Best ever NFL running back

[formerlyofCtown]

43 minutes ago, Buffalo Junction said:

Definitely one of the most dominant positional groups I’ve ever seen. 

Woulda had 4 or 5 Lambardi's if that was our line.

[Buffalo Junction]

4 minutes ago, formerlyofCtown said:

Woulda had 4 or 5 Lambardi's if that was our line.

Which is saying something because Wolford, Ballard, Richter, Hull, and Davis were a damn good unit. Probably the second best o line at the time. 

[frostbitmic]

8 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...fun to watch.....tragic loss to liver ailment.........Emmitt was a durable grinder....Sayers' career was cut short.......there have been plenty of good ones....tough call on GOAT..

Agreed ... One of my all time favorite players though so I'll make him #1 in my book.

[Nihilarian]

2 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

Payton was amazing in a different way.  He didn't have any of the classic attributes of any of the great ones - he didn't have great speed, he didn't have great moves, he didn't have great power, but he had just the right combinations of just enough of all those things that he was a great, great back.  

 

No doubt! While Barry could juke you outta your shoes and OJ with his 4:29 30 speed could run right by you.

 

Sweetness motto was "never die easy" as he would never run out of bounds and always try to punish his tacklers. He had a stiff arm like no other! He didn't have the speed so he would use a "stutter step" to distract opponents to take the wrong angle as he would read what they were about to do and do the opposite.  

 

Like I said, for the majority of his career he didn't have top talent around him and basically carried his team every year

[stuvian]

I always liked the multipurpose backs:

Marcus Allen 

Thurman Thomas 

Marshall Faulk

[somnus00]

17 hours ago, Nelius said:

 

Eh, I definitely don't agree with this. The generational gap with Jordan isn't anything like it is with Brown. Peak MJ would still dominate. 

 

Today's NBA is different. The players are bigger, faster without sacrificing agility. It's just a product of improved training, nutrition, etc. Jordan would still be good because, as you said, the time gap isn't too large. But I doubt he would dominate.

 

By the way, I consider Jordan to be the greatest because I compare him to his contemporaries.

 

Thanks for the comment by the way. Not being sarcastic.

[metzelaars_lives]

7 hours ago, mannc said:

Wait, you're not blaming OJ for not winning the title with those Bills teams, are you?   They were an abysmal team when he arrived and he single-handedly took them to the playoffs for the first time since the franchise joined the NFL.  In his first two years with the Bills, OJ was coached by an idiot named Johnny Rauch, who was too stupid to simply hand the ball off to the best collegiate running back of all-time, whom the team had selected with the first overall pick in the draft.  In his third season in the NFL, OJ was coached by the immortal Harvey Johnson...     

Dude, everything you just said about OJ you can apply to Sanders as well. The ‘they didn’t win anything/they had no supporting casts’ arguments apply equally to both players.

[somnus00]

17 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

 

Jordan would be better. The NBA was significantly tougher and more violent defensively in Jordan's day. He would absolutely dominate today's NBA.

 

Sanders would as well imo. His game translates. Athletically he'd be fine. Plus the difference between the 60s NFL when Brown played and the 90s NFL >> the 90s NFL and today's NFL.

 

D-linemen are bigger and faster. Linebackers can run 4.4 these days and still remain fluid. And the safeties...

 

I disagree with you. Barry would be good. Just not great these days. But damn was he fun to watch in his prime. Never knew if it would be negative 3 yards, or a 60 yard td.

 

Thanks for the conversation by the way.

[Shaw66]

24 minutes ago, somnus00 said:

 

D-linemen are bigger and faster. Linebackers can run 4.4 these days and still remain fluid. And the safeties...

 

I disagree with you. Barry would be good. Just not great these days. But damn was he fun to watch in his prime. Never knew if it would be negative 3 yards, or a 60 yard td.

 

Thanks for the conversation by the way.

I really don't agree with this.  As I've said elsewhere, I think Shady is a poor man's Sanders.  Sanders' change of direction was simply devastating.   He'd keep his center of gravity low, bend his knees and get his feet out in from of him.  When his feet hit the ground, he would push off one way or the other or straight ahead.   In any case, his hips and torso were still going full speed, trying to catch up where his feet were.   When he pushed off, often to change direction, his hips and torso lost almost no speed, so he was going full speed almost immediately out of his cut.  I don't think there are any more defenders who could deal with those cuts today than there were when he was playing.   He was just amazing. 

 

The reality is that what makes the top 5 (maybe Brown, Simpson, Peterson, Sanders and, oh, just say Jackson) so great is that they would be great in any era.   OJ was clearly better than Tomlinson, and Tomlinson was real tough in the modern game.  Brown and Peterson are similar, so they clearly could move between generations.  Jackson was like them, too - speed, power and shiftiness.  And Sanders was and would be uncatchable.  

1 hour ago, Nihilarian said:

No doubt! While Barry could juke you outta your shoes and OJ with his 4:29 30 speed could run right by you.

 

Sweetness motto was "never die easy" as he would never run out of bounds and always try to punish his tacklers. He had a stiff arm like no other! He didn't have the speed so he would use a "stutter step" to distract opponents to take the wrong angle as he would read what they were about to do and do the opposite.  

 

Like I said, for the majority of his career he didn't have top talent around him and basically carried his team every year

Obviously, I was and am a big Brown fan.  I did like sweetness simply because he was running over Brown's records.   I kept watching him and thinking "he's got nothing."  But "nothing" always seemed to turn into 100-yard games.   At some point I put my prejudice aside and just started watching him.  He was a truly fantastic back, even though he looked ordinary week after week.  Still, the very best were better.

[formerlyofCtown]

1 hour ago, Buffalo Junction said:

Which is saying something because Wolford, Ballard, Richter, Hull, and Davis were a damn good unit. Probably the second best o line at the time. 

?Redskins had a great line as well IIRC

Edited March 29, 2019 by formerlyofCtown

[Orlando Tim]

I am very happy as i read that i have not seen Emmitt Smith- i can see good arguments for Brown, OJ, Sanders, Payton and even LT because each was dominate in their own era. The only guy that regularly is listed- mostly by Cowboy fans- that is absurd is Emmitt.

[Alphadawg7]

Just thought I would come back in and say...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Its still Barry Sanders.

Edited March 30, 2019 by Alphadawg7

[Charles Romes]

I hate to say it the greatest running back I have ever seen play is Marshawn Lynch.  Violent North South runner could elude, break tackles, bowl people over.  Could make yards all by himself. Hands as soft as silk.  A combination of Jim Brown and Marshall Faulk.  Could take over a game with his energy. Went on to have a Hall of Fame career in a shortened time frame. If he was drafted by a stable playoff franchise he’d be widely recognized for what he is.  The Goat.  

[Kirby Jackson]

Barry Sanders is, without question, the best that I have ever seen. I’m not old enough to remember OJ or Brown or Sayers or Sweetness. Peterson is probably next.

 

FWIW, I spent a good bit of time with Marv Levy (LAMP). I asked him one day who the best football player that he had ever seen. Without hesitation he said, “Gayle Sayers.” I said, “Marv do you want to think about that?” He said, “No, it’s Gayle Sayers.” That’s enough for me. 

[Helpmenow]

3 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

 

Cherry picking. He was a rookie in ‘73 and split time with Dennis Shaw. By ‘75, he was a top QB in the League.

Dennis Shaw only completed 22 passes on 73. 

[Alphadawg7]

1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Barry Sanders is, without question, the best that I have ever seen. I’m not old enough to remember OJ or Brown or Sayers or Sweetness. Peterson is probably next.

 

FWIW, I spent a good bit of time with Marv Levy (LAMP). I asked him one day who the best football player that he had ever seen. Without hesitation he said, “Gayle Sayers.” I said, “Marv do you want to think about that?” He said, “No, it’s Gayle Sayers.” That’s enough for me. 

 

I think if I made a ranking list it would look like this:

1. Barry Sanders
2. Jim Brown
3. Gale Sayers
4. Walter Payton
5. Bo Jackson
6. OJ Simpson
7. Adrian Peterson
8. Earl Campbell
9. Eric Dickerson
10. LaDanian Tomlinson
11. Marshall Faulk
12. Thurman Thomas
13. Emmit Smith
14. Tony Dorsett
15. Jerome Bettis

That was harder than I thought to slot them.  Had to get Bettis in there, was just a rare combo of speed, power, and agility and had some decent hands too.  

[Nihilarian]

1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Barry Sanders is, without question, the best that I have ever seen. I’m not old enough to remember OJ or Brown or Sayers or Sweetness. Peterson is probably next.

 

FWIW, I spent a good bit of time with Marv Levy (LAMP). I asked him one day who the best football player that he had ever seen. Without hesitation he said, “Gayle Sayers.” I said, “Marv do you want to think about that?” He said, “No, it’s Gayle Sayers.” That’s enough for me. 

I met Gale Sayers in Chicago, great guy and a darn shame his career was cut short due to injuries. Mike Ditka said he was the greatest NFL player he had ever seen.

 

Anyway, my case for sweetness. "never die easy"

 

 

[#34fan]

I know he's not, but I love 'em anyway... Thurm! Thurm! Thurm!!!!

 

[Shaw66]

1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Barry Sanders is, without question, the best that I have ever seen. I’m not old enough to remember OJ or Brown or Sayers or Sweetness. Peterson is probably next.

 

FWIW, I spent a good bit of time with Marv Levy (LAMP). I asked him one day who the best football player that he had ever seen. Without hesitation he said, “Gayle Sayers.” I said, “Marv do you want to think about that?” He said, “No, it’s Gayle Sayers.” That’s enough for me. 

That's interesting.  Most of you aren't old enough to have seen Sayers.   He was amazing.

 

I remember when he was coming out of college I saw three highlights from his career.  Kickoff return for 99, punt return for 95 and run from scrimmage for 97.   It was jaw-dropping.  

 

Simpson had this way of gliding in the open, just sort of flowing through the defense.   Sayers ran like that.  

[Shaw66]

18 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

I met Gale Sayers in Chicago, great guy and a darn shame his career was cut short due to injuries. Mike Ditka said he was the greatest NFL player he had ever seen.

 

Anyway, my case for sweetness. "never die easy"

 

 

Amazing balance and ability to absorb hits.  Relentless.  

Since we're posting videos, here it is, the greatest kickoff return of all time.

 

 

[Mat68]

Because of my age I saw Barry Sanders.  He plays 3 to 4 more years he puts up Rice like numbers compared to other running backs.  

[Tcali]

55 yrs watching football...

 

1.Jim Brown

2.OJ Simpson,Gayle Sayers,Earl Campbell

3.Eric Dickerson,Barry Sanders,Cookie Gilchrist,Walter Payton

4.There are about 15-20 RBs tied at a close 4th incl adrian peterson,Ladanian Tomlinson,Marshall Faulk,Fred Taylor

[Tcali]

12 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

He didn’t really hit his stride until ‘72. By ‘74, the Bills had the #1 offense with Ferguson passing to Rashad, Hill & Chandler -along with a 2-Headed Monster RB tandem of Braxton & OJ. 

 

Marion Motley was a man among boys in his era and some guy named Thurman led the League in total yards from scrimmage an unprecedented 4 Straight Seasons. So it’s really just in the eye of the era’s beholder.

he didnt hit his stride cuz they werent giving him the effing ball. remember when the geniuses had him returning kick offs??(7 returns for 333 yds by the way)

[Mikie2times]

On 3/28/2019 at 8:17 PM, Alphadawg7 said:

 

If he played in the NFL today he would struggle to run for 1000 yards.  His style does not translate.  But thats ok, different eras. Just like if Wilt Chamberlain played in the NBA today he would never sniff 100 points.  He may struggle to get 100 points over 4 consecutive games let alone one.  But Brown was the best of his era, no doubt and a legend no doubt.  But sorry he just would not have anything close to the same career today.  Barry would be untouchable in any era he played.  He probably would have averaged 2000 yards a season had he played in Browns era, even on the shorter seasons.  

Brown played at 6-2, 230 pounds. He was solid muscle and ran the 100 meters under 11 seconds at Syracuse.  He benefited little from any modern day training and often commented at how little he worked out. Give him the benefit of modern training and he's running in the 4.4's at 240+ with the agility of a deer.

   

[Mikie2times]

4 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

That's interesting.  Most of you aren't old enough to have seen Sayers.   He was amazing.

 

I remember when he was coming out of college I saw three highlights from his career.  Kickoff return for 99, punt return for 95 and run from scrimmage for 97.   It was jaw-dropping.  

 

Simpson had this way of gliding in the open, just sort of flowing through the defense.   Sayers ran like that.  

Not old enough to have seen him live but I have watched a lot of highlights on him. In my opinion Sayers had the best full speed agility of all time. He could cut at top speed and not lose any speed. People might be quick to argue Barry should get this honor. Barry is certainly the most agile, but he never really had a top gear. He was much more violent with his agility and acceleration. Barry had that wide base and ability to cut no matter what he was doing. He could stop then accelerate faster than anyone in history . Sayers made his cuts in full stride without slowing down at all. Both are two of my favorite backs to watch highlights from.  

Edited March 30, 2019 by KzooMike

[Alphadawg7]

26 minutes ago, KzooMike said:

Brown played at 6-2, 230 pounds. He was solid muscle and ran the 100 meters under 11 seconds at Syracuse.  He benefited little from any modern day training and often commented at how little he worked out. Give him the benefit of modern training and he's running in the 4.4's at 240+ with the agility of a deer.

   

 

All very fair points...and yeah, you have to factor that in, and he was good enough to give the benefit of the doubt.

 

Still best ever is Barry IMO.  I have Brown at #2 though...Barry was not only the most elusive RB to ever exist, he was also fast, powerful and durable.  People forget just how strong Barry was, he was very difficult to tackle and ran over his fair share of defenders.  

 

The thing with Brown that wont let me put him at the top of the list...is go watch his career highlights.  He is just so much bigger and faster than the guys on the field.  It was such a lopsided mismatch like when Wilt Chamberlain played in the NBA.  So while his film is dominance, there is no guarantee he has as good of a career had he played in the more modern era.  

 

At the end of the day I look at this way.  If Barry played during the same years as Brown...who puts up the better stats.  For me that is Barry as he would have destroyed that era with the power, speed, and elusiveness that he possessed.  Now I ask myself if Brown played in Barry's era who would have had the better career...still Barry for me.  Brown just wouldnt have run over as many people nor would he have ran away from them as easily.  

 

But hey, its splitting hairs really.  There is no "wrong" answer and I am sure those who grew up watching Brown favor him more and people like me who grew up watching Barry favor him more.  

[mannc]

7 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

I think if I made a ranking list it would look like this:

1. Barry Sanders
2. Jim Brown
3. Gale Sayers
4. Walter Payton
5. Bo Jackson
6. OJ Simpson
7. Adrian Peterson
8. Earl Campbell
9. Eric Dickerson
10. LaDanian Tomlinson
11. Marshall Faulk
12. Thurman Thomas
13. Emmit Smith
14. Tony Dorsett
15. Jerome Bettis

That was harder than I thought to slot them.  Had to get Bettis in there, was just a rare combo of speed, power, and agility and had some decent hands too.  

You lost all credibility putting Bo Jackson ahead of OJ Simpson.  As talented as he was, he played only four seasons and never even rushed for 1000 yards.  Gayle Sayers ahead of O.J. is pretty laughable, too.  Perhaps you saw some great highlight reels.  

 

And Jerome Bettis was never even a top three back in the league; he has no business being in the Hall of Fame.

Edited March 30, 2019 by mannc

[Alphadawg7]

7 minutes ago, mannc said:

You lost all credibility putting Bo Jackson ahead of OJ Simpson.  As talented as he was, he played only four seasons and never even rushed for 1000 yards.  Gayle Sayers ahead of O.J. is pretty laughable, too.  Perhaps you saw some great highlight reels.  

 

And Jerome Bettis was never even a top three back in the league; he has no business being in the Hall of Fame.

 

Bo Jackson made the list on talent, not longevity.  If not for the hip injury he may have been the best ever.  And many believe Gale Sayers is the best ever, how is it laughable he is ahead of OJ?  

 

I have no issue if someone puts OJ above Gale, that’s their opinion.  But to say it’s laughable that Gale is ahead of OJ is quite the stretch and pretty silly considering Gale garners best ever consideration by many and just about always in everyone’s top 4.  

 

I put Bettis at 15 cuz I wanted to.  You saying he has no business being in the Hall if Fame is the only thing that’s laughable here.  He is an all time great and was a first ballot HOF for a reason.  

[mannc]

3 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Bo Jackson made the list on talent, not longevity.  If not for the hip injury he may have been the best ever.  And many believe Gale Sayers is the best ever, how is it laughable he is ahead of OJ?  

 

I have no issue if someone puts OJ above Gale, that’s their opinion.  But to say it’s laughable that Gale is ahead of OJ is quite the stretch and pretty silly considering Gale garners best ever consideration by many and just about always in everyone’s top 4.  

 

I put Bettis at 15 cuz I wanted to.  You saying he has no business being in the Hall if Fame is the only thing that’s laughable here.  He is an all time great and was a first ballot HOF for a reason.  

No, Bettis was not a first-ballot Hall of Famer.  He was passed over four times.

 

Sayers I will give you, although his greatness was really more as a kick returner than as a running back.  He was a five-time all-pro.  Seems silly putting him ahead of O.J. as an all-time great RB, though.

 

Bo Jackson ahead of O.J. is just nonsense.  Bo played in one pro bowl and didn’t even start on his own team for a significant part of his (very short) career.  There is good reason he’ll never be in the hall.  

[DBilz2500]

9 hours ago, Tcali said:

55 yrs watching football...

 

1.Jim Brown

2.OJ Simpson,Gayle Sayers,Earl Campbell

3.Eric Dickerson,Barry Sanders,Cookie Gilchrist,Walter Payton

4.There are about 15-20 RBs tied at a close 4th incl adrian peterson,Ladanian Tomlinson,Marshall Faulk,Fred Taylor

Damn ur old ??‍?

[Shaw66]

4 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

The thing with Brown that wont let me put him at the top of the list...is go watch his career highlights.  He is just so much bigger and faster than the guys on the field.  It was such a lopsided mismatch like when Wilt Chamberlain played in the NBA.  So while his film is dominance, there is no guarantee he has as good of a career had he played in the more modern era.  

You know, this just isn't true.  Brown played around 230 pounds.  Most of the full backs in the league were 220 to 235 or 240.  None of those other fullback were gaining 1500 yards in a 12 game season .  They were gaining 800.  And qbs were attempting 15 passes a game, so it was no because Brown was getting more carries. They couldnt tackle Brown for the same reasons they couldn't tackle Peterson or Dickerson. 

 

If you listen to anyone who played or coached in that era, NO ONE talks about Brown being oversized liken you say Chamberlain was oversized. 

 

And to talk about Sanders' power is silly.  He was a power back just like McCoy.  Just because he ran inside didn't mean he had power,  

[RememberTheRockpile]

5 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

At the end of the day I look at this way.  If Barry played during the same years as Brown...who puts up the better stats.  

 

Brown without a doubt. Barry would not be playing on super traction artificial fields. He would be playing on chewed up dual use grass fields. Under the field conditions Brown played under Barry isn't even a footnote in history.

[mannc]

5 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

 

The thing with Brown that wont let me put him at the top of the list...is go watch his career highlights.  He is just so much bigger and faster than the guys on the field.  It was such a lopsided mismatch like when Wilt Chamberlain played in the NBA.  

So Jim Brown is downgraded because of his overwhelming speed and power but Bo makes the list (ahead of OJ!) for those qualities alone.  ?

[Juror#8]

I’m convinced that anyone who doesn’t answer “Barry Sanders” never watched the man play. 

 

Sanders was a transcendent talent. While Jim Brown ran over people and relied on his physicality, Sanders was vision, improvisation, speed, elusiveness, and anticipation. 

 

Its like a Mingus jazz composition, all these parts coming together to make something amazingly balanced. 

 

Sayers had a handful of those same qualities - maybe even one or two of them equally as good - just not all the qualities as good at the same time. 

 

Another thing I love about Barry Sanders, he’s probably the only person on any list who would rank himself last amongst any names in a discussion about whose the best. 

 

Great story in an old article that I read years ago about him going to the same McDonalds after a home game and getting his meal. Sitting in the McDs enjoying his meal and signing a few autographs. And neighbors would tell stories about how he was so regular down to mowing his own lawn. 

 

Thats good rearing. 

 

It sounds silly to mention that as commendable but in today’s world of pampered athletes, that’s almost unheard of. 

Edited March 30, 2019 by Juror#8

[DCbillsfan]

On 3/28/2019 at 8:08 PM, Reed83HOF said:

Walter is the best all around back.  Great runner, could catch the ball out of the backfield, and he could block.  Most backs even the great ones can't do all three.  Thurman could but Walter was better.

[Juror#8]

11 minutes ago, mannc said:

So Jim Brown is downgraded because of his overwhelming speed and power but Bo makes the list (ahead of OJ!) for those qualities alone.  ?

 

Bo was more elusive and in my opinion had better lateral quickness than Jim Brown. 

 

Bo just has too small a sample size - unless you factor in his Hb1 runs in Techmo Bowl. 

[Juror#8]

10 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

That's interesting.  Most of you aren't old enough to have seen Sayers.   He was amazing.

 

I remember when he was coming out of college I saw three highlights from his career.  Kickoff return for 99, punt return for 95 and run from scrimmage for 97.   It was jaw-dropping.  

 

Simpson had this way of gliding in the open, just sort of flowing through the defense.   Sayers ran like that.  

 

You can watch YouTube videos all day of these cats. Though I didn’t see Jim Brown or Sayers play when they played, their plays are there for posterity to enjoy. 

 

And enjoy they will.

 

Five hundred years hence, in space communities within galaxies we might not now know exist, people will talk about how amazing, captivating, enjoyable, and splendid Sayers, Brown, Payton, and Simpson were to watch and at their crafts(s). 

 

And then they’ll say “yet they just weren’t as good as Barry Sanders.”

[BillsBlue]

On 3/28/2019 at 7:24 PM, BuffaloBill said:

In Buffalo we have had our fair share of phenomenal RB’s.  So, think league wide who was the best ever?  I would have to vote for Barry Sanders.  The guy really had no other real help in his career.  It is simply amazing to see some of the moves he could make.  Take a look at his highlights then tell the rest of us who has your vote.

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/all-time-greats/0ap3000000940393/Barry-Sanders-career-highlights-NFL-Legends

 

 

i concur barry is the best 

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, mannc said:

No, Bettis was not a first-ballot Hall of Famer.  He was passed over four times.

 

Sayers I will give you, although his greatness was really more as a kick returner than as a running back.  He was a five-time all-pro.  Seems silly putting him ahead of O.J. as an all-time great RB, though.

 

Bo Jackson ahead of O.J. is just nonsense.  Bo played in one pro bowl and didn’t even start on his own team for a significant part of his (very short) career.  There is good reason he’ll never be in the hall.  

 

My bad if Bettis wasn’t first ballot, but he deserves his place none the less.  

 

And again, Bo is on my list based on talent.  

[noacls]

Dont want to comment on any backs that I have not seen play. My list would be:

1. Bo

2. Barry

3. Walter

 

Terrelle Davis was a hell of a player too.