What Was the Primary Reason the Bills Lost (NYJ)?

[Gugny]

30 minutes ago, TC in St. Louis said:

Give Darnold some credit.  His passes were precise.  Especially the long one down the sidelines and the touchdown pass.  Those were incredible throws.  Into tight coverage, and they were perfect.

 

They were also great catches by his receiver.

 

Allen made the mistake of hitting Zay Jones in the hands and the chest a couple times. 

[Stank_Nasty]

My buddy just sent me this via text. I think it’s a tweet he saw. Thought it fit in well here....

 

Bills ranked 31st entering Sunday in special-teams efficiency, per @ESPNStatsInfo. Ranks 400th out of 416 teams since ESPN started tracking stat in 2006. Another Danny Crossman-coached unit, the 2013 Bills, ranks 409th.

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, Magox said:

Special teams and red zone defense.

 

Over the past 2 weeks the number one culprit has been red zone defense.

 

We don't give up many yards but the yards the other teams have put up the past 2 weeks have led to points.

 

Last week Miami was 3 for 3 in the red zone and for that reason they won.

 

This week Jets were 2-3 in the red zone and that heavily contributed.    

 

We are top 2 in the league in yards given up yet we are in the middle of the pack in points allowed.  Last year it was the opposite.  The makings are there to have a very good defense but until they straighten out their red zone defense we won't be elite.

 

Currently Bills are 27th in the league in red zone defense.

Agreed. I was thinking the same thing given the Miami game, but this is pretty eye-opening.

[Gugny]

Just now, Stank_Nasty said:

My buddy just sent me this via text. I think it’s a tweet he saw. Thought it fit in well here....

 

Bills ranked 31st entering Sunday in special-teams efficiency, per @ESPNStatsInfo. Ranks 400th out of 416 teams since ESPN started tracking stat in 2006. Another Danny Crossman-coached unit, the 2013 Bills, ranks 409th.

 

Hell yeah, it fits in here!

 

He should be fired today.  But Clap McClappermot won't do it.

[BringBackOrton]

33 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

 

Well, even though I think that the defense shoulders some responsibility, I think that they probably did enough if STs execute properly.

 

 

I would be happy to...I go to an awesome church!

 

 

Indeed--he made two really impressive throws to my former boy Robby Anderson (yeah, he's not my boy anymore now that he's revealed himself to be a scumbag)

I hear you, but allowing 24 points in 3 Q's is no bueno.  And allowing couple of long third down conversions.  Seems like we didn't get any big stops after the first Q.

20 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

didn't the special teams promptly let the jets down inside the 45 on the very next play after the td?

 

…. or was that the one where they promptly let them down inside the 10 after a score...

 

 

see a theme there?

 

 

I do think the d deserves some flack. but not the brunt of it. 

The Jets started with the ball in the RZ and we held them to three in the first Q.  That was the defenses' only big stop of the game.  Get off of the field.

[K-9]

1 hour ago, Magox said:

Special teams and red zone defense.

 

Over the past 2 weeks the number one culprit has been red zone defense.

 

We don't give up many yards but the yards the other teams have put up the past 2 weeks have led to points.

 

Last week Miami was 3 for 3 in the red zone and for that reason they won.

 

This week Jets were 2-3 in the red zone and that heavily contributed.    

 

We are top 2 in the league in yards given up yet we are in the middle of the pack in points allowed.  Last year it was the opposite.  The makings are there to have a very good defense but until they straighten out their red zone defense we won't be elite.

 

Currently Bills are 27th in the league in red zone defense.

^This. Two weeks in a row our D gave up the lead late. I give credit to the opponents for making terrific plays, but if you’re as good a defense as you think you are, you have to shut the door. Especially in crunch time. 

[thebandit27]

3 minutes ago, BringBackOrton said:

I hear you, but allowing 24 points in 3 Q's is no bueno.  And allowing couple of long third down conversions.  Seems like we didn't get any big stops after the first Q.

 

 

You're right about that...certain players like Tre and Jerry Hughes definitely didn't have their best games

[MJS]

1 hour ago, Magox said:

Special teams and red zone defense.

 

Over the past 2 weeks the number one culprit has been red zone defense.

 

We don't give up many yards but the yards the other teams have put up the past 2 weeks have led to points.

 

Last week Miami was 3 for 3 in the red zone and for that reason they won.

 

This week Jets were 2-3 in the red zone and that heavily contributed.    

 

We are top 2 in the league in yards given up yet we are in the middle of the pack in points allowed.  Last year it was the opposite.  The makings are there to have a very good defense but until they straighten out their red zone defense we won't be elite.

 

Currently Bills are 27th in the league in red zone defense.

 

That's interesting, but when the offense and special teams continually put the defense in terrible positions, it's tough to blame the defense.

 

Some people think (not necessarily you) that the defense should be holding teams to 0 points. Elite defenses still give up points. Opposing offenses are going to get points, even if you have an elite defense.

 

If the other two phases were holding their own, the defense would look even better.

[Alphadawg7]

2 hours ago, Gugny said:

What's the main reason the Bills lost yesterday?  Offense, Defense or Special Teams.

 

I realize all three had their crappy moments; but which team's ineptitude was the primary reason the Bills lost the game?

 

Our defense is good.  Mistakes kept putting them on the field, you can’t expect them to hold every single time in tough positions.  They had to deal with a short field frequently, and then losing Milano late didn’t help.  Anyone blaming the defense is over looking the real reason.  I mean to expect a defense to be perfect every drive is an impossible task.  Guys are being paid on the other side of the ball too, and when they have a short field just making one big play can swing a game like that long pass by Darnold late to Anderson.

 

Offensive miscues lost us this game, and the biggest culprit was the offensive line.  Allen made a bad rookie mistake in his first INT, but he was also running for his life like he did a lot last night when he threw the pick while trusting his arm too much.  Penalties and terrible protection were the unquestioned biggest culprit last night and it’s not even close.  Add in the dropped passes, and this is why we lost.  

[Antonio]

Special Teams and Ultra Conservative playcalling in the red zone. 

 

After the Philly Special, it seems they were trying not to lose yardas and maintain a Field Gol position, insted of trying to score. I think they need to trust Allen a little bit more.

 

After the fumble recovery to start the 2nd hald they should have gone for the TD or big play to start the series, insted they run thruw the middle...

[YoloinOhio]

I think it was josh Allen. He needs to stop hitting WRs and TEs in the hands and sucking on special teams. 

[Gugny]

9 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Our defense is good.  Mistakes kept putting them on the field, you can’t expect them to hold every single time in tough positions.  They had to deal with a short field frequently, and then losing Milano late didn’t help.  Anyone blaming the defense is over looking the real reason.  I mean to expect a defense to be perfect every drive is an impossible task.  Guys are being paid on the other side of the ball too, and when they have a short field just making one big play can swing a game like that long pass by Darnold late to Anderson.

 

Offensive miscues lost us this game, and the biggest culprit was the offensive line.  Allen made a bad rookie mistake in his first INT, but he was also running for his life like he did a lot last night when he threw the pick while trusting his arm too much.  Penalties and terrible protection were the unquestioned biggest culprit last night and it’s not even close.  Add in the dropped passes, and this is why we lost.  

 

I don't think not allowing the 2018 NY Jets into the endzone is a lot to ask of the defense.  But I agree that they were FAR from the main reason the Bills lost.

 

Crossman should be fired today.  A Head Coach with balls would make that happen.

[Big Gun]

I picked special teams but this loss was a split between special teams and coaching.

[Virgil]

1 - Special Teams

2 - Offensive Line, rushing attack

3 - Defensive pressure last quarter 

[Alphadawg7]

4 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

I don't think not allowing the 2018 NY Jets into the endzone is a lot to ask of the defense.  But I agree that they were FAR from the main reason the Bills lost.

 

Crossman should be fired today.  A Head Coach with balls would make that happen.

 

Agreed on Crossman.  But as far as the Jets go, they have a young talented QB too who is going to make some plays.  Are the Jets a good team, no of course not.  But the Jets have 4 wins because they can make some plays here and there.  So giving them a short field so often means they only need to make one good pass and be in the Redzone, and that’s what happened.  

 

I mean Tre is an elite corner, but he’s not going to go an entire season where someone doesn’t make a catch on him.  And his coverage was good, that was just a perfect pass to where only Anderson could really catch it.  Really tough to defend a pass that is a perfect strike to where the WR is only one who can cleanly catch it.

[dave mcbride]

3 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Agreed on Crossman.  But as far as the Jets go, they have a young talented QB too who is going to make some plays.  Are the Jets a good team, no of course not.  But the Jets have 4 wins because they can make some plays here and there.  So giving them a short field so often means they only need to make one good pass and be in the Redzone, and that’s what happened.  

 

I mean Tre is an elite corner, but he’s not going to go an entire season where someone doesn’t make a catch on him.  And his coverage was good, that was just a perfect pass to where only Anderson could really catch it.  Really tough to defend a pass that is a perfect strike to where the WR is only one who can cleanly catch it.

Anderson, who is a good player, also had a very nice subtle push-off that dramatically affected the play. It's the sort of push-off that's never called, so that makes it a good play by Anderson. Nothing White could do about that; it knocked him out of position and it's never gonna get called. 

[HomeskillitMoorman]

McDermott. 

 

I won't say that we would have won if not for him, but coaching to keep it close instead of winning is not going to work most of the time in this league. 

 

Also it was his decision to keep Crossman, and the special teams unit is ultimately still under his umbrella as a head coach...it's still McDermott's responsibility. 

[CuddyDark]

The offense allowed 46 to take cheap shots on their QB and offensive players all game and no one stood up to him. They need an enforcer to take care of players like him. Also 33 bullied the receivers all game and no one was tough enough to push back against him.

[HomeskillitMoorman]

Just now, CuddyDark said:

The offense allowed 46 to take cheap shots on their QB and offensive players all game and no one stood up to him. They need an enforcer to take care of players like him. Also 33 bullied the receivers all game and no one was tough enough to push back against him.

 

I was talking about this after I saw the Hauschka cheap shot, but someone mentioned he had a cheap shot of his own, I haven't seen that play yet.

 

But in general...the biggest example being last year with Gronk on Tre White, which is one of the dirtiest plays I've ever seen in my life...this team does not stand up to players when things like that happen. I'm still mad about that one and I'm not usually one to care much about things that happened in the past. 

[CuddyDark]

1 minute ago, HomeskillitMoorman said:

 

I was talking about this after I saw the Hauschka cheap shot, but someone mentioned he had a cheap shot of his own, I haven't seen that play yet.

 

But in general...the biggest example being last year with Gronk on Tre White, which is one of the dirtiest plays I've ever seen in my life...this team does not stand up to players when things like that happen. I'm still mad about that one and I'm not usually one to care much about things that happened in the past. 

They set a tone for the entire game. 46 & 33. Their Dline was playing well but it was those two who changed the game after we scored the first 14.

[Comebackkid]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

Option 4: Coaching.

Bingo

[CuddyDark]

1 minute ago, Comebackkid said:

Bingo

Nope. This was about toughness and the players got whipped.

[Comebackkid]

1 minute ago, CuddyDark said:

Nope. This was about toughness and the players got whipped.

They got burned on some plays.  Didn't get enough pressure on darn old.  But from what I seen,  offense was hampered badly from play calling.  Special teams was atrocious and I put most of that on coaching as well.    Way to many downs wasted on bad play calling.    Asking our kicker to attempt a 55 yard kick after barely being able to walk earlier was full on retarded. 

[BillsMafia13]

1 hour ago, Gugny said:

 

I almost added this, but chose not to.  My logic was that coaching was mostly to blame for how crappy all three phases were.

Penalties again are basically a bazooka to the foot

[Gugny]

19 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Agreed on Crossman.  But as far as the Jets go, they have a young talented QB too who is going to make some plays.  Are the Jets a good team, no of course not.  But the Jets have 4 wins because they can make some plays here and there.  So giving them a short field so often means they only need to make one good pass and be in the Redzone, and that’s what happened.  

 

I mean Tre is an elite corner, but he’s not going to go an entire season where someone doesn’t make a catch on him.  And his coverage was good, that was just a perfect pass to where only Anderson could really catch it.  Really tough to defend a pass that is a perfect strike to where the WR is only one who can cleanly catch it.

 

I agree that it was a beautiful pass and catch.  But someone posted earlier that the Bills are near dead last in red zone defense this season.  Yesterday was definitely a team loss.

 

There is a severe discipline problem, in my opinion.  31st in penalties (8.2) and penalty yards (70.7) per game.

 

I left "Coaching" out as an option.  But the coaching on this team has been terrible at every position/level.  Terrible.  That's not my call to fire McDermott.  But he has certainly not been good.

[RochesterRob]

2 hours ago, Gugny said:

What's the main reason the Bills lost yesterday?  Offense, Defense or Special Teams.

 

I realize all three had their crappy moments; but which team's ineptitude was the primary reason the Bills lost the game?

  Special teams by far.  The defense was just playing vanilla which made me think that the season is now written off in favor of a better draft pick which is OK with me.  Looking more and more like we will pick in the top 10 now.  The offense is simply auditioning players to see if any will be contributors next year.  I was pretty pissed off at 4:30 yesterday afternoon but I understand that there is a long term objective in this loss.

[CuddyDark]

5 minutes ago, Comebackkid said:

They got burned on some plays.  Didn't get enough pressure on darn old.  But from what I seen,  offense was hampered badly from play calling.  Special teams was atrocious and I put most of that on coaching as well.    Way to many downs wasted on bad play calling.    Asking our kicker to attempt a 55 yard kick after barely being able to walk earlier was full on retarded. 

Robert Foster made two or three bad plays and none of them was play calling. He just got flat out beat physically by 33. Dion Dawkins for the 3rd or 4th week in a row was godawful. Both guards got whipped all game. They got beat physically and it didn't even matter what play they called.

 

I will cede the FG. It was a dumb call.

[BillsMafia13]

1 hour ago, HOUSE said:

Excessive clapping by Sean McDermott,, our players are deaf

This gif needs to be destroyed for all eternity 

[GoBills808]

3 hours ago, Gugny said:

What's the main reason the Bills lost yesterday?  Offense, Defense or Special Teams.

 

I realize all three had their crappy moments; but which team's ineptitude was the primary reason the Bills lost the game?

Special teams for sure. Anytime you outgain your opponent 3:2 in yards, 24:15 in first downs, hold an 8-minute +differential in TOP, and surrender fewer yards in penalties than the opposition it's a safe bet you lost due to special teams.

[NewEra]

The OL.  It’s terrble and is the main reason we lose most of our games imo.  We literally don’t have 1 “good” offensive lineman at the moment.  I have hope that Teller and Dawkins can become good, but neither are.  We have the worst running back running game in the league at the moment imo.  It’s embarassing

[Royale with Cheese]

Specials teams and no offensive running game.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

ST's has been bad the last few weeks  

 

By some, all season  - FIRE Crossman NOW 

[frostbitmic]

Crossman's group of unspecial teams.

 

When you'd be safer kicking it out of bounds and giving your opponent the ball at the 40, you've got issues.

 

The (special) teams unit has now become the laughing stock of the NFL, I've never seen more guys running around looking like chickens that have just been beheaded than this pitiful group. Crossman should've been told to clean out his office at halftime and his job should be given to the guy that makes coffee for the coaching staff the temp job.

[Comebackkid]

1 hour ago, CuddyDark said:

Robert Foster made two or three bad plays and none of them was play calling. He just got flat out beat physically by 33. Dion Dawkins for the 3rd or 4th week in a row was godawful. Both guards got whipped all game. They got beat physically and it didn't even matter what play they called.

 

I will cede the FG. It was a dumb call.

What was our percentage on run to pass on first down? And what percent of those runs went for two yards or less? Had McCoy not went out it might have even been worse

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, dave mcbride said:

Anderson, who is a good player, also had a very nice subtle push-off that dramatically affected the play. It's the sort of push-off that's never called, so that makes it a good play by Anderson. Nothing White could do about that; it knocked him out of position and it's never gonna get called. 

 

Anderson is good. White had an off day. He has had two bad games and 11 very good ones. He is the least of our worries. I hope Anderson isn't just one of those players who gets a little hex over him though... remember when Stevie Johnson bizarrely used to cause Revis problems?

[thebandit27]

39 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Anderson is good. White had an off day. He has had two bad games and 11 very good ones. He is the least of our worries. I hope Anderson isn't just one of those players who gets a little hex over him though... remember when Stevie Johnson bizarrely used to cause Revis problems?

 

Anderson might already be that guy--he had a good game against him in New Jersey in 2017 too.

[CuddyDark]

1 hour ago, Comebackkid said:

What was our percentage on run to pass on first down? And what percent of those runs went for two yards or less? Had McCoy not went out it might have even been worse

How many of those runs failed because the WR got beat or took a penalty destroying the run call? Some of it is coaching but the players got dominated physically as well.

[Gugny]

2 hours ago, Comebackkid said:

What was our percentage on run to pass on first down? And what percent of those runs went for two yards or less? Had McCoy not went out it might have even been worse

 

We run on 37.61% of first downs, which is 3rd highest in the league.  I was shocked to see that.

 

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/rushing-first-down-pct

 

 

[SoCal Deek]

I’m going to say it...the Bills win that game if Barkley was at QB

[jr1]

turnovers