McD's weekly presser: Huddling not planned on final drive

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

There was plenty of clock left. The huddle didn’t hurt them as much as leaving Hausch with that long kick. 

[fansince88]

47 minutes ago, SlimShady'sGhost said:

asshat Daboll throws Josh under the bus. 
er

 

Thanks!

[WideNine]

49 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

That's not what he's saying at all. He's defending him for not throwing to Beasley because it was cover zero and he had to make a decision instantly.

 

There are some things I am starting to question around Daboll's game-day coaching, and whether he is a better X's an O's guy than hands-on coach, but he was protecting Allen there - anything else folks try to pull out of that comment is a reach.

[london_bills]

The clock is ticking after that shitshow drive. I DO like allen and want him to succeed..but I might want him to start being p*ssed off with drives like that. Get angry. Someone has to be. 

5 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

There are some things I am starting to question around Daboll's game-day coaching, and whether he is a better X's an O's guy than hands-on coach, but he was protecting Allen there - anything else folks try to pull out of that comment is a reach.

I read it as backing allen

 

Also, Spend SOME f**'*ING time on OFFENCE McDermott. ?

Edited November 11, 2019 by london_bills

[Mark92]

Pretty sure Dabol has been trying to stop " Bad Josh " from showing up.  You know, the guy who trys to make a play out of nothing and throws picks.  But at the same time "Good Josh " plays the same way.  It's a fine line and I think the bills need to let the reigns off of him a lot more.

[london_bills]

45 minutes ago, row_33 said:

we were used to EJ and Tyrod letting vital seconds dribble away as the sidelines tried to figure out the next play

 

don't worry guys, only 70 seconds left down 2 scores....

 

so what is new now?

 

Tyrod and EJ had no Presence on the field. I'm starting to feel that way about Allen now. Minnesota he had presence. 

[row_33]

Just now, london_bills said:

Tyrod and EJ had no Presence on the field. I'm starting to feel that way about Allen now. Minnesota he had presence. 

 

give him some more time, this isn't JP Losman 2.0

 

just yet....

 

it can't be...

 

[whatdrought]

That makes it sound like Daboll called for the huddle and McD didn’t like that.

 

either way, a stupid situation that looked bad all around.

[london_bills]

Just now, row_33 said:

 

give him some more time, this isn't JP Losman 2.0

 

just yet....

 

it can't be...

 

It may be man. It just may be. Without the deep ball. 

[whatdrought]

2 minutes ago, Mark92 said:

Pretty sure Dabol has been trying to stop " Bad Josh " from showing up.  You know, the guy who trys to make a play out of nothing and throws picks.  But at the same time "Good Josh " plays the same way.  It's a fine line and I think the bills need to let the reigns off of him a lot more.

 

Yup. The problem is that training wheels josh is the worst version of josh. I’ll take the interceptions over conservative bs. Let him grow and learn. Don’t clip his wings. 

[row_33]

Just now, london_bills said:

It may be man. It just may be. Without the deep ball. 

 

not like we have a choice with this team but to sit there and gladly take the maximum punishment dished out to loyal fans 

 

 

[Mc1320]

Trust the Mediocrity

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, Reed83HOF said:

wants to see points scored every time we have the ball, whether TDs or FGS,  wants to be a a big physical team.

 

 

 

still believes in Josh, way too many penalties, pre-snap penalties are inexcusable

 

Full video is up
 

 

 

If you have trouble with the twitter link as I do, try this: https://www.facebook.com/BuffaloBills/videos/1132793540444888/

The main takeaways I got was that the huddle/loss of time before 3rd down call and fieldgoal were a mistake, that he is still committed to Josh at this point and certainly not assigning all the blame to Josh.  He is committed to Daboll but is displeased with some of the playcalling and starting to mix it in with playcalling on offense.  The biggest kind of finger-pointy things he said were on the OL and DL not controlling the line of scrimmage for the run game on their respective sides and towards Lee Smith for penalties.

 

More details on the tweets above and additional stuff:

-His review of the tape showed a need for "a higher level of execution on all three phases"

-Said we didn't dominate the run game on either side of the ball and we didn't get takeaways on defense (no shout-out to ST for not collecting the muffed punt)

-Said the plan after the Singletary run with almost a minute left was not to huddle, it was to go to the line and get the play off and then call the time out.  Later asked some more about it and said "we had to huddle" it was "operation" and they'd look at that again going forward.

-He was specifically asked about the 3rd and 4 incomplete pass to John Brown, and whether it was the right play, whether that was the designed play call or a check by Josh.  He ducked the question. Kind of made a face and said "without getting into too much strategy, we had a play call right there, and we didn't execute".  That's a Non Answer, and it's All the answer we get. 

-Asked about the decision to kick the field goal when Haushka has said it's the limit of his range, said he knew where we were and there weren't a lot of options and "we've got a lot of confidence in Steven" and "we'll remain confident in him going forward"  I think that's described as "Belching Out Glurge." 

-Ok, he did expand on his thinking a bit, that he feels if you go for it on 4th and don't make it, you don't give your players a chance to win the game, but if you go for the field goal at least you give your players a chance to win the game.  This does NOT make sense to me, but at least he kind of answered.

-(John Wawrow I think) converted a statement to a question and asked "This offense doesn't seem to have an identity, is that a fair assessment?" and specifically "are you a running offense? are you a passing offense?"  McDermott said he wants to move the ball and score points.  Well, now, that clears everyone up.

-Someone asked about Josh Allen's statement that he didn't really know why his deep balls aren't getting there and thought it might be unconscious concern about throwing INTs.  Asked about how to deal with that, McDermott said "it's execution, we detail our work during the week and then we build the rep count"    He gave a specific example, though, of a blocking problem where one of our players knocked into another and there was pressure up the middle during the throw to McKensie, and that sometimes it's "6 inches, 6 inches is the difference between a big play and an incompletion".  So his example made it very clear that he is NOT putting it all on Josh.

-Reinforced that theme when he was asked if it was frustrating that you drafted Josh for his big arm and he's not executing.  Said "Listen, I remain confident in Josh" and gave the example of what he's been able to improve with short to intermediate throws, said he understood her point that we need to be able to go down the field with the deep balls and that's where execution comes in.

-He specifically said that "we have to do a better job of getting it into our playmaker's hands, in this case Devin, and remaining consistent with that" so evidently, Not Pleased with 8 carries for Devin

-He was asked about going for it on 4th in two previous attempts vs. the final play and what was the difference, he said "different amounts of time on the clock, situational football" ?

-Said he had talked to Brian Daboll after the game and today about the play calling on 3rd and 4th down and some of them he "felt the ball was going to the right spot" and some he felt it wasn't so "he and I talked about that today"

-Someone pointed out Lee Smith has 9 penalties and is on the field 30% of the time, why is that continuing to happen?  McDermott said "he's got to be locked in" and that "presnap penalties are non negotiable" and they're part of what's killing our drives.  But he didn't really address the question of how to fix it, and of course a good number of Smith's penalties are for holding post-snap.

-Said he's always confident in his staff and in the players in the locker room (?Did he say that in 2017 a few games before he relieved Dennison?)

 

Overall, I thought our press did a pretty good job of asking tough but fair questions and holding Sean's feet to the fire, but he didn't reveal much under torture.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Seven-N-Nine said:

His pressers are about as useless as his game day decision making.

 

I wouldn't go that far.  You can get a few bits of info out of it.

[london_bills]

 

4 minutes ago, row_33 said:

 

not like we have a choice with this team but to sit there and gladly take the maximum punishment dished out to loyal fans 

 

 

Based on this moment -

 

It's all fine as long as we draft another QB somewhere. Cannot lock ourselves in as a franchise if it becomes more clear Allen may not pan out. 

Edited November 11, 2019 by london_bills

[Jammer8732]

You do realize that if we won, they would be debating the greatest goal line stand in NFL history...don’t you?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, SlimShady'sGhost said:

asshat Daboll throws Josh under the bus. 
er

 

 

No, not at all.  He's saying that Josh had to make a split second decision to throw to Brown and didn't have time to make a read and see that Beasley was open.

[row_33]

4 minutes ago, london_bills said:

 

Based on this moment -

 

It's all fine as long as we draft another QB somewhere. Cannot lock ourselves in as a franchise if it becomes more clear Allen may not pan out. 

 

be patient, it's torturing me to have to say this

 

we knew a lot sooner about JP... 

 

 

2 minutes ago, Jammer8732 said:

You do realize that if we won, they would be debating the greatest goal line stand in NFL history...don’t you?

 

nah, real teams have provided much better ones

 

the end to the Titans/Rams SB was the most important, ended at the 1/2 yard line

 

 

[london_bills]

Regarding the last drive. 

 

In his presser Mcd says it wasn't the plan to huddle and said it starts with him to put the team in a better position to win. 

 

Could McDermott have been the one who got involved and wanted the play to go to the area where they would kick the FG? 

 

He said they wanted to kick to tie so I ask the question did he get them to huddle and realise that was wrong and make himself accountable inside close doors? 

 

Might be overthinking it sure but he's so Conservative and may have been afraid of a turnover. 

5 minutes ago, Jammer8732 said:

You do realize that if we won, they would be debating the greatest goal line stand in NFL history...don’t you?

Defence was outstanding. Not perfect(last drive) but held them to 19 which is good. No way I rag on the D. 

Edited November 11, 2019 by london_bills

[YoloinOhio]

14 minutes ago, whatdrought said:

That makes it sound like Daboll called for the huddle and McD didn’t like that.

 

either way, a stupid situation that looked bad all around.

Neither one planned for the huddle. Daboll ended up calling it to get the right play. I’m sure both wish it hadn’t occurred. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

14 minutes ago, Mark92 said:

Pretty sure Dabol has been trying to stop " Bad Josh " from showing up.  You know, the guy who trys to make a play out of nothing and throws picks.  But at the same time "Good Josh " plays the same way.  It's a fine line and I think the bills need to let the reigns off of him a lot more.

 

I don't think that's it exactly.  Let me try an analogy.

 

There are different approaches to honing a skill.  One approach is to let someone go their own way - a musician learning a piece of music say, and making mistakes while the thinking brain is still involved and the notes aren't yet going from the eyes to the fingers with no conscious thought.  Then you point out the mistakes and have them play it again, and hope that the mistakes disappear over time.  Except the problem is, the mistakes are getting engrained by repetition along with the correct playing.

 

Another approach is to insist that the musician practice correctly until they get the fundamentals right - slowing down and hesitating if necessary to avoid making mistakes in a challenging section.  Tell them to avoid making mistakes - "playing it into your fingers".  Then over time, the playing will become automatic and correct, and be able to speed up.  But in the learning process, the playing may seem forced and awkward at times.

 

Daboll and Dorsey are insisting on the latter approach with Josh.  There's actually a bunch of psychological studies that says it's the approach that will work more quickly to produce mistake-free playing.  A number of other QBs had the former approach taken with them, and it's a mixed bag how well it worked.

 

I don't know if what Daboll and Dorsey are doing with Josh will work.  The question is whether the hesitation and second guessing will get "played into his game psychology" and become habitual, or whether he will be able to speed up and play freely while still avoiding mistakes.  Time will tell, I can't.

[blacklabel]

I see a lot of comments about them loosening the reins on Allen somewhat. I agree to a point but I think one of the main reasons they want him playing it safe is because they aren't quite at a point where they can routinely overcome a turnover from him. And they don't want to keep putting their defense back on the field after three-and-outs or turnovers, because eventually they'll wear down. And they don't exactly have the kind of offense where they can deal with some bad plays/turnovers yet still dig themselves out of a 14 point hole. 

 

They're not quite there yet. They're still learning and the good thing about learning while being able to win is that it does a lot for their confidence and shows them what it takes to get wins in this league. 

 

I'm not at all a "sky is falling" fan right now. I have questions on Daboll but that's it. Overall, this is the most consistent and organized staff this team has had in who knows how long. It's not perfect, no staff/team is, but they have a collective vision from the top down and they won't deviate from that plan. So far it's working pretty well. Took a team not really shaped by the new staff and went to the playoffs. Had to tear it down and deal with a "growing pains" season in 2018, necessary for long-term success. Now, they're definitely on an upward trajectory but it's a delicate balance to climb as they don't have a lot of margin for error. Another off-season to work on the roster and make any necessary coaching changes and I feel like they'll be in good shape. 

 

I understand the fans that live and die with every game, I do. I just try to keep the big picture in mind and keep it all in perspective. Can't blow things up and have knee-jerk reactions and make changes every single time there's a loss. They're a well-coached, hard working team that'll be eager to get back to it to correct things and go out and try to get back in the W column next week. I think they're on the right track but just need a bit more time and a few more pieces before the "but are they for real?" questions stop  

 

I'd hate to see the comments after a loss during a season where they start 9-0 or something, yikes!

[row_33]

what???

 

someone who had a chance to lose his job didn't come out and PROUDLY take on the masterminding of that abomination to football?

 

[WideNine]

14 minutes ago, whatdrought said:

That makes it sound like Daboll called for the huddle and McD didn’t like that.

 

either way, a stupid situation that looked bad all around.

 

kind of what I got out of it - Daboll wanted to get a play in that needed the huddle to communicate it and McD was saying in that situation with the clock winding down they should not huddle (you think). So the only take away we can have is that it was a case of poor game day coaching and communication.

 

 

[Coach Tuesday]

What the hell does that mean, they weren’t planning to huddle?  Sorry that I’m dense.  Can someone explain to me what that means?  Isn’t he the coach?  Doesn’t he make the plans AND implement them?  What is going on????

[YoloinOhio]

1 minute ago, Coach Tuesday said:

What the hell does that mean, they weren’t planning to huddle?  Sorry that I’m dense.  Can someone explain to me what that means?  Isn’t he the coach?  Doesn’t he make the plans AND implement them?  What is going on????

In the case of “planning to huddle” it was inferred that they may have been intentionally taking time off of the clock to try and just play for the FG and tie. That wasn’t the plan. They actually go up to the line ready to run the play and then decide to huddle. Not sure why it was decided to do that but they are saying they wanted make sure they had the right play. 

Edited November 11, 2019 by YoloinOhio

[Luka]

If McDermott wants to win and move the football, it's time to go back to 2018 Josh. Run, pass do whatever the ***** you have to do to win the football game. This watered down version of Josh is no fun to watch. He's not throwing picks, so what? Still lost 2 of the last 3. They've really ruined his confidence. Not sure why you would do that from a coaching perspective. McDermott is pointing out the play calling problems with the long balls on 3rd and short and the lack of Delvin even though he's proven time and time again that if he gets the football enough, special things can happen.

 

Take the training wheels off of Josh and for god's sake, over ride your idiot OC when you feel the need to. Don't just let it happen and talk about it afterwards.

[GimmeSomeProcess]

1 hour ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 

I didn't take it as Wayne saying McD is fired after this year.  McD shouldn't get to pick the next OC, which I would agree with.

Why? Harbough has gone through like 5 oc’s before landing Roman, who fits the qb perfectly. 

[Buffalo Junction]

9 minutes ago, GimmeSomeProcess said:

Why? Harbough has gone through like 5 oc’s before landing Roman, who fits the qb perfectly. 

They already had Roman in a lesser capacity. It may have factored in to drafting Jackson. No way to know for sure. 

[Beast]

1 hour ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 

I didn't take it as Wayne saying McD is fired after this year.  McD shouldn't get to pick the next OC, which I would agree with.

No.

 

The Heat Coach picks his staff. That’s the way it is and should be.

[Rock-A-Bye Beasley]

2 hours ago, thenorthremembers said:

Better get ready for him to choose number 3, because he and Beane will get their entire contract here.  I am sure of it. 

 

Good for you

2 hours ago, Binghamton Beast said:

If you think McDermott is getting fired you truly are clueless.

He will be fired eventually. They might waste another year or two unfortunately.

Edited November 12, 2019 by Chemical

[wvbillsfan]

2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

 

Beasley being open is a split second decision. 
crock of crap

its a pre snap read. Off coverage on the left vs tight coverage on the right. 
 

He looked right the entire time vs a cover 0 blitz. 

[HOUSE]

 

That'a boy McD.....

 

 

Edited November 12, 2019 by HOUSE

[wagon127]

It doesnt matter if Daboll gets fired, Mcdermott is still going to hire somebody with the same style. You might get someone with a better 2 minute game plan, but Dabolls bigger problem is with the first 58 minutes of the game. The last 1 minute of the game was just the icing on the cake.

[Happy]

27 minutes ago, GimmeSomeProcess said:

Why? Harbough has gone through like 5 oc’s before landing Roman, who fits the qb perfectly. 

 

Why?!  John Harbaugh is in his 11th season as HC, has been to the AFCC 3x in that period, and won a SB.  I'm gonna give Harbaugh the benefit of the doubt in OC selections.  Harbaugh IS the reason why the Roman/Lamar Jackson pairing is working out.  How did Roman do with TT?  NoMoreProcess.

[Mr. WEO]

"We've got to score more points to enable ourselves to win games -- and to be a stretch down the threat, that's what we've got to do. I want to move the ball and score points."

 

You see....this is why none of us could be the Bills HC.  We simply aren't wired to think this way, no more than we could describe how to split the atom. 

Edited November 12, 2019 by Mr. WEO

[Happy]

18 minutes ago, Binghamton Beast said:

No.

 

The Heat Coach picks his staff. That’s the way it is and should be.

 

That is the way it typically works.  Do you really want McD to pick a 3rd OC? 

[Cripple Creek]

Buffalo media are such a bunch of cupcakes.

 

McDermott says little about getting Singletary the ball.  Then follow up and ask him why Singletary got single digit carries against the 30th ranked rush defense in the league.

 

Daboll: 8 in the box dictated.  What about a follow up?  Have they had 8 in the box against other teams?  Is it possible in football to take what you want, or do you always have to take what the defense gives you?

 

Ask some tough questions fergodssake.

[LABILLBACKER]

If Josh is so stupid to be sauntering back to a huddle with under 50 seconds and 1 TO, then forget about coaching. This kid might be as dumb as a bag of nails.  I've watched Buffalo Bills games for over 50 years and I've never seen what I saw yesterday with that huddle. I was angry and embarrassed all at the same time.

[fansince88]

59 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

No, not at all.  He's saying that Josh had to make a split second decision to throw to Brown and didn't have time to make a read and see that Beasley was open.

You are seing it that way? Guess it is tough to see via the tweet. Seems more of a he needs to make split second decisions when asked if he didnt throw it to the open man. Just after that being the go to play.  I could be wong but seemed like he was blaming Allen not seeing  the field well

[Da webster guy]

3 hours ago, Wayne Arnold said:

The offense is such a cluster f___. Unfortunately I don't ever see it getting better under McDermott. He has no idea what a good offensive coordinator looks like. 0 for 2. You don't get a third choice.

 

Remember when Rex fired Roman after we lost because the defense gave up like 40 points so the blowhard figured he'd fire the OC.

 

Roman winning coordinator of the year running that Baltimore O.  That same mix of zone reads, misdirection and power-based pulls run out of a million different formations.

It's not just Lamar Jackson making that thing go, it's an experienced OC with full reign of all the calls, gameplanning the way he wants.   

 

I don't know enough about pro football or Daboll to slam the guy, but being an OC for Tom Brady means about as much to me as Adam Gase coaching Peyton Manning for a year or two.  It's a joke of a job and you're there to stay out of the way.