Free Agency News and Updates - around the league

[BritBill]

12 hours ago, NewEra said:

stats doesn’t make a player better than another 

No, but they play a part. 

[Cripple Creek]

On 4/3/2020 at 7:31 AM, thebandit27 said:

What? No! Why would they want a guy that everyone on this board knows is terrible? 

Why you're willing to fight to the death for this turd is beyond me.

[NewEra]

2 hours ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

ORLY. I'll remember that for future Josh Allen threads.

 
i’d hope that you would ?

[MrEpsYtown]

16 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Well Williams certainly isn't. 

Remember when everyone wanted to sign him here last offseason and give him stupid money? That was fun. 

[Cruiserplayer]

Kevin Johnson signs for one year 3.5 mill with the Browns.

[Codyny13]

1 minute ago, Cruiserplayer said:

Kevin Johnson signs for one year 3.5 mill with the Browns.

that Happened awhile ago no? 6 mil with incentives or something?

[Cruiserplayer]

7 minutes ago, Codyny13 said:

that Happened awhile ago no? 6 mil with incentives or something?

Your right. I missed that. It was made official today.

[thebandit27]

1 hour ago, Cripple Creek said:

Why you're willing to fight to the death for this turd is beyond me.

I tend to push back against extremism on players.

 

I have no issue with the opinion that he didn’t live up to #4 overall pick status. The idea that he sucks and isn’t any more than a WR3 is silly and indefensible.

[Cripple Creek]

59 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

I tend to push back against extremism on players.

 

I have no issue with the opinion that he didn’t live up to #4 overall pick status. The idea that he sucks and isn’t any more than a WR3 is silly and indefensible.

Suckitude is a relative value.  Based on where he was picked, he sucks.  The fault of where he was drafted isn't his.  Much of what has transpired since, is his fault.  He took a prove it deal for a reason as he has much to prove.  Does he have value? Yes.  Is his value as over inflated as it was?  Not any longer.  Maybe a one year deal will light his fire.  Time will tell.  

[MiltonWaddams]

33 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

Suckitude is a relative value.  Based on where he was picked, he sucks.  The fault of where he was drafted isn't his.  Much of what has transpired since, is his fault.  He took a prove it deal for a reason as he has much to prove.  Does he have value? Yes.  Is his value as over inflated as it was?  Not any longer.  Maybe a one year deal will light his fire.  Time will tell.  

I am willing to take a $9million prove it deal. I actually do suck, so maybe I will take less. Guys who actually need to prove it are taking $1-2.5million deals. Sammy does not suck. Draft positioning plays no bearing on a players on-field value. Is he a top 5 WR as we had expected/hoped for? Nope. Is he a top end WR2? Absolutely.

[Cripple Creek]

2 hours ago, MiltonWaddams said:

Draft positioning plays no bearing on a players on-field value.

Then how do we determine a GM's worth? 

[MrSarcasm]

55 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

Then how do we determine a GM's worth? 

Valid point. Which GM is better- the one who hits on rounds 4-7 and gets all starters out of them but misses on rounds 1-3 or the GM that hits on rounds 1-3 but 4-7 bust out?

[Cripple Creek]

31 minutes ago, MrSarcasm said:

Valid point. Which GM is better- the one who hits on rounds 4-7 and gets all starters out of them but misses on rounds 1-3 or the GM that hits on rounds 1-3 but 4-7 bust out?

Hit on 1-3 > hitting on 4-7.  I know it's just a piece of the puzzle, but Whaley's inability to draft a solid QB and then risking much on a WR when he had no viable QB aren't helping him find a job.

 

1-3 is money, 4-7 is gravy.  

 

[MrSarcasm]

3 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

Hit on 1-3 > hitting on 4-7.  I know it's just a piece of the puzzle, but Whaley's inability to draft a solid QB and then risking much on a WR when he had no viable QB aren't helping him find a job.

 

1-3 is money, 4-7 is gravy.  

 

I get it, but, if you get 4 viable starters (4-7) or 3 starters (1-3) wouldn't it be safe to say the GM that hit on 4-7 did better, 4>3?

 

On the flip side isn't the GM that hits on the expensive picks,1-3, better? I'M SO CONFUSED!

[Orlando Tim]

8 hours ago, Cripple Creek said:

Suckitude is a relative value.  Based on where he was picked, he sucks.  The fault of where he was drafted isn't his.  Much of what has transpired since, is his fault.  He took a prove it deal for a reason as he has much to prove.  Does he have value? Yes.  Is his value as over inflated as it was?  Not any longer.  Maybe a one year deal will light his fire.  Time will tell.  

Are you trying to say that a $9 million guaranteed contract is a " prove it" contract? He is still being paid well and btw he is on a team that a small chance at super bowl next year. Is this what you say about all the guys who take below market to go to the Pat's*?

[MiltonWaddams]

6 hours ago, Cripple Creek said:

Then how do we determine a GM's worth? 

I’m pretty certain that the topic was based on the quality of player and you described Sammy as sucking. If you are diverting attention from that, you failed. Judging a player by a GM’s failure is a ridiculous concept. If a crap parent raises a good kid, we don’t consider that kid as crap. The same thing applies to the GM

[John from Riverside]

6 hours ago, Cripple Creek said:

Hit on 1-3 > hitting on 4-7.  I know it's just a piece of the puzzle, but Whaley's inability to draft a solid QB and then risking much on a WR when he had no viable QB aren't helping him find a job.

 

1-3 is money, 4-7 is gravy.  

 

Of course hitting on 1 through 3 is wanted.

Just want to point out that when you hit on those late round picks you are getting players on EXTREMELY cap friendly contracts.....for a number of years.

 

Lets say for instance that Darryl Johnson and Tommy Sweeney end up being solid contributers to the team (they both showed flashes) they are basically working for peanuts

[Cripple Creek]

6 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

Of course hitting on 1 through 3 is wanted.

Just want to point out that when you hit on those late round picks you are getting players on EXTREMELY cap friendly contracts.....for a number of years.

 

Lets say for instance that Darryl Johnson and Tommy Sweeney end up being solid contributers to the team (they both showed flashes) they are basically working for peanuts

True, but the question was about judging a GM.  If Allen, Edmunds, Harry, Oliver, Ford, Singletary, Knox all bust do you think anyone will be saying "but, Beane HAS done a great job, look at Johnson and Sweeney!?"

[Cripple Creek]

9 hours ago, MiltonWaddams said:

I’m pretty certain that the topic was based on the quality of player and you described Sammy as sucking. If you are diverting attention from that, you failed. Judging a player by a GM’s failure is a ridiculous concept. If a crap parent raises a good kid, we don’t consider that kid as crap. The same thing applies to the GM

So, players shouldn't be judged based on their draft position and GMs shouldn't be judged based on their drafts.  Participation trophies for all.  Wonderful.

 

Watkins was drafted #4.  He has not come close to living up to that potential and based on draft position, he sucks.

Whaley moved up to draft him even though he didn't have a QB to get him the ball, he sucks.

[YattaOkasan]

42 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

So, players shouldn't be judged based on their draft position and GMs shouldn't be judged based on their drafts.  Participation trophies for all.  Wonderful.

 

Watkins was drafted #4.  He has not come close to living up to that potential and based on draft position, he sucks.

Whaley moved up to draft him even though he didn't have a QB to get him the ball, he sucks.

You mean he sucks relative to his draft position?  Clearly he doesn’t suck if he’s getting 9 mil as @thebandit27 said. 

[Cripple Creek]

53 minutes ago, YattaOkasan said:

You mean he sucks relative to his draft position?  Clearly he doesn’t suck if he’s getting 9 mil as @thebandit27 said. 

Yes.  Where he was drafted cannot be ignored. (IMO)

[YattaOkasan]

3 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

Yes.  Where he was drafted cannot be ignored. (IMO)

So Sammy sucks?  Then Milano should be HoF because he was drafted in the 5th round?

 

I agree with your thoughts about the GM and the draft. But when I evaluate players in the league I don’t care where they were drafted.  
 

Your logic would have had us not make the Hughes trade (a 1st rounder not playing well) for Sheppard (a meh middle round pick).  You have to evaluate the player without mind of where he was drafted. 
 

and yes you evaluate the GM based on where they picked the player. 

[Cripple Creek]

Just now, YattaOkasan said:

So Sammy sucks?  Then Milano should be HoF because he was drafted in the 5th round?

 

I agree with your thoughts about the GM and the draft. But when I evaluate players in the league I don’t care where they were drafted.  
 

Your logic would have had us not make the Hughes trade (a 1st rounder not playing well) for Sheppard (a meh middle round pick).  You have to evaluate the player without mind of where he was drafted. 
 

and yes you evaluate the GM based on where they picked the player. 

Matt Milano has outperformed his draft position, he is not a bust and is a very pleasant surprise.

Sammy has not outperformed his draft position by a very wide margin.  That makes him a draft bust.

[YattaOkasan]

3 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

Matt Milano has outperformed his draft position, he is not a bust and is a very pleasant surprise.

Sammy has not outperformed his draft position by a very wide margin.  That makes him a draft bust.

Gotcha. I agree with him being a bust. But wouldn’t say he sucks. Thanks. 

[JaCrispy]

3 hours ago, Cripple Creek said:

Matt Milano has outperformed his draft position, he is not a bust and is a very pleasant surprise.

Sammy has not outperformed his draft position by a very wide margin.  That makes him a draft bust.

I don’t view that definition as a “bust”...to me a “bust” is when a player drafted fairly high doesn’t even manage to become a serviceable player- likely resulting in being cut, or out of the league in short order (ie Jamarcus Russel, EJ Manuel, Jonny Manzeil, JP Losman)....Sammy is not a bust imho, but rather a mediocre player...

Edited April 5, 2020 by JaCrispy

[Formerly Allan in MD]

No matter his draft position, Sammy's career would have taken a very different trajectory if he had started his career with a quarterback who could get him the ball.  Also, injuries were a problem early on.  He's a very good receiver, attitude problems and career path aside.

[Cripple Creek]

2 hours ago, JaCrispy said:

I don’t view that definition as a “bust”...to me a “bust” is when a player drafted fairly high doesn’t even manage to become a serviceable player- likely resulting in being cut, or out of the league in short order (ie Jamarcus Russel, EJ Manuel, Jonny Manzeil, JP Losman)....Sammy is not a bust imho, but rather a mediocre player...

To each his own.  Based on his draft position he is, to me.

[PIZ]

Is there any news on OT LaAdrian Waddle? I’d like to sign him for depth and competition if he is healthy. 

[ColoradoBills]

28 minutes ago, PIZ said:

Is there any news on OT LaAdrian Waddle? I’d like to sign him for depth and competition if he is healthy. 

 

Nothing that I have seen.  I did read an article somewhat back that a torn quad is hard for OL players to recover from.

Probably won't get any looks until he can visit teams and get checked/worked out.

[GG]

36 minutes ago, PIZ said:

Is there any news on OT LaAdrian Waddle? I’d like to sign him for depth and competition if he is healthy. 

 

I'm guessing that with the Williams signing, Waddle is a longshot.

[Jerboski]

On 3/15/2020 at 12:22 PM, WMDman said:

per nfl network. terms still unknown 

 

On 3/15/2020 at 2:24 PM, astb41 said:

what time does the legal tampering period begin?

Would like to know as well

Did Jason Peters  or everson Griffith sign yet?

[ytownblofan]

44 minutes ago, GG said:

 

I'm guessing that with the Williams signing, Waddle is a longshot.

Yeah, at this point, I would guess Waddle is on their shortlist if an injury occurs during TC or during the season if he isn't picked up elsewhere 

[MiltonWaddams]

3 hours ago, Jerboski said:

 

Would like to know as well

Did Jason Peters  or everson Griffith sign yet?

Neither have.

[Richard Noggin]

13 hours ago, Cripple Creek said:

So, players shouldn't be judged based on their draft position and GMs shouldn't be judged based on their drafts.  Participation trophies for all.  Wonderful.

 

Watkins was drafted #4.  He has not come close to living up to that potential and based on draft position, he sucks.

Whaley moved up to draft him even though he didn't have a QB to get him the ball, he sucks.

A player can only be judged upon his play. The player has no say in where he is drafted. 

 

The general manager who drafts the player, however, SHOULD be judged based upon draft value relative to performance. 

 

Think critically.

[Formerly Allan in MD]

4 hours ago, GG said:

 

I'm guessing that with the Williams signing, Waddle is a longshot.

Could be the impact of Waddle's injury is still evident.

[Watkins101]

8 hours ago, Formerly Allan in MD said:

Could be the impact of Waddle's injury is still evident.

Or it's possible teams don't know, and are waiting for a physical first.

[YoloinOhio]

8 hours ago, Formerly Allan in MD said:

Could be the impact of Waddle's injury is still evident.

Or they just don’t know enough yet because they can’t examine him with their own doctors. A lot of these fringe guys coming off injury are going to be late signings with the current restrictions 

[Cripple Creek]

9 hours ago, Richard Noggin said:

A player can only be judged upon his play. The player has no say in where he is drafted. 

 

The general manager who drafts the player, however, SHOULD be judged based upon draft value relative to performance. 

 

Think critically.

So, Watkins has maxed out his god given abilities.  Got it.

[Richard Noggin]

3 hours ago, Cripple Creek said:

So, Watkins has maxed out his god given abilities.  Got it.

I really don't understand what you're getting at.

 

I don't think Watkins has ever realized his full potential at the NFL level. That's a fair criticism. 

[Cripple Creek]

7 minutes ago, Richard Noggin said:

I really don't understand what you're getting at.

 

I don't think Watkins has ever realized his full potential at the NFL level. That's a fair criticism. 

In my opinion, by a wide margin. Bust.