Scorp83 Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 (edited) This dude John is a beast! Even my boy Sal tried to set him up with some good questions & Mr. Ledyard had answer after answer... on the state of the Bills Check it out... 05-11 Jon Ledyard on Schopp and the Bulldog - http://www.wgr550.com/media/podcast/schopp-and-bulldog Edited May 11, 2018 by Scorp83 Typo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WPBillsFan Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 (edited) 2 things that sticks out... He had Allen as a 3rd rd grade... wow Then us not getting weapons around Allen. I want to see Allen succeed but I was thinking the same thing... how can he without any legitimate weapons. I love Benjamin but I've lost faith in Zay cause he had alot of drops last year. After today, & I could be reading too much in it, but I think they are gearing up for Allen to start day 1... especially with the 1-on-1 treatment he was getting today. Edited May 11, 2018 by WPBillsFan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fadingpain Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 Ledyard on Allen: He had 3rd round grade on him. Talent/athleticism is awesome, but at end of day decision making/accuracy are issues. Is it possible to develop the talent? Yes, but difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 Just now, WPBillsFan said: 2 things that sticks out... He had Allen as a 3rd rd grade... wow Then the us not getting weapons around Allen. I want to see Allen succeed but I was thinking the same thing... how can he without any legitimate weapons. I love Benjamin but I've lost faith in Zay cause he had alot of drops last year. After today, & I could be reading too much in it, but I think they are gearing up for Allen to start day 1... especially with the 1-on-1 treatment he was getting today. When you look at top ten picks for the last decade it would be a surprise to see him sit at all and a shock if he sat for any noteworthy stretch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fadingpain Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 1 minute ago, WPBillsFan said: 2 things that sticks out... He had Allen as a 3rd rd grade... wow Then us not getting weapons around Allen. I want to see Allen succeed but I was thinking the same thing... how can he without any legitimate weapons. I love Benjamin but I've lost faith in Zay cause he had alot of drops last year. After today, & I could be reading too much in it, but I think they are gearing up for Allen to start day 1... especially with the 1-on-1 treatment he was getting today. Many, if not most, "expert draft analysts" had him as a 3rd round type project. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midwest1981 Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 (edited) According to Charlie Cassey, Daniel Jeremiah, Matt Miller, and others Allen was no worse than the 3rd-best QB in this year's draft. But for "draft twitter" or the "little draft" community (non NFL or non ESPN & NFL Network), like NDT scouting, he was no higher than 5th behind Rosen, Mayfield, Darnold, and Jackson (generally in that order). Ledyard was actually more complimentary and bullish of Allen in this WGR interview than in his draft review of the Bills (and the AFC East). He absolutely excoriates the Bills and their decision to not only draft Allen but to trade UP to do it, while passing on Rosen. He defines it as a franchise-altering move in the absolute worst way (for the record, the Bills are the first team they talk about): https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/locked-on-nfl-2/locked-on-nfl-draft/e/54394834 Edited May 11, 2018 by Midwest1981 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
78thealltimegreat Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 Just another guy trying to be proven right about Allen he fits with dope and bullish&ts antibills antics 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Fischer Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 (edited) Well, his analysis for Cardale Jones was spot on: Cardale Jones, Buffalo Bills – 4th (139) My No. 3 quarterback in the draft with a second round grade, Jones was a great value selection by the Bills in the fourth round, and should fit their offense well. I think he’ll be given the opportunity to compete with Tyrod Taylor for the starting spot, and has the electric arm and underrated smarts to succeed earlier than many expect. I’m not sure he’s worse than Taylor, but the Bills may ultimately feel more comfortable with the incumbent – for now. Year One Impact: Will push for starting spot For more interesting analysis - https://draftwire.usatoday.com/2016/05/23/2016-nfl-draft-review-quarterbacks/ Edited May 11, 2018 by Max Fischer 3 17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 https://fineartamerica.com/featured/1-john-ledyard-1751-1789-granger.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albwan Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 (edited) 48 minutes ago, Fadingpain said: Many, if not most, "expert draft analysts" had him as a 3rd round type project. wow peoples are still mad...as a casual draft watcher i don't think i saw one time him out of the first round, i thought their best option was to go bpa early and with lamar jackson late. However I'm thrilled with Allen, mostly because I'm behind a management team 100% who gets a bills team led by tt to their first playoff win in forever. I hope they hit a home run. I almost forgot who the heck is john ledyard Edited May 11, 2018 by Albwan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baskingridgebillsfan Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 I thought he came off a real tool. I rarely agree with Schoop but his stance on predicting how these qb's pan out if how i feel. There are so many variables that go in developing a qb and if any of them go wrong the whole process could fail. Now with that said. Lets start with pick 20 and look at all the players drafted until round 3 . I am not sure there are many is any players who have the upside of Allen. Considering the value of the position and the fact that you would be passing on guards , receivers and number 2 corners there is no way Allen is a third round player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 Schopp is off today. Ledyard was on with Bulldog and Sal. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Fadingpain said: Many, if not most, "expert draft analysts" had him as a 3rd round type project. Umn no that is absolutely not true....why are you posting this crap? 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Lightning Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 Those of us who did not want Allen viewed him as a 2nd or 3rd round project. I still do, though I understand the QB premium. And I have to admit I was bitter that they passed on Rosen for him, especially burning draft capital to trade up to get him. And I understand the born-again Allen lovers now because after all he's a Bill! But I'm prepared to be wrong, and truly hope to see this guy be great. That said, everybody else should be not shocked to see him fail. Because it's not clear which way it's going to go. I hope for the best. I want this team to win and be live every January. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Diver Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 3rd round? I would have turned the channel. The guy is a moron. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 10 minutes ago, Sky Diver said: 3rd round? I would have turned the channel. The guy is a moron. He had Tremaine Edmunds going as a Tier 3 guy end of 1st round beginning of 2nd. I guess the Bill's are doomed! LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 4 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: He had Tremaine Edmunds going as a Tier 3 guy end of 1st round beginning of 2nd. I guess the Bill's are doomed! LOL I thought it interesting how he waffled at the end of his interview just in case he was wrong...... Newsflash Ledlard.....ALL players are drafted on potential. QBs are no different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 Yeah, I seriously have never heard of this guy before. I think his opinion is waaaaay out there regarding Josh Allen. I'd rather go with Boomer Esiason's and Phil Simms' opinions that Josh Allen was the best QB in this draft class who warranted the 1st overall selection to the Browns. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mat68 Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 2 biggest needs in the team were Qb and Mike. They got 2 freak athletes with infinite potential. They got 2 guys with the best chance to be a hall of famer at either position. They hit on Allen and Edmunds Buffalo is a perenial comtender. Will they? Time will tell. Daboll building Allen, and Mcdermott building Edmunds. Lets see how it turns out. Imo both start week 1. Both do better than many think. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Diver Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 12 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: He had Tremaine Edmunds going as a Tier 3 guy end of 1st round beginning of 2nd. I guess the Bill's are doomed! LOL You don’t get any notoriety being sensible. You have to be outrageous. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 33 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Schopp is off today. Ledyard was on with Bulldog and Sal. Giving the commencement address at M.I.T., no doubt. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Max Fischer said: Well, his analysis for Cardale Jones was spot on: Cardale Jones, Buffalo Bills – 4th (139) My No. 3 quarterback in the draft with a second round grade, Jones was a great value selection by the Bills in the fourth round, and should fit their offense well. I think he’ll be given the opportunity to compete with Tyrod Taylor for the starting spot, and has the electric arm and underrated smarts to succeed earlier than many expect. I’m not sure he’s worse than Taylor, but the Bills may ultimately feel more comfortable with the incumbent – for now. Year One Impact: Will push for starting spot For more interesting analysis - https://draftwire.usatoday.com/2016/05/23/2016-nfl-draft-review-quarterbacks/ He was wrong on practically every QB. I wish he had an undraftable grade on Allen but I'll take a 3rd rd grade from this Anti-Nostradamus. Since he was off so much on the class of 2016, I'm expecting Allen to be Super Bowl MVP within 3 years. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Diver Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 18 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: He had Tremaine Edmunds going as a Tier 3 guy end of 1st round beginning of 2nd. I guess the Bill's are doomed! LOL I think there is a good chance we got the best offensive and defensive players in the draft. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 1 minute ago, Sky Diver said: I think there is a good chance we got the best offensive and defensive players in the draft. My thoughts pre draft (which technically don't amount to a hill of beans) was that Edmunds would be exactly what McDermott wanted in a LB. I'm glad he got his guy. He could really be something special. The QB's all had so many pluses and minuses that I only hoped Beane picked a good one. He picked Allen and I got to admit I like the young man's story. If he can reach somewhere near his ceiling you could be right. Wouldn't that be a pleasant change for the Bills! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMF2006 Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Max Fischer said: Well, his analysis for Cardale Jones was spot on: Cardale Jones, Buffalo Bills – 4th (139) My No. 3 quarterback in the draft with a second round grade, Jones was a great value selection by the Bills in the fourth round, and should fit their offense well. I think he’ll be given the opportunity to compete with Tyrod Taylor for the starting spot, and has the electric arm and underrated smarts to succeed earlier than many expect. I’m not sure he’s worse than Taylor, but the Bills may ultimately feel more comfortable with the incumbent – for now. Year One Impact: Will push for starting spot For more interesting analysis - https://draftwire.usatoday.com/2016/05/23/2016-nfl-draft-review-quarterbacks/ Year 2 impact........traded for a bag of deflated footballs This guy is a clown and Scoop and Dogpoop are trying too hard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elite Poster Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 50 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: He had Tremaine Edmunds going as a Tier 3 guy end of 1st round beginning of 2nd. I guess the Bill's are doomed! LOL I mean, Edmunds was pick 16 so he was a late first.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 1 hour ago, 78thealltimegreat said: Just another guy trying to be proven right about Allen he fits with dope and bullish&ts antibills antics Ledyard is a SOLID analyst. His job isn’t to reassure you on your teams draft pick; it’s to give his honest opinion. It was all professional criticism. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 2 hours ago, Fadingpain said: Many, if not most, "expert draft analysts" had him as a 3rd round type project. Really? Who would those many and most be who had Allen as a 3rd round type project? Names and work association please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 5-11 Dan Orlovsky on One Bills Live (15:17) Dan Orlovsky has been rather critical of Allen as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
78thealltimegreat Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 1 hour ago, The_Dude said: Ledyard is a SOLID analyst. His job isn’t to reassure you on your teams draft pick; it’s to give his honest opinion. It was all professional criticism. He ever play the position? Cause Miller,Esiason, and Simms all did professionally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 13 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said: He ever play the position? Cause Miller,Esiason, and Simms all did professionally I trust the opinions of those former NFL QBs who've all spent over a decade in the league, than I do a professional stat geek who've I've never heard of until today. Oh yeah, I also trust Beane and McDermott over him too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 35 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said: He ever play the position? Cause Miller,Esiason, and Simms all did professionally ....he’s a draft analyst. He analyzes draft picks. That’s his job. People pay him to do that. He has opinions. That’s ok. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 2 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said: 5-11 Dan Orlovsky on One Bills Live (15:17) Dan Orlovsky has been rather critical of Allen as well. It's one thing to be critical, to say here are the flaws, here's what this guy needs to work on, I don't see him as the #1 pick or even a top 5 pick in the draft. I've seen a lot of people who are respectful and knowledgeable including Dan Orlovsky, say that. It's another thing to say he's a "third round type project". Though on this message board... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 2 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said: 5-11 Dan Orlovsky on One Bills Live (15:17) Dan Orlovsky has been rather critical of Allen as well. "My #1 (concern about Allen) was just that I thought he consistently showed on tape struggling to process what was going on. Almost like he had no plan at the line of scrimmage and simple stuff that defenses were doing to him. Whether it was a one linebacker blitz against the protection he seems surprised by it. And I just know that that is something that is really difficult to understand and take to the next level when you get to the NFL because it only becomes more detailed, more complicated, more disguised. So I think that's going to be a big hurdle for him to jump." I didn't see this on 2017 tape and find it hard to believe that this is the case considering the reports that teams were impressed with his chalkboard explanations and recall. I wonder what Orlovsky is referring to specifically. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorp83 Posted May 12, 2018 Author Share Posted May 12, 2018 3 hours ago, Green Lightning said: Those of us who did not want Allen viewed him as a 2nd or 3rd round project. I still do, though I understand the QB premium. And I have to admit I was bitter that they passed on Rosen for him, especially burning draft capital to trade up to get him. And I understand the born-again Allen lovers now because after all he's a Bill! But I'm prepared to be wrong, and truly hope to see this guy be great. That said, everybody else should be not shocked to see him fail. Because it's not clear which way it's going to go. I hope for the best. I want this team to win and be live every January. This is my whole entire stance with Allen, I pray to God that I'm wrong. I would love to be wrong... for the Bills front office, pray that I'm wrong on Allen 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 (edited) 5 hours ago, Scorp83 said: This dude John is a beast! Even my boy Sal tried to set him up with some good questions & Mr. Ledyard had answer after answer... on the state of the Bills Check it out... 05-11 Jon Ledyard on Schopp and the Bulldog - http://www.wgr550.com/media/podcast/schopp-and-bulldog Ledyard is very good...His Locked On NFL Draft Podcast is my favorite of all the Draft Podcasts...I try to listen to every one during Draft season... He's really sharp...I've heard him talk a lot about the Buffalo market...He's been on WGR a ton this off season, and he found out quick Bills fans will come at him if he's less than prepared ( I think it had to do with Groy)... He's crazy prepared though usually...He was born to do what he's doing for sure... Edited May 12, 2018 by KOKBILLS 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorp83 Posted May 12, 2018 Author Share Posted May 12, 2018 2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Really? Who would those many and most be who had Allen as a 3rd round type project? Names and work association please. Your asking a poster to literally dig up this information... that's crazy. Shoot your better off clicking on my profile, I've started threads all throughout this draft process, with links on a ton of WGR interviews with guy's that had Allen projected as a 3rd rd pick. Like your crazy thread says(that you locked & won't allow anyone to comment on)... "use the search engine" I'm quite sure you'll find what your looking for sir 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBean Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 How long has Ledyard been a GM? Director of college scouting? How many winning teams has he fielded himself in the NFL? His opinion means jack **** to me. When the whistle blows on noon Sunday in the fall, we’ll see who’s right or wrong. I for one am betting on Brandon Beane and Sean McDermott...not some Slapdick wanna be analyst. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 6 minutes ago, Scorp83 said: Your asking a poster to literally dig up this information... that's crazy. Horseradish. Fadingpain made the statement " Many, if not most, "expert draft analysts" had him as a 3rd round type project. " If he knows that, he should already have the information and be able to "stand and deliver": who are these "many expert draft analysts" who proclaimed Allen a 3rd round type project? Otherwise it's just blowing smoke. As a general principle of argument, if you make a sweeping, inclusive statement, be prepared to back it up when asked, not instruct everyone else to do your research project for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 Ledyard didn't suddenly formulate his opinion on Allen after the Bills drafted him. His critiques are legitimate and backed up by Orlovsky and others even if those who want ensconce Allen in a safe place don't want to admit he needs work in the very areas that Ledyard speaks of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts