McShay now has Oliver to the Jets too

[Virgil]

This is now two major draft gurus (for whatever that titles worth) that has Oliver going at 3. 

 

I think a lot of people are about to get very disappointed around here.  Many were hoping for Oliver to fall, or Williams fall as a consequence. With many viewing Willams as the best overall talent in the draft, it looks more and more like the Bills might be sitting at 9 without a slam dunk prospect.  

 

I’ve been on board with Hock, but worry about the lack of pre-draft visit.  People are on the Metcalf train, but I think he has busy written all over him.  

 

I’m falling more and more into the trade up group 

[Cornette's Commentary]

So, we draft Hockenson at 9 and then have him be an extra offensive lineman, to help stop Oliver?

[Bangarang]

lol McShay mock draft

[Chuck Wagon]

If Murray goes 1 and Oliver goes 3, that means one of Williams or Allen is on the board at 5 and Beane & Licht did the Allen trade last year.

[MAJBobby]

3 minutes ago, Virgil said:

This is now two major draft gurus (for whatever that titles worth) that has Oliver going at 3. 

 

I think a lot of people are about to get very disappointed around here.  Many were hoping for Oliver to fall, or Williams fall as a consequence. With many viewing Willams as the best overall talent in the draft, it looks more and more like the Bills might be sitting at 9 without a slam dunk prospect.  

 

I’ve been on board with Hock, but worry about the lack of pre-draft visit.  People are on the Metcalf train, but I think he has busy written all over him.  

 

I’m falling more and more into the trade up group 

All of them putting a lot of stock in the PULL that many are speculating that Greg Williams will have in NY

Edited April 22, 2019 by MAJBobby

[Virgil]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

All of them putting a lot of stock in the Pull that Greg Williams will have in NY

 

I mean, if you’re drafting a defensive player, don’t you partner with your defensive coordinator?

[Cornette's Commentary]

1 minute ago, Chuck Wagon said:

If Murray goes 1 and Oliver goes 3, that means one of Williams or Allen is on the board at 5 and Beane & Licht did the Allen trade last year.

I don't see Tampa passing on Allen OR Quinnen Williams.  Now that they're moving to a 3-4 defense under Bowles, either player would be a perfect fit for that scheme.

[YoloinOhio]

I love Oliver but would rather the Jets take him than quinnen or Bosa 

[MAJBobby]

2 minutes ago, Virgil said:

 

I mean, if you’re drafting a defensive player, don’t you partner with your defensive coordinator?

Look all I am saying that that people are speculating that Gregg Williams will have the power and the ear to Ownership and GM more so than Adam Gase.

 

So will this be the first power struggle between those two.  And if you are one that believe that about Gregg Williams of course you are going to Mock Gregg Williams player crush to the Jets.

 

 

The SMART defensive pick for the Jets is an EDGE.  They haven't had a legit passrusher in YEARS.  

Edited April 22, 2019 by MAJBobby

[Chuck Wagon]

3 minutes ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

I don't see Tampa passing on Allen OR Quinnen Williams.  Now that they're moving to a 3-4 defense under Bowles, either player would be a perfect fit for that scheme.

 

 

Cool

 

No one saw the Browns taking Ward over Chubb.  But I do enjoy how definitive you are in all your posts.

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

72 hrs.

[Coach Tuesday]

Albert Breer and Peter King agree.  If the draft shakes out like it's looking, the Bills absolutely need to trade back if possible - someone like the Giants, Broncos or Redskins might be willing to come up for a QB.  Staying at 9 to take a tight end or right tackle is pretty much worst case scenario for me.

[Virgil]

2 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Albert Breer and Peter King agree.  If the draft shakes out like it's looking, the Bills absolutely need to trade back if possible - someone like the Giants, Broncos or Redskins might be willing to come up for a QB.  Staying at 9 to take a tight end or right tackle is pretty much worst case scenario for me.

 

I agree. If it had to be one, then I hope it’s Hock. No one seems to be able to clearly say which offensive lineman is the better option, nor do we even know which position we need to fill

[aristocrat]

smokescreenn 

[SWATeam]

I don't see Oliver as a great fit for a 3-4.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

4 minutes ago, SWATeam said:

I don't see Oliver as a great fit for a 3-4.

Gregg Williams runs a 1 gap attack system, no matter the alignment. He'll fit just fine. 

[maryland-bills-fan]

1 hour ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

So, we draft Hockenson at 9 and then have him be an extra offensive lineman, to help stop Oliver?

Uh,  you don't have to draft hockenson in order to have the tight end block.  Actually, a bigger blocking tight end or a retread offensive tackle would be better.   Seems like they have already thought of that.

[MrEpsYtown]

I just don't understand how the Jets can continue to ignore edge players. They have none at all. Unless they feel havoc up the middle and Williams' scheme will cause enough pressure. I'd actually be happy if they passed on Josh Allen. I still think they are trying to coerce a trade up from a team in the 6-12 range who had their heart set on Oliver. 

[TOboy]

If all the top defensive studs are off the board (Williams, Allen, Oliver, Bosa), I'd be in favour of dropping back to the early teens provided you can pick up an extra 2nd. As long as you don't go further back than Washington at 15, you should have a selection of solid OT's, DL (Gary? Ferrell, Wilkins), TE (likely Hock or Fant available), and WR (DK or Hollywood). 

 

[Coach Tuesday]

4 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I just don't understand how the Jets can continue to ignore edge players.

 

They have been doing it for a couple decades.

[John from Riverside]

I just do not want to trade up sorry......the cost is too crazy......

 

There will be a good player at 9

[Reed83HOF]

1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Albert Breer and Peter King agree.  If the draft shakes out like it's looking, the Bills absolutely need to trade back if possible - someone like the Giants, Broncos or Redskins might be willing to come up for a QB.  Staying at 9 to take a tight end or right tackle is pretty much worst case scenario for me.

 

Beane has said on a couple of occasions that if you trade back you might as well trade out of the round. I expect some surprises, and the Jets most certainly want/need to move back. Oliver is being dangled to try to drum up interest. The problem is no trades will happen until ARZ is off the clock. 

6 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

I just do not want to trade up sorry......the cost is too crazy......

 

There will be a good player at 9

9 to 6 is like a 3rd rounder - palatable. 

[Virgil]

8 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

 

9 to 6 is like a 3rd rounder - palatable. 

 

This is the best case scenario.  One of the big three fall due to QB’s or Oliver going early 

[TOboy]

1 hour ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

72 hrs.

 

[wppete]

The more I think about it Ed Oliver prob wont be there at #9 but I am very happy if we go with Christian Wilkins. Especially if we can trade down a couple of spots and still get him while adding an extra 2nd or 3rd. 

[Reed83HOF]

4 minutes ago, Virgil said:

 

This is the best case scenario.  One of the big three fall due to QB’s or Oliver going early 

Personally, I'm ballsy and I would try to get a bit higher if possible, but not to the edge of stupidity.

 

Our cap situation is good and I would be gunning for blue chip this year at 1, I am of the mindset to give next year's 1 and preserve our 2nd this year (provided a blue chip is available and a deal is able to be made). We have enough ammo left to move back into round 3. The fact is blue chip rarely hits the market and role players frequently do. Identify, draft and retain your blue chippers use future drafts and FAs to fill out the roster. Once ready to move on from a blue chipper, you trade them and maneuver in the draft to get his replacement. We are at a place with this team that it should presumably start it's upward climb, now my be our best chance to make a move to grab an elite guy while drafting in the single digits for some time, the cost to grab one only gets more expensive here on out (since we will be a better and more winning team).

 

It's like Beane has said (paraphrasing):

 

1.) Positional value in the round

2.) As far as positional rankings, you have top-tier, mid-tier and the rest 

3.) If the draft has a lot of depth you can push that position down the draft

4.) "I think defensive front. I think there's definitely some depth there, it looks like, early on." “I think it’s solid. I don’t know if I want to label it as off-the-charts great."

 

You have to look at the separation between the tiers. The gap between the tiers for the WRs is relatively small (and there is no clear cut #1) , TEs (Hock clearly #1 - the rest are similar & don't forget he wants a run blocker, pass blocker and someone who can catch), DL has a sizeable gap in the tiers (Wlliams, Bosa, Allen & Oliver) and he basically admits that. OL has depth, but not top must have talent in the tiers. 

 

 

[bourbonboy]

2 hours ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

I don't see Tampa passing on Allen OR Quinnen Williams.  Now that they're moving to a 3-4 defense under Bowles, either player would be a perfect fit for that scheme.

 

Not saying passing on those two makes sense to me either, but Tampa is rumored to be in love with Devin White, and they do have a need at LB.....hope those rumors are true....

[fmr60]

39 minutes ago, wppete said:

The more I think about it Ed Oliver prob wont be there at #9 but I am very happy if we go with Christian Wilkins. Especially if we can trade down a couple of spots and still get him while adding an extra 2nd or 3rd. 

An ideal scenario with which I would be very pleased.

[hjnick]

2 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Albert Breer and Peter King agree.  If the draft shakes out like it's looking, the Bills absolutely need to trade back if possible - someone like the Giants, Broncos or Redskins might be willing to come up for a QB.  Staying at 9 to take a tight end or right tackle is pretty much worst case scenario for me.

I think one of the keys for Buffalo to trade down will be how many QBs are taken before the pick.  IF for some reason Arizona doesn't take Murray and the Giants doesn't take a QB (which sounds far fetched, but who knows), the #9 pick right before Denver will be a prime spot for a team to get in before Denver to get their pick of QB.  If that scenario happens, then I think we could even get a premium for our pick.

[Logic]

2 hours ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

So, we draft Hockenson at 9 and then have him be an extra offensive lineman, to help stop Oliver?

Each time you think Cornette's takes can't get more repetitive and irritating, he finds a way to surprise you!

[MDH]

4 hours ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I just don't understand how the Jets can continue to ignore edge players. They have none at all. Unless they feel havoc up the middle and Williams' scheme will cause enough pressure. I'd actually be happy if they passed on Josh Allen. I still think they are trying to coerce a trade up from a team in the 6-12 range who had their heart set on Oliver. 

 

Wiliams' has always felt that he can create pressure through scheme and sheer numbers. His D's tend to cause a lot of sacks, sometimes cause a lot of turnovers and almost always allow a lot of big plays. His scheme's deficiencies plays right into the Bill's offensive strengths.

[maryland-bills-fan]

We are in okay shape with our present roster.  FA's have improved the overall talent level (saftey) and last year's draft and some lucky or canny draft picks have provided some quite good players as well. (Milano) 

 

The OPPORTUNITY in the draft is to add the STUDS,  DIFFERENCE MAKERS AND IMPACT PLAYERS.  We are not looking for incremental improvement in players, we are looking for IMPACT players.   Sorry.  Trading down to pick up  an extra 3rd round is NOT what we should do.  That is aiming at a perpetual 8-8 or 9-7 record.  We want 11-5 to be a bad season.

 

I think Beane gets this.   At #9, or even moving up one or two spots, we should try for a guy who other teams will be thinking,,, " Oh, Shitz! how are we going to control this guy, so he doesn't wreck us?"   If we can trade up again to the 1st and get two such guys, DO IT!.   The extra lower draft picks are ammo for this OR Wild Shots at high ceiling, low floor guys (if they were high ceiling and high floor, they would be in the first round)  OR  "one trick ponies".  By this I mean, players like an EDGE guy who can only rush the passer but is poor at stopping the run or setting the edge or a tight end who blocks like a water buffalo but only catches the occasional pass or another TE guy who is more of a big receiver.

 

 

[ColoradoBills]

3 hours ago, hjnick said:

I think one of the keys for Buffalo to trade down will be how many QBs are taken before the pick.  IF for some reason Arizona doesn't take Murray and the Giants doesn't take a QB (which sounds far fetched, but who knows), the #9 pick right before Denver will be a prime spot for a team to get in before Denver to get their pick of QB.  If that scenario happens, then I think we could even get a premium for our pick.

 

How many (if any) QBs are taken early has everything to do with it.

If none go after the NYG pick it will get interesting real fast.

[Ittakestime]

Good.  Oliver is becoming the most overrated prospect this draft.  The guy is a whiner, who overcommits.  All I hear about with Oliver is that he needs the right situation to succeed.  Taking a guy like that 3rd overall would be fine with me, seeing as though that's not the Bills.

[The Jokeman]

6 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

Look all I am saying that that people are speculating that Gregg Williams will have the power and the ear to Ownership and GM more so than Adam Gase.

 

So will this be the first power struggle between those two.  And if you are one that believe that about Gregg Williams of course you are going to Mock Gregg Williams player crush to the Jets.

 

 

The SMART defensive pick for the Jets is an EDGE.  They haven't had a legit passrusher in YEARS.  

All signs have said the Jets want to trade down likely cuz they don't know who to take at 3. Knowing that some team lower (like us seem to like Oliver) they looking to see if can force a trade. Yet I can't see Beane doing it as think he knows we're not one player away.

[ndirish1978]

I'd much rather trade back and get Wilkins and a TE/WR with the second pick. I'm all for trading up starting round 3 when we can use all those extra late round picks we have, but I don't want to trade away 1, 2 or 3 in order to move up to pick a player who MIGHT be better than the guys who we could choose from at 9 anyway.