Is this finally the year we make a big push for offense?

[Rigotz]

4 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

If you dont then what is the point?  Also Cool.  So we are the Marvin Lewis led Bengals

 

The Marvin Lewis led Bengals never did what we did LAST YEAR.

Josh Allen has been a great QB for 1.5 seasons. Last year was AFC Championship. This year isn't over yet.

 

Go to time out for a few weeks and sit on your hands with these other fans who can't handle a little adversity.

[dave mcbride]

22 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Exactly. For one whole year Daryl Williams looked amazing. He got paid and fell off the map. We're forced to hide him at RG and he still sucks. Boettger just doesn't have talent and that would've been Tellers spot. Morse's days are probably numbered and Brown/ Dawkins have been inconsistent. 

We also drafted Ford as an OT and moved him inside too. 

[Alphadawg7]

5 hours ago, whorlnut said:

Let’s face it…McDs love affair with using high picks on defense has finally caught up with this offense. Here is what I wanna see:

1.  Sign a nasty vet guard in FA

2.  Use first round pick on a WR

3.  Use second rounder on a speedy RB

4.  Use a third rounder on another nasty guard

Is this finally the year McD sees the light and understands we have a dawg at qb and we need to give him the weapons to get the most out of his abilities?

What?  We traded first rounder for WR, drafted multiple RBs, TE’s, signed OL and other WRs, drafted Allen, drafted more OL…

 

We have one of the most potent offenses in the NFL 2 years in a row with an MVP runner up at QB whose again in contention for MVP this year.

 

But you’re suggesting we haven’t made a push previously to build the offense?

 

This makes no sense on any level.  
 

OL will be a point of focus for sure this off-season, but to suggest we “finally make a push” to address the offense is just way over the top.  
 

And mind you, we did all that while also having to build up the defense as well.  

[FilthyBeast]

One thing that a lot of fans don't seem to be considering is cap space.

 

Beane has essentially created his own cap jail mess that he blamed the previous regime for and while some deals he can get out off and create space quickly (Feliano, Williams, etc) it's not like we are going to have tons of money to throw around in the spring to address all the gaping holes on the roster, specifically remaking the entire defensive/offensive lines.

[MAJBobby]

1 hour ago, Rigotz said:

 

The Marvin Lewis led Bengals never did what we did LAST YEAR.

Josh Allen has been a great QB for 1.5 seasons. Last year was AFC Championship. This year isn't over yet.

 

Go to time out for a few weeks and sit on your hands with these other fans who can't handle a little adversity.

What’s that Lose in the playoffs?  Yeah he did that ALOT. 

[TheFunPolice]

I just want to see them need 2 airplanes to fly our free agent class in for the presser due to the weight and size of the linemen. 

 

My dream would be a 6'7 400 pound DT. I'd settle for 350, though if he's willing to put in the work in the dining room. 

 

 

[LABILLBACKER]

7 hours ago, NewEra said:

I think a lot depends on Levi and Dane.  I could see us grabbing a cb in the first 3 rds if we let Levi go in FA because his price tag is too high and Dane play the rest of the season is underwhelming.

 

other than that: we need a legit 1 tech.  We will likely need another DE.  We might have to draft Tremaines replacement (but more than likely the following year).  
 

I really hope offense is the focus, but could see is putting band aids on the offensive wounds like we did this pas offseason.  Only so many resources to go around.  

The 2 most glaring defensive needs this April would be 1T and CB2. We all know Dermott can't help himself.  If you can find viable starters at those 2 spots, then the rest of the draft should be dedicated to  OL / RB. I think we keep Singletary RB2,  dump everyone else and go shopping in FA for a RB1. No way I risk a 1st round WR when we need 2 Guards and  C.  I love Kenneth Walker III  in the 2nd.

1 hour ago, dave mcbride said:

We also drafted Ford as an OT and moved him inside too. 

Very true. Ford will be released once the season ends.

Edited December 14, 2021 by LABILLBACKER

[Nextmanup]

4 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

The 2 most glaring needs this April would be 1T and CB2. If you can find viable starters at those 2 spots, then the rest should be dedicated to  OL. I think we keep Singletary RB2,  dump everyone else and go shopping in FA for a RB1. No way I risk a 1st round WR when we need 2 Guards and  C.

Very true. Ford will be released once the season ends.

I would dedicate more resources to the offensive line before I would dedicate them to CB2.

 

Making the offense hum should be the first, second, and third most important jobs of the team. 

 

Our passing game is what directly translates to wins more than anything else, BY FAR.

 

Josh will be a much better passer when his OL is much better.

 

There are entire games, or large parts of games now, where Josh has real trouble consistently finding anyone to throw too, and it's largely because he doesn't have enough time.  His passing stats suffer, and the game becomes a real challenge, and often a loss.

 

When the OL has a great day and Josh is comfortable all day long, we sometimes win by 30.

 

Having said that, once the OL is fully addressed, I do agree that stopping the other team's ability to pass is the second most important factor that translates directly to wins and losses...and the most important position for that is DB, not "edge rusher" or anyone else.

 

I.E., maximum resources should go to OL, receivers (if needed; we are good there now), and then DBs, in that order.

 

Of course, we'll probably draft a DT with our first pick, as we've now done more than once.

 

LOL

 

 

 

 

[NewEra]

11 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

The 2 most glaring defensive needs this April would be 1T and CB2. We all know Dermott can't help himself.  If you can find viable starters at those 2 spots, then the rest of the draft should be dedicated to  OL / RB. I think we keep Singletary RB2,  dump everyone else and go shopping in FA for a RB1. No way I risk a 1st round WR when we need 2 Guards and  C.  I love Kenneth Walker III  in the 2nd.

Very true. Ford will be released once the season ends.

Agreed.  1T and Cb2 on the defensive side. Levi may be that cb2.  Or maybe Danes play this year will set him up as our cb2 next year and let Levi get paid elsewhere.  Then draft a corner somewhere mid round and a cheap FA.

 

Walker is my guy too.  A little worried about an ankle injury but then again, just about every RB gets hurt at some point.

[whorlnut]

4 hours ago, atomicpwrd said:

I don't know...we have one of the top offenses and defenses in the league - it hasn't been long since we traded a first for Diggs.  I would settle for some balance.  It should not be too difficult to find an interior offensive lineman, interior defensive lineman, rb, and cb that can all contribute in this draft...then add some pieces via free agency to complete the puzzle.

 

CB in the first

IOL or IDL in the second

IOL or IDL in the third

RB in the 4th

Add some developmental talent to round out the draft...

Wow. I don’t even know where to start with this. Top offenses?  I guess you still think this is 2020, but all you have to do is watch games and see we have basically a one man offense right now. Our line is hot garbage. Our TE can’t catch the ball consistently. Our WRs and RBs are slow, outside of Breida. Heck, it even took half the season for them to let him play. It’s a mess. 
 

It’s time to admit that Beane and McD screwed the pooch with this offense. I’m sure additions will be made this off-season, but please let it be top picks and not a patch job like years past. 

[Chicharito]

We will probably draft a safety in the 1st!

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

7 hours ago, Tenhigh said:

How much predicted cap space are you seeing?

 

Spotrac is assuming a 2022 cap of 199 (probably low) - 10.1 mil

 

Assuming you cut 

Morse - 7.5M savings

Klein - 5.2M savings

Ford - 1.5M savings

Williams - 5.3M or Feliciano 3.7M savings (I'll use Williams as the example because he was paid to play right tackle, can't swing to LT, and he sucks at RG - feliciano probably also moves to center)

Matakevich - 2.5M savings

Beasely - 6.1M savings (i'd probably just add a void year or extend him 1 more year to space cap hit rather than create a hole here, so i'm not counting it - his replacement will not be cheaper than 6M)

 

That would give them 32M total.  And they'd have 

QB - Allen Webb

RB - DS, Moss, Wade

FB - Gilliam

WR - Diggs Davis Beasely stevenson hodgins

TE - Knox Sweeney

OL - Dawkins Feliciano Brown Doyle (Bates RFA)

DE - Rousseau Basham Epenesa

DT - Oliver Star

LB - MIlano Edmunds Smith (Dodson ERFA)

CB - White Jackson Lewis Johnson

S - Hyde Poyer Hamlin johnson

 

Free agents

Hughes, addison, butler, sanders, kumerow, trubisky, boettger, wallace, jones, obada, mckenzie, Breida, Phillips, Zimmer, Neal

 

There are a fair amount of candidates to restructure as well if they need additional space - but as it stands now its going to be tough to go after any premier free agents with that many holes in their depth.  

 

On the plus side, the defense is already pretty good- and the unit is largely intact outside hughes/addison.  I think they can get by with the corners they have, but CB depth could probably be improved upon - also important to note what they do about losing a gunner in Neal.  A premier pass rusher would be wonderful... they're just insanely expensive.  

 

[LABILLBACKER]

2 hours ago, Nextmanup said:

I would dedicate more resources to the offensive line before I would dedicate them to CB2.

 

Making the offense hum should be the first, second, and third most important jobs of the team. 

 

Our passing game is what directly translates to wins more than anything else, BY FAR.

 

Josh will be a much better passer when his OL is much better.

 

There are entire games, or large parts of games now, where Josh has real trouble consistently finding anyone to throw too, and it's largely because he doesn't have enough time.  His passing stats suffer, and the game becomes a real challenge, and often a loss.

 

When the OL has a great day and Josh is comfortable all day long, we sometimes win by 30.

 

Having said that, once the OL is fully addressed, I do agree that stopping the other team's ability to pass is the second most important factor that translates directly to wins and losses...and the most important position for that is DB, not "edge rusher" or anyone else.

 

I.E., maximum resources should go to OL, receivers (if needed; we are good there now), and then DBs, in that order.

 

Of course, we'll probably draft a DT with our first pick, as we've now done more than once.

 

LOL

 

 

 

 

Your preaching to the choir. If it's up to me I go G, RB, G, C in the first 4 picks. But try convincing Dermott to not pick a defensive player. Good luck with that.

[716to540]

IMO, we need to go Offensive Line early.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

35 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Your preaching to the choir. If it's up to me I go G, RB, G, C in the first 4 picks. But try convincing Dermott to not pick a defensive player. Good luck with that.

 

It depends who is there - i'm not taking a CB2 in the first or probably even the 2nd.  I probably just buy a back in free agency and use a 6/7  because they aren't expensive.  Offensive line clearly impacts both the run game and pass game - it needs to get better, and it needs to probably get younger.

[whorlnut]

1 hour ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Your preaching to the choir. If it's up to me I go G, RB, G, C in the first 4 picks. But try convincing Dermott to not pick a defensive player. Good luck with that.

Yeah exactly. Technically, he did use a first on Diggs. He used a 2nd on Ford. A couple thirds on offensive players.

 

What happened when we took Allen 7 overall?  It was followed up by moving up for a defensive player that may not make it through his rookie deal, and two more defensive players after that. Forget about adding weapons for your new qb. 
 

For me, last year was the straw that broke my back and made me really question if Mcbeane really cares about building an Uber talented roster on offense. Taking Basham was unacceptable after using a second the year before on a guy that barely played and using a first on Rousseau. I have no regrets on Rousseau but Basham stings. 

[FlaFitz1]

On 12/14/2021 at 11:20 AM, FlaFitz1 said:

 

Agreed!!  I was looking at some rushing stats and for as much and some think Motor isn't and can't be the answer I fully believe his lack of overall production (total yards and TDs) is due to the dumb rotation Daboll uses.   Motor out played Moss all season yet they consistently gave Moss more snaps and carries each week until recently.

 

In yards per carry Motor is 9th - take out Allen, Jackson and Hurts he's 6th but only has 112 carries. The top 10 in rushing yards have on average carried the ball 204 times so far this season.  If he had 204 carries he's got 996 yards which would place him 3rd behind Taylor, Mixon and ahead of Cook.   On times stuffed per carry he's 13th - he's only been stuffed 8 times on 112 carries.  In yards per carry in the 2nd half of games he's 7th.  Yards per carry in the 4th quarter he's 4th.  On his first 10 carries of a game he has the 11th.  He has no fumbles inside the Bills or the opponents 20 yard line.

 

They talked about going with the hot hand at RB yet for some unknown reason they gave Moss the bulk of the work instead of the more productive back.

 

Motor has been doing this behind a less than stellar and at times banged up O-line.  If they had a couple of true road graders who run block consistently and effectively plus actually gave him the rock regularly I don't think anyone would be talking about RB being a need.   They should relegate Moss on the bench, feature Singletary and spell him with Breida they rest of the season.

 

 

I saw this graphic today which furthers my point

 

[turftoe]

On 12/14/2021 at 4:50 PM, TheFunPolice said:

I just want to see them need 2 airplanes to fly our free agent class in for the presser due to the weight and size of the linemen. 

 

My dream would be a 6'7 400 pound DT. I'd settle for 350, though if he's willing to put in the work in the dining room. 

 

 

Remember this Bills’ draft pick?

 

Bills last monstrosity

[TheFunPolice]

30 minutes ago, turftoe said:

Remember this Bills’ draft pick?

 

Bills last monstrosity

 

Yes! Slimming down cost the kid! 

[Norcalbillsfan]

On 12/14/2021 at 6:59 AM, NewEra said:

I think a lot depends on Levi and Dane.  I could see us grabbing a cb in the first 3 rds if we let Levi go in FA because his price tag is too high and Dane play the rest of the season is underwhelming.

 

other than that: we need a legit 1 tech.  We will likely need another DE.  We might have to draft Tremaines replacement (but more than likely the following year).  
 

I really hope offense is the focus, but could see is putting band aids on the offensive wounds like we did this pas offseason.  Only so many resources to go around.  

Agreed, relying on star is not an option anymore. 1 tech is too important to our LB success. Phillips has shown improvement but he's not the guy. The edmunds replacement is tricky, do we wait until edmunds walks and put an unproven rookie on the feild? Or get one this draft and let him learn and rotate in and fill in for injuries to see how he does? I'd prefer the latter but I think your right, they will draft his replacement when he's gone or resign edmunds. 

I think with the Etienne rumors (true or not) and the production we've had at rb I have a weird feeling beane goes premium for RB this year. But that being said we can afford to sign a great FA RB, but we can't afford a great 1 tech FA. So drafting premium at 1 tech definitely makes more fiscal sense.

[Nextmanup]

"Bethel didn’t have a scale that would register higher than 400 pounds, so when Jasper needed to monitor his progress in trying to lose weight, he’d go to the McKenzie Feed & Grain Store."

 

“He’d step up on our platform feed scale and customers would start coming over, gathering to see what he weighed,” said Dan Bradford, owner of the store. “We’d have a big time with it.”

 

"Bethel listed Jasper at 390 pounds, but he was actually quite a bit bigger than that."

 

 

LMFAO

 

 

[reddogblitz]

On 12/14/2021 at 7:25 AM, 34-78-83 said:

I am hoping for something like this -

 

1 - DT (gotta take them early)

2 - G

3 - Speed WR

4 - G

5 - BPA

6 - BPA

7 - BPA

 

 

 

I am hoping for this:

 

1  - BPA

2 - BPA

3 - BPA

4 - BPA

5 - BPA

6 - BPA

7 - BPA

[reddogblitz]

I don't believe our offensive issues this year has to do with a lack of talent.  Execution has been the problem. We lost 3 games due to it at least.  Pitt because our punter only lined up 13 yards back instead of 15.   Tenn due to "The Slip". And NE due to dropped passes, bad penalties, and a fumble in FG range.  That's either on the players screwing up or coaching, not lack of talent IMHO.

[atomicpwrd]

Quote

On 12/14/2021 at 5:17 PM, whorlnut said:

Wow. I don’t even know where to start with this. Top offenses?  I guess you still think this is 2020, but all you have to do is watch games and see we have basically a one man offense right now. Our line is hot garbage. Our TE can’t catch the ball consistently. Our WRs and RBs are slow, outside of Breida. Heck, it even took half the season for them to let him play. It’s a mess. 
 

It’s time to admit that Beane and McD screwed the pooch with this offense. I’m sure additions will be made this off-season, but please let it be top picks and not a patch job like years past. 

True the offense is not playing to 2020 level, but it is far from hot garbage.   I guess Allen both threw and caught those 30 touchdowns.  The TE you speak of has 8 TDs.  He had one inconsistent game in the crazy wind.  Our WRs may not be burners, but Diggs had an all pro season last year, Beasley is considered one of the best in the slot, and Gabriel Davis and Sanders are pretty damn good 3rd and 4th options.  I think the biggest difference is the use of those weapons this year.  We don't run the ball enough to make teams have to respect it.  Defenses are pinning their ears back and coming after Allen with everything they have.  That is the real difference between this year and last.

That said, both the interior OL and DL need some real help and not another team's rejects.  I never said the offense was perfect and that we should go all defense.  I stated that balance would be a better option.  The defense has just as many flaws as the offense...giving up long runs has costed us multiple games.  Then there is the ACL issue with Tre.  Sometimes it takes 2 years to fully recover from that...You can't completely ignore one side of the ball...

 

[ganesh]

On 12/14/2021 at 8:27 PM, RyanC883 said:

 

nope.  Bean and McD are making us into the Marvin Lewis Bengals.  Mediocracy is now success. 

Lewis never won a playoff game.  The Bills went to the AFCC with McDermott and Beane...Respect!

1 minute ago, atomicpwrd said:

 

Our TE has 500 yards and 8 TDs...He has made play after play.  Did he have a bad game against the Patriots - Yes...but it happens.

[MiltonWaddams]

9 minutes ago, ganesh said:

Lewis never won a playoff game.  The Bills went to the AFCC with McDermott and Beane...Respect!

Our TE has 500 yards and 8 TDs...He has made play after play.  Did he have a bad game against the Patriots - Yes...but it happens.

Everybody wants to have the next Kelce or Kittle, but even those two have had off weeks. Look at Kelce two weeks ago. He was definitely not on his game. 
Dawson came into the league with hardly any receptions in college. We all knew he was a work in progress, but the progress is looking really good so far. We have to take those bad weeks as long as we get the majority of games being very good,  which he has had this season.

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Josh Allen is our franchise. 

 

I agree, resources need to be poured into this offense. 

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

26 minutes ago, ganesh said:

Lewis never won a playoff game.  The Bills went to the AFCC with McDermott and Beane...Respect!

Our TE has 500 yards and 8 TDs...He has made play after play.  Did he have a bad game against the Patriots - Yes...but it happens.

We need real NFL players at Tight End, and to compete with Knox and build out the depth chart. 

 

The Bills have tried for years to skimp by at Tight End with low-end draft picks like Derek Fine, Derek Schouman, Chris Gragg, Nick O'Leary and now Tommy Sweeney who is not athletic enough for this league. 

 

The Bills need another Stefon Diggs level talent at WR. Simply promoting Gabe Davis and brining back 33-year old Cole Beasley will not work. To get a WR that can make an impact, the Bills need to go First Round. Not 3rd and below. 

 

 

[Solomon Grundy]

5 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

We need real NFL players at Tight End, and to compete with Knox and build out the depth chart. 

 

The Bills have tried for years to skimp by at Tight End with low-end draft picks like Derek Fine, Derek Schouman, Chris Gragg, Nick O'Leary and now Tommy Sweeney who is not athletic enough for this league. 

 

The Bills need another Stefon Diggs level talent at WR. Simply promoting Gabe Davis and brining back 33-year old Cole Beasley will not work. To get a WR that can make an impact, the Bills need to go First Round. Not 3rd and below. 

 

 

I agree with the TE aspect. The Bills need another weapon there. Isaiah Likely would be a great get in the draft. I’d also like to see them give Stevenson some burn with his deep speed. I really think this is what they are lacking. 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

22 minutes ago, Solomon Grundy said:

I agree with the TE aspect. The Bills need another weapon there. Isaiah Likely would be a great get in the draft. I’d also like to see them give Stevenson some burn with his deep speed. I really think this is what they are lacking. 

I don’t think Stevenson is as fast as advertised.

 

He ran ~4.40-4.41 in pre combine testing and didn’t do much of note in the Senior Bowl practices.
 

He is a long-shot to ever earn playing time in my opinion.

 

He’s Marcus Easley all over again. 

[billsfan89]

On 12/18/2021 at 1:24 PM, reddogblitz said:

 

I am hoping for this:

 

1  - BPA

2 - BPA

3 - BPA

4 - BPA

5 - BPA

6 - BPA

7 - BPA

 

BPA is relative. I think the best GM's draft combining value and need. For example, the Bills if they pick at pick 32 (optimistic thinking) and they identify Guard, DT, and RB as their top front line needs and WR, CB and Safety as their top depth needs and at pick then they have to weight their frontline and depth needs vs what is available to them at their pick. 

 

For example if the best Guard available is ranked 50th, the best DT is ranked 48th and the best RB is ranked 56th on their board then reaching for need is foolish esp if a WR they have ranked 22nd or a CB they have ranked 24th are both on the board. BUT if a Guard they have ranked 30th is on the board and they have a WR ranked 24th it makes sense to take the guard as it is a more pressing need and still a fairly good value for their pick even if the guard isn't technically the BPA.