BillsVet Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 From Peter King's MMQB this AM: Baalke knew the Bills weren't going to take Kaepernick or Dalton at 34, and he figured Cincy would take Dalton at 35. Peter King reported leading up to the 2011 draft that Buffalo was a "black hole" of information. Unlike teams that attempt to use subterfuge, the Bills buttoned up completely that year. Yet, how did SF and presumably other teams needing a QB know the Bills would not take either Kaepernick or Dalton? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 A lot of times teams will get information from agents/families/reps of draft-eligible players. It's pretty easy to speak to an agent or player and find out if Team X has spoken to them. Also, GMs spend a lot of time at the draft conversing about all kinds of things, so it's not out of the question for Nix and Baalke to have spoken briefly before day 2 began and Baalke to have gotten the impression that Nix wasn't picking a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 There's too much we don't know to answer that question, and by even asking it you're assuming King's information is accurate (which it may not be). Remember, King gets his tidbits from insiders who also have their own agendas to promote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Hindsight is also a wonderful thing Coming out now and saying that the 49ers GM knew Buffalo wouldn't take a QB, and the Bengals would take Dalton at 35 is much easier a year or 2 later Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Linen Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 A lot of times teams will get information from agents/families/reps of draft-eligible players. It's pretty easy to speak to an agent or player and find out if Team X has spoken to them. Also, GMs spend a lot of time at the draft conversing about all kinds of things, so it's not out of the question for Nix and Baalke to have spoken briefly before day 2 began and Baalke to have gotten the impression that Nix wasn't picking a QB. Yeah but why would an agent/family member/rep say "no that team hasn't talked to us"? That would only hurt the player and allow him to slip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Yeah but why would an agent/family member/rep say "no that team hasn't talked to us"? That would only hurt the player and allow him to slip. I don't think they'd say that, but they might say "yeah, we've talked to Team A, Team B, etc.", which would allow a GM to deduce who might be interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 98% of all secrets are revealed the same way: Alcohol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 From Peter King's MMQB this AM: Baalke knew the Bills weren't going to take Kaepernick or Dalton at 34, and he figured Cincy would take Dalton at 35. Peter King reported leading up to the 2011 draft that Buffalo was a "black hole" of information. Unlike teams that attempt to use subterfuge, the Bills buttoned up completely that year. Yet, how did SF and presumably other teams needing a QB know the Bills would not take either Kaepernick or Dalton? Because the Bills were too stupid to take a QB and believed in one that everyone knew wasnt very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 A lot of BS. I guess you can say the Bills spend a ton of money on Fitz, so they likely won't spend another high pick on a guy. at the same time, the 49ers believed so much in Kaepernick that they tried to sign Manning and re-signed Smith. 20-20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Doug Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 This is sad. Buffalo (Nix) became so predictably dumb as to not take a QB when they should have been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 From Peter King's MMQB this AM: Baalke knew the Bills weren't going to take Kaepernick or Dalton at 34, and he figured Cincy would take Dalton at 35. Peter King reported leading up to the 2011 draft that Buffalo was a "black hole" of information. Unlike teams that attempt to use subterfuge, the Bills buttoned up completely that year. Yet, how did SF and presumably other teams needing a QB know the Bills would not take either Kaepernick or Dalton? I knew you would create this thread. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mead107 Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 They had no idea he would turn out the way he did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 A lot of BS. I guess you can say the Bills spend a ton of money on Fitz, so they likely won't spend another high pick on a guy. at the same time, the 49ers believed so much in Kaepernick that they tried to sign Manning and re-signed Smith. 20-20. 2011 draft was before Fitz's extension, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pirate Angel Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 From Peter King's MMQB this AM: Baalke knew the Bills weren't going to take Kaepernick or Dalton at 34, and he figured Cincy would take Dalton at 35. Peter King reported leading up to the 2011 draft that Buffalo was a "black hole" of information. Unlike teams that attempt to use subterfuge, the Bills buttoned up completely that year. Yet, how did SF and presumably other teams needing a QB know the Bills would not take either Kaepernick or Dalton? Kaepernick is not in the SEC....I also believe that they mentioned that Fitz is there guy at the time ...Honestly I doubt they new they maybe they just took the highest rated player on the board when they where on the clock. Alot of tape on Kapernick was a run first mentality..not always attractive to the NFL but maybe they had more info on the guy being SF is closest to Nevada Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 (edited) A lot of BS. I guess you can say the Bills spend a ton of money on Fitz, so they likely won't spend another high pick on a guy. at the same time, the 49ers believed so much in Kaepernick that they tried to sign Manning and re-signed Smith. 20-20. Jim Harbaugh already had a #1 overall pick at QB in Alex Smith and resurrected him from a QB that couldn't win, that nobody wanted, to a playoff caliber player. Which still wasn't good enough for him so tried to sign Manning and he drafted Colin Kaepernick. Pete Carroll in Seattle with Matt Hasselbeck, Charlie Whitehurst Matt Flynn, Tavaris Jackson, then drafted Russell Wilson, Mike Shanahan in Washington with Donovan McNabb, Rex Grossman, John Beck, then gave up the farm for RG3, and still drafted Kirk Cousins in the same year. Top, smart, very good head coaches keep working,and looking to obtain that elusive "elite" QB that can win a SB for them. Unlike the Buffalo Bills with Nix & Gailey who stuck with Fitz for 3 years and didn't even bring in reasonable competition for the QB position is a big reason why the team doesn't win many games. P.S. Someone please explain how Buddy Nix missed so badly by drafting DB Aaron Williams with a #2 pick right before Andy Dalton in the 2011 draft. There was no Tom Modrak excuse for the 2011 Draft. Besides CJ Spiller (who was Gaileys waterbug) where are all the future pro bowlers from the Buddy Nix drafts? This is the man the Buffalo Bills are trusting to find their franchise QB? Edited January 28, 2013 by FeartheLosing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 How did SF know? Lil Donte Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickelCity Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Jim Harbaugh already had a #1 overall pick at QB in Alex Smith and resurrected him from a QB that couldn't win, that nobody wanted, to a playoff caliber player. Which still wasn't good enough for him so tried to sign Manning and he drafted Colin Kaepernick. Pete Carroll in Seattle with Matt Hasselbeck, Charlie Whitehurst Matt Flynn, Tavaris Jackson, then drafted Russell Wilson, Mike Shanahan in Washington with Donovan McNabb, Rex Grossman, John Beck, then gave up the farm for RG3, and still drafted Kirk Cousins in the same year. Top, smart, very good head coaches keep working,and looking to obtain that elusive "elite" QB that can win a SB for them. Unlike the Buffalo Bills with Nix & Gailey who stuck with Fitz for 3 years and didn't even bring in reasonable competition for the QB position is a big reason why the team doesn't win many games. +1 With the rookie pay scale, I am fully on board with taking QBs each year until we find our own 'elite' qb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted January 28, 2013 Author Share Posted January 28, 2013 There was no Tom Modrak excuse for the 2011 Draft. Modrak was fired 5/4/2011. I knew you would create this thread. PTR Yes, because I start no more than 5 threads a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 They knew because Fitz looked like a guy worth developing at that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mob16151 Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Jim Harbaugh already had a #1 overall pick at QB in Alex Smith and resurrected him from a QB that couldn't win, that nobody wanted, to a playoff caliber player. Which still wasn't good enough for him so tried to sign Manning and he drafted Colin Kaepernick. You do realize he tried to sign Manning'even after having drafted Kaepernick 'and having him on the roster for a season. So obviously even the 49ers weren't really sold on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Linen Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 I don't think they'd say that, but they might say "yeah, we've talked to Team A, Team B, etc.", which would allow a GM to deduce who might be interested. And you don't think the agent knows who the teams that need QB's are and wouldn't say they have all called? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDS Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 98% of all secrets are revealed the same way: Alcohol. lockbox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted January 29, 2013 Author Share Posted January 29, 2013 lockbox. What about just good old fashioned strategery? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Might have had something to do with Modrak's frequent flyer points to Missouri. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthymcnasty08 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Jim Harbaugh already had a #1 overall pick at QB in Alex Smith and resurrected him from a QB that couldn't win, that nobody wanted, to a playoff caliber player. Which still wasn't good enough for him so tried to sign Manning and he drafted Colin Kaepernick. Pete Carroll in Seattle with Matt Hasselbeck, Charlie Whitehurst Matt Flynn, Tavaris Jackson, then drafted Russell Wilson, Mike Shanahan in Washington with Donovan McNabb, Rex Grossman, John Beck, then gave up the farm for RG3, and still drafted Kirk Cousins in the same year. Top, smart, very good head coaches keep working,and looking to obtain that elusive "elite" QB that can win a SB for them. Unlike the Buffalo Bills with Nix & Gailey who stuck with Fitz for 3 years and didn't even bring in reasonable competition for the QB position is a big reason why the team doesn't win many games. P.S. Someone please explain how Buddy Nix missed so badly by drafting DB Aaron Williams with a #2 pick right before Andy Dalton in the 2011 draft. There was no Tom Modrak excuse for the 2011 Draft. Besides CJ Spiller (who was Gaileys waterbug) where are all the future pro bowlers from the Buddy Nix drafts? This is the man the Buffalo Bills are trusting to find their franchise QB? mmmthissssssssssss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KollegeStudnet Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 98% of all secrets are revealed the same way: Alcohol. Tis' true Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAWNDO Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 IIRC Never Give Up mentioned right after the pick that they needed to upgrade the CB position. Epic Fail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 (edited) Jim Harbaugh already had a #1 overall pick at QB in Alex Smith and resurrected him from a QB that couldn't win, that nobody wanted, to a playoff caliber player. Which still wasn't good enough for him so tried to sign Manning and he drafted Colin Kaepernick. Pete Carroll in Seattle with Matt Hasselbeck, Charlie Whitehurst Matt Flynn, Tavaris Jackson, then drafted Russell Wilson, Mike Shanahan in Washington with Donovan McNabb, Rex Grossman, John Beck, then gave up the farm for RG3, and still drafted Kirk Cousins in the same year. Top, smart, very good head coaches keep working,and looking to obtain that elusive "elite" QB that can win a SB for them. Unlike the Buffalo Bills with Nix & Gailey who stuck with Fitz for 3 years and didn't even bring in reasonable competition for the QB position is a big reason why the team doesn't win many games. :thumbsup: Fans are FINALLY coming around about what it takes to be champions in this league... I hope Buddy doesn't cave to the pundits who would FORCE him to pick a junk QB in this draft. Fear-based decision making is an invite to dysfunction. If Buddy seizes this moment and drafts the championship Defense AVAILABLE IN THIS DRAFT, all his past screw-ups will be forgiven. Edited January 29, 2013 by #34fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Maybe its the environment Kaepernick was put into as opposed to Kaepernick? They had him sit a year behind Alex Smith, get comfortable with the system and have him take some snaps here and there. As this season went along they inserted him more and more. Then they put him in and he had success behind a great D, great coach, and a really good supporting offensive cast. They signed Moss and Manningham and already had guys like Crabtree, Gore, and Davis. They had a great O-line and a great defense. The way you groom a QB is just as important as who the QB is. Its astonishing how some people don't get this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Just after Chan Gailey was hired Peter King wrote an article stating that Gailey had told the Bills FO he could win without stars! Probably the reason Gailey hung on to Fitz for so long. Some lameoids in the FO bought that idea too. Although someone forgot to give that memo to Buddy Nix and his 100 million dollar DE. But then I suppose if you can't figure out what player to draft for 3 years...then just sign the most expensive DE you can find in free agency. I recall Ralph Wilson stating that the Bills would draft a QB in 2011, tho they never did. This leaves me to think the past 3 years have been all Buddy Nix. The man can't find a pass rusher, can't find a WR, can't find a QB, can't find a LBer in 3 years of drafting... so now suddenly the FO trusts the guy to find their franchise QB in a weak QB class. I can only hope Marrone knows what he is doing because its evident that nobody else at OBD does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 The truth is, Ralph doesn't like Kaps tats. Thought they were a roadmap to Grosse Pointe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Cain Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Since 1999 the Bills have drafted 2 QBs: JP Losman & Levi Brown. I'd say there's a 100% chance we draft a QB in '13. In 2011 Fitzpatrick had just come off a mildly successful 2010 where he went for 23tds & 15ints in 13 games. The idea was if Fitz could cut down his picks and throw a few more tds we'd be back in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 From Peter King's MMQB this AM: Baalke knew the Bills weren't going to take Kaepernick or Dalton at 34, and he figured Cincy would take Dalton at 35. Peter King reported leading up to the 2011 draft that Buffalo was a "black hole" of information. Unlike teams that attempt to use subterfuge, the Bills buttoned up completely that year. Yet, how did SF and presumably other teams needing a QB know the Bills would not take either Kaepernick or Dalton? I think it's called Twitter...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T master Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 It was pretty well known that Gailey & Nix were going to stick with Fitz as the starter that was a year when they had Levi Brown then brought in Tyler Thigpen as a back up plan b/c he knew Gailey's offense. Nix wanted to go more to the defensive side of the ball would draft there .. After all defense wins championships as long as they don't give up to many points like ours did. Alls it would have taken was a stop here & a stop there & our record this year could have looked a lot more respectable... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Several good comments on how "smart" SF really was . . . . They liked Kapernick, but if they were really SOLD on him, they would have made the trade with New England into 1st round and they would not have been so aggressive with Manning after they had Kap on roster . . . . . in the end, drafting is as much luck as it is skill . . . . but you do need skill !! . . . something the Bills have lacked over the past decade If you have time, take a look at Mel Kiper's draft guides over the past decade and his "expert" rankings are as wrong as everybody --- if you worship the Pats, look at some of the players they passed on over the past decade . . . . everybody gets it wrong . . . . the skill part of the process helps increase your odds, but all teams will make mistakes and most teams will get gems in later rounds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 if our gm was as bright as the 49ers gm we would have kaepernick. drafting is a skill some have it some don't. heres to hoping we get it right this year. trade up for Geno and everything else will fall into place IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 From Peter King's MMQB this AM: Baalke knew the Bills weren't going to take Kaepernick or Dalton at 34, and he figured Cincy would take Dalton at 35. Peter King reported leading up to the 2011 draft that Buffalo was a "black hole" of information. Unlike teams that attempt to use subterfuge, the Bills buttoned up completely that year. Yet, how did SF and presumably other teams needing a QB know the Bills would not take either Kaepernick or Dalton? He called Buddy and asked him who he was going to draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 He called Buddy and asked him who he was going to draft. The sobering thing is that you might even be correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badassgixxer05 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 P.S. Someone please explain how Buddy Nix missed so badly by drafting DB Aaron Williams with a #2 pick right before Andy Dalton in the 2011 draft. There was no Tom Modrak excuse for the 2011 Draft. Besides CJ Spiller (who was Gaileys waterbug) where are all the future pro bowlers from the Buddy Nix drafts? This is the man the Buffalo Bills are trusting to find their franchise QB? I wouldn't give up on Aaron Williams just yet. He's been battling injuries the first 2 years so far(played in only 9 in 2011 and 11 in 2012). His rookie year he showed great promise, enough so that everyone thought this past year we were set at corner with him and Gilmore starting. He took a step back and look absolutely ridiculous in coverage this year, but hoping he comes back healthy this season and regains his confidence. Dalton is Avg and would be 6-10 just like fitz, or worse on this team. If fitz had A.J. Green to throw to opposite of stevie, were in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 I wouldn't give up on Aaron Williams just yet. He's been battling injuries the first 2 years so far(played in only 9 in 2011 and 11 in 2012). His rookie year he showed great promise, enough so that everyone thought this past year we were set at corner with him and Gilmore starting. He took a step back and look absolutely ridiculous in coverage this year, but hoping he comes back healthy this season and regains his confidence. Dalton is Avg and would be 6-10 just like fitz, or worse on this team. If fitz had A.J. Green to throw to opposite of stevie, were in the playoffs. Is it possible to injure your football IQ and instincts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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