Why the defense got it's mojo back

[delirious]

58 minutes ago, DDCC said:

We are in serious conversation about a defensive tackle.  All signs are pointing to Washington but potential sleeper out west. More to come

 

You got some proof?

[wvbillsfan]

9 minutes ago, Marvlevydraftdaygenius said:

I love when McDermott puts his insight into the defense.  Frazier and McDermott have two different beliefs Frazier does not believe in blitzing at all he believes in the Defensive line.  McDermott believes in bringing the blitz and shaking things up lining his linebackers down over the center to cause the offensive line to wonder who is coming and it works.

When you start seeing that inside corner blitz you know the defense is confident. Love see safeties and corners get after the qb. We disguise it really well imo

[BigDingus]

I don't know...

The 3rd & long thing hasn't been an area of success for this team all year. 

In fact, when I see the team is 3rd & 8 or 3rd & 15, it almost feels like a foregone conclusion they'll get an easy look downfield and convert. 

"Pressure packages" implies we can get pressure. That's usually not the case unfortunately.

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

Defense looked better .... defense faced the Jets.  Hmmmmmm 🤔

[VW82]

Hughes coming to life was a good sign. We're still getting blown off the line though and it's leading to clock killing drives like the one Jets had mid first into the second where we turned them over on downs. It puts too much pressure on the offense to score. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, FUTURIST said:

I think the Bill's D is figuring it out.  I am still pretty confident the Bills will figure out the run defense and the elite Bills offense again once Brown gets healthy and can get back to stretching the field.

 

Call me crazy but I still think the Bills we saw early in the season will return and I still believe they can win the Super Bowl.  

 

I dunno about the Super Bowl.  Our Defense has to figure a lot out for me to even dream about that.

 

As far as our offense, we're in the middle of the Football Chess Match.  We started the season with "Make him be a QB" being the mantra against Josh.  Blanket the middle where he was deadly accurate last year, and force him to throw deep against man coverage.

 

After 4 games it was obvious the answer to that was a little nod and smile and a bunch of deep completions.

 

So now it's been figured out that the Bills are struggling like anything to run the ball, Josh has been reluctant to run it, so if teams can take away the deep ball and play a soft zone, Josh struggles because his "Brett Favre says Touchdowns First, Coach!" mentality just does NOT want to take the checkdown.  Teams are betting on Josh's personality to push the ball into tight coverage and make mistakes. 

 

Once Josh shows he will be patient and accurately take what they give him, things will change again. 

 

I couldn't believe it when I saw that our TE and RB had actually been targetted 13 of 41 passes and caught 10 of 30 the completed passes today. 

I literally screamed YEAH!   Because that's what Josh has to do right now.

[2ForMacAdoo]

4 hours ago, Billznut said:

The Bills have given up TONS of 3rd and long conversions this season. They are one of the worst 3rd down defenses this year. The reason the defense looked good today is because we were playing the Jets. Don’t kid yourself into thinking it was anything other than that. We haven’t stopped any other offense this year. 

This.  The Jets are the only team in the NFL south of 100 total points scored, coming in at a whopping 85 points, or 12 points per game. Period. End of story.

[BillsFan130]

4 hours ago, Billznut said:

The Bills have given up TONS of 3rd and long conversions this season. They are one of the worst 3rd down defenses this year. The reason the defense looked good today is because we were playing the Jets. Don’t kid yourself into thinking it was anything other than that. We haven’t stopped any other offense this year. 

Yep^. And on top of it, they still gave up a 3rd and 20 conversion against the jets today lol.

[MasterStrategist]

4 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

The second half it seemed that the defense was clicking on all cylinders. So what's the difference between that and the last few weeks?

 

Down and distance

 

When our defense is consistently in second and 3 or Third and short . It really limits what you call defensively

 

McDermott's and Frasier's pressure packages and exotic schemes can't get called in those distances

 

Offenses have taken advantage of nickeling and diming us and getting us out of those packages

 

Today in the second half we got the Jets into second and third and long. Which allowed McDermott and Frasier to get our pressure packages and disguises on the field

 

We've been stuck in 2 and 4 so much that we had little of those opportunities this year that they really haven't even had time to gel when they call those packages

 

Now it's only the Jets, but you can see why fraziers and mcdermotts pressure packages and disguises are very good. We bottle the quarterback up in the pocket, and swallow them up as a whole unit

 

McDermotts scheme doesn't scheme up one pass rusher, it schemes up the whole unit as a whole to collapse the pocket and engulf the quarterback. In the second half the defenses overloads and green dogs confused darnold and had him seeing ghost's

 

This is definitely something you could carry over into next week

100% agree, great post.  More aggressive on 1st down, translated to many more 2nd/3rd downs with longer to go and improved recognition of run/pass.

 

I think it might have been the Dallas Thanksgiving game last year when Romo made this exact comment during the game (Bills are aggressive early in downs so that they can keep everything in front of them on 3rd down & rally to the ball).

 

Not sure why we haven't been doing this all season.  But I'm glad 2nd half we might have found our identity again.  Yes, against the Jets, but nonetheless, something to build off of

[mike22nc]

It may be as simple as this.

2018-2020 Bills defense with Milano:

192.75 pass yards per game
103.31 rush yards per game

2018-2020 Bills defense without Milano:

207.14 pass yards per game
152.71 rush yards per game

[BillsVet]

2 hours ago, Marvlevydraftdaygenius said:

I love when McDermott puts his insight into the defense.  Frazier and McDermott have two different beliefs Frazier does not believe in blitzing at all he believes in the Defensive line.  McDermott believes in bringing the blitz and shaking things up lining his linebackers down over the center to cause the offensive line to wonder who is coming and it works.

 

McD does not, as a rule, bring the blitz in the scheme and Frazier's calls mirror that.  If you see more blitzing, it's because the front 4 is not generating necessary pressure.  

 

And the reason McD demands the front 4 get pressure is so that he can force throws into the Cover-4, Cover-3, or Cover-2.    

 

https://buffalonews.com/sports/bills/it-all-starts-with-the-front-four-for-sean-mcdermott-and-leslie-frazier/article_0526c65a-eece-11ea-820d-a7be0097eaed.html

 

McD would not have hired Frazier if their defensive philosophy differed on this point so dramatically. 

[Billever76]

12 minutes ago, BillsVet said:

 

McD does not, as a rule, bring the blitz in the scheme and Frazier's calls mirror that.  If you see more blitzing, it's because the front 4 is not generating necessary pressure.  

 

And the reason McD demands the front 4 get pressure is so that he can force throws into the Cover-4, Cover-3, or Cover-2.    

 

https://buffalonews.com/sports/bills/it-all-starts-with-the-front-four-for-sean-mcdermott-and-leslie-frazier/article_0526c65a-eece-11ea-820d-a7be0097eaed.html

 

McD would not have hired Frazier if their defensive philosophy differed on this point so dramatically. 

They may have relied on the defensive line being the most vital cog to the defense but this year they dont have that and now have to adjust their scheme to our current players strengths......the cover 3 and cover 4 should no longer be our base defense.....we must attack and blitz and disguise coverages by moving around pre snap and threatening to blitz etc etc......if we are going to make a deep playoff run coach McDermott must adjust our defensive identity he has stubbornly held on to the first 6 1/2 weeks.....Release the hounds!

[BillsVet]

31 minutes ago, Billever76 said:

They may have relied on the defensive line being the most vital cog to the defense but this year they dont have that and now have to adjust their scheme to our current players strengths......the cover 3 and cover 4 should no longer be our base defense.....we must attack and blitz and disguise coverages by moving around pre snap and threatening to blitz etc etc......if we are going to make a deep playoff run coach McDermott must adjust our defensive identity he has stubbornly held on to the first 6 1/2 weeks.....Release the hounds!

 

Give McDermott a call and tell him to change a defensive philosophy he's had for years.  Maybe a zebra can change their spots while we're at it. 

[TigerJ]

6 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

The second half it seemed that the defense was clicking on all cylinders. So what's the difference between that and the last few weeks?

 

Down and distance

 

When our defense is consistently in second and 3 or Third and short . It really limits what you call defensively

 

McDermott's and Frasier's pressure packages and exotic schemes can't get called in those distances

 

Offenses have taken advantage of nickeling and diming us and getting us out of those packages

 

Today in the second half we got the Jets into second and third and long. Which allowed McDermott and Frasier to get our pressure packages and disguises on the field

 

We've been stuck in 2 and 4 so much that we had little of those opportunities this year that they really haven't even had time to gel when they call those packages

 

Now it's only the Jets, but you can see why fraziers and mcdermotts pressure packages and disguises are very good. We bottle the quarterback up in the pocket, and swallow them up as a whole unit

 

McDermotts scheme doesn't scheme up one pass rusher, it schemes up the whole unit as a whole to collapse the pocket and engulf the quarterback. In the second half the defenses overloads and green dogs confused darnold and had him seeing ghost's

 

This is definitely something you could carry over into next week

I'll take your word on this, but it does beg the question, what did the Bills do differently that allowed them to limit the yardage they gave up to the Jets on first down.  The Jets got first down yardage in huge chunks in the first quarter.

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, TigerJ said:

I'll take your word on this, but it does beg the question, what did the Bills do differently that allowed them to limit the yardage they gave up to the Jets on first down.  The Jets got first down yardage in huge chunks in the first quarter.

Obviously the Jets abandoning the run helped

 

And the first quarter was by far their most successful quarter

 

As they became more predictable, it allowed McDermott and Frazier to get them in the downs and distances that they like

 

And draw up some of the combo coverages that they like to play.. which they seem to have gotten away from for some reason in the first 6 weeks this season

 

McDermott and Frazier have always been good at confusing quarterbacks on third down but has gotten away from it a bit this year

[KD in CA]

Let’s just say a game against the Jets offense couldn’t have come at a better time.

[Buffalo716]

8 minutes ago, KD in CA said:

Let’s just say a game against the Jets offense couldn’t have come at a better time.

Timing is everything

[Nelius]

Yes, it's the Jets, but also, yes it's the Patriots. Anybody actually looked at their roster this year? Just gross. I'll take what I saw in the second half and hope it carries over against another BAD team next week while this defense continues to heal. Most of our defensive anchors are young outside of Hughes. Good reps against bad opponents isn't a bad thing and shouldn't be dismissed. Defense won it today.

Edited October 26, 2020 by Nelius

[Buffalo716]

18 minutes ago, Nelius said:

Yes, it's the Jets, but also, yes it's the Patriots. Anybody actually looked at their roster this year? Just gross. I'll take what I saw in the second half and hope it carries over against another BAD team next week while this defense continues to heal. Most of our defensive anchors are young outside of Hughes. Good reps against bad opponents isn't a bad thing and shouldn't be dismissed. Defense won it today.

Exactly

 

It's crazy how people act like the Jets are an actual college football team. Being one of the 32 is one of the most privileged things in any sport

 

And every player is fighting for their job. I will guarantee the Jets will beat another NFL team this season

 

They played hard for 13 minutes. And the bills took over,  we just didn't put the ball in the endzone

[Patrick Duffy]

1 hour ago, BillsVet said:

 

Give McDermott a call and tell him to change a defensive philosophy he's had for years.  Maybe a zebra can change their spots while we're at it. 

Cool, but zebras have stripes, not spots 😎

[Thurman#1]

7 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

Why the defense got its mojo back

 

 

 

Some of it was playing the Jets, no doubt.

 

But there was more to it than that.

 

Some of it was having Milano and Edmunds both again. We're a much better team with both guys on the field. They were also running more of the deceptive looks, stuff we haven't seen much of this year, with seven guys on the line, three of whom back out at the snap. It was confusing and pressuring the Jets. It's not clear why they haven't done that much this year when it's been a McDermott staple the last few years, but my guess is they haven't had the guys they fell they need to run those. Yesterday they did. Because Milano was back? Dunno. Because Zimmer seems to have helped toughen up the interior?

 

Dunno, but they were pressuring even when they weren't blitzing and some of it seemed to come from those unpredictable pre-snap looks.

 

I'm more hopeful than I've been for a couple of weeks about this defense.

[Buffalo716]

5 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Some of it was playing the Jets, no doubt.

 

But there was more to it than that.

 

Some of it was having Milano and Edmunds both again. We're a much better team with both guys on the field. They were also running more of the deceptive looks, stuff we haven't seen much of this year, with seven guys on the line, three of whom back out at the snap. It was confusing and pressuring the Jets. It's not clear why they haven't done that much this year when it's been a McDermott staple the last few years, but my guess is they haven't had the guys they fell they need to run those. Yesterday they did. Because Milano was back? Dunno. Because Zimmer seems to have helped toughen up the interior?

 

Dunno, but they were pressuring even when they weren't blitzing and some of it seemed to come from those unpredictable pre-snap looks.

 

I'm more hopeful than I've been for a couple of weeks about this defense.

I'm pretty sure I said all of that

[LABILLBACKER]

7 hours ago, Billznut said:

The Bills have given up TONS of 3rd and long conversions this season. They are one of the worst 3rd down defenses this year. The reason the defense looked good today is because we were playing the Jets. Don’t kid yourself into thinking it was anything other than that. We haven’t stopped any other offense this year. 

Because of the obvious weakness in our front 4, McD will have no choice but to take chances and use the blitz packages more. I'm not using either Jets came as a barometer. 

[BringBackFlutie]

12 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Some of it was playing the Jets, no doubt.

 

But there was more to it than that.

 

Some of it was having Milano and Edmunds both again. We're a much better team with both guys on the field. They were also running more of the deceptive looks, stuff we haven't seen much of this year, with seven guys on the line, three of whom back out at the snap. It was confusing and pressuring the Jets. It's not clear why they haven't done that much this year when it's been a McDermott staple the last few years, but my guess is they haven't had the guys they fell they need to run those. Yesterday they did. Because Milano was back? Dunno. Because Zimmer seems to have helped toughen up the interior?

 

Dunno, but they were pressuring even when they weren't blitzing and some of it seemed to come from those unpredictable pre-snap looks.

 

I'm more hopeful than I've been for a couple of weeks about this defense.

It was completely different. Either personnel (Milano back), or McD took over play calling. I dunno. The second half showed shades of every other season that our defensive slump ended. Sometimes that's been McD taking over the play calls...

 

It's the Jets, yeah, but even they were moving the ball all first half. The second half didn't look like a rebound- it looked like our D snapped back to 2019.

[GreggTX]

All through the 2nd half I kept thinking about that Bills vs Chargers game where McDermott took over the playcalling from Frazier and the defense went from horror show to hammer time. It wouldn't surprise me if that happened in this game too. I wonder if Frazier is easier to predict and his HC is catching offenses off guard more frequently. If this is the case, McDermott needs to own up to this and start calling the plays for the defense going forward.

[Thurman#1]

 

 

4 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

I'm pretty sure I said all of that

 

Congratulations on that.

 

But you also said how it was getting them in 2nd and 3rd and long which allowed us to use them. Yet, they were used for all downs and distances.

 

The first time they noticeably use it, for example, was a 3rd and 4, at 8:57 in the 1st quarter.  They've had plenty of 3rd and 4s so far this season but we haven't seen much of those packages.

 

A bit later, they run a nice left side blitz on 1st and 10 at 3:00 in the first quarter. I think it's fair to say that they've faced one or two 1st and 10s as a defense this year.

 

Since one of the most common things they do as a pressure thing is move Edmunds up onto the line, and we've seen very little of that this year till today, seems likely to me it may be more about Edmunds getting healthy and Milano's wise head being on the field.

 

Having run a package like that on 3rd and 4, they didn't run one on a 3rd and 20. It's at 1:15 in the 1st. They do finally run one in one of the situations you talk about at 0:17 in the 1st on a 2nd and 8. Nothing on the 3rd and 11 that immediately follows. Another blitz on a 1st and 10 at 10:19  ....

 

They were running them on situations that weren't 2nd or 3rd and long, and they didn't run them on several situations that did fit your specs. To me, it's pretty clear that whatever reason they did run more of these, having more 2nd and 3rd and long situations is not the main factor.

 

More, I'd argue that you're misreading the situation when you say that the reason for our success is more 2nd and 3rd and longs. IMO you're confusing cause and effect. It's more like our success is causing more long late downs for opponents.

Edited October 26, 2020 by Thurman#1

[DDCC]

15 hours ago, delirious said:

 

You got some proof?

Yes

[DDCC]

16 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

And what trade would that be, Grasshopper?

It is wifey being reported the bills are in serious conversation to improve their defense.  A lot is predicated on the cost but Beane is very aggressive and is being pushed by McDermott to make a move.  He doesn’t want to be one and done in the playoffs again

[DDCC]

15 hours ago, delirious said:

 

You got some proof?

Yes

[delirious]

15 minutes ago, DDCC said:

Yes

 

The Bills org has been tight lipped since it seems the Beane administration has taken place.  Why, all of a sudden, is there loose lips?

 

I guess I just find this way too convenient considering the D line play has been so bad, us peons can recognize it on our TVs. Like, I'm sure Beane is doing his due diligence and seeing if there's trade candidates etc, he's shown he has done this in past trades. I'd probably believe you more if our D line play wasn't so painfully obvious bad. 

 

Edit: Just in case I wasn't clear enough: I'd believe you more that you have sources if your trade talks weren't so convenient. As I'm sure most people on this board can speculate that Beane is on the phones about D lineman, at this point. 

Edited October 26, 2020 by delirious

[DDCC]

16 hours ago, Real McNasty said:

Are you the new Dunkirk Don?

I heard of him

[MJS]

18 hours ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

Hard to put any stock in to the defense today.  Miami shut them out last week.  The Jets are absolutely horrendous 

But they also didn't have Darnold. Say what you like about Darnold, but he has the ability to make some wow throws. He is also infinitely more mobile than Flacco.

 

But yeah, the Jets do suck.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

10 minutes ago, DDCC said:

It is wifey being reported the bills are in serious conversation to improve their defense.  A lot is predicated on the cost but Beane is very aggressive and is being pushed by McDermott to make a move.  He doesn’t want to be one and done in the playoffs again

 

I know it's probably autocorrect, but LOL on the "wifey"

 

I agree it's widely speculated that Beane should be making a move, but I think all signs point to dumping a defensive tackle.  We're rolling with 10 DL currently.

We need to reactivate Feliciano and we probably want to keep Dane Jackson on the roster now.  Someone's got to go.

[DDCC]

9 minutes ago, delirious said:

 

The Bills org has been tight lipped since it seems the Beane administration has taken place.  Why, all of a sudden, is there loose lips?

 

I guess I just find this way too convenient considering the D line play has been so bad, us peons can recognize it on our TVs. Like, I'm sure Beane is doing his due diligence and seeing if there's trade candidates etc, he's shown he has done this in past trades. I'd probably believe you more if our D line play wasn't so painfully obvious bad. 

 

Edit: Just in case I wasn't clear enough: I'd believe you more that you have sources if your trade talks weren't so convenient. As I'm sure most people on this board can speculate that Beane is on the phones about D lineman, at this point. 

Check my record 

[BillsFan4]

17 hours ago, NewEra said:

While I don’t think our defense is “fixed”, we did look like an entirely different defense in the 2nd half.  
 

did McD take over play calling?  Sure looked like it to me.  There’s been very few times, this season, where I’ve seen us like up 7-8 guys at the LOS to disguise our pass rush/blitz packages.  I think I saw it more times today than I had all season combined.  

I was wondering the same thing myself. Does anyone know if he did?
 

Seems like it happens once every season. The defense sucks for a couple/few games, McD takes over play calling for a 1/2 and the defense gets their **** together again.

Wondering if that’s what happened again.

[DDCC]

4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I know it's probably autocorrect, but LOL on the "wifey"

 

I agree it's widely speculated that Beane should be making a move, but I think all signs point to dumping a defensive tackle.  We're rolling with 10 DL currently.

We need to reactivate Feliciano and we probably want to keep Dane Jackson on the roster now.  Someone's got to go.

I am very confident things are happening behind the scene 

[Rocbillsfan1]

Not sure if it was mentioned but they were playing the jets .... and they were able to blitz which most likely wouldn’t have looked good against the titans or chiefs. 

[Putin]

17 hours ago, OldTimer1960 said:

I would not get too excited about holding Jets to 10.

I bet at that age a hot chicken soup with a warm blanket on a lazy boy is something to get excited about !!! 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

20 minutes ago, DDCC said:

Check my record 

 

OK I did (all from 'any member can access' stuff)

You joined September 28 (public profile).  Your 41 post "record" says "no to Dareus", our D is not elite, Allen is great, Falcons are horrible, Cody Ford is a bust, Dane Jackson is not a starter based upon 1 INT, Tre White is overpaid and overhyped, Moss is a Dud, Knox has potential to be out of football soon, and (16 hrs ago) Daboll is on the hot seat and this will be his last year with the Bills because "him and McDermott" (sic) don't get along at all.

 

There's nothing in that "record" that Sara Q Fan couldn't have said. 

We all can see that the Bills DL and run game have both greatly underperformed expectations.  It doesn't take insider insight to deduce that Beane is probably looking very hard to make one or more trade moves before the deadline (whether to shore up the injury plagued roster or to improve the team long-term).

 

If you were a Bills employee or close to one, you come across as highly negative and disgruntled (except about Josh Allen): not a guy I would want with access to confidential team information.

 

31 minutes ago, DDCC said:

Yes

 

Your cred would improve if you would provide a source rather than just posting this twice.

[Billsfan1972]

The Jets scored 28 points vs. the Broncos (though aided by 3 Ints).  Offense has generated 320, 277, 254, 260, 285, 263 & 219 yards (268 avg) in 5 blowout losses and two games withing 9 points.

 

I'd be careful to announce they got their "mojo" back....

Edited October 27, 2020 by Billsfan1972