O-Line Play Today

[drummernut74]

Not for nothing, but they probably deserve their own thread today. I haven’t seen that level of play from our O-line against a quality front like that in a lllloooonnnngggg time.  Cybo and McG were huge pickups … and it looks like it’s trickling down to helping Brown develop week by week 👍👍

Allen is probably having to adjust to having time and confidence for the first time in his football life 😬

Edited September 24, 2023 by drummernut74

[Dan in Owego]

2 minutes ago, drummernut74 said:

Not for nothing, but they probably deserve their own thread today. I haven’t seen that level of play from our O-line against a quality front like that in a lllloooonnnngggg time.  Cybo and McG were huge pickups … and it looks like it’s trickling down to helping Brown develop week by week 👍👍

Loved the backups as well.

[BillsPride12]

They made me nervous after the first Offensive series but they definitely played good as the day went on.  That Washington front four is no joke

[drummernut74]

In Krome we trust 🤘

[MAJBobby]

Last two games I have to say I have been VERY VERY happy with Spencer Brown. 

 

the work he did with Crosby and now Sweat. Impressive. 
 

rook  already looks like a 10 yr vet OG

 

Morse is playing good ball

 

dawkins turned Young invisible today. 

 

all and all last two weeks been VERY impressed with the OL. 

Edited September 24, 2023 by MAJBobby

[Ben]

Its starting to look like Spencer's back really was the issue last year. Very encouraging start to the year.

[CSBill]

Hard to ask for anything more. Maybe a bit better with the run game in the early portion, but the pass protection was great and they wore the Commando's down with the run as the game went along.

[MAJBobby]

1 minute ago, CSBill said:

Hard to ask for anything more. Maybe a bit better with the run game in the early portion, but the pass protection was great and they wore the Commando's down with the run as the game went along.

So based on my field view. The DC LBers were selling out early on Run. It looked to me like they were not worried initially about Josh taking the short stuff 

 

once they backed off a bit the lanes where there for the RBs. 

[PBF81]

It was tremendously encouraging.  

 

And Torrence, for a rookie, ... very impressive.  

 

You can see the chemistry building.  

 

 

36 minutes ago, Dan in Owego said:

Loved the backups as well.

 

I wasn't really paying attention to subs, did they come in with the QB swap, or prior to then? 

 

Can't wait to see the snap counts for the OL again.  

 

 

[MAJBobby]

13 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

It was tremendously encouraging.  

 

And Torrence, for a rookie, ... very impressive.  

 

You can see the chemistry building.  

 

 

 

I wasn't really paying attention to subs, did they come in with the QB swap, or prior to then? 

 

Can't wait to see the snap counts for the OL again.  

 

 

Yeah came in with Kyle Allen from what I could tell. 
 

https://twitter.com/tjdmcr/status/1704218805268840638?s=46 

 

look at this this is a STUD DT. And Rook just handles him. We have a stud in the making. 

Edited September 24, 2023 by MAJBobby

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

I thought they were ok today. 

 

Run blocking was a pretty big problem. We racked up some stats in garbage time, but really couldn't move the ball on the ground with any consistency until after the game was out of reach. 

 

Pass pro was good against a strong pass rush. Helps a lot when your QB can evade pressure and either scramble for a gain or make a pass downfield. 

[JerseyBills]

This is the Bills team we were supposed to look like last year

Dominant in every phase. McDermott has these boys hungry and humble forreal 

SB or Bust 

[TheyCallMeAndy]

2 minutes ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

I thought they were ok today. 

 

Run blocking was a pretty big problem. We racked up some stats in garbage time, but really couldn't move the ball on the ground with any consistency until after the game was out of reach. 

 

Pass pro was good against a strong pass rush. Helps a lot when your QB can evade pressure and either scramble for a gain or make a pass downfield. 

We gave up zero sacks and ran for 140+
 

That wasn’t an “ok” performance, they shut down one of the most talented DLs in the game. 

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

1 minute ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

We gave up zero sacks and ran for 140+
 

That wasn’t an “ok” performance, they shut down one of the most talented DLs in the game. 

 

46 of those rushing yards were Josh scrambling. 

 

64 of those rushing yards came on our TD drive with 8 minutes left up 30-0. It's important to close out games, but that was 100% garbage time. 

 

If we had Howell back there I think he gets sacked 5+ times pretty easy. Josh is a magician 

[TheyCallMeAndy]

Just now, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

 

46 of those rushing yards were Josh scrambling. 

 

64 of those rushing yards came on our TD drive with 8 minutes left up 30-0. It's important to close out games, but that was 100% garbage time. 

 

If we had Howell back there I think he gets sacked 5+ times pretty easy. Josh is a magician 

Scrambling right through that DL 🤷🏻‍♂️ For how good that DL is, Bills OL (which most fans here consider mediocre) had an amazing day. 

[MJS]

The oline is night and day from last year. And they should get better as the year goes as the right side gets more experience and the new faces gel even more.

 

Dawkins is playing very well, in particular.

[Dan in Owego]

2 hours ago, PBF81 said:

It was tremendously encouraging.  

 

And Torrence, for a rookie, ... very impressive.  

 

You can see the chemistry building.  

 

 

 

I wasn't really paying attention to subs, did they come in with the QB swap, or prior to then? 

 

Can't wait to see the snap counts for the OL again.  

 

 

came in with the QB switch

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

2 hours ago, drummernut74 said:

In Krome we trust 🤘

Just don’t mess with his beach chairs. 🤐

[John from Riverside]

In particular Spencer Brown
 

That was Montez sweat. He was going against today.

 

And last week he was going against a monster in Vegas

[TFBillsfan]

Major kudos to the OL the last two games. The Washington front four is certainly a top 5 DL and they didn’t allow a sack and ran for over 170 yards. The starters are playing well and yet we have good depth if needed. Great to see Brown developing into a consistent RT. Torrence and McGovern have been big additions to the IOL. 
 

Keep it up boys and stay healthy!

[AuntieEm]

1 hour ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

 

46 of those rushing yards were Josh scrambling. 

 

64 of those rushing yards came on our TD drive with 8 minutes left up 30-0. It's important to close out games, but that was 100% garbage time. 

 

If we had Howell back there I think he gets sacked 5+ times pretty easy. Josh is a magician 

Well our oline would protect k Allen as well if he had to start in any game.  Here's hoping he only spells josh late 4th q when game is safely out if reach for opponents.

Edited September 25, 2023 by AuntieEm

[billieve420]

OL hasn’t been a tire fire last two games that is all I can ask for.

[Brand J]

I’ve also noticed Allen is starting to have a lot more trust in the front 5 and isn’t bailing from clean pockets like he was in game 1. When he does get pressure, he isn’t immediately looking to run left or right, he’s manipulating the pocket now, side step here, side step there, it’s what made Brady so frustrating to sack. Hopefully the OL continues to give Allen that trust!

[GunnerBill]

8 minutes ago, billieve420 said:

OL hasn’t been a tire fire last two games that is all I can ask for.

 

Hasn't been a tire fire in any of the 3 games. It played well vs the Jets too. 

 

As for today, the third down in the redzone on the first drive Dion got beat. There were two plays where Spencer Brown for beat clean (one Josh managed to extend the play the other resulted in an incompletion). And there were a couple of run plays early where Morse seemed to be zone blocking while everyone else was gap blocking that I'd like to look at again. 

 

But overall this was an excellent performance by the OL. They have played well all 3 games. They are competing their asses off.

Edited September 25, 2023 by GunnerBill

[HappyDays]

2 hours ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

Helps a lot when your QB can evade pressure and either scramble for a gain or make a pass downfield. 

 

And the QB is helped when his OL washes the entire DL out of the picture, leaving huge rushing lanes in the middle of the field. Allen is a magician but don't take away the OL's performance the first 3 weeks. They're going against studs and mostly winning their reps.

[CookieG]

28 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

In particular Spencer Brown
 

That was Montez sweat. He was going against today.

 

And last week he was going against a monster in Vegas

Oe of the benefits of 12 personnel is the ability to give help to the OT's.  Last week against Crosby, Brown received help from a TE on at least a dozen occasions.  (Someone broke it down on Youtube last week). It was usually just a chip, to keep the pass rusher from blowing by him.  But then ,that's all that is usually needed. Im sure he received similar help this week. 

 

And I certainly don't have a problem with that.  Few things are as frustrating as watching an edge rusher blow by an OT, who can clearly not keep up...but then the  OC refuses to give the OT help.

 

A bump, a chip, a rub, its usually all that's needed.  And it usually gives the TE enough time to go out in some type of pattern. 

 

Washington had 7 sacks last week against Denver.

 

Today...none. 

 

Like most, I was coenrned about the OT's this year.  But they have played surprisingly well.

 

 

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

23 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

And the QB is helped when his OL washes the entire DL out of the picture, leaving huge rushing lanes in the middle of the field. Allen is a magician but don't take away the OL's performance the first 3 weeks. They're going against studs and mostly winning their reps.

 

How much of that is the DL over-commiting, our O-line steering, or just a great play by Josh ? I think it's a bit of all 3. I thought the Raiders were much better than Washington about staying disciplined and not letting Josh scramble. 

 

I'm being critical of our O-line but I'll gladly admit they are much improved over last season. Looks like we've gone from bottom 10 (borderline bottom 5) to somewhere around average. We may even be above average pushing top 10. O-Lines are so bad league wide you have to be happy when they're just not a liability. 

[Rew]

Not enough people giving Dorsey some of the credit for this.  It's not like the front 5 turned All Pro overnight.  We are primarily calling plays that either get the ball out quick or have extra protection.  Many of the clean pockets were with 6 or 5 and a chip in protection.  I'm sure it's impacting play calling to some degree, but it's really helping Allen find a groove.

[NickelCity]

Really happy with the OLine. I'm looking forward to watching again. Last week, they gave a lot of help to Brown and the play designs were great (it wasnt as pretty when Brown was singled up with Crosby).

 

I'm really curious to see if Brown had a good game wrt his 1:1 matchups. 

 

[Fetou]

I honestly think they performed admirably all three games. Josh didn't seem comfortable behind them in the Jets game and didn't step around well in the pocket. He made them look worse than they were and moved into pressures multiple times.

 

Him trusting the pocket to hold is a part of the process alongside their actual performance in protection. He seems to get progressively more comfortable having an actual offensive line in front of him. 

Edited September 25, 2023 by Fetou

[NewEra]

6 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

Yeah came in with Kyle Allen from what I could tell. 
 

https://twitter.com/tjdmcr/status/1704218805268840638?s=46 

 

look at this this is a STUD DT. And Rook just handles him. We have a stud in the making. 

Who is the stud DT that he handled?  The raider DTs are awful 

5 hours ago, JerseyBills said:

This is the Bills team we were supposed to look like last year

Dominant in every phase. McDermott has these boys hungry and humble forreal 

SB or Bust 

I thought he lost the locker room after 13 seconds?  😉 

[NewEra]

3 hours ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

 

How much of that is the DL over-commiting, our O-line steering, or just a great play by Josh ? I think it's a bit of all 3. I thought the Raiders were much better than Washington about staying disciplined and not letting Josh scramble. 

 

I'm being critical of our O-line but I'll gladly admit they are much improved over last season. Looks like we've gone from bottom 10 (borderline bottom 5) to somewhere around average. We may even be above average pushing top 10. O-Lines are so bad league wide you have to be happy when they're just not a liability. 

Agreed.  
 

I understand why people gave you downvotes, but I do see where you’re coming from with regards to the run game.  I thought our run game was poor in the 1st half.  The results show this to be true. 

 

Our designed runs: 

1st qtr-

1, -2, 1, 8, 2.  2 yards per carry  That’s not good.   

 

2nd qtr-

2, 4, 3, 2, 1, 7, 7-  3.71 ypc.  That’s not good.

 

3rd qtr- 

10, 3, 5, 3-  5.25 ypc.  Solid- but only 4 rushes

 

4th qtr-  

1, 5, -3, 10, 1, 7, 6, 34, 1, 1- 6.3 ypc-  great-  not much to make out of this imo.  Game was over.  Washington was demoralized at this point and looking to go home to their families.  Many of the yards were our backups. Good nonetheless. 

 
 

I thought we did a very good job in pass protection, especially considering the talent level of Washington’s DL.  I can remember Dion getting smoked on a 3rd and goal which forced Josh to throw it out of the end zone.  Also Spencer brown getting beat another 2 times, but Josh felt it and escaped.  Eager to rewatch and see how many times we gave the tackles help and chipped with TEs and RBs

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, NewEra said:

Agreed.  
 

I understand why people gave you downvotes, but I do see where you’re coming from with regards to the run game.  I thought our run game was poor in the 1st half.  The results show this to be true. 

 

Our designed runs: 

1st qtr-

1, -2, 1, 8, 2.  2 yards per carry  That’s not good.   

 

2nd qtr-

2, 4, 3, 2, 1, 7, 7-  3.71 ypc.  That’s not good.

 

3rd qtr- 

10, 3, 5, 3-  5.25 ypc.  Solid- but only 4 rushes

 

4th qtr-  

1, 5, -3, 10, 1, 7, 6, 34, 1, 1- 6.3 ypc-  great-  not much to make out of this imo.  Game was over.  Washington was demoralized at this point and looking to go home to their families.  Many of the yards were our backups. Good nonetheless. 

 
 

I thought we did a very good job in pass protection, especially considering the talent level of Washington’s DL.  I can remember Dion getting smoked on a 3rd and goal which forced Josh to throw it out of the end zone.  Also Spencer brown getting beat another 2 times, but Josh felt it and escaped.  Eager to rewatch and see how many times we gave the tackles help and chipped with TEs and RBs

 

But that is kinda common league wide in terms of run game. The hardest time in a game to run is early against fresh defenses. Defending the run is partly technique and partly "want to" and both of those can slide with tiredness. 

 

The difference this year to the last two is the reduced number of negative runs. Only two yesterday. That is a bit the improved line and a bit Cook's speed.

 

I thought the balance was good yesterday. Gotta try and run it against Miami some too. Can't get into a drop Josh back 60 times game.

[John from Riverside]

And it’s not just passed protection
 

Cook had 124 yards last week and this week he had 96

 

Our running game is starting to be consistent

 

Today’s front four was no joke

[JerseyBills]

11 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

Last two games I have to say I have been VERY VERY happy with Spencer Brown. 

 

the work he did with Crosby and now Sweat. Impressive. 
 

rook  already looks like a 10 yr vet OG

 

Morse is playing good ball

 

dawkins turned Young invisible today. 

 

all and all last two weeks been VERY impressed with the OL. 

It's McGovern and Torrence allowing the rest of the line to focus on their matchups. Saffold killed us last year

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, JerseyBills said:

It's McGovern and Torrence allowing the rest of the line to focus on their matchups. Saffold killed us last year

 

And some of us did say he would the day we signed him. Overrated trash.

[JerseyBills]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

And some of us did say he would the day we signed him. Overrated trash.

Ya i take an L on that , I thought he'd be good. I loved the McGovern signing and the contract 

[NewEra]

5 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

But that is kinda common league wide in terms of run game. The hardest time in a game to run is early against fresh defenses. Defending the run is partly technique and partly "want to" and both of those can slide with tiredness. 

 

The difference this year to the last two is the reduced number of negative runs. Only two yesterday. That is a bit the improved line and a bit Cook's speed.

 

I thought the balance was good yesterday. Gotta try and run it against Miami some too. Can't get into a drop Josh back 60 times game.

Great point regarding run success early on. Does anyone have access to the splits on 1st and 2nd half rushing YPC league wide?  I believe you in that it’s tougher to run in the 1st.  I’d just like to see the actual difference.  
 

Do you have thoughts on Kincaid seeing 2 quick targets and then basically being told to stand in the corner after the bogus tripling call?

[Jerome007]

They were great yesterday. Dawkins had an awesome game. The pass protection was really physical and they were on it.

 

Josh helped with his easy side stepping. When there's only one rusher free, he always evades easily when not flustered. 

Gameplan by Dorsey also helps in fatiguing and demoralizing opposing DLines. It bodes well. I was one saying in the offseason that with McGovern and Torrence, plus the short game with Cook  and Kincaid, that the Bills O would crazy good  - and they were 2nd last year! So far so good, for sure.

[Robert Paulson]

They have been better this year- i think Friday dance party is on hiatus so they can focus on football