Dan Jeremiah - Bills covet Allen

[Seventeen]

1 minute ago, Bobby Hooks said:

I can cherry pick too. It’s a waste of time. 

 

Just like choosing a project qb in the first. 

 

Sure you can and that's why you or anyone else has no idea of how successful Allen will be in the pros.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

6 minutes ago, BillsVet said:

 

GMs who play it safe get fired just like those who take calculated risks. 

 

GMs who don't provide their team with options get fired as well. To enter the season with McCarron and Peterman isn't much better than going with EJM, Thad Lewis, and Jeff Tuel. 

 

The guy who pulled that stunt got fired. 

 

 

...in a potentially lucrative QB clas year, rest assured McBeane is taking one IMO...may not be the consensus pick, but I'd bet he takes a QB....forget "wait 'til next year" crap....it may never come....

[Putin]

35 minutes ago, peterpan said:

Im sure there is a die hard bills fan out there who works for the NSA.  Or has a Russian connection, who could work to hack the other teams draft boards and help us aquire the next all pro QB, which is Rosen.  Knowing who wants whom would really help us maneuver. 

For the right price anything is possible 

[sven233]

If this is true and the Bills love Allen, then I think a big thank you is needed for the Jets for the trade they made yesterday.  If the Bills had intentions of trading a ton of assets away to get into the top 5 only to draft Josh Allen, then the Jets may have done the Bills a huge favor yesterday.  The only thing that is worse than not being able to trade for for the guy that we want is trading up for Josh Allen.

 

If Allen makes it to 12 on his own, I am still not sure I want to draft him anyways.  But trading multiple first and 2nd round picks for Allen would be a disaster.

 

Look.....Allen could very well be good someday.  Who knows, he could turn out to be the best QB in the class, but man.....there is a much better chance that he won't be and I would prefer some other team to take that chance.

Edited March 18, 2018 by sven233

[Mango]

48 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

NFL careers are on the line with whatever they do. The safer choice might be to stay at 12 and see what AJ McCarron can do this year.

 

You could make the same arguement the other way. NFL careers are on the line here, we can’t go into the season with just McCarron. 

 

For me, I don’t mind sending a bunch of draft capital to move up, take our guy, and have McCarron turn into a stud. I see it as an investment in the position not the player. If it costs the Bills 2 firsts this year and maybe one next year, and McCarron is the man, then so be it, it’s the cost of the position for the next 15 years. 

[RyanC883]

52 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

NFL careers are on the line with whatever they do. The safer choice might be to stay at 12 and see what AJ McCarron can do this year.

 

not a terrible option.  It's possible that Mayfield falls to 12, which would be fantastic, IMO.  

 

Allen needs to sit behind a vet.  I see the Steelers, Saints, etc. taking him .  

[Seventeen]

2 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

You could make the same arguement the other way. NFL careers are on the line here, we can’t go into the season with just McCarron. 

 

For me, I don’t mind sending a bunch of draft capital to move up, take our guy, and have McCarron turn into a stud. I see it as an investment in the position not the player. If it costs the Bills 2 firsts this year and maybe one next year, and McCarron is the man, then so be it, it’s the cost of the position for the next 15 years. 

 

If it's Rosen, I have a big issue with trading three #1s for a guy that's is possibly one more concussion from being out of the league. Especially when his dad is a doctor and would probably advise him to hang it up. And I'm aware there are varying levels of concussions, but there has to be some cumulative effect and possibility of CTE. 

[alluro]

The classic counter point to the accuracy problem is of course hall of famer Brett Favre. He finished his college career with a 52.4% completion percentage and finished his NFL career with a 62.0% completion percentage. Allen certainly has a Favre-like cannon.

 

FWIW, I hope Buffalo gets Lamar Jackson. He has more upside than anyone in this class and a fairly safe floor. At worst, you're getting a better passing version of Tyrod with way more ability to run. 

[Seventeen]

5 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

 

not a terrible option.  It's possible that Mayfield falls to 12, which would be fantastic, IMO.  

 

Allen needs to sit behind a vet.  I see the Steelers, Saints, etc. taking him .  

 

Steelers would have to move up and do they have enough draft capital to make it happen ? 

[BuffAlone]

24 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

I don't think we have enough or the a highest 1 to make it worth while for the Giants...

Yeah, I think we do. But I just don't see Beane doing that. I've pretty much reserved myself to the notion that if any of "the big 4" fall to 12 we probably draft him. Otherwise, the search continues

[Seventeen]

1 minute ago, alluro said:

The classic counter point to the accuracy problem is of course hall of famer Brett Favre. He finished his college career with a 52.4% completion percentage and finished his NFL career with a 62.0% completion percentage. Allen certainly has a Favre-like cannon.

 

FWIW, I hope Buffalo gets Lamar Jackson. He has more upside than anyone in this class and a fairly safe floor. At worst, you're getting a better passing version of Tyrod with way more ability to run. 

 

Jury's out on whether Jackson is a better passer than Tyrod whose NFL stats are not bad at all. 

[Victory Formation]

I actually like Allen the most out of any QB in the draft, not enough to trade the farm for, but enough to trade up to #6 without hesitation. Guy has a golden arm, very mobile and can break tackles. I think Allen is a perfect fit for Buffalo and we are the ideal landing spot for him as well IMO.

[starrymessenger]

27 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

I don't think we have enough or the a highest 1 to make it worth while for the Giants...

 

There is always next years first for example. Not saying I would do it and I doubt Beane would go there either.

[Tierlifer]

49 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

...yup....for all we know, maybe it's Woody Allen......

Former Met and Cardinal Neil Allen. The key component of trade that netted Keith Hernandez 

[GoBills808]

Hope so. He's going to be great.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

Allbright already stated that the Bills are purposely shoving this info out there to multiple sources. DJ is likely one of them. 

 

OBD has been vacuum sealed on info since Beane’s team got there. Everything they’ve done was sans leak. Except for what they wanted out there - that they wouldn’t cut TT so if you want him, better trade for him. Now all of a sudden they are leaking real info about the most important decision in their world? Think about that, please.

I still think they like Rosen

[Reed83HOF]

8 minutes ago, BuffAlone said:

Yeah, I think we do. But I just don't see Beane doing that. I've pretty much reserved myself to the notion that if any of "the big 4" fall to 12 we probably draft him. Otherwise, the search continues

I should be careful how I say that, it will take the top 3 rounds of of this draft and possibly the top 2 of next year; which is why I said we don't have enough...

[BuffAlone]

1 minute ago, Reed83HOF said:

I should be careful how I say that, it will take the top 3 rounds of of this draft and possibly the top 2 of next year; which is why I said we don't have enough...

Again, if that's a possibility for them to get our guy, do it. But that doesn't seem likely now. And I don't see them reaching for scraps at a huge price. That's all I meant

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

10 minutes ago, Tierlifer said:

Former Met and Cardinal Neil Allen. The key component of trade that netted Keith Hernandez 

 

...QB attributes so we can fulfill the ALLEN need somehow, any how??.....

[Reed83HOF]

7 minutes ago, starrymessenger said:

 

There is always next years first for example. Not saying I would do it and I doubt Beane would go there either.

I think we will be into next year's 1 & 2 in order to go up in addition to this years top 2 or 3 rounds...I don't think the giants will want to slide to 12. They would rather have Nelson + the 22 and so forth

1 minute ago, BuffAlone said:

Again, if that's a possibility for them to get our guy, do it. But that doesn't seem likely now. And I don't see them reaching for scraps at a huge price. That's all I meant

I agree

[Steptide]

Keep playing the game beane, keep playing the game.... 

[Nihilarian]

11 minutes ago, Bobby Hooks said:

The mindset of blowing another first rounder and trying to “fix” a qb with serious accuracy issues is absurd. 

 

Have we not experimented enough on the talented non-accurate qbs enough? 

 

Im over high ceiling prospects. Give me accuracy or give me death!!!!

I've got a news flash for ya! It's that none of the QB's in this year's draft class are a perfect day one starter. All of them have warts and issues. Allen has the highest ceiling if developed properly. Think Big Ben, Arron Rodgers, and a Matthew Stafford who can run. 

 

It just so happens that Allen went 9 of 13 for 158 yards, 2 TD's in the senior bowl. Which shows the NFL scouts that he has already improved on his passing completion percentage with a better supporting cast then he had in college. 

 

 

Cherry picking? It's not only Matthew Stafford, Jay Cutler, Russell Wilson, Tyrod Taylor. Recent QBs who improved their completion percentage from college to the pros.

 

Check out one of the greatest all-time QBs ever in Joe Montana who in his freshman season had a comp% of 42.4% to his final year of 54.2 which is worse than Allen's. One other guy I might mention is Brett Favre who's freshman season started with a 40.7 completion percentage and he finished with 54.5 and averaging 52.4. 

 

So, don't tell me that a kid who only played two seasons of college ball can't improve his accuracy when he already showed that he did in the senior bowl ...with receivers who can actually catch the ball. 

[Bobby Hooks]

Just now, Nihilarian said:

I've got a news flash for ya! It's that none of the QB's in this year's draft class are a perfect day one starter. All of them have warts and issues. Allen has the highest ceiling if developed properly. Think Big Ben, Arron Rodgers, and a Matthew Stafford who can run. 

 

It just so happens that Allen went 9 of 13 for 158 yards, 2 TD's in the senior bowl. Which shows the NFL scouts that he has already improved on his passing completion percentage with a better supporting cast then he had in college. 

 

 

Cherry picking? It's not only Matthew Stafford, Jay Cutler, Russell Wilson, Tyrod Taylor. Recent QBs who improved their completion percentage from college to the pros.

 

Check out one of the greatest all-time QBs ever in Joe Montana who in his freshman season had a comp% of 42.4% to his final year of 54.2 which is worse than Allen's. One other guy I might mention is Brett Favre who's freshman season started with a 40.7 completion percentage and he finished with 54.5 and averaging 52.4. 

 

So, don't tell me that a kid who only played two seasons of college ball can't improve his accuracy when he already showed that he did in the senior bowl ...with receivers who can actually catch the ball. 

...tldr

[Augie]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

Allbright already stated that the Bills are purposely shoving this info out there to multiple sources. DJ is likely one of them. 

 

OBD has been vacuum sealed on info since Beane’s team got there. Everything they’ve done was sans leak. Except for what they wanted out there - that they wouldn’t cut TT so if you want him, better trade for him. Now all of a sudden they are leaking real info about the most important decision in their world? Think about that, please.

BUT.......what does it MEAN???

[RiotAct]

1 hour ago, Nihilarian said:

NFL careers are on the line with whatever they do. The safer choice might be to stay at 12 and see what AJ McCarron can do this year.

yes, that would be very safe.

[Nihilarian]

2 minutes ago, Bobby Hooks said:

...tldr

Thanks for quoting it so other Bills fans can read it again. 

[Reed83HOF]

31 minutes ago, alluro said:

FWIW, I hope Buffalo gets Lamar Jackson. He has more upside than anyone in this class and a fairly safe floor. At worst, you're getting a better passing version of Tyrod with way more ability to run. 

That's not making a good case for him....

[Bobby Hooks]

19 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

Thanks for quoting it so other Bills fans can read it again. 

Baker Mayfield ftw! 

[Seventeen]

6 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

Thanks for quoting it so other Bills fans can read it again. 

 

Funny thing is that if Allen was around 60% in college, this board would be slobbering all over him. 

[NewEra]

1 hour ago, DCOrange said:

To be fair, Allbright also pointed out that it's the same source as the guy that leaked out Buffalo's interest in Peterman and Buffalo has been leaking interest in literally every QB lol

Peterman was drafted in the 5th rd.....they must have really loved him.

[Lurker]

1 hour ago, BillsEnthusiast said:

Josh Allen's Accuracy Problems are "Overblown"

 

Might as well start damage control. 

 

LOL.... "overblown" says Jordan Palmer, he of 18 (count em, 18), NFL passing attempts in a four year career, who just happens to be paid by Allen to be his "consultant."

 

Yeah, that's a credible source....

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, aristocrat said:

I don’t believe for a second anyone other than beane knows what qb he likes 

 

Presumably the Head Coach, Assistant GM and Director of College Scouting know? 

[MrEpsYtown]

5 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Peterman was drafted in the 5th rd.....they must have really loved him.

 

Yep after they passed on him for Matt Milano in the fifth. Definitely a sense of urgency there.  

[Nihilarian]

13 minutes ago, RiotAct said:

yes, that would be very safe.

Well, look at it this way if Allen, Rosen, and Darnold are all taken with the first three picks and the Bills don't like Mayfield. At the 12 pick to 22 they have some really great choices to consider that they didn't have at 21. 

 

OT Mike McGlinchey

DT Veta Vea

DE Marcus Davenport

WR Calvin Ridley

WR Cortland Sutton

LB Leighton VanderEsch

CB Denzel Ward

OT Orlando Brown

RB Derrius Guice 

OT Connor Williams

C James Daniels

Are just some of the list between 12 and 22 with one solid starter and perhaps Mason Rudolph at 22 to develop along with Peterman. 

 

[YoloinOhio]

1 hour ago, Reed83HOF said:

I don't think we have enough or the a highest 1 to make it worth while for the Giants...

It will probably take 3 #1s and a 2nd (12,22, 53 and  next year’s 1st) to move up 10 spots this year. I definitely think the NYG will be in. Not sure if Bills will ultimately do it but we won’t know until draft day, because whatever is on the table now they won’t pull the trigger until they are on the clock and their guy is there at 2.

 

jets moving up 3 spots in March to 3 makes no sense. They don’t even know if their guy will be there and they gave up a ton. 

Edited March 18, 2018 by YoloinOhio

[Reed83HOF]

9 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

It will probably take 3 #1s and a 2nd (12,22, 53 and  next year’s 1st) to move up 10 spots this year. I definitely think the NYG will be in. Not sure if Bills will ultimately do it but we won’t know until draft day, because whatever is on the table now they won’t pull the trigger until they are on the clock and their guy is there at 2.

 

jets moving up 3 spots in March to 3 makes no sense. They don’t even know if their guy will be there and they gave up a ton. 

 

I hope it's that cheap...

[NewEra]

11 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

It will probably take 3 #1s and a 2nd (12,22, 53 and  next year’s 1st) to move up 10 spots this year. I definitely think the NYG will be in. Not sure if Bills will ultimately do it but we won’t know until draft day, because whatever is on the table now they won’t pull the trigger until they are on the clock and their guy is there at 2.

 

jets moving up 3 spots in March to 3 makes no sense. They don’t even know if their guy will be there and they gave up a ton. 

It makes a LOT of sense if they really like 3 QBs.  

[Nihilarian]

15 minutes ago, Looper said:

 

Funny thing is that if Allen was around 60% in college, this board would be slobbering all over him. 

The sad fact is that some Bills fans are simply far too lazy to look into the reasons as to why Allen's completion percentage didn't improve in his last season at Wyoming. Due to the fact that the entire class of 2016 that touched the football had moved on and he was dealing with all rookies who were constantly dropping passes.  He was literally running for his life most games and yet the team still went 8-5 and won their bowl game. Or that his YPA was a mere 6.7 in college and at the Senior bowl that improved to 12.2. 

 

Most fans would rather sit back and regurgitate what others are saying that accuracy can't be fixed ...which I've already shown is ridiculous to say.  

 

There is a real reason as to why a lot of NFL scouts and draft analysts have Josh Allen as the #1 pick overall going to the Browns. Come to think of it I don't know why I even bother attempting to enlighten my fellow fans should they want to end it all should the Bills actually draft this kid. Simply because he will be gone after the first three picks...unless they trade up to two to draft him. 

[gobills1212]

2 hours ago, starrymessenger said:

Jeremiah nailed the Spiller pick which surprised most observers, so he's been right before. He has also trotted this Allen to the Bills interest several times. There were as many and similar questions regarding Cam's accuracy as a passer before his draft (despite his better completion percentage) and Allen probably did better than Cam in the combine passing drills. Allen is not, as some maintain, a third round prospect. EJ was a third round prospect (again despite his better completion percentage). Allen is much better and is completely legit as a first rounder. All things considered he would not be my choice, especially if we have to trade up again, (I'd take Lamar ahead of him) but if he winds up being the guy I will have no problem getting behind him 100%. 

You had me until Lamar lol

[YoloinOhio]

4 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

The sad fact is that some Bills fans are simply far too lazy to look into the reasons as to why Allen's completion percentage didn't improve in his last season at Wyoming. Due to the fact that the entire class of 2016 that touched the football had moved on and he was dealing with all rookies who were constantly dropping passes.  He was literally running for his life most games and yet the team still went 8-5 and won their bowl game. Or that his YPA was a mere 6.7 in college and at the Senior bowl that improved to 12.2. 

 

Most fans would rather sit back and regurgitate what others are saying that accuracy can't be fixed ...which I've already shown is ridiculous to say.  

 

There is a real reason as to why a lot of NFL scouts and draft analysts have Josh Allen as the #1 pick overall going to the Browns. Come to think of it I don't know why I even bother attempting to enlighten my fellow fans should they want to end it all should the Bills actually draft this kid. Simply because he will be gone after the first three picks...unless they trade up to two to draft him. 

I admit to watching zero Wyoming football outside of a passing glance. I have seen a few of the others though. I do think all the negativity surrounding Allen is interesting considering so many actual NFL people see him as a very high pick. 

 

The only reason that I don’t think he’s the Bills plan A guy is that he is not ready to play yet and is more of a project like Mahomes. The Bills traded away their starting QB and then were very passive about acquiring a QB in FA. This tells me they are targeting a QB is more of a day 1 starter. That’s not allen. Coupled with that are the reports that they are feeding nfl reporters info that they want allen ... means they don’t but they want everyone to think they do so they can manipulate draft position. 

Edited March 18, 2018 by YoloinOhio