball.  The defense knows where the ball is going.  This forces Josh to throw the ball in tight windows with the defense on top of the receiver.  This also forces Josh to throw the ball a 100mph to fit it into a very tight window.

 

The weapons argument is a bit silly as all QB's need great weapons.

 

What would Josh be without Diggs, or Mahomes without Kelsey or Burrow without Chase/Higgins ?

[SWATeam]

1 minute ago, BillsShredder83 said:

shanny is smart. he would create a square hole to put his square peg... how many "good coaches" would either avoid a superior square peg, or just spit on the hole and hope square magically goes in lol exactly why id never want an aging coach ever again. that dinosaur mentality is finally dying from the sport

He was also rolling Lance out there until he got injured.

[BillsShredder83]

1 minute ago, SWATeam said:

He was also rolling Lance out there until he got injured.

weird situation agreed. they took a big swing and missed, crazy that lance only had like  qb snaps IN HIS LIFE. a chance i wouldnt have took, not for that compensation... and im certain he was a big part of that. they got lucky with a Elam/Benford type scenario landing Purdy..... but hes still an elite playcaller/designer

[FilthyBeast]

Packers all of a sudden looking like the proverbial 'team nobody wants to face in the playoffs', and if Love is truly a superstar in the making the Packers model for QB development is an interesting study going back to when Aaron Rogers was drafted during Favre's peak and sat multiple years before playing eerily similar to current situation with Love/Rogers.

 

As for the Chiefs, they finally took a hard hit on the injury front last night especially on the defensive side which has carried that team this year. They still have probably the easiest schedule left of all AFC contenders but not sure they are going to cruise to the #1 seed and another SB win anymore.

[Yobogoya!]

30 minutes ago, SWATeam said:

I've thought about that.  Honestly I don't think Josh is a great fit for Shanahan's system.  He's not exactly a "point guard" making quick decisions and distributing the ball.

 

Josh can execute quick throws, but I do agree he's not perfect for that offense as it's executed right now. 

 

I think Shanahan would have to retool things to maximize Josh's strengths, and I think he would excel at that. Just my opinion, obviously. But if you let Shanahan have JA17 and pair him with weapons like Deebo and CMC, I mean... if Shanny can scheme his guys wide open with space in front of them with the threat of Brock Purdy at QB, I can only imagine what the threat of Josh would do. 

[Warcodered]

19 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

Packers all of a sudden looking like the proverbial 'team nobody wants to face in the playoffs', and if Love is truly a superstar in the making the Packers model for QB development is an interesting study going back to when Aaron Rogers was drafted during Favre's peak and sat multiple years before playing eerily similar to current situation with Love/Rogers.

 

As for the Chiefs, they finally took a hard hit on the injury front last night especially on the defensive side which has carried that team this year. They still have probably the easiest schedule left of all AFC contenders but not sure they are going to cruise to the #1 seed and another SB win anymore.

It's weird they traded their team captain who played his ass off for them and well and that everyone on the team loved, and somehow that pissed the locker-room off into playing well.

[zow2]

1 hour ago, Warcodered said:

It's weird they traded their team captain who played his ass off for them and well and that everyone on the team loved, and somehow that pissed the locker-room off into playing well.

 

I was thinking last night,  why did the Packers suddenly get better since they traded Rasul Douglas?  I bet he will be disillusioned if the Packers make the playoffs and the Bills don't.

[Beck Water]

2 hours ago, Warcodered said:

If they just went over it a bit sure, though as has been pointed out hailmary plays almost never draw PI penalties in either direction and they should note that, by the sounds of it though they above and beyond that which is where the issue would be.

 

They went over the uncalled DPI and the Hail Mary at the end of the game, I could be wrong but I think it was the first time they brought in their 'officiating expert'.

 

You're probably correct that Collinsworth went on a bit about it affecting the outcome of the game, he has that tendency where Paddy Mahomes is concerned.  IIRC during a SNF game in ?2020?, he went on and on about a final drive 'roughing' call on Josh Allen that was legit by rule, but sometimes uncalled, and allowed the Bills to keep their drive alive and choke out any chance of the Pats coming back to score - I'd have to look up which game that actually was

[RoyBatty is alive]

16 hours ago, zow2 said:

Taylor Swift looks like she is starting to get bored w football.  

Thinks about what your wrote.

 

In a million years, would you have ever thought you would make such a post of the Bills message board?

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, Warcodered said:

It's weird they traded their team captain who played his ass off for them and well and that everyone on the team loved, and somehow that pissed the locker-room off into playing well.

 

I thought GB's LB and secondary were practically sieve-like last night.  Paddy routinely manipulated them to leave huge holes for Kelce in zone.  The difference is GB was able to 'get to' Mahomes for 3 sacks and a number of pressures, and he's lucky he was only picked once and not 2-3x.  GB DL was 🔥

 

The big improvement for GB has been offense.  They averaged 282 yds their 1st 5 games, and 389 the most recent 5 games.  Their points scored didn't go up so much, but sustaining drives and keeping the ball away from the opponent has been huge.

 

15 minutes ago, zow2 said:

 

I was thinking last night,  why did the Packers suddenly get better since they traded Rasul Douglas?  I bet he will be disillusioned if the Packers make the playoffs and the Bills don't.

 

It's not like he left in FA or asked to be traded.  Beane made GB an offer, and they thought they had good depth behind him to take the draft picks.

 

I don't think the Packers got better on defense since trading Douglas.  They're giving up scary yards rushing and the Lions had a >300 yd game.  But their offense has gotten its proverbial act together.

 

 

Edited December 4, 2023 by Beck Water

[GoBills808]

3 hours ago, SWATeam said:

I've thought about that.  Honestly I don't think Josh is a great fit for Shanahan's system.  He's not exactly a "point guard" making quick decisions and distributing the ball.

Time from snap to throw

 

Brock Purdy: 2.81 seconds

Josh Allen: 2.85 seconds

[Beck Water]

 

4 hours ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

He is.  He's a very cerebral QB who knows the Shanny system inside and out.

 

He's a touch/timing passer who throws the ball to a spot BEFORE the receiver makes their break.  That catches the defense completely off guard as they have no idea where the pass is going.  Thats why the passes he throws are wide open.  The defense can't predict where the pass is going.

Brady, Montana, Peyton were passers like that although it may be a little premature to compare Purdy to those greats.

 

Josh throws the ball AFTER the receiver makes the break which allows the defense to converge on the ball.  The defense knows where the ball is going.  This forces Josh to throw the ball in tight windows with the defense on top of the receiver.  This also forces Josh to throw the ball a 100mph to fit it into a very tight window.

 

The weapons argument is a bit silly as all QB's need great weapons.

 

What would Josh be without Diggs, or Mahomes without Kelsey or Burrow without Chase/Higgins ?

 

I agree with most of this - but, Josh absolutely throws with anticipation at times.  He did this regularly with Beasley.  If you watch some of the Youtube videos with guys who break down film, they absolutely point this out.

 

What Josh doesn't do as much, that I witnessed Purdy doing last night, was take the quick throws to the open receiver/RB.  Part of this dynamic with Purdy may be he's got an all-world player at RB in McCaffrey, so why wouldn't you get the ball into his hands quickly?

Frankly, I think part of Josh's issue last season and this is a weapons question.  Kincaid seems to be coming on, but I think losing Beasley and believing that Davis could step into Sanders/Browns shoes and McKenzie then some combo of Shakir/Harty/Sherfield could step into Beasley's shoes was a big Fail by Beane.

But the point is, you can have a QB who has elite weapons and if he's not a "real" QB he can fail to take advantage of them appropriately.

 

[Simon]

6 hours ago, eball said:

 

Whatever.  It was mostly a joke, just like this board has become.

 

 

Any suggestions for what I can do on this end to help with that or are we just stuck in a Billsy moment that can't really be helped?

[FilthyBeast]

5 hours ago, Warcodered said:

It's weird they traded their team captain who played his ass off for them and well and that everyone on the team loved, and somehow that pissed the locker-room off into playing well.

 

I believe at the time the Packers traded Douglas to the Bills they were sitting at 2 or 3 wins and probably thought they were toast. But funny things have changed and too bad the Bills aren't in the NFC or they'd have a very real shot a that the playoffs this year even with 7 or 8 losses.

[eball]

1 hour ago, Simon said:

 

Any suggestions for what I can do on this end to help with that or are we just stuck in a Billsy moment that can't really be helped?

Probably can’t be helped. Just means I’m taking a step back because I come here for enjoyment and a distraction, not to sift through a load of bs. 
 

My problem, not yours. 
 

Go Bills

[Jon in Pasadena]

6 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Time from snap to throw

 

Brock Purdy: 2.81 seconds

Josh Allen: 2.85 seconds

Time from throw to catch

 

Josh Allen:  0.5 seconds

Brock Purdy:  *cough* a bit longer than that

Tua Tagovailoa:  one sidereal week

[Scott7975]

9 hours ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

Josh throws the ball AFTER the receiver makes the break which allows the defense to converge on the ball.  The defense knows where the ball is going.  This forces Josh to throw the ball in tight windows with the defense on top of the receiver.  This also forces Josh to throw the ball a 100mph to fit it into a very tight window.

 

Thats because the receiver can break like 5 different ways after deciding which route they are going to run, which can change during the route as well.  This is not a timing based offense.