Wawrow: Bills aren’t planning to add to upper management

[YoloinOhio]

 

Edited May 3, 2018 by YoloinOhio

[Fadingpain]

Given their tremendous record of success with both teams since taking ownership, I have every confidence in Kim's ability to now function as president of three major organizations at the same time.

 

How hard can it be?  What could go wrong?

 

 

[Heavy Kevi]

Makes sense. The Pegulas aren't really greenhorns anymore, and habe decent newer GMs in place. 

 

If the reports of Brandon being shut out of McD are true, what was he really doing anyway? From a field/ice perspective probably little to none.

1 minute ago, Fadingpain said:

Given their tremendous record of success with both teams since taking ownership, I have every confidence in Kim's ability to now function as president of three major organizations at the same time.

 

How hard can it be?  What could go wrong?

 

 

 

What's the third, PSE?

[Doc]

1 minute ago, Fadingpain said:

Given their tremendous record of success with both teams since taking ownership, I have every confidence in Kim's ability to now function as president of three major organizations at the same time.

 

How hard can it be?  What could go wrong?

 

The business side, which Kim will be taking over, has been doing fine. 

[Buffalo716]

So that’s why they are no longer returning my calls? 

 

Always the bridesmaid and never the bride ?

[ExiledInIllinois]

Just now, Buffalo716 said:

So that’s why they are no longer returning my calls? 

 

Always the bridesmaid and never the bride ?

Don't despair, just a busy signal... They got Dunkirk Don on the line.

[Buffalo716]

Just now, ExiledInIllinois said:

Don't despair, just a busy signal... They got Dunkirk Don on the line.

 

He takes every high level business meeting from me!

[PromoTheRobot]

17 minutes ago, Shotgunner said:

 

What's the third, PSE?

 

Yes.

Edited May 3, 2018 by PromoTheRobot

[Marv's Neighbor]

I'll always remember that it was Russ who put us in the Toronto games!  Another nice move "on the business side."

[Augie]

38 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

He takes every high level business meeting from me!

 

 

Don’t tell me...you have to go out east, don’t you? 

[sullim4]

The President titles for the Bills and Sabres are meaningless.  She is the owner and she is the driving force behind PSE which is essentially the business side of the Sabres and Bills.

 

McBeane runs the football operation and Botterill runs the hockey side of the business.  Problems happen when people like Russ, Terry, and Kim meddle in the sport operations side of things... with Russ gone, that just leaves Terry and Kim to mess things up.  Rich people tend to learn from their mistakes so I would hope they've figured out by now to leave the GM duties to the actual GMs.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

More people means more problems.

 

 

[eball]

1 hour ago, sullim4 said:

The President titles for the Bills and Sabres are meaningless.  She is the owner and she is the driving force behind PSE which is essentially the business side of the Sabres and Bills.

 

McBeane runs the football operation and Botterill runs the hockey side of the business.  Problems happen when people like Russ, Terry, and Kim meddle in the sport operations side of things... with Russ gone, that just leaves Terry and Kim to mess things up.  Rich people tend to learn from their mistakes so I would hope they've figured out by now to leave the GM duties to the actual GMs.

 

The evidence suggests that particularly on the football side, McBeane are doing exactly what they want without any “meddling” from the Pegulas. 

[Doc Brown]

1 hour ago, sullim4 said:

The President titles for the Bills and Sabres are meaningless.  She is the owner and she is the driving force behind PSE which is essentially the business side of the Sabres and Bills.

 

McBeane runs the football operation and Botterill runs the hockey side of the business.  Problems happen when people like Russ, Terry, and Kim meddle in the sport operations side of things... with Russ gone, that just leaves Terry and Kim to mess things up.  Rich people tend to learn from their mistakes so I would hope they've figured out by now to leave the GM duties to the actual GMs.

Rex Ryan was good for something at least.

[100DollarBills]

6 minutes ago, eball said:

 

The evidence suggests that particularly on the football side, McBeane are doing exactly what they want without any “meddling” from the Pegulas. 

They report directly to the Pegula's, which means the Pegula's probably have some sway in the football decisions. Why can't they just let the GM and coach run the show without meddling on personal player favorites. 

[eball]

3 minutes ago, 100DollarBills said:

They report directly to the Pegula's, which means the Pegula's probably have some sway in the football decisions. Why can't they just let the GM and coach run the show without meddling on personal player favorites. 

 

Name an owner in the NFL who doesn’t consult with his GM or coach. I don’t think you understand how this works. 

[BillsFan692]

Nothing against Kims qualifications -- i do think she could handle this job. But don't worry if Kim does bad Terry will just fire her right guys???

5 minutes ago, eball said:

 

Name an owner in the NFL who doesn’t consult with his GM or coach. I don’t think you understand how this works. 

Some owners are not involved at that level where they are suggesting who the GM should draft, that's just not how most of them are. Most of them leave that stuff to the experts they have hired.

 

Some like Jerry Jones get more involved and it causes problems typically. Robert Kraft got involved recently when he forced the garapolo trade and told belichik to suck it up and deal with Brady for as long as Brady wants.

 

It's not good when stuff like that happens

[NickelCity]

2 hours ago, sullim4 said:

The President titles for the Bills and Sabres are meaningless.  She is the owner and she is the driving force behind PSE which is essentially the business side of the Sabres and Bills.

 

McBeane runs the football operation and Botterill runs the hockey side of the business.  Problems happen when people like Russ, Terry, and Kim meddle in the sport operations side of things... with Russ gone, that just leaves Terry and Kim to mess things up.  Rich people tend to learn from their mistakes so I would hope they've figured out by now to leave the GM duties to the actual GMs.

 

These are pretty much my feelings on the matter. Why should there be messengers in between owners and GMs? 

[eball]

4 hours ago, BillsFan692 said:

Nothing against Kims qualifications -- i do think she could handle this job. But don't worry if Kim does bad Terry will just fire her right guys???

Some owners are not involved at that level where they are suggesting who the GM should draft, that's just not how most of them are. Most of them leave that stuff to the experts they have hired.

 

Some like Jerry Jones get more involved and it causes problems typically. Robert Kraft got involved recently when he forced the garapolo trade and told belichik to suck it up and deal with Brady for as long as Brady wants.

 

It's not good when stuff like that happens

 

Yes, Jones is a great example of a "meddling" owner.  I don't think there is any evidence of that with the Bills -- at least not since McD, and then Beane, were hired.  Everything we have been led to believe -- with more facts coming to light in the wake of Russ' exit -- is that the Pegulas are merely consultants, or advisors, with respect to the moves Beane and McDermott are making.  Nothing has suggested the Pegulas have either forced or blocked moves, and apparently they were fully on board with McD's desire not to have Russ involved in any way, shape, or form on the football side.  My interpretation of Terry's involvement is that he is more of a sounding board, or a consultant who asks questions.

 

Does anyone believe that if Terry was "meddling" he would have permitted the complete re-tooling of the roster we've seen in what amounts to just over a calendar year?

[bmur66]

Kimmy is the Queen. Get used to it.

 

[BobbyC81]

13 minutes ago, bmur66 said:

Kimmy is the Queen. Get used to it.

 

 

Long live the Queen!

[Radar]

6 hours ago, eball said:

 

Name an owner in the NFL who doesn’t consult with his GM or coach. I don’t think you understand how this works. 

Exactly. If I owned a team I would certainly expect to be consulted/reported to by my managers. Some fans are pretty naive on there view of these things. When you own a business that's how it is.

[The Wiz]

8 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

More people means more problems.

 

 

I thought it was more money, more problems.

[Sanners]

8 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

More people means more problems.

 

 

 

No... Mo money, mo problems 

[Doc]

There is absolutely zero evidence that Terry and/or Kim stick their noses in the football side.  At best McBeane run things by them just to make sure they know and that's probably all there is to it.  Maybe there are some political/league image aspects to player moves that need to be considered, but that's probably it.

[Soda Popinski]

Just now, Doc said:

There is absolutely zero evidence that Terry and/or Kim stick their noses in the football side.  At best McBeane run things by them just to make sure they know and that's probably all there is to it.  Maybe there are some political/league image aspects to player moves that need to be considered, but that's probably it.

Kim said as much in her interview on NFLN a few weeks ago.  She said they don't watch tape, don't do evaluations.   They leave that to the people they pay to do it.  

[TH3]

10 hours ago, Fadingpain said:

Given their tremendous record of success with both teams since taking ownership, I have every confidence in Kim's ability to now function as president of three major organizations at the same time.

 

How hard can it be?  What could go wrong?

 

 

Dis you even read the context of the messages ?

[corta765]

7 hours ago, BillsFan692 said:

Nothing against Kims qualifications -- i do think she could handle this job. But don't worry if Kim does bad Terry will just fire her right guys???

Some owners are not involved at that level where they are suggesting who the GM should draft, that's just not how most of them are. Most of them leave that stuff to the experts they have hired.

 

Some like Jerry Jones get more involved and it causes problems typically. Robert Kraft got involved recently when he forced the garapolo trade and told belichik to suck it up and deal with Brady for as long as Brady wants.

 

It's not good when stuff like that happens

 

Wrong. Owners have to get involved to some extent. Do you honestly think after last seasons protests which the Pegula's directly had to get involved with their players, that they didn't speak with Allen also regarding the tweets posted and whether they wanted a player like him in the organization depending on what he had to say. I would be slightly concerned if my owner had absolutely no idea about any player moves given how personality and character especially in today's world can have drastic consequences if your not paying attention. Plus in a position like QB that individual is expected to be the face of your franchise for hopefully 10-15 years and someone you are going to pay millions upon millions of dollars. If my team was making that type of commitment I'd want to at least be involved a little in the process. I would still let my GM make the call but I wouldn't be asleep at the wheel.

 

ALL OWNERS are involved. The difference is to what degree. Jerry Jones and Dan Snyder especially are the anti-thesis of what you want. They are too involved and as a result cause to many problems. At the other end of the spectrum the Rooney's from Pittsburgh almost forced Big Ben out after his sexual misconduct and motorcycle crash because they didn't want that associated with their organization. Finding a healthy balance of where to be is key and teams like Pittsburgh/NYG typically are models of this.

 

The Pegulas with both teams took some time to find the healthy middle ground of not being overly involved. Rex Ryan's hire was their failure, but to the same token McBeane is looking like their success and in general they now seem at a safe distance. The single most important thing is for the owner, gm, and coach all to be on the same page and vision. Issues arise very quickly like we saw with Whaley with Marrone/Ryan when things aren't in unison and the owner sides with one of the other.

Edited May 3, 2018 by corta765

[Soda Popinski]

At that level, really you're managing your people, not the football side.   Or the Hockey side.   

[YoloinOhio]

37 minutes ago, Soda Popinski said:

Kim said as much in her interview on NFLN a few weeks ago.  She said they don't watch tape, don't do evaluations.   They leave that to the people they pay to do it.  

Yep I just watched that yesterday. She said they just want to be in the conversations and meet the players but aren’t making decisions on their ability.

[Soda Popinski]

Just now, YoloinOhio said:

Yep I just watched that yesterday. She said they just want to be in the conversations and meet the players but aren’t making decisions on their ability.

I see her as a good influence on the organization.   She killed that interview, I love Terry, but sometimes his interviews aren't half as good as hers.   

[xxxxxxxx]

They handed a 4-3 league leading defense over to a head coach who only runs a 3-4, and then fired that coach and replaced him with a 4-3 guy.

And they let the 4-3  guy (who has never developed a pro level qb) trade up for a project qb that a college OC who is known for running the ball will have to mold into an NFL success. Like all the interviews you want, and while I have nothing against Kim personally, it all starts at the top, and you can't convince me that a competitive search would not turn up a better candidate for the job.

 

 

 

Edited May 3, 2018 by MURPHD6

[corta765]

13 minutes ago, Soda Popinski said:

I see her as a good influence on the organization.   She killed that interview, I love Terry, but sometimes his interviews aren't half as good as hers.   

 

She is a farrrr better voice to be speaking then Terry. I trust her when she talks, Terry is nice and all but aloof as heck or at least seems that way.

[Soda Popinski]

Just now, corta765 said:

 

She is a farrrr better voice to be speaking then Terry. I trust her when she talks, Terry is nice and all but aloof as heck or at least seems that way.

I think he's just not a good public speaker.  IDK what Kim's college background was, but if you asked me after that interview I'd say she has a PHD in public relations.   

[eball]

1 minute ago, corta765 said:

 

She is a farrrr better voice to be speaking then Terry. I trust her when she talks, Terry is nice and all but aloof as heck or at least seems that way.

 

It's a bad idea to correlate public speaking ability with intelligence, intuition, business acumen, etc.  The man is a billionaire.

[corta765]

1 minute ago, eball said:

 

It's a bad idea to correlate public speaking ability with intelligence, intuition, business acumen, etc.  The man is a billionaire.

 

By the same token there are a lotttt of rich people who are not necessarily the brightest. I don't doubt Terry isn't smart, but for a major sports org where everything is analyzed inside and out she comes off far better then he does. I am sure in the business world he is far more savy then her tenfold.

 

Half of being a sports owner is PR relations and managing it correctly. She excels at that where he just isn't as strong.

Edited May 3, 2018 by corta765

[eball]

2 minutes ago, corta765 said:

 

By the same token there are a lotttt of rich people who are not necessarily the brightest. I don't doubt Terry isn't smart, but for a major sports org where everything is analyzed inside and out she comes off far better then he does. I am sure in the business world he is far more savy then her tenfold.

 

Half of being a sports owner is PR relations and managing it correctly. She excels at that where he just isn't as strong.

 

I don't think you understand my point so I'm not going to continue the discussion.  Yes, Kim comes across very well in public.

[Lurker]

Not worried.   

 

After living through Ralph's era, nothing Kim can do could ever be any worse...

[Mat68]

1 hour ago, MURPHD6 said:

They handed a 4-3 league leading defense over to a head coach who only runs a 3-4, and then fired that coach and replaced him with a 4-3 guy.

And they let the 4-3  guy (who has never developed a pro level qb) trade up for a project qb that a college OC who is known for running the ball will have to mold into an NFL success. Like all the interviews you want, and while I have nothing against Kim personally, it all starts at the top, and you can't convince me that a competitive search would not turn up a better candidate for the job.

 

 

 

This is where they madena mistake.  They were sold on the guy and not aware of the vision.  I can hear Rex say that his defense is multiple and he can get more out of an already good unit.  They listened to Brandon and paid deerly for it.  Since Mcdermott and Beane I think the plan was always for Kim to become the more controling intrest of the two and president of both makes sense.  Timing is never perfect.  So what bettet way to get out infront of a probably sexual harresment story than to replace the man with a female minority?  The pegulas seem smart enough to let people they hire to do their jobs, but in the beginning were too ignorant of the profression to know who to empower and what to look for.

[US Egg]

We've witnessed the on field results of the Bills with Brandon in numerous positions of team building,  he wasn't impressive in any way when doing that.

 

So he was excellent at marketing. Want to know the best way to market a team ? Build a team that wins and makes the playoffs at least once in awhile .

 

•  

Edited May 3, 2018 by Ifartalot