The_Ripster Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 Cardinals could face Chandler Jones holdout with no contract extension (usatoday.com) Chandler Jones, 31 (one year younger than Julio), has yet to show up at an offseason practice (like Julio), despite living year-round near the facility. This is a team leader who has done nothing but represent the team with class on and off the field, and someone who could be held up as an example to others. Yet he is a no-show. Oh, and he deleted every reference to the Cardinals from his social media, a telltale indicator if there ever was one. And he hasn't put anything back. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/why-julio-jones-may-not-be-only-blockbuster-jones-trade-on-nfl-horizon-cardinals-sack-star-deserves-more/ https://cardswire.usatoday.com/2021/05/26/chandler-jones-contract-extension-holdout-possibility/ Jones is a monster.. wonder if Jerry and a first would pry him loose from AZ https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/J/JoneCh03.htm 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSBill Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 But would I take him over Zach Ertz? Hmmm ??? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonCents Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 2 minutes ago, CSBill said: But would I take him over Zach Ertz? Hmmm ??? Sarcasm? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 (edited) We just drafted a 1st Round Defensive End and a 2nd Round Defensive End in conjunction with a 2nd Rounder spent on a Defensive End last year. Now you want to send a future 1st for ANOTHER Defensive End, who's also 31 years old? Hard pass. We're closed for business on Defensive End moves for 2021. Edited June 5, 2021 by BillsFanForever19 9 8 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17islongenough Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 What does race have to do with it? 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Ripster Posted June 4, 2021 Author Share Posted June 4, 2021 1 minute ago, BillsFanForever19 said: We just drafted a 1st Round Defensive End and a 2nd Round Defensive End in conjunction with a 2nd Rounder spent on a Defensive End last year. Now you want to send a future 1st for ANOTHER Defensive End, who's also 31 years old? Hard pass. because he's a proven decorated QB killer that the young ones can model their game after, this guy would be a huge addition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, The_Ripster said: because he's a proven decorated QB killer that the young ones can model their game after, this guy would be a huge addition. He's 31 and coming off a season ending torn bicep where he missed most of the year. Not worth a 1st Rounder at this point in his career and we'll need that 1st for other positions following the Josh and Tremaine deals. We've already allocated a 1st and 2 2nd's in the past two years. Spending another 1st on the same position is crazy talk at this point. Edited June 4, 2021 by BillsFanForever19 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PonyBoy Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 2 DE picks in rounds 1 & 2. Plus! Chandler #81, Moderator... Chandler Jones... Hmm... Too many DE's & Chandlers associated with this Bills team. Sorry Jones, No Bills for you 😃 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Joe Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 2 minutes ago, The_Ripster said: because he's a proven decorated QB killer that the young ones can model their game after, this guy would be a huge addition. Beane is drafting edge guys to free up money for Josh’s extension so I can’t see this happening ... 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Ripster Posted June 4, 2021 Author Share Posted June 4, 2021 3 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said: He's 31 and coming off a season ending torn bicep where he missed most of the year. Not worth a 1st Rounder at this point in his career and we'll need that 1st for other positions following the Josh and Tremaine deals. We've already allocated a 1st and 2 2nd's in the past two years. Spending another 1st on the same position is crazy talk at this point. Understandably thats a lot spent, yet, will any of those 3 be starting this season? Epenesa maybe, and that's if they make some serious decisions about Hughes/Addison still unlikely tho. Honestly, what else do you see the bills putting that first rounder towards next year? another corner? the roster is practically complete at this point and I don't know about you but I don't see TE the pathway to a superbowl ring. Only thing holding a move like this back, in my mind is prioritizing extending Allen/Edmunds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 (edited) 30 minutes ago, The_Ripster said: Only thing holding a move like this back, in my mind is prioritizing extending Allen/Edmunds. Yep - and since both will happen, we're going to lose players off this roster to make the cap work. Players that will have to be replaced in the coming Drafts. So we can't afford to give those assets away. Especially for a position that we've already heavily invested in. And I'm not convinced that Chandler Jones, coming off a season ending injury in which it'll be close to a full calendar year since he last played, switching teams, and learning a new system is going to be that much of an upgrade over Jerry for this season anyways. And beyond that - how many more solid years does he have left in the tank at this point? Edited June 5, 2021 by BillsFanForever19 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddenboy Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 There is nothing "Process" about the whole situation. From the hold-out, to the deletions of Team stuff on his media, to "leaking" this stuff out, etc. Plus, as posted above, McBeane are investing in high draft picks on the DL so they DONT have to break the bank at the position(s). So pass, and its also not gonna happen. I do like his play though. Or am I remembering who he used to be, rather than who he is going to be in the future? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niagara Dude Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 1 hour ago, The_Ripster said: Cardinals could face Chandler Jones holdout with no contract extension (usatoday.com) Chandler Jones, 31 (one year younger than Julio), has yet to show up at an offseason practice (like Julio), despite living year-round near the facility. This is a team leader who has done nothing but represent the team with class on and off the field, and someone who could be held up as an example to others. Yet he is a no-show. Oh, and he deleted every reference to the Cardinals from his social media, a telltale indicator if there ever was one. And he hasn't put anything back. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/why-julio-jones-may-not-be-only-blockbuster-jones-trade-on-nfl-horizon-cardinals-sack-star-deserves-more/ https://cardswire.usatoday.com/2021/05/26/chandler-jones-contract-extension-holdout-possibility/ Jones is a monster.. wonder if Jerry and a first would pry him loose from AZ https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/J/JoneCh03.htm 1 hour ago, The_Ripster said: Cardinals could face Chandler Jones holdout with no contract extension (usatoday.com) Chandler Jones, 31 (one year younger than Julio), has yet to show up at an offseason practice (like Julio), despite living year-round near the facility. This is a team leader who has done nothing but represent the team with class on and off the field, and someone who could be held up as an example to others. Yet he is a no-show. Oh, and he deleted every reference to the Cardinals from his social media, a telltale indicator if there ever was one. And he hasn't put anything back. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/why-julio-jones-may-not-be-only-blockbuster-jones-trade-on-nfl-horizon-cardinals-sack-star-deserves-more/ https://cardswire.usatoday.com/2021/05/26/chandler-jones-contract-extension-holdout-possibility/ Jones is a monster.. wonder if Jerry and a first would pry him loose from AZ https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/J/JoneCh03.htm I would consider a 3rd rounder and maybe a second but hard pass if they want first 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 He's done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Ripster Posted June 5, 2021 Author Share Posted June 5, 2021 2 hours ago, maddenboy said: There is nothing "Process" about the whole situation. From the hold-out, to the deletions of Team stuff on his media, to "leaking" this stuff out, etc. Plus, as posted above, McBeane are investing in high draft picks on the DL so they DONT have to break the bank at the position(s). So pass, and its also not gonna happen. I do like his play though. Or am I remembering who he used to be, rather than who he is going to be in the future? Yeah ur right, I figured he's good for maybe 5 more seasons at best anyways. Those double digit sack numbers are really enticing. Only one season removed too (kinda like Star). I'm not sure how often a torn bicep equates to a career ending injury. I agree with a lot of points made so far tho, and I would still be willing to give Chandler an opportunity for a few seasons, but i'm not so sure it's worth giving up a 1st anymore. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Ripster Posted June 5, 2021 Author Share Posted June 5, 2021 39 minutes ago, Doc said: He's done. It's a bicep injury, just get the surgeon to replace the tendon with some heavy test fishing line and he's good to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddiegoofball Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 Wondering what the NFL's black market is... is that like when you trade for a guy illegally? Like Arizona doesn't realize we acquired him? But to answer the question, with how we drafted and how we are about to get a lot younger and cheaper at the edge position after this season, adding a higher priced, aging veteran is counterproductive. We can't pay Josh, Edmunds and others if we bring in players like this. When you think about how much we spent on the lines last season and how we drafted all this younger, cheaper talent I think the last thing we need is someone like Jones. You're thinking pre McBeane era Bills who might have brought in a name for the novelty and to sell tickets. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 So this is def worth discussion....but didnt we basically draft a younger version of him with our 1st round pick? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 17 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: So this is def worth discussion....but didnt we basically draft a younger version of him with our 1st round pick? But you know how we love to start threads about acquiring expensive old guys who’s names we recognize. It’s a theme we like to keep alive! 1 1 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 5 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said: We just drafted a 1st Round Defensive End and a 2nd Round Defensive End in conjunction with a 2nd Rounder spent on a Defensive End last year. Now you want to send a future 1st for ANOTHER Defensive End, who's also 31 years old? Hard pass. We're closed for business on Defensive End moves for 2021. I would tend to agree that given the cap situation it doesn’t seem likely but I would also say that I do imagine that if they were to make a move for a vet front line DE the Bills would likely toss Addison back in a trade to make room. If it could fit cap wise somehow I would gladly trade a 1st in 2022 and Addison got Jones. This teams biggest weakness in my opinion is the lack of a prime time pass rusher. Jones would fit that bill instantly and even if he only has 2 or 3 more good years left it could be the last piece needed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 Not exactly smart for anyone over 30 to mess with their team in a year where the cap goes down and just about everyone but Watt took pay cuts to stay or move to another team. There was 800 or so one year contracts. All of these guys, Ertz, Jones, Julio are going to lose $ in the long run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Says Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 11 hours ago, The_Ripster said: Cardinals could face Chandler Jones holdout with no contract extension (usatoday.com) Chandler Jones, 31 (one year younger than Julio), has yet to show up at an offseason practice (like Julio), despite living year-round near the facility. This is a team leader who has done nothing but represent the team with class on and off the field, and someone who could be held up as an example to others. Yet he is a no-show. Oh, and he deleted every reference to the Cardinals from his social media, a telltale indicator if there ever was one. And he hasn't put anything back. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/why-julio-jones-may-not-be-only-blockbuster-jones-trade-on-nfl-horizon-cardinals-sack-star-deserves-more/ https://cardswire.usatoday.com/2021/05/26/chandler-jones-contract-extension-holdout-possibility/ Jones is a monster.. wonder if Jerry and a first would pry him loose from AZ https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/J/JoneCh03.htm Take on his 15 million dollar salary? Even if they buy into your fantasy and agree to take Hughes:it would use up almost all of Buffalo's available cap space. That would mean no Ertz, or Nelson/ Breeland. After signing Obada,then drafting Basham and Rousseau: no thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Boo Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 7 hours ago, John from Riverside said: So this is def worth discussion....but didnt we basically draft a younger version of him with our 1st round pick? We hope. 2015-2019 Chandler Jones had 60 sacks in 64 games for AZ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 11 hours ago, Doc said: He's done. 11, 17, 13, 19 sacks.....then tears his bicep....and he’s now done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 26 minutes ago, NewEra said: 11, 17, 13, 19 sacks.....then tears his bicep....and he’s now done? He had 1 sack in the 4-1/2 games last year he did play last year, is on the wrong side of 31 and now coming back from a significant injury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wppete Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 He is expensive but would love to see him in the Bills roster. He’s a baller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 2 minutes ago, wppete said: He is expensive but would love to see him in the Bills roster. He’s a baller. The things I mentioned above are the reason why I wouldn't bother with him. On top of that he's looking to get paid and it would cost a draft pick to get him. Hard pass. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 18 minutes ago, Doc said: He had 1 sack in the 4-1/2 games last year he did play last year, is on the wrong side of 31 and now coming back from a significant injur 4.5 games vs an entire career of dominance suggests that you’re overreacting. The previous season, he had 19 sacks. Not 10-13. 19......that’s elite. So one year older and one injury and he’s gone from elite.....to done. So now that he’s “done”, how many sacks do you think he’ll this year? I don’t believe he’s a target for us because of his contract and it looks as if the drafting of pass rushers Rousseau and Basham + allen contract will work in unison to keep out cap as manageable going forward. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Ripster Posted June 5, 2021 Author Share Posted June 5, 2021 17 minutes ago, Doc said: The things I mentioned above are the reason why I wouldn't bother with him. On top of that he's looking to get paid and it would cost a draft pick to get him. Hard pass. Would you do it for Hughes+Addison+3rd pick? That shuffles 10 mill to the cards, we take on Jones' 15 mill and have the possibility to extend his contract. I'm not too familiar with the NFL's rules about restructuring a contract that a team has traded for, but if that were possible could be pretty sweet. Get Jones then turn the 15 mill this year into 2 years at 7.5 mill and extend him... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChronicAndKnuckles Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 17 hours ago, The_Ripster said: Cardinals could face Chandler Jones holdout with no contract extension (usatoday.com) Chandler Jones, 31 (one year younger than Julio), has yet to show up at an offseason practice (like Julio), despite living year-round near the facility. This is a team leader who has done nothing but represent the team with class on and off the field, and someone who could be held up as an example to others. Yet he is a no-show. Oh, and he deleted every reference to the Cardinals from his social media, a telltale indicator if there ever was one. And he hasn't put anything back. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/why-julio-jones-may-not-be-only-blockbuster-jones-trade-on-nfl-horizon-cardinals-sack-star-deserves-more/ https://cardswire.usatoday.com/2021/05/26/chandler-jones-contract-extension-holdout-possibility/ Jones is a monster.. wonder if Jerry and a first would pry him loose from AZ https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/J/JoneCh03.htm If you go browsing in the black market, let me know if you find my kidney. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Ripster Posted June 5, 2021 Author Share Posted June 5, 2021 21 minutes ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said: If you go browsing in the black market, let me know if you find my kidney. No kidney's, only Chandler Jones's... weird right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 2 hours ago, The_Ripster said: Would you do it for Hughes+Addison+3rd pick? That shuffles 10 mill to the cards, we take on Jones' 15 mill and have the possibility to extend his contract. I'm not too familiar with the NFL's rules about restructuring a contract that a team has traded for, but if that were possible could be pretty sweet. Get Jones then turn the 15 mill this year into 2 years at 7.5 mill and extend him... I wouldn't trade for him for the reasons mentioned, much less extend him. He has 1 year left on his contract for $15.5M in base salary and wants a new deal. He's not staying away from the Cardinals and a $15.5M salary and signing with another team to spread out that amount over 2 seasons. He wants a longer-term extension for at least $15.5M/year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transient Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 1 hour ago, The_Ripster said: No kidney's, only Chandler Jones's... weird right? Chandler Jones’s what? He might need whatever it is back. I’m sure the kidney is glad whatever it is didn’t belong to it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 2 hours ago, The_Ripster said: Would you do it for Hughes+Addison+3rd pick? Get Jones then turn the 15 mill this year into 2 years at 7.5 mill and extend him... First off, as mentioned above, he's on a 15 mil 1 year deal right now and holding out on it. How does it make any sense that he'd accept a 50% pay cut on a deal he's already not happy with? Secondly, Addison isn't going anywhere. He took a paycut to stay here. And Beane has never in his tenure told a player "if you want to stay here, we need you to take a cut" and then come back to say "thanks for working with us, but you're still out of here". Not even with guys he won't use like Tyler Kroft. It's a bad look to the locker room team building and trust in their "process" Even after the Draft when people speculated he might do it this time, he doubled down in the post-Draft press conference saying Addison won't be going anywhere and that his mentoring and leadership of the young guys will be important in their growth. Was even commenting on how he planned to use Addison and his snap counts going forward to maximize his impact. Long story short - the Defensive End position has been addressed this offseason. In multiple moves. As it is, we may have to move on from Efe Obada from a pure numbers standpoint. You may question how Beane has addressed the position and how much impact Rousseau and Basham will make in Year One. But that's how he went about it. Rousseau, Basham, perhaps Obada, and the growth of Epenesa in his second year is what he's hanging his hat on. We cannot and should not even do due diligence into a move for Chandler Jones. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southern_Bills Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 If it could get done for a 2nd maybe, Atlanta won't even get a 1st for Julio. I wouldn't give up a 1st, but a 2nd yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, NewEra said: 4.5 games vs an entire career of dominance suggests that you’re overreacting. The previous season, he had 19 sacks. Not 10-13. 19......that’s elite. So one year older and one injury and he’s gone from elite.....to done. So now that he’s “done”, how many sacks do you think he’ll this year? I don’t believe he’s a target for us because of his contract and it looks as if the drafting of pass rushers Rousseau and Basham + allen contract will work in unison to keep out cap as manageable going forward. Prior career means little when you're talking about aging players who can decline from getting older and especially coming off injury. If Jones were, say, 27, it would be a far different story. And 1 sack in 4.5 games works-out to 3.5 over a season. Maybe he gets more, maybe he gets less. The point is it isn't worth spending a ton of money and a draft pick to take a gamble that least year was a complete fluke and he'll be the player he was prior to his 30s. Edited June 5, 2021 by Doc 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, Doc said: Prior career means little when you're talking about agings players who can decline from getting older and especially coming off injury. If Jones were, say, 27, it would be a far different story. And 1 sack in 4.5 games works-out to 3.5 over a season. Maybe he gets more, maybe he gets less. The point is it isn't worth spending a ton of money and a draft pick to take a gamble that least year was a complete fluke and he'll be the player he was prior to his 30s. Seems there's a lot of folks around here who feel that both our 1st and our 2nd will provide nothing in Year 1 and are essentially red shirts 🙄 Baffles me that everyone is counting out both our top picks, are closed off to the idea that Epenesa could improve, AND feel both Hughes and Addison provide nothing. Edited June 5, 2021 by BillsFanForever19 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 2 hours ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said: If you go browsing in the black market, let me know if you find my kidney. Your kidney? Well this is awkward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Ripster Posted June 5, 2021 Author Share Posted June 5, 2021 Lots of well articulated thoughts and opinions in here! Thank you all for sharing ur input about the pass rushing situation and ur feelings about whether going after another elite caliber QB killer is worth it for this team. 😎 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 (edited) 6 hours ago, Doc said: The things I mentioned above are the reason why I wouldn't bother with him. On top of that he's looking to get paid and it would cost a draft pick to get him. Hard pass. I totally get the argument that we are in our SB window and one guy could make a huge difference. I just happen to lean toward using our cap space and draft picks on developing our own young guys who come much cheaper than a “name player vet” for a season or two. If Jones wants $15 mil+ over more years than he’s worth that, we’d be spending a lot of money that could go towards Josh and some of the other guys we are developing in-house. I want to “win now”, but I also want to build a team that can stay at or near the top for the long term. Having said all that, I just LOVE that Chandler Jones has demonstrated to the world how incredibly fallible The Great Belichick is! . Edited June 5, 2021 by Augie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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