Buffalo #1 NFL City ... for Bad Weather as per The Weather Channel

[ChasBB]

Here's the video link identifying the top 5 bad weather NFL cities:

 

https://weather.com/news/weather/video/which-nfl-city-has-the-worst-weather

Edited November 26, 2021 by ChasBB
Fix link

[Dablitzkrieg]

This is groundbreaking news

[Big Turk]

That isn't surprising at all

[Nextmanup]

I have to say, this seems so over-played.

 

In December and January, MOST of this country is cold and crappy.  I'm not sure it's any worse in Orchard Park, especially if there is no storm at the moment.

 

Also: parts of this country (Green Bay, Chicago, Minneapolis) are FREAKING COLD in the winter time...they routinely get much colder air than Buffalo does, thanks to the lake.

 

On a non-storm kind of day, I'd rather be in Buffalo than Green Bay or Chicago, with minus 3 outside air temps.

 

It just doesn't get that cold in WNY typically.

 

 

[ChasBB]

1 minute ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

This is groundbreaking news

Fair enough.  I just never saw a formal analysis like this before, but those of us from Buffalo know this.

 

[Big Turk]

And remember..."When it's too tough for them...it's even worse for us!"

[SCBills]

Green Bay and Chicago seem to have more snow games than we have.  
 

The wind is getting ridiculous though.  Every pregame it’s a conversation piece.  Hopefully our next stadium has designs to address this even if it won’t likely be a dome. 

[Nextmanup]

Just now, ChasBB said:

Fair enough.  I just never saw a formal analysis like this before, but those of us from Buffalo know this.

 

As a native WNYer, I have said for years: the rest of the country thinks typical BUFFALO weather is the type of thing that is, in reality, typical WATERTOWN type weather....which is WAY worse than Buffalo.

 

 

[ChasBB]

Just now, BillnutinHouston said:

Clicked the link and saw nothing related to NFL cities.

Sorry, fixed it above ...
https://weather.com/news/weather/video/which-nfl-city-has-the-worst-weather

 

[First Round Bust]

attention mods...clean-up required !

[Big Turk]

8 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

I have to say, this seems so over-played.

 

In December and January, MOST of this country is cold and crappy.  I'm not sure it's any worse in Orchard Park, especially if there is no storm at the moment.

 

Also: parts of this country (Green Bay, Chicago, Minneapolis) are FREAKING COLD in the winter time...they routinely get much colder air than Buffalo does, thanks to the lake.

 

On a non-storm kind of day, I'd rather be in Buffalo than Green Bay or Chicago, with minus 3 outside air temps.

 

It just doesn't get that cold in WNY typically.

 

 

 

Yes, much of the midwest gets colder than we do by a lot...but winters here in general are miserable for 3 main reasons:

 

1) Cloud cover - while many places get colder, they also are usually sunny much more often than we are in the winter...November and December are in the low to mid 20s for percentage of sunshine, far below summertime when we have very high rates of sunshine for the NorthEast

 

2) Lake Effect Snow - very few places routinely get the amount of snow we can get here in the blink of an eye, and that literally can happen out of nowhere.  There are days we have picked up a foot of snow from a lake effect storm that just "happened" and was completely unexpected(I know as I read the NOAA forecasts regularly) that are unlike pretty much anywhere else in the country.  We also can have very well forecasted events that are known well in advance that can lead to multiple feet of snow.  That's unheard of for places outside of mountainous areas...they don't just get random snow events unless they are from strong fronts coming through and picking up moisture from somewhere.

 

3) Wind - we are in the top 10 windiest cities in the lower 48(ranked 8th), and much windier than Chicago(wrong side of the lake). Boston is actually a little windier than we are, but they don't usually get the snow we do to go with it unless they have a Nor'easter.  Worst of all, the winter months are windier than the summer here and anyone who has spent any time outdoors in the winter knows it can be brutal. Couple this with our stadium having the trickiest winds by far to deal with due to only having a tunnel at one end of it which causes crazy swirling winds, and it's not hard to see why we rank so high.

 

https://www.treehugger.com/windiest-cities-us-4858513

Edited November 26, 2021 by Big Turk

[hondo in seattle]

Just at a Michael's in Kansas where my wife bought fake polyester snow for her little Christmas village.  The product was  called "Buffalo Snow."

 

That's the city's reputation and we ought to wear it with pride.  I didn't watch the video but if I'm not mistaken,  Buffalo is both the snowiest and windiest NFL city.

[Nextmanup]

6 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Yes, much of the midwest gets colder than we do by a lot...but winters here in general are miserable for 2 main reasons:

 

1) Cloud cover - while many places get colder, they also are usually sunny much more often than we are in the winter...November and December are in the low to mid 20s for percentage of sunshine, far below summertime when we have very high rates of sunshine for the NorthEast

 

2) Lake Effect Snow - very few places routinely get the amount of snow we can get here in the blink of an eye, and that literally can happen out of nowhere.  There are days we have picked up a foot of snow from a lake effect storm that just "happened" and was completely unexpected(I know as I read the NOAA forecasts regularly) that are unlike pretty much anywhere else in the country.  We also can have very well forecasted events that are known well in advance that can lead to multiple feet of snow.  That's unheard of for places outside of mountainous areas...they don't just get random snow events unless they are from strong fronts coming through and picking up moisture from somewhere.

Yeah but what the rest of the country doesn't know is that the lake effect stuff mostly pounds the snow belt which is not Buffalo at all.

 

It's the South Towns and places like West Seneca, Orchard Park, East Aurora, etc.

 

Of course ANYWHERE in WNY can be slammed with snow on occasion, but it's funny how the national media will start up with the "Buffalo Gets Slammed" story and I'll talk to my sister who lives right in the heart of the city....and she'll say "We have a light dusting of snow on the ground."

 

As for GRAY SKY?  NO DOUBT!  That stuff will KILL YOU and WNY gets a ton of it.

Then again, so does Seattle and lots of other places too.

 

 

 

[Big Turk]

7 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

Just at a Michael's in Kansas where my wife bought fake polyester snow for her little Christmas village.  The product was  called "Buffalo Snow."

 

That's the city's reputation and we ought to wear it with pride.  I didn't watch the video but if I'm not mistaken,  Buffalo is both the snowiest and windiest NFL city.

 

Actually Boston is windier than we are...average winds in Buffalo are 11.8 mph to 12.3 mph for Boston

[SirAndrew]

12 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

As a native WNYer, I have said for years: the rest of the country thinks typical BUFFALO weather is the type of thing that is, in reality, typical WATERTOWN type weather....which is WAY worse than Buffalo.

 

 

I just need to play devil’s advocate a bit. The term Buffalo is a vague one that most of the country doesn’t understand. Lake effect snow and weather patterns are crazy. What’s happening in Amherst is typically different from what’s happening in the Southtowns. Different areas of the city see different weather patterns as well. The stadium is in Orchard Park, and I’m willing to bet that Orchard Park weather is closer to Watertown than other areas of WNY are. 

[Gugny]

This makes me wonder whether a dome would be the best option for the new stadium.  Has this been brought up around here yet?

[SirAndrew]

1 minute ago, Nextmanup said:

Yeah but what the rest of the country doesn't know is that the lake effect stuff mostly pounds the snow belt which is not Buffalo at all.

 

It's the South Towns and places like West Seneca, Orchard Park, East Aurora, etc.

 

Of course ANYWHERE in WNY can be slammed with snow on occasion, but it's funny how the national media will start up with the "Buffalo Gets Slammed" story and I'll talk to my sister who lives right in the heart of the city....and she'll say "We have a light dusting of snow on the ground."

 

As for GRAY SKY?  NO DOUBT!  That stuff will KILL YOU and WNY gets a ton of it.

Then again, so does Seattle and lots of other places too.

 

 

 

I fully agree, good post. I saw the same thing with that big fall storm a few years ago when I had family in the city. The Weather Channel spent days talking about how Buffalo was a no go for travel, and I easily drove right downtown, with just a little snow. That’s the exact issue at hand though, the stadium is in OP. 

[LabattBlue]

Today in WNY…cold, gray, windy and snow flurries…depending on where you are at, much more than flurries. 
 

In one word…depressing. 😞

Edited November 26, 2021 by BTB

[elijah]

4 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

Yeah but what the rest of the country doesn't know is that the lake effect stuff mostly pounds the snow belt which is not Buffalo at all.

 

It's the South Towns and places like West Seneca, Orchard Park, East Aurora, etc.

 

Of course ANYWHERE in WNY can be slammed with snow on occasion, but it's funny how the national media will start up with the "Buffalo Gets Slammed" story and I'll talk to my sister who lives right in the heart of the city....and she'll say "We have a light dusting of snow on the ground."

 

As for GRAY SKY?  NO DOUBT!  That stuff will KILL YOU and WNY gets a ton of it.

Then again, so does Seattle and lots of other places too.

 

 

 

I mean, that is where the stadium is located isn’t it 

[JMF2006]

21 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

I have to say, this seems so over-played.

 

In December and January, MOST of this country is cold and crappy.  I'm not sure it's any worse in Orchard Park, especially if there is no storm at the moment.

 

Also: parts of this country (Green Bay, Chicago, Minneapolis) are FREAKING COLD in the winter time...they routinely get much colder air than Buffalo does, thanks to the lake.

 

On a non-storm kind of day, I'd rather be in Buffalo than Green Bay or Chicago, with minus 3 outside air temps.

 

It just doesn't get that cold in WNY typically.

 

 

 

When that wind blows across that lake in Nov/Dec you can get some pretty significant accumulations even into January.

[Marv's Neighbor]

They are also big advocates of Global Warming, so why worry? 

[Big Turk]

13 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

Yeah but what the rest of the country doesn't know is that the lake effect stuff mostly pounds the snow belt which is not Buffalo at all.

 

It's the South Towns and places like West Seneca, Orchard Park, East Aurora, etc.

 

Of course ANYWHERE in WNY can be slammed with snow on occasion, but it's funny how the national media will start up with the "Buffalo Gets Slammed" story and I'll talk to my sister who lives right in the heart of the city....and she'll say "We have a light dusting of snow on the ground."

 

As for GRAY SKY?  NO DOUBT!  That stuff will KILL YOU and WNY gets a ton of it.

Then again, so does Seattle and lots of other places too.

 

 

 

 

Yeah, but the airport averages over 93 inches a year, which still ranks it as the snowiest major city in the US.  We also have the record for highest single season snowfall of any city of over 100K Population in the US ever recorded with over 199 inches...again measured at the airport.  Our reputation for snow is well earned.

 

True that the Southtowns get blasted harder with Hamburg averaging 150+ inches a year and even West Seneca and OP(where the stadium is) probably in the 120's, but many don't realize, the eastern suburbs not far from the airport are in a snowbelt also...Depew and Lancaster get buried too(I know, I live there) many times even as the airport gets little to nothing...there is a pattern that sets up where the snow goes over West Seneca, Lackawanna, misses just south of downtown Buffalo, but then heads directly over Depew/Lancaster and out towards Batavia.  This is what happened in SnowVember where we also got about 7 feet of snow along with the Southtowns and South Buffalo, even as the airport which is under 3 miles away got very little. I would say we probably get on average 110 inches where I am. We also tend to get the Lake Effect snow off Lake Ontario when it effects NF and Lockport areas blowing SouthEast, so we get it from both directions, something West Seneca and OP do not.

 

Further north you go...North Buffalo, Tonawanda, NF, Lockport, etc they get far less snow...usually 50-60 inches in a typical winter, and usually only get the synoptic snow from storm systems and occasionally LE Snow from Lake Erie when it goes way north, which usually is only for short bursts when disturbances come through and temporarily change wind direction before it goes back to the normal SW or SSW flow.  

 

Edited November 26, 2021 by Big Turk

[Nextmanup]

Here we are just a few days away from the start of December.

How about keeping a detailed weather log for all remaining home games in 4 places:

 

Buffalo, Chicago, Green Bay, and Foxboro.

 

I would suggest the weather will be equally CRAP in all places, on balance.

 

And that's just a few places; it's not like the weather will be nice in Philadelphia, New Jersey, Baltimore, and many other places.

 

And I haven't even mentioned Minneapolis, who magically gets removed from the conversation due to the dome.

 

You want bad winter weather?  Move to Minnesota for F's sake.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[NewEra]

Uhoh, I hear the sirens!  The Anti Dome Fire Department is en route!!

[Buffalo_Stampede]

29 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

That isn't surprising at all

Would be if you looked at a stadium thread. 

[Big Turk]

1 minute ago, Nextmanup said:

Here we are just a few days away from the start of December.

How about keeping a detailed weather log for all remaining home games in 4 places:

 

Buffalo, Chicago, Green Bay, and Foxboro.

 

I would suggest the weather will be equally CRAP in all places, on balance.

 

And that's just a few places; it's not like the weather will be nice in Philadelphia, New Jersey, Baltimore, and many other places.

 

And I haven't even mentioned Minneapolis, who magically gets removed from the conversation due to the dome.

 

You want bad winter weather?  Move to Minnesota for F's sake.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Minnesota is mostly just cold tho...same with Wisconson.  They don't get anywhere near the snow we get here. once again, wrong side of the lake.  Now the UP of Michigan and the Tug Hill Plateau area east of Lake Ontario for places like Potsdam and Watertown??  They get it ALL...bitter cold to like 20-30 degrees below 0 regularly WITHOUT the windchills, AND tons of snow....no thanks.

Edited November 26, 2021 by Big Turk

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

11 minutes ago, Gugny said:

This makes me wonder whether a dome would be the best option for the new stadium.  Has this been brought up around here yet?

oh man. I was just about to pop in for my daily dome post, and you beat me to it. 

[Big Turk]

13 minutes ago, Gugny said:

This makes me wonder whether a dome would be the best option for the new stadium.  Has this been brought up around here yet?

 

Yes...not going to happen...would add a minimum of 500 million to the cost of the new stadium.

[The Frankish Reich]

27 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

Yes, much of the midwest gets colder than we do by a lot...but winters here in general are miserable for 3 main reasons

This Buffalo you speak of seems to be a very appealing place to visit. I must make a plan to visit sometime, preferably in December - February.

[SirAndrew]

2 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Minnesota is mostly just cold tho...same with Wisconson.  They don't get anywhere near the snow we get here

Weather is all subjective, but I don’t think WNY people realize how unusual around 100 inches per year is in the world. We think of Niagara Falls 50 inches or so as being nothing, but that’s still significant compared to other metro areas around the globe. 

[LABILLBACKER]

37 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Green Bay and Chicago seem to have more snow games than we have.  
 

The wind is getting ridiculous though.  Every pregame it’s a conversation piece.  Hopefully our next stadium has designs to address this even if it won’t likely be a dome. 

Exactly,  the issue isn't even snow anymore.  It's the wind every single Sunday. Not even Laramie Wyoming sees wind like they do in Buffalo. They don't even get snow or wind in New Orleans yet they build a dome. Stop being dumb asses and put in a damn retractable roof.  Common sense is your friend. Optimize Josh's talents and maybe we win a Super Bowl. Sorry diehards.

Edited November 26, 2021 by LABILLBACKER

[Utah John]

I thought Buffalo was cold when I lived there but having lived in Laramie Wyoming (before Josh was even born), Omaha Nebraska, and now Alaska I can tell you there are far colder places.  Lots of snow in Buffalo of course, and of course the accumulation depends on where you live as others have said. 

 

Strictly from a PR perspective, it would be better if the new stadium was inside Buffalo to avoid most of the big lake effect storms, but if the wind is from the southwest instead of the south, downtown can get nailed too.

 

But so what.  Yes it snows there.  It's SERIOUSLY cold here (Fairbanks Alaska) where we fortunately warmed up to -1F a couple of days ago and will be close to -30F again on Saturday night.  And it's dark, with only a few hours of daylight.  We had snow this year in September, while it was still summer.  And it chills your heart to know that winter isn't here yet.  And the winters are LONG -- we'll have deep snow on the ground until early May. 

 

There are a lot of celebrities who act as if the only two places in the country where a person could live are downstate New York and southern California.  Other people think the only places where a person could live are NFL cities, and so comparisons like this article are important for some reason.  It is what it is.  You live where you live for a variety of reasons, and which reasons are most important depends on your personal preferences.  

 

 

[Chandler#81]

Never wonder why I gave up my season tickets and moved to Florida in ‘96. I WILL return for a Super Bowl parade though!

[SirAndrew]

2 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Exactly,  the issue isn't even snow anymore.  It's the wind every single Sunday. Not even Laramie Wyoming sees wind like they do in Buffalo. Stop being dumb asses and put in a damn retractable roof.  Common sense is your friend. 

The design of the current stadium also amplifies the wind. They basically built a wind tunnel. 

[Utah John]

12 minutes ago, Marv's Neighbor said:

They are also big advocates of Global Warming, so why worry? 

Global warming itself is not going to make a lot of difference with respect to avoiding cold winters.

 

But global warming is causing climate change, and THAT is going to play havoc with weather everywhere.  

12 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Yeah, but the airport averages over 93 inches a year, which still ranks it as the snowiest major city in the US.  We also have the record for highest single season snowfall of any city of over 100K Population in the US ever recorded with over 199 inches...again measured at the airport.  Our reputation for snow is well earned.

 

True that the Southtowns get blasted harder with Hamburg averaging 150+ inches a year and even West Seneca and OP(where the stadium is) probably in the 120's, but many don't realize, the eastern suburbs not far from the airport are in a snowbelt also...Depew and Lancaster get buried too(I know, I live there) many times even as the airport gets little to nothing...there is a pattern that sets up where the snow goes over West Seneca, Lackawanna, misses just south of downtown Buffalo, but then heads directly over Depew/Lancaster and out towards Batavia.  This is what happened in SnowVember where we also got about 7 feet of snow along with the Southtowns and South Buffalo, even as the airport which is under 3 miles away got very little. I would say we probably get on average 110 inches where I am. We also tend to get the Lake Effect snow off Lake Ontario when it effects NF and Lockport areas blowing SouthEast, so we get it from both directions, something West Seneca and OP do not.

 

Further north you go...North Buffalo, Tonawanda, NF, Lockport, etc they get far less snow...usually 50-60 inches in a typical winter, and usually only get the synoptic snow from storm systems and occasionally LE Snow from Lake Erie when it goes way north, which usually is only for short bursts when disturbances come through and temporarily change wind direction before it goes back to the normal SW or SSW flow.  

 

Synoptic snow?  You are revealing yourself as a person with actual meteorological knowledge, my friend.  As a professional meteorologist, I find your post to be extremely informative and accurate.  

 

When I was growing up in West Seneca, we had relatives in Newfane NY, north of us and not very far from Lake Ontario.  They hardly ever got hammered with deep snow.  They said they thought they were living in God's country.

[Big Turk]

36 minutes ago, SirAndrew said:

I fully agree, good post. I saw the same thing with that big fall storm a few years ago when I had family in the city. The Weather Channel spent days talking about how Buffalo was a no go for travel, and I easily drove right downtown, with just a little snow. That’s the exact issue at hand though, the stadium is in OP. 

 

Yes, there ARE areas that get less snow...typically the highest snow totals are in the southern tier areas around Randolph, Colden, Boston, etc where they get both the typically favored wind direction for Lake Effect snow AND orographic lifting caused by the hills in the area, which enhance the Lake Snows even more.  Those places normally get 200-250+ inches a year, sometimes 300+ in bad years.  Then Hambug and areas near there get 150+ inches...then West Seneca and OP in the 120-130 range typically...then Eastern Suburbs like Depew/Lancaster with 110ish average...then the area around the airport with 93.  Ironically Downtown Buffalo often times doesn't get as much because it is too CLOSE to the Lake and it takes longer for the air to cool coming inland from the relatively speaking warmer lake water so places further away usually get heavier snow.  

 

Obviously North Buffalo and the Northern Suburbs get the least snow in the area, around 50-60 inches as the Lake Effect snows typically don't hit them for very long if they make it up there at all.  Typically if they get Lake Snow it is usually at the beginning of the event as it sometimes will start up north before the winds change back to the typical SW or SSW favored patterns coming off Lake Erie once the system or disturbance pulls away and no longer is influencing the wind direction.

 

But don't get it twisted. Buffalo is both the snowiest major city in the US and holds the US record for most snow of any city with over 100K population in a single season.  We have earned our reputation for snow.

Edited November 26, 2021 by Big Turk

[The Frankish Reich]

12 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Minnesota is mostly just cold tho...same with Wisconson.  They don't get anywhere near the snow we get here. once again, wrong side of the lake.  Now the UP of Michigan and the Tug Hill Plateau area east of Lake Ontario for places like Potsdam and Watertown??  They get it ALL...bitter cold to like 20-30 degrees below 0 regularly WITHOUT the windchills, AND tons of snow....no thanks.

All of this agrees with my experience. The coldest days in Minnesota are typically sunny (not that you can feel the sun) and calm. I have to agree with you, Buffalo is just one of the most miserable winter climates with wind/cloud cover/snow/cold all together.

[Big Turk]

8 minutes ago, Utah John said:

Global warming itself is not going to make a lot of difference with respect to avoiding cold winters.

 

But global warming is causing climate change, and THAT is going to play havoc with weather everywhere.  

Synoptic snow?  You are revealing yourself as a person with actual meteorological knowledge, my friend.  As a professional meteorologist, I find your post to be extremely informative and accurate.  

 

When I was growing up in West Seneca, we had relatives in Newfane NY, north of us and not very far from Lake Ontario.  They hardly ever got hammered with deep snow.  They said they thought they were living in God's country.

 

Hahaha thanks! I was a meteorology major for 2 years in college and grew up fascinated by weather, always watching the weather channel...just couldn't deal with all the crazy math/physics I would have had to take the last 2 years so I switched to marketing, although I never really used that...now I am a software engineer

Edited November 26, 2021 by Big Turk

[Rochesterfan]

For years and years - every study shows the same thing - Buffalo is top 1 or 2 for wind during NFL games and has one of the most difficult stadiums to kick and thrown in because of how that wind comes across the stadium and swirls.

 

Buffalo is the snowiest NFL stadium for games and is near the top in rain and precipitation for all venues.  Small amounts of snow are not a big deal, but rain and heavy snow has major impacts - especially when combined with the wind.

 

Buffalo is one of the coldest cities - although GB is and can be colder - it doesn’t combine all of the other weather the way Buffalo does.

 

Buffalo is by far the worst NFL city for weather and we have a chance to fix that any of multiple ways.  A new OP stadium built with better wind and weather blocking and built at a proper angle and not dug down - will all help with the wind, but does little for the rain and snow and temperatures.

 

A covered stadium fixes all 3 issues.

 

A downtown stadium likely also helps as there is less wind and the stadium design can help, there is significantly less snow and the temperature is warmer closer to the water.

 

There are so many good options to adjust this, but most likely we will stay status Quo and remain a place no one can play at their peak level.

 

 

Edited November 26, 2021 by Rochesterfan

[Utah John]

1 minute ago, Big Turk said:

 

Hahaha...I was a meteorology major for 2 years in college and grew up fascinated by weather, always watching the weather channel...

I bounced around at UB through various college majors before taking an intro to meteorology course offered by the physics department.  I was hooked, and I never looked back.  Had to transfer to SUNY Albany to pursue the major.  It was a great career, taking me to places all over the country.  I hope whatever you settled on has worked out as well for you as meteorology did for me.