Brick-By-Brick, the NFL Losing Me As A Fan

[Billz4ever]

4 minutes ago, MJS said:

It clearly stopped his momentum.

It didn't stop him momentum.  What stopped his momentum was the receiver himself since he was going to turn it up field. 

 

The spilt second grab of the jersey never impeded the receiver from getting up field.  How could it?  The pull is in the direction he was going to be going.

[MJS]

Just now, Billz4ever said:

It didn't stop him momentum.  What stopped his momentum was the receiver himself since he was going to turn it up field. 

 

The spilt second grab of the jersey never impeded the receiver from getting up field.  How could it?  The pull is in the direction he was going to be going.

It was a ticky tack call. It did affect the route, though. The initial hold does impede the receiver somewhat. I'm not sure why you and others don't want to admit that. It's obvious when you watch the play.

 

I think they shouldn't have called it, but there were technically still grounds to call it, including an obvious jersey tug.

[Royale with Cheese]

2 hours ago, thenorthremembers said:

You had me until you said underpaid.    NFL referees make around 200,000 per season.   Not bad for a part time gig.

 

I think the more senior officials make something like $45,000 per game and over the course of a 17 week season....

[Billz4ever]

Just now, MJS said:

It was a ticky tack call. It did affect the route, though. The initial hold does impede the receiver somewhat. I'm not sure why you and others don't want to admit that. It's obvious when you watch the play.

 

I think they shouldn't have called it, but there were technically still grounds to call it, including an obvious jersey tug.

And they had let those same type of plays slide literally the entire game until then. That's the point.  You're either going to call a tight game, or you're going to let them play.

 

If you're not going to call it the rest of the game, you certainly shouldn't be calling it when it will literally decide the game. Refs must be consistent.  It was a very weak call.

[C.Biscuit97]

Damn, league is probably going to fold now!

 

”a lot” of fans quit after Kaepernick. “A lot” of fans quit after the concussion stuff. Guess what? It doesn’t matter. Nfl prints money. A monkey could run the league and it would make a ton of money.

 

so with all due respect, the nfl doesn’t care. 

[MJS]

Just now, Billz4ever said:

And they had let those same type of plays slide literally the entire game until then. That's the point.  You're either going to call a tight game, or you're going to let them play.

 

If you're not going to call it the rest of the game, you certainly shouldn't be calling it when it will literally decide the game. Refs must be consistent.  It was a very weak call.

I agree, which is why I said they shouldn't have called it.

 

But some fans are claiming the hold didn't happen and when they see it did, they claim it didn't affect anything (even though it clearly did).

 

The level of outrage is ridiculous. You know what really lost the Eagles the game? Hurts fumbling and spotting the Chiefs 7 free points. Or how about getting zero pressure on Mahomes the entire game, with a historic sack defense?

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

8 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

I think the more senior officials make something like $45,000 per game and over the course of a 17 week season....

Hell, in Cleveland the fans will even give you a beer!

Edited February 13, 2023 by Ridgewaycynic2013

[BFLO]

2 hours ago, Beast said:

Let’s also be honest. If that was a Bills defender and it was called this place would go worse than nuts.

 

I thought it was a ticky-tack penalty AT BEST and one you certainly don’t want a league championship game decided on. I felt it was an awful look for the NFL for that to happen.

It's an awful look that a $17.2 billion in revenue a year league lets obvious penalties like that slide 9 times out of 10 because of the "let 'em play" mindset, so the 1 time out of 10 they do call it, people get upset.  

 

Right now it's expected that every O-lineman holds on every single play and it's only called a penalty if the ref thinks it crossed some nebulous and inconsistent threshold.

 

And the secondary holds/interferes with the receivers every single play, and it's only a penalty if the refs think it crossed some nebulous and inconsistent threshold. 

 

Fans get upset because the refs thresholds are never consistent game to game, or even from one play to the next.  

 

 

 

 

[Billz4ever]

3 minutes ago, MJS said:

I agree, which is why I said they shouldn't have called it.

 

But some fans are claiming the hold didn't happen and when they see it did, they claim it didn't affect anything (even though it clearly did).

 

The level of outrage is ridiculous. You know what really lost the Eagles the game? Hurts fumbling and spotting the Chiefs 7 free points. Or how about getting zero pressure on Mahomes the entire game, with a historic sack defense?

Philly only allowed the Chiefs 7 offensive points in the first half, so they were doing a decent job. 

 

It fell apart in the second half.  Reid made adjustments and Mahomes was getting rid of the ball quickly, so sacks weren't going to happen.

 

With the points and the offense we saw in this game, it should be crystal clear that no matter how good the defense, the great offenses of today are going to score.

 

Which brings us to the Hurts fumble.  While not obvious when it happened, was a huge factor.

 

But regardless, refs should not be injecting themselves into a play like that unless they've been calling a tight game from the start. 

 

 

[\GoBillsInDallas/]

3 hours ago, pocoboy said:

I hate to say it, but I don't feel that they want guys like me as consumers anymore

 

 

[Dancing Fool]

16 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Damn, league is probably going to fold now!

 

”a lot” of fans quit after Kaepernick. “A lot” of fans quit after the concussion stuff. Guess what? It doesn’t matter. Nfl prints money. A monkey could run the league and it would make a ton of money.

 

so with all due respect, the nfl doesn’t care. 

I agree that the NFL does not care.

 

Conversely, I do not care that the NFL does not care. Quite frankly it is cathartic to discuss what so many of us have been thinking.

 

Remember that we would not be here if we did not appreciate the Bills. It is not our fault that the NFL has been providing a dubious product.

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, pocoboy said:

I hate to say it, but I don't feel that they want guys like me as consumers anymore. I don't tune in for theatrics, politics, or the type of pop music that litters this "spectacle."

 

And then, we finally get to the true reason that those who are their loyal, week-in and week-out customers tune in, and then they have systems in place which allow for 1 of 7 underpaid, part-time officials to ruin our primary focus. They take the game and turn it into a mockery.

 

All of this thrown together, and it gives me the feeling I have better ways to waste my Sunday afternoons. Goodell & the NFL are ruining something I've loved since childhood.

 

And I even wanted (ever so slightly) for the Chiefs to win.

 

 

Your confusion is that you think the NFL is changing.

 

You are changing.

 

Officiating always has been and always will be bad............Goodell wasn't wrong when he said it's never been better...........so your complaint sounds contrived.

 

Maybe you just have less tolerance for it because the rest of the content is no longer directed at entertaining you.........and instead at the demographics that pay the bills and will-be paying the bills in the near future.    That's the circle of life.  

 

You can be mad about it or have fun with it.........last year we had an 18 year old at the party who didn't know who 50 Cent was and thought he was wearing the "50" medallion on his chain because he was 50 years old.     This year we had kids who had no idea who Terry Bradshaw or Paul McCartney were.   

 

It's a kids game played by men in their 20's........if we can't play along they got Doug Flutie selling us Nugenix to help with that.........I'm actually pleasantly surprised when the NFL and advertisers still throw the 60+ crowd a few bones with guest appearances and references in commercials etc..

 

 

 

 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

3 hours ago, pocoboy said:

I hate to say it, but I don't feel that they want guys like me as consumers anymore.

 

12 minutes ago, \GoBillsInDallas/ said:

 

 

Be quiet about your disinterest, and your age.  You might find yourself in their next batch of Soylent Green Burgers.  (Endorsed by Pat Mahomes!)

[Bills!Win!]

I used to watch every possible game. Now I only watch the bills and if one of the primetime games features 2 good teams 

[NoSaint]

39 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

And they had let those same type of plays slide literally the entire game until then. That's the point.  You're either going to call a tight game, or you're going to let them play.

 

If you're not going to call it the rest of the game, you certainly shouldn't be calling it when it will literally decide the game. Refs must be consistent.  It was a very weak call.

In the time you’ve spent typing it you could’ve found examples of all the other holds ignored to put this to bed 

[BillsFanSD]

38 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

so with all due respect, the nfl doesn’t care. 

The NFL doesn't care right up to the point that fan dissatisfaction starts reducing the value of television contracts.  Then they care a lot.

 

So no, obviously Goodell is not going to lose sleep over one guy on one forum complaining about one call in one game.  I don't know if you've noticed this recently, but there are lots of people out there who either agree with OP or who are vaguely sympathetic to OP.  I'm fairly confident that some of us have been complaining about part-time officials for years.  We know the league won't care until there are more of us.  That's why we're seeking to bring more attention to the issue.

[NoSaint]

12 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Your confusion is that you think the NFL is changing.

 

You are changing.

 

Officiating always has been and always will be bad............Goodell wasn't wrong when he said it's never been better...........so your complaint sounds contrived.

 

Maybe you just have less tolerance for it because the rest of the content is no longer directed at entertaining you.........and instead at the demographics that pay the bills and will-be paying the bills in the near future.    That's the circle of life.  

 

You can be mad about it or have fun with it.........last year we had an 18 year old at the party who didn't know who 50 Cent was and thought he was wearing the "50" medallion on his chain because he was 50 years old.     This year we had kids who had no idea who Terry Bradshaw or Paul McCartney were.   

 

It's a kids game played by men in their 20's........if we can't play along they got Doug Flutie selling us Nugenix to help with that.........I'm actually pleasantly surprised when the NFL and advertisers still throw the 60+ crowd a few bones with guest appearances and references in commercials etc..

 

 

 

 

Generally fair. And frankly, if getting everything perfect is priority number 1– gosh, get off the message boards dissecting every minute detail, trade in the hi def tv for something a little fuzzier and look away from the ultra zoomed in frame by frame replays and you’ll find it’s likely not that it’s worse but that you recently started seeking out mistakes on a level you’d never dream of in 1982

[Billz4ever]

10 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

In the time you’ve spent typing it you could’ve found examples of all the other holds ignored to put this to bed 

I'm not a video editor.  I'll let the people who are do that.

Edited February 13, 2023 by Billz4ever

[pocoboy]

49 minutes ago, Dancing Fool said:

I agree that the NFL does not care.

 

Conversely, I do not care that the NFL does not care. Quite frankly it is cathartic to discuss what so many of us have been thinking.

 

Remember that we would not be here if we did not appreciate the Bills. It is not our fault that the NFL has been providing a dubious product.

 

Yeah I get tired of the Beane hatred, and others get tired of the complaining about the refs & the seemingly impossible task of improving it all. It's understandable. Sometimes one might post something to get talked down off the ledge, or to be reinforced. Oh well, another day goes by and we still haven't gotten a Lombardi.

 

Dammit.

[pocoboy]

29 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

Generally fair. And frankly, if getting everything perfect is priority number 1– gosh, get off the message boards dissecting every minute detail, trade in the hi def tv for something a little fuzzier and look away from the ultra zoomed in frame by frame replays and you’ll find it’s likely not that it’s worse but that you recently started seeking out mistakes on a level you’d never dream of in 1982

 

Getting everything perfect isn't priority number 1. But that defensive holding call was egregiously terrible.

 

But I suppose if anyone should really ride the Blame Train today? Nick Sirianni should be standing in front of his players, the GM, and the Owner explaining why it was worth spending a timeout to make a 38 yard field goal into a 33 yard field goal. How'd you like to be that guy, after getting lauded for your forward-thinking strategy, only to cost your team 40 seconds at the end of the game where they could have answered?

[Big Turk]

4 hours ago, pocoboy said:

I hate to say it, but I don't feel that they want guys like me as consumers anymore. I don't tune in for theatrics, politics, or the type of pop music that litters this "spectacle."

 

And then, we finally get to the true reason that those who are their loyal, week-in and week-out customers tune in, and then they have systems in place which allow for 1 of 7 underpaid, part-time officials to ruin our primary focus. They take the game and turn it into a mockery.

 

All of this thrown together, and it gives me the feeling I have better ways to waste my Sunday afternoons. Goodell & the NFL are ruining something I've loved since childhood.

 

And I even wanted (ever so slightly) for the Chiefs to win.

 

OK, then stop watching, nobody is forcing you to watch. Have a nice day...plenty of Bachelorette or Housewives of Wherever episodes for you to watch competing in Primetime against the NFL.

Edited February 13, 2023 by Big Turk

[NoSaint]

32 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

I'm not a video editor.  I'll let the people who are do that.

hasn’t occurred to you that there are millions of Philly fans and it’s been a good bit of time and… crickets?

[wppete]

I’m done with the NFL. Will only watch the games, no pregame nonsense and watch the games on mute. Not buying any NFL gear anymore. 

[Billz4ever]

3 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

hasn’t occurred to you that there are millions of Philly fans and it’s been a good bit of time and… crickets?

That's your take here? Since nobody has made a video compilation yet it didn't happen?

 

OK, great.  Glad you feel that way. 

[streetkings01]

"It was a holding. I tugged his jersey. I was hoping they would let it slide," he said after Super Bowl LVII.

 

From the mouth of Bradberry, but y’all still arguing the call smh 
 

Guy came out and admitted he held him which is what I saw with my own 2 eyes and you guys are still arguing that he didn’t 🤦🏽‍♂️

[Bobby Hooks]

4 hours ago, pocoboy said:

I hate to say it, but I don't feel that they want guys like me as consumers anymore. I don't tune in for theatrics, politics, or the type of pop music that litters this "spectacle."

 

And then, we finally get to the true reason that those who are their loyal, week-in and week-out customers tune in, and then they have systems in place which allow for 1 of 7 underpaid, part-time officials to ruin our primary focus. They take the game and turn it into a mockery.

 

All of this thrown together, and it gives me the feeling I have better ways to waste my Sunday afternoons. Goodell & the NFL are ruining something I've loved since childhood.

 

And I even wanted (ever so slightly) for the Chiefs to win.

I definitely don’t have all the same feels as I used to. I can still get amped for big games, though only Bills games. 
 

Last night was “meh” for me. But mostly because I didn’t care about either team. 
 

I feel like most of that is just getting older though. Things just kinda lose a little luster with time. Like Ally Sheedy said in the coming of age classic “when you grow up, your heart dies.” 
 

It’s a bit on the dramatic side, but comes with some truth. With that said, there are lots of things I loved as a kid that I couldn’t care less about now. If the NFL bugs you this much, maybe it’s one of those things for you. 
 

No shame in it. Just do something else for a while. Maybe you’ll come back to it when you can watch for the what it promises, which is entertainment. If it’s not entertaining you, find something that does. 
 

[PromoTheRobot]

4 hours ago, pocoboy said:

I hate to say it, but I don't feel that they want guys like me as consumers anymore.

 

Assuming you're around my age, we went from being the "darling" demo (Boomers 25-54) to being mostly irrelevant. Time marches on.

[NoSaint]

7 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

That's your take here? Since nobody has made a video compilation yet it didn't happen?

 

OK, great.  Glad you feel that way. 

“I can point to no proof of my claim that millions of passionate fans would be eager to prove” doesn’t ring much better does it? 
 

Im just saying that you are actively saying there was an issue that occurred while I’m simply saying the rule was accurately enforced and you’ve brought no support of your claim. Which of us is using feelings?

[Simon]

20 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

Have a nice day...plenty of Bachelorette or Housewives of Wherever episodes for you to watch

 

Actually I think his point was that modern NFL broadcasts are becoming too much like that reality garbage you're referring to.

imo, he is 100% correct.

 

But great job missing the point and insulting a good guy for no reason. 

[BullBuchanan]

4 hours ago, pocoboy said:

I hate to say it, but I don't feel that they want guys like me as consumers anymore. I don't tune in for theatrics, politics, or the type of pop music that litters this "spectacle."

 

And then, we finally get to the true reason that those who are their loyal, week-in and week-out customers tune in, and then they have systems in place which allow for 1 of 7 underpaid, part-time officials to ruin our primary focus. They take the game and turn it into a mockery.

 

All of this thrown together, and it gives me the feeling I have better ways to waste my Sunday afternoons. Goodell & the NFL are ruining something I've loved since childhood.

 

And I even wanted (ever so slightly) for the Chiefs to win.

Man, if that doesn't paint a picture clear as a summer's day. Oof.

[Billz4ever]

Just now, NoSaint said:

“I can point to no proof of my claim that millions of passionate fans would be eager to prove” doesn’t ring much better does it? 
 

Im just saying that you are actively saying there was an issue that occurred while I’m simply saying the rule was accurately enforced and you’ve brought no support of your claim. Which of us is using feelings?

Feelings?  LMAO

 

Interesting way of describing me saying the refs need to decide if they're going to call a tight game or let them play and stick to it.  It should be a situation where you're letting them play, and then with the outcome of the game in the balance, you're going to flag a weak holding call.

 

[BullBuchanan]

17 minutes ago, wppete said:

I’m done with the NFL. Will only watch the games, no pregame nonsense and watch the games on mute. Not buying any NFL gear anymore. 

way to stick it to 'em.

[BADOLBILZ]

19 minutes ago, pocoboy said:

 

Getting everything perfect isn't priority number 1. But that defensive holding call was egregiously terrible.

 

But I suppose if anyone should really ride the Blame Train today? Nick Sirianni should be standing in front of his players, the GM, and the Owner explaining why it was worth spending a timeout to make a 38 yard field goal into a 33 yard field goal. How'd you like to be that guy, after getting lauded for your forward-thinking strategy, only to cost your team 40 seconds at the end of the game where they could have answered?

 

 

Bradberry admitted he held him...........and video shows him stretching his jersey as he clutched it.

 

So obviously NOT egregiously terrible...........more like an egregiously stupid time to disappoint us all by killing his teams chances with a penalty because he thought he was about to get posterized with a game sealing TD.

 

As for the latter........I wish I could root for the locally raised guy Sirianni........but he is an EGREGIOUSLY sore winner so seeing him make such a tactical error is actually gratifying if you don't like seeing your HC's act like a rookie diva on the sideline.

 

 

[RyanC883]

4 hours ago, nucci said:

Eagles player admitted to holding. If that was a Bills receiver and it wasn't called, this place would have gone nuts. If it  was still ruined for you then you probably should stop watching

 

I disagree here.  The Eagles player held, but: (1) the ball was so overthrown it didn't matter; (2) no holding was called all game until then.  That game was great until then, after that, it was like a TV series you watch that is great, and the terrible series finale ruins it (looking at you Lost) 

[pocoboy]

2 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

As for the latter........I wish I could root for the locally raised guy Sirianni........but he is an EGREGIOUSLY sore winner so seeing him make such a tactical error is actually gratifying if you don't like seeing your HC's act like a rookie diva on the sideline.

 

 

 

Well he was local but cops to being a Stiller fan. So for sure his sideline character holds true with the type of guy who had to root for the Pittsburgh team.

[Ethan in Cleveland]

OP, what has really changed ??? They have been doing over the top half time shows for decades. The only thing that has changed is you are older and your tastes in entertainment probably didn't change. There is nothing wrong with that.  There is always something someone will complain about. Domes, artifical turf, too much passing, too much protection for the QB, officiating.  If you don't like it that is fine. Seriously no one forced you to watch the game. There are books and movies and hobbies you can enjoy if it bothers you that much. 

Oh yeah, the officiating is never perfect and it never has been. The game is so fast and for the most part they did a good job last night. Could that have been a no-call, sure. But as others have pointed out if that was a Bills WR and it wasn't called you would be screaming the fix was in. 

Enjoy, don't enjoy, who cares. The NFL continues to grow no matter who complains of some mythical better past.  

I'm not trying to pick on you but you started the thread. 

And for the record, I thought the half time show was the worst ever.

[WotAGuy]

3 hours ago, pocoboy said:

So here - I'm willing to concede a defensive holding can be a justified ending. This wasn't. If Mahomes gets someone to come offside and it's a first down, fine. You just have to make the punishment fit the crime, and the official who threw that flag would either have to be a) one of the lower IQ individuals in the profession to not understand the gravity of that moment, b) told that he should throw it by a higher-up in his ear, or c) be deceitful in his own right.

 

I don't want to be dramatic about all of this. Yes, the nature of the post is that way. It's just tougher and tougher to accept the outcomes of these games.

 

My assumption would be that the coming-off-a-one-year-deal aging defensive back was told by someone in the league to admit to it if he wants his next contract.

 

Just curious…..if you hadn’t lost your shirt on the outcome, would ya still be mad?

 

How can anyone have watched NFL officiating for multiple seasons draw the line at this particular play?  

[NoSaint]

19 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

Feelings?  LMAO

 

Interesting way of describing me saying the refs need to decide if they're going to call a tight game or let them play and stick to it.  It should be a situation where you're letting them play, and then with the outcome of the game in the balance, you're going to flag a weak holding call.

 

yes, you are declaring that you feel like it was happening all game. You can’t produce factually that it was happening. 

[Billz4ever]

1 minute ago, NoSaint said:

yes, you are declaring that you feel like it was happening all game. You can’t produce factually that it was happening. 

Sorry, I don't bark on your command so go ahead and carry on with your day and have a good one.

Edited February 13, 2023 by Billz4ever

[NoSaint]

1 minute ago, WotAGuy said:

 

Just curious…..if you hadn’t lost your shirt on the outcome, would ya still be mad?

 

How can anyone have watched NFL officiating for multiple seasons draw the line at this particular play?  

yea, it took the air out of the moment but was letter of the rule and no one’s shown it inconsistent yet… not my favorite call but definitely not egregious as highlighted this far.

Just now, Billz4ever said:

Sorry, I don't bark on your command.

you came and made an unsubstantiated claim that should be easy to substantiate- I’m not sure what to say about your dislike of being questioned on it. Don’t make the claim if you don’t plan to back it up somehow?