Tyler Dunne story on McDermott - 3 parts, 25 interviews, one damning conclusion

[Warcodered]

7 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

Journalists should only report complimentary descriptions from sources.

That wasn't journalism, a bunch of quotes surrounded with his own opinion that frames a narrative he's trying to create, yeah that's not it.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

5 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

I fully acknowledge that Dunne likely has a bias here, but it seems appropriate to question the character of a guy who praises the 9/11 terrorists organizational ability and won't take responsibility, like when he reportedly blamed the offense for 13 seconds, 

 

I mean.. imagine the shock after losing that game though.  Obviously he's deflecting blame and pissed off.  In a loss like that, everyones pointing fingers - the seasons over and everyones unhappy. 

 

I like the idea of getting some understanding of the locker room and the long form story.  But to just take like... quotes about something that happened years ago and not really contextualize it.  Were people arguing?  People say dumb stuff when they're arguing. 

[Wayne Arnold]

1 minute ago, Warcodered said:

That wasn't journalism, a bunch of quotes surrounded with his own opinion that frames a narrative he's trying to create, yeah that's not it.

 

Ok.

 

Reporters should only report complimentary descriptions from sources.

[DC Greg]

9 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

my grain of salt is Bill B comes across as a narcissistic control freak too as did Parcels. Polian was widely reported to be a complete ahole. I think to be an nfl coach some of these personality defects are a feature not a bug. 

 

Yeah, but those are coaching legends who don't crap their pants when the game is on the line and have 12 men on the field, call timeouts that help the other team, throw dumb challenge flags, have the defense out of position and generally unprepared, have the offense take a knee, and everything else that McDermott does to lose games. I could care less about this hit piece and whatever aspects of his personality are being discussed here.

 

I don't care if he's a jerk or a saint, I care if he can coach. And at this point, he has proven THAT HE CANNOT. He is SINGLEHANDEDLY losing this team games with his cowardly, deer-in-headlights coaching in any tight game. Enough is enough. That's why he needs fired, not because of any of this crap. It's remarkable how obviously bad he is whenever the game is on the line. He's the anti-clutch and everyone knows it. Dump this hack already.

[Bruffalo]

2 minutes ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:

 

I mean.. imagine the shock after losing that game though.  Obviously he's deflecting blame and pissed off.  In a loss like that, everyones pointing fingers - the seasons over and everyones unhappy. 

 

I like the idea of getting some understanding of the locker room and the long form story.  But to just take like... quotes about something that happened years ago and not really contextualize it.  Were people arguing?  People say dumb stuff when they're arguing. 

 

It's understandable to give him the benefit of the doubt, I just don't think that leeway is appropriate anymore. 

[eme123]

At the end of the day 25 former players, coaches, and staff decided to give their two cents on what an aweful person mcdermott is. What is really amazing is not one of these 25 people was willing to offer their name with their thoughts. 

[boco357]

13 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Got a linky?  Not that it's a surprise.

Just listening on wgr.

[1ManRaid]

25 minutes ago, McBean said:

Getting caught up on WGR from yesterday where a caller named Sean called in to Schoop and Bulldog saying McDermott doesn’t deserve this treatment and bad publicity…

 

Well Sean, if you are on here, I’d like to say to you…WHAT AN ABSOLUTE HORRIBLE BS COMMENT AND RANT!

 

MCDERMOTT owes this fan base and city an apology. He owes us a resignation. 
 

What McDermott has done for us? He hasn’t done a mother bleepin thing but screw it all up. ANDY DALTON broke the streak followed up by the selection of JOSHUA ALLEN AS QB THAT OUR BUM HC HAS HID BEHIND.

 

If people credit McDermott for turning this around and not Allen, you are on drugs. Insanity!

 

Oh stop with this Dalton ended our streak nonsense.  That's loser mentality, same as the diaper wearers who always say we "didn't deserve to win" our close games.  Similar to when all someone sees is the 1 turnover in a 4 TD game.

 

The rest of the game matters.  The rest of the season matters.  Dalton was a great story, but NO MORE RELEVANT to our season or success than any other play or game through our or anyone else in the AFC's season.  We won as many games as we needed to win.  Anything else is irrelevant because Dalton doesn't even get mentioned if we had a different result in ANY of our games.  One additional win or loss and what someone else did for another team isn't even a blip on our radar.

[Gregg]

13 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

my grain of salt is Bill B comes across as a narcissistic control freak too as did Parcels. Polian was widely reported to be a complete ahole. I think to be an nfl coach some of these personality defects are a feature not a bug. 

 

Behind the scenes Bill is supposedly a funny guy from what his players/coaches have said. He is the opposite of his press conferences with the media where he sounds like a robot or a miserable guy answering questions. He has earned the right to be a control freak with his 9 Super Bowl appearances and 6 Lombardi trophies. Winning buys you credibility with the players, coaching staff, and fans.

[Paul Costa]

16 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

I fully acknowledge that Dunne likely has a bias here, but it seems appropriate to question the character of a guy who praises the 9/11 terrorists organizational ability and won't take responsibility, like when he reportedly blamed the offense for 13 seconds, 

What coaches or players said McDermott blamed the offense? I didn’t see any name’s attached to said events. Did you? Not saying it’s not true but there’s zero proof that it is true. 

[Warcodered]

5 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

Ok.

 

Reporters should only report complimentary descriptions from sources.

It's an opinion piece it isn't news, and why don't you find where I said they shouldn't do either of those things you decided to just copy and paste if that's what you're saying. Someone said it didn't attack his character it did, saying it didn't is just ridiculous.

[Scott7975]

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

We're going to have to agree to disagree on this one.  Goodwin was in my opinion a lousy route runner and poor at tracking the ball while he was with Buffalo.  It was only when he got over making "career decisions" to save himself for his Olympic dreams and decided to earn his contract with San Francisco that his abilities as a WR leveled up.

 

I mean, Come On Man, in his 4 years in Buffalo he had a catch % of 44%.  Even in SFO his first year it was 53%.  You do you, but painting that as "perfect for Allen's cannon" strikes me as highly revisionist.  Foster Part Deux.

 

He was good enough to get 58 catches for just shy of 1000 yards with Brian Hoyer, Jimmy Garrapololololololol, and CJ Beathard as his QBs in SF the year after leaving Buffalo.  He is better than Robert Foster who is what Allen had.  His problem was he was made of glass.  At the time we got him, he was one of the fastest receivers in the league which is great for a guy that can blaze a ball 50-60 yards with the flick of a wrist.  I don't care that he wasn't a good route runner.  With a QB like Allen all I need is for him to run streaks down the field and play decoy while Allen has two other very good receivers to throw to.  He'd get some big plays too.

 

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

You're entitled to your opinion but no, while I wouldn't say they were terrible, I don't think that's a particularly talented crew, especially for a raw rookie QB.  I grant that the OL was halfway decent.  You're kinda stretching Chandler's productivity.  He did have one >600 yd year.

 

As you are entitled to your opinion but no, it was a talented group.  Watkins and Woods alone is a talented group.  Way more talented than what Allen had in fat ass no effort Benjamine and Zay Jones who is decent now but not back then.  As for Chandler he is about the same as Clay, who Allen had.  I said he was a 500-600 yards guy.  That isn't a stretch.  He had 497, 655, and 571 yards.  Thats exactly what I said... 500-600 yards.

 

This whole argument was can he make the playoffs with Marrone and that group. Not about whether the group was world beaters.  Yes, he makes the playoffs with that group.  Marrone was one game shy of doing it with garbage at QB. (same record as McD just not the same Bengals luck) Allen makes that one game difference IMO.

 

Edited December 8, 2023 by Scott7975

[Rico]

1 hour ago, TheFunPolice said:

I understand the sentiment about McDermott being a good person.

 

One has to wonder why so many people would be looking to hurt him and his reputation, that being the case. I mentioned it earlier in the thread, but Frank Reich was a walking disaster in Indy. Nobody listened to him or respected him as HC. It was like there was a substitute teacher there. He had to go.

 

But Reich the human? You don't see guys eager to line up and take shots, even though it was a mess. He tried, he just wasn't good at the job. That's no reason to tear the guy apart. 

 

That's why you don't see these long stories about other coaches. This isn't normal. 

 

So why McDermott? 

Ask Doug Whaley, maybe he can tell you.

[Billsfan1972]

12 minutes ago, DC Greg said:

 

Yeah, but those are coaching legends who don't crap their pants when the game is on the line and have 12 men on the field, call timeouts that help the other team, throw dumb challenge flags, have the defense out of position and generally unprepared, have the offense take a knee, and everything else that McDermott does to lose games. I could care less about this hit piece and whatever aspects of his personality are being discussed here.

 

I don't care if he's a jerk or a saint, I care if he can coach. And at this point, he has proven THAT HE CANNOT. He is SINGLEHANDEDLY losing this team games with his cowardly, deer-in-headlights coaching in any tight game. Enough is enough. That's why he needs fired, not because of any of this crap. It's remarkable how obviously bad he is whenever the game is on the line. He's the anti-clutch and everyone knows it. Dump this hack already.

Except you forget according to McD it's all the offenses fault.🤣

[Rico]

1 hour ago, FilthyBeast said:

So for the Bills fans that insist this loser is the best head coach we've had since Marv Levy

[Bruffalo]

7 minutes ago, Paul Costa said:

What coaches or players said McDermott blamed the offense? I didn’t see any name’s attached to said events. Did you? Not saying it’s not true but there’s zero proof that it is true. 

I don't like Tyler Dunne either but I'm going to doubt that he's just making stuff up.  It's in line with what we know about regarding his views on complementary football as well. 

Edited December 8, 2023 by Bruffalo

[Beck Water]

2 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

my grain of salt is Bill B comes across as a narcissistic control freak too as did Parcels. Polian was widely reported to be a complete ahole. I think to be an nfl coach some of these personality defects are a feature not a bug. 

 

Anyone want to bet against the chance that Josh McDaniel is a narcissistic control freak?  
 

"Narcissist" is a term with a specific psychological meaning that gets thrown around far too widely these days, but to the fundamental point - I think you're exactly correct.  Football HC have to be dialed in and focused.  The buck stops with them, so yes they want control.  Who was Sean McDermott's coaching mentor?  Want to bet Andy Reid isn't a demanding control freak?

 

That said:

 

A lot of coaches come in to a team and the team (if it's average) sustains that level or improves the coach's first or second year.  They're novel, players want to win, the coaches get the benefit of the doubt ("buy in").  Then the "honeymoon" wears off and the team slumps.  Gase got Miami to 10-6 his first season, playoff game, whoo hoo they're on their way.  Flores 10-6 the team's second season, likewise whoo hoo. 

 

So the difference is, can the team sustain success and build?  And McDermott, whatever he is to work for or play for, has managed that for the Bills. 

I've said it before, I'll say it again, I don't find it difficult to believe that McDermott is a control freak who wants it 'his way or the highway' and who has definite ideas about how things should be done, and definite expectations of being 'heard and obeyed' when he says something.

 

On the other hand....I find it very difficult to believe that he could sustain success with the Bills for 7 years if it's true that "He has zero relationship with the offensive players. Zero. None. Absolutely zero" and "He wants the relationship that he can’t have with the players. Because he’s not physically, mentally, or socially able to". 

 

Because coaching professional sports now a days is very much about building and managing relationships with the players.  So is McDermott the Dale Carnegie Award Winning Self-Aware COTY, maybe not, but there's a lot of room between that and "not physically mentally or socially able to" have relationships with the players and just pooping on his assistants.

 

I could see big development in Brian Daboll from his first year with the team to his fourth, from being a stiff-faced guy who flirted with throwing his players under the bus in pressers, to being an affable guy who expressed concern for both players and reporters.  Usually (not always) people develop in their job because it's asked or even demanded of them to change.

[BuffaloRebound]

2 minutes ago, eme123 said:

At the end of the day 25 former players, coaches, and staff decided to give their two cents on what an aweful person mcdermott is. What is really amazing is not one of these 25 people was willing to offer their name with their thoughts. 

 2 did, but they clearly admired McDermott.  It’s the Feliciano, Beasley, Quinton Spain, Levi Wallace, Hughes’s of the world who don’t have the guts to put names to their bitching.  

[BillsFan2313]

Who the hell is Tyler Dunne? 

[Billsfan1972]

8 minutes ago, Paul Costa said:

What coaches or players said McDermott blamed the offense? I didn’t see any name’s attached to said events. Did you? Not saying it’s not true but there’s zero proof that it is true. 

He's inferred it numerous times this year, while heaping praise on his defense.  Where have you been?

[Wayne Arnold]

3 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

It's an opinion piece it isn't news, and why don't you find where I said they shouldn't do either of those things you decided to just copy and paste if that's what you're saying. Someone said it didn't attack his character it did, saying it didn't is just ridiculous.

 

What people who worked closely with McDermott think of his coaching and leadership qualities is absolutely news. If you don't think so then don't read it.

 

"Attacking his character". Cry me a river. You could claim any criticism of your job performance as having your character attacked if you really wanted to.

 

Part of being a coach is being a leader. If you're not allowed to describe the stupid things McDermott has done to make people question his leadership abilities because it might *gasp* "attack his character" then how do you suggest people evaluate his leadership skills?

[Beck Water]

11 minutes ago, BillsFan2313 said:

Who the hell is Tyler Dunne? 

 

Former reporter for TBN and for Bleacher Report.  Good reporter, at his best writing in-depth pieces.

 

He struck out on his own to start a subscription-based sports feature publication called "Go Long" - he's got a website with articles and podcasts and I think if you're a subscriber he emails articles to you.  From WNY and makes his home there.

 

I thought it was a brave concept and wished him the best, but I'm not a fan of his implementation.

 

 

Edited December 8, 2023 by Beck Water

[Scott7975]

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

 

I apologize, but my best efforts can't find this tweet or the "chad hall truck story". 

 

could you summarize please?

Quote

One story comes to mind. Take a position traditionally teeming with eccentric personalities. Chad Hall played wide receiver, was much closer in age and — clearly — has a gift for managing egos in his room. The Bills receivers loved Hall so much that they bought him a truck for Christmas in 2020. An objectively touching moment that Isaiah McKenzie shared via Instagram. In the dark, in the rain, you see Stefon Diggs and Andre Roberts lead Hall out to the driveway with a beanie over the coach’s eyes. On the audio, Cole Beasley says that this was originally Gabe Davis’ idea and that they all chipped in.

It's impossible for any sane person to watch this heartwarming video and not feel happy for Hall.

Obviously, this coach had made a profound impact on those receivers’ lives — why anyone gets into coaching in the first place.

But Sean McDermott? Oh boy. Sean McDermott was not pleased. One source described this as “a dark day at One Bills Drive.” Not only was the head coach pissed that players were gathering as a group during Covid, McDermott told his staff he pays them to be a coach. Not a friend. Other coaches could not believe his cold response. They had never seen anything like this in their careers.

Not only were the Bills’ wide receivers shattering franchise records. Right here was the ultimate sign of respect.

Said one assistant: “I thought it was cool as *****. And he made it into the biggest negative ever. That’s him. He couldn’t take that. He couldn’t handle that. He couldn’t let that be. He couldn’t let that stand. And there’s cases of that more so on the offensive side of the ball than the defensive side. He has zero relationship with the offensive players. Zero. None. Absolutely zero. He’s insecure. He wants the relationship that he can’t have with the players. Because he’s not physically, mentally, or socially able to.”

And another: “Sean was pissed. He was super pissed. One of Sean’s biggest things is, coaches that related to the players, it was almost like he resented it. He’d always say, ‘I have to be the bad cop. You guys are always the good cop.’ He always hated the fact that players liked a couple of coaches. It was frowned upon.”

This coach cannot help but laugh at the absurdity of such a statement.

Multiple sources indicate that McDermott was especially harsh toward Hall and paid him a salary so low it was insulting.

Hall declined to comment for this story. 

 

[Rico]

54 minutes ago, boco357 said:

Damn Brown and Tasker killing Dunne.

Major blunder by this chump.

[boater]

The McDermott 9/11 speech was four years ago.

 

How many of you here can be found not saying something stupid the past four years?

[Nephilim17]

I don't get all these questions of "who is Tyler Dunne?"
 

McD already admitted to the 9/11 speech and thus far hasn't denied other allegations like his displeaure with the WRs buying Chad Hall a truck as a gift.

 

McD either did and said these things or he didn't. If the latter, he should get a good lawyer and litigate.

 

If he did do them, the messenger doesn't matter. 

Edited December 8, 2023 by Nephilim17

[Warcodered]

5 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

What people who worked closely with McDermott think of his coaching and leadership qualities is absolutely news. If you don't think so then don't read it.

 

"Attacking his character". Cry me a river. You could claim any criticism of your job performance as having your character attacked if you really wanted to.

 

Part of being a coach is being a leader. If you're not allowed to describe the stupid things McDermott has done to make people question his leadership abilities because it might *gasp* "attack his character" then how do you suggest people evaluate his leadership skills?

News is information reported without opinion this wasn't that at all, hell this was a ton of opinion with quotes.

 

Yeah I don't care if you agree with the things said in this article or not it is what it is, and it is an attack on his character, he has a right to be upset about that part, and people pretending it isn't are just being ridiculous.

[beer can shower]

26 minutes ago, 1ManRaid said:

 

Oh stop with this Dalton ended our streak nonsense.  That's loser mentality, same as the diaper wearers who always say we "didn't deserve to win" our close games.  Similar to when all someone sees is the 1 turnover in a 4 TD game.

 

The rest of the game matters.  The rest of the season matters.  Dalton was a great story, but NO MORE RELEVANT to our season or success than any other play or game through our or anyone else in the AFC's season.  We won as many games as we needed to win.  Anything else is irrelevant because Dalton doesn't even get mentioned if we had a different result in ANY of our games.  One additional win or loss and what someone else did for another team isn't even a blip on our radar.

 

Of course, Andy Dalton's pass ended the Bills drought.
Had that pass not been caught the Bills would not have been in the playoffs.
It's not nonsense, it's a fact.

 

Edited December 8, 2023 by beer can shower

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

23 minutes ago, Gregg said:

 

Behind the scenes Bill is supposedly a funny guy from what his players/coaches have said. He is the opposite of his press conferences with the media where he sounds like a robot or a miserable guy answering questions. He has earned the right to be a control freak with his 9 Super Bowl appearances and 6 Lombardi trophies. Winning buys you credibility with the players, coaching staff, and fans.

A lot of named ex players have said they hated playing for him or he was terrifying lol. I don’t think he’s a ‘funny guy’ in a coaching capacity at all but maybe in casual conversation unrelated to football 

 

edelman said he’s terrifying and like the emperor

cassius marsh said there’s nothing fun or happy about playing for the pats and he hated his time there

Reggie Wayne signed there and reportedly said it was too tough then recanted it

Brandon spikes called his time in NE ‘4 years a slave’

Wes Welker referred to bill as someone you just have to endure and that he’s hard on everybody 

 

I get that it got results and so on (although you can probably make a pretty solid case he lucked into Brady much like the bills lucked into Josh) but the point is things couldn’t have been THAT bad in Buffalo if these ex players are remaining anonymous because they think they’ll seem petty if people knew who they were.  I think belichick was such a tyrant that some of these players were at their breaking point and just didn’t care how complaining made them look 

Edited December 8, 2023 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[RichRiderBills]

IMO screw Tyler Dunne. I've never liked him, he's always dripped of ambition and is sour grapes he's not treated like a real press guy. He's just always rubbed me the wrong way. 

 

McD looks like he said some dumb / unnecessary anecdote that was likely in bad taste 4 years ago. Sean is many things, but he's a patriot and no sympathizer w 911 hijackers. I'd have to have heard the exact pitch to pass further judgement, really we all should. Dunne does a huge disservice by throwing this out there without the exact context and exact words. I've heard 20 reporters paraphrase what was said today and each one has phrased it differently. 

 

 

 

 

[DrDawkinstein]

7 minutes ago, boater said:

The McDermott 9/11 speech was four years ago.

 

How many of you here can be found not saying something stupid the past four years?

 

Not that stupid, and not in a professional setting.

[WEATHER DOT COM]

4 minutes ago, RichRiderBills said:

Dunne does a huge disservice by throwing this out there without the exact context and exact words. I've heard 20 reporters paraphrase what was said today and each one has phrased it differently. 

 

Dunne included it in the article with context and exact words.

 

Why is your problem with Dunne and not the 20 reporters paraphrasing his reporting incorrectly? 

[DrDawkinstein]

4 minutes ago, RichRiderBills said:

IMO screw Tyler Dunne. I've never liked him, he's always dripped of ambition and is sour grapes he's not treated like a real press guy. He's just always rubbed me the wrong way. 

 

McD looks like he said some dumb / unnecessary anecdote that was likely in bad taste 4 years ago. Sean is many things, but he's a patriot and no sympathizer w 911 hijackers. I'd have to have heard the exact pitch to pass further judgement, really we all should. Dunne does a huge disservice by throwing this out there without the exact context and exact words. I've heard 20 reporters paraphrase what was said today and each one has phrased it differently.

 

To be clear, NO ONE thinks McD is a terrorist sympathizer. No one.

 

The criticism comes from it just being a totally idiotic example to use. And even Sean admits it was that much.

[Billsfan1972]

9 minutes ago, boater said:

The McDermott 9/11 speech was four years ago.

 

How many of you here can be found not saying something stupid the past four years?

This wasn't off the cuff comment made in a bar after a couple of drinks to friends. This was a well thought out speech he gave to his players.

 

If you can't see the big difference, what more can I say?

[wettlaufer]

51 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

Being called a narcissist is often seen as a compliment.

 

Dunne didn't call him that. An interview subject did. Is every comment fair? Probably not. But let's look at the entire body of the work rather than latching onto the dumb 9/11 comment and one person going over the edge and playing armchair psychiatrist. It's a pretty damning work that reflects commentary from 25 football professionals. It's not a hit piece or an attack on McD's character. That is whiny nonsense from McD...again.

 

[Gregg]

Just now, DrDawkinstein said:

 

To be clear, NO ONE thinks McD is a terrorist sympathizer. No one.

 

The criticism comes from it just being a totally idiotic example to use. And even Sean admits it was that much.

 

He should have gone with 1980 USA hockey team. The miracle on ice, you can't go wrong there. Even people who aren't sports fans or hockey fans know that story.

[WEATHER DOT COM]

1 minute ago, Gregg said:

 

He should have gone with 1980 USA hockey team. The miracle on ice, you can't go wrong there. Even people who aren't sports fans or hockey fans know that story.

 

I would have went with Angels in the Outfield. 

[Blackbeard]

I'm sure McD is loving trying to prepare and plan for a game having to deal with all this media crap and Monday morning quarterbacking.  

 

Cutting nose of to spite face this fan base is doing.   Sad to sit back and watch it.

 

I think if Bass misses another FG, we burn McD at the stake outside of Jims Steakout.

 

 

[Breakout Squad]

1 minute ago, Gregg said:

 

He should have gone with 1980 USA hockey team. The miracle on ice, you can't go wrong there. Even people who aren't sports fans or hockey fans know that story.

Do you believe in miracles?!?!

McD: No it takes complimentary football to win. 

[Sherlock Holmes]

2 hours ago, boyst said:

https://myfox8.com/news/north-carolina/piedmont-triad/davidson-county-sheriff-investigating-after-calf-shot-killed/

 

you be the judge. the opening line they gave me - "it was a friendly cow".... jeesh. thanks.

i did 

Damn, sorry about your loss Boyst, beautiful white cattle! They ever get those B word?

Edited December 8, 2023 by Sherlock Holmes