Hebert19 Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 Personally I dont see our front 4 do enough in the pass rush but I just read this and maybe the lack of sacks isn't the only story. They must be getting consistent pressure. Buffalo Bills at Cleveland Browns (-3) Pick: Buffalo Bills +3 Buffalo's pass rush should be the difference here. According to Pro Football Focus, Buffalo has the fifth-best pass rushing unit of 2019 and Cleveland sports the 20th best pass-blocking unit. Browns quarterback Baker Mayfield, meanwhile, sees his passer rating drop from 83.0 in a clean pocket to 40.8 when facing pass pressure this year. For comparison, a player will get a 39.6 passer rating for throwing the ball into the dirt. The favored Browns, in general, are a hot mess, while the Bills are 6-2. Who knew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koko78 Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 They may not get a ton of sacks, but the D-Line regularly generates a lot of disruption and pressure. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BfloBillsFan Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 I thought for the first 3 games the pressure was noticeable. They also knocked down a lot of passes at the Line of scrimmage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CEN-CAL17 Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 The Bills don’t really get after the QB as much as they collapse the pocket... there’s never a DE flying off the edge and forcing the QB out the pocket. It’s always the pocket collapses and the QB is swamped by his Oline. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 (edited) The Bills generate enough pressure to make the QB uncomfortable enough to drop his eyes, move out of the pocket or throw it before he wants to many times...they might not get sacks but they are affecting throws. Edited November 10, 2019 by matter2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chill Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 (edited) Yes it’s a problem. Pass rush has a direct correlation with interceptions. Our picks are way down... Edited November 10, 2019 by Chill 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 Whatever metric or analysis they are using to claim the Bills have 5th best pass rush is severely flawed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 Wow, that ranking by PFF seems very high. I obviously don’t see every other NFL game, but I’d have guessed the Bills would be in the bottom half of the league somewhere. They don’t get a ton of pressure or sacks, and not many takeaways as a direct result. I’m surprised at their analysis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Ethan in Portland said: Whatever metric or analysis they are using to claim the Bills have 5th best pass rush is severely flawed. Hmm...i dunno... How many throw aways do opposing QBs have against us where they are chased out of the pocket with a Bills defender trailing them? Seems like it happens fairly frequently. Edited November 10, 2019 by matter2003 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 16 minutes ago, Ethan in Portland said: Whatever metric or analysis they are using to claim the Bills have 5th best pass rush is severely flawed. why pass when you can run through them at will 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, row_33 said: why pass when you can run through them at will Hopefully that will be fixed for the Cleveland game. That still leaves the pass rush to improve. I don't necessarily care about sacks, but Mayfield needs to be pressured and he will turn it over, or at least be inaccurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSHMEAB Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 Wonder how much this ranking has to do with the opponents the Bills have played. As someone noted, there's rarely a playmaker flying off the edge or even shooting an interior gap. They collapse the pocket well enough, but that's not the type of pressure that really rattles the top QB's or leads to turnovers, etc. It's a problem. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlayoffsPlease Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 28 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said: Hopefully that will be fixed for the Cleveland game. That still leaves the pass rush to improve. I don't necessarily care about sacks, but Mayfield needs to be pressured and he will turn it over, or at least be inaccurate. whats the plan to stop Chubb? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hebert19 Posted November 10, 2019 Author Share Posted November 10, 2019 46 minutes ago, matter2003 said: Hmm...i dunno... How many throw aways do opposing QBs have against us where they are chased out of the pocket with a Bills defender trailing them? Seems like it happens fairly frequently. This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dkollidas Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 I think the analytics stuff is overstated in sports like Football & Hockey. There’s too many random variables to isolate a lot of what’s happening on any given play. Baseball is so much easier in terms of using analytics, just s simpler game. That being said, while I think they could use another guy on the edge (I’m not a Murphy fan, and Hughes is getting towards the end of his road), they get pressure, but not a ton of sacks. I wonder if that’s partially because we cover so well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 50 minutes ago, PlayoffsPlease said: whats the plan to stop Chubb? The same one that stopped AP in the second half last week? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlayoffsPlease Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 10 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said: The same one that stopped AP in the second half last week? you dont honestly think Chubb and old man peterson are similar talents in 2019 do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 12 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said: The same one that stopped AP in the second half last week? I’m pretty sure their adjustments worked last week (at least in part )due to facing a rookie QB in his first start ; they weren’t too concerned about the passing game. I’d venture they have a plan designed to limit Chubb, but it won’t be the same thing they ran vs WAS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 8 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said: I’m pretty sure their adjustments worked last week (at least in part )due to facing a rookie QB in his first start ; they weren’t too concerned about the passing game. I’d venture they have a plan designed to limit Chubb, but it won’t be the same thing they ran vs WAS. That's a good point. McD didn't fear Haskins' passing threat, but will have to respect Mayfield. Chubb and AP are similar in stature, but Chubb is faster than AP. He'll be a handful who you don't want to get going to full speed. I would guess Oliver will be limited in playing time again in favor of Jordan Phillips, Star, and Taylor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 I don’t believe PFF for a second here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 3 hours ago, Koko78 said: They may not get a ton of sacks, but the D-Line regularly generates a lot of disruption and pressure. They generate a lot of disruption and pressure and also disguise coverage from their base D, nickel, or what Zo said they call "Buffalo" (a heavy nickel) Right now, they're stopping the run by going bigger bodies/less penetration on the DL and playing man. The question is can we stop the run enough out of our base D? 1 hour ago, LSHMEAB said: Wonder how much this ranking has to do with the opponents the Bills have played. As someone noted, there's rarely a playmaker flying off the edge or even shooting an interior gap. They collapse the pocket well enough, but that's not the type of pressure that really rattles the top QB's or leads to turnovers, etc. It's a problem. Tom Brady seemed fairly rattled. 2 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said: Whatever metric or analysis they are using to claim the Bills have 5th best pass rush is severely flawed. 2 hours ago, Boatdrinks said: Wow, that ranking by PFF seems very high. I obviously don’t see every other NFL game, but I’d have guessed the Bills would be in the bottom half of the league somewhere. They don’t get a ton of pressure or sacks, and not many takeaways as a direct result. I’m surprised at their analysis. Yeah, I'd take that with a ton of salt like many PFF ratings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 2 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said: Whatever metric or analysis they are using to claim the Bills have 5th best pass rush is severely flawed. These may help: 3rd in total points allowed 16.4 per game 10th on 3rd down completion at 35% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 24th in QB hits: 21st in sacks: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turk71 Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 58 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said: I’m pretty sure their adjustments worked last week (at least in part )due to facing a rookie QB in his first start ; they weren’t too concerned about the passing game. I’d venture they have a plan designed to limit Chubb, but it won’t be the same thing they ran vs WAS. As much talent as Cleveland has at wr and rb, their passing game is not exactly tearing it up and scaring the ***** out of opponents. I think the Bills should do what is necessary to stop the run like they did in 2nd half of Redskins game. Force Mayfield to get it done through the air without turning it over, I think the Bills secondary and pass rush win that battle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Turk71 said: As much talent as Cleveland has at wr and rb, their passing game is not exactly tearing it up and scaring the ***** out of opponents. I think the Bills should do what is necessary to stop the run like they did in 2nd half of Redskins game. Force Mayfield to get it done through the air without turning it over, I think the Bills secondary and pass rush win that battle. Going through all the weekly podcast, here is what I could summarize: 1. Browns have a helluva Running Back in Nick Chub, who is a very physical runner. However, he is not being utilized in the offense. 2. Browns have two WRs who are on pace for 1200 yards each 3. Their TEs are non-existent 4. Their OL is in shambles even though they extended their center. This has hurt the accuracy issues for Mayfield. 5. Mayfield's targets last year are on the bench...so there is no chemistry at the difficult times. 6, Mayfield is not letting OBJ make plays by throwing it up to him. On Defense: 1. They are missing Greg's aggresiveness 2. They have a NFL Sack leader in Myles Garrett 3. They have two outstanding CBs but their entire DB is quite thin and leaves a lot to be desired with backups 4. Their front seven has been out-manned On past Games: 1. They have been low scoring games, shoot outs, close games (Seattle) and beat up on opponents (Baltimore) 2. Their Coaching Staff is definitely getting Out coached. 3. Freddie Kitchens is over his head when it comes to managing the Football Team The best plan for the Bills to win are: 1. Run the football and score points on every drive. 2. Keep Mayfield and Chubb off the field. Our Run Defense will be torn apart by Chubb like Peterson did in the 1st half. Bills have been weak against North-South backs. 3. Make Mayfield one dimensional and throw the football. Our DBs are up for the task. They may need to play Kevin Johnson more than Levi Wallace. 4. Make plays on Special Teams. This is one game the team has to win by playing as a team. No individual heroics needed other than by Singletary! Edited November 10, 2019 by ganesh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 4 hours ago, PlayoffsPlease said: you dont honestly think Chubb and old man peterson are similar talents in 2019 do you? Nope. He's twice the running back. He'll get twice the 2nd half yardage (14). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 I see the pressure and sacks aren’t everything. Making the QB very uncomfortable which we have done all year is easy to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 (edited) 11 hours ago, Hebert19 said: Personally I dont see our front 4 do enough in the pass rush but I just read this and maybe the lack of sacks isn't the only story. They must be getting consistent pressure. Buffalo Bills at Cleveland Browns (-3) Pick: Buffalo Bills +3 Buffalo's pass rush should be the difference here. According to Pro Football Focus, Buffalo has the fifth-best pass rushing unit of 2019 and Cleveland sports the 20th best pass-blocking unit. Browns quarterback Baker Mayfield, meanwhile, sees his passer rating drop from 83.0 in a clean pocket to 40.8 when facing pass pressure this year. For comparison, a player will get a 39.6 passer rating for throwing the ball into the dirt. The favored Browns, in general, are a hot mess, while the Bills are 6-2. Who knew. Buffalo does not have a pass rush problem. A huge element of the defensive success so far has been pressure that has forced Quarterbacks to get rid of the ball early or bail the pocket and hold it longer. Even against Philly, in the first half Wentz was never throwing in rhythm, we were in his face and disrupting his pocket pretty much every snap. The second half when they started to bludgeon us with the run the Bills defenders had to back off getting up field so fast which demonstrates how with most defenses - but especially McDermott's scheme - one part of the D struggling affects everything else. The people who think we have a pass rush problem are the people looking only at sacks. We have got QBs off their spot and out of rhythm all season long. EDIT: the one thing we lack is a dominant player in that front 4 or even front 7 that the opponents have to specifically game plan for. I still think Ed Oliver has a chance to be that but he isn't it now. Edited November 10, 2019 by GunnerBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSBill Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 5 hours ago, ganesh said: Going through all the weekly podcast, here is what I could summarize: 1. Browns have a helluva Running Back in Nick Chub, who is a very physical runner. However, he is not being utilized in the offense. 2. Browns have two WRs who are on pace for 1200 yards each 3. Their TEs are non-existent 4. Their OL is in shambles even though they extended their center. This has hurt the accuracy issues for Mayfield. 5. Mayfield's targets last year are on the bench...so there is no chemistry at the difficult times. 6, Mayfield is not letting OBJ make plays by throwing it up to him. On Defense: 1. They are missing Greg's aggresiveness 2. They have a NFL Sack leader in Myles Garrett 3. They have two outstanding CBs but their entire DB is quite thin and leaves a lot to be desired with backups 4. Their front seven has been out-manned On past Games: 1. They have been low scoring games, shoot outs, close games (Seattle) and beat up on opponents (Baltimore) 2. Their Coaching Staff is definitely getting Out coached. 3. Freddie Kitchens is over his head when it comes to managing the Football Team The best plan for the Bills to win are: 1. Run the football and score points on every drive. 2. Keep Mayfield and Chubb off the field. Our Run Defense will be torn apart by Chubb like Peterson did in the 1st half. Bills have been weak against North-South backs. 3. Make Mayfield one dimensional and throw the football. Our DBs are up for the task. They may need to play Kevin Johnson more than Levi Wallace. 4. Make plays on Special Teams. This is one game the team has to win by playing as a team. No individual heroics needed other than by Singletary! Good thoughts, and a generally an optimistic perspective on things. Thanks One area I 100% agree with you: They may need to play Kevin Johnson more than Levi Wallace. Yes! Yes! Yes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshAllenHasBigHands Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 Sacks are an overrated stat. There are give or take 80 offensive snaps a game. Great sack teams get 4 to 5 sacks a game. Awesome, but the percentage is so small a sack just doesn’t consistently change the course of a game. A 50% pressure rate, on the other hand, that changes the whole dynamic of the game. Granted, sacks usually indicate a high pressure rate. However, if I had to choose between a relatively high sack rate and a high pass rush rate, I pick the latter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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