Joe B All-22 vs Baltimore from The Athletic

[transplantbillsfan]

https://theathletic.com/1445380/2019/12/10/bills-all-22-review-what-was-up-with-josh-allens-processing-time-and-that-final-fourth-down?source=shared-article

1) Allen’s processing time drifts back to early-season levels

...

Allen salvaged his average processing time on the Bills’ final two offensive series. He looked more like the quarterback we saw in the team’s previous three outings and less like the player we saw in the first three quarters. Those first three quarters, however, are where the damage was done and the game was lost. The Bills were begging for anything from their passing offense. The Ravens caught Allen in a cycle of decisions that took far too long. Through the first three quarters, Allen took an average of 3.03 seconds to throw, run or get sacked on his first 33 dropbacks. Over his final 17 dropbacks on the last two drives, that time dropped to 2.71 seconds on average.

...

2) What went wrong on the final fourth down?

 

Allen tried to force the ball into John Brown in one-on-one coverage, with cornerback Marcus Peters on Brown’s back running step-for-step with him. While there’s a slight case to be made for defensive holding here, it wasn’t blatant enough for the officials to make a potentially game-changing call. They had been letting that type of contact go all game long. What could have changed the outcome is Brown running a better route against man-to-man coverage.

 

Brown is the best outside route runner the Bills have had since Stevie Johnson, but his execution on this play was lacking. Brown’s deception tactics — trying to get Peters to bite with three non-threatening stutter steps — were insufficient.

...

Additionally, the offensive line protected well enough against an eight-man blitz that Allen had time to come off his first read. On the left side of the formation, the Bills used a route combination with Cole Beasley and Isaiah McKenzie to clear out the entire side of the field for Beasley. McKenzie took a deeper and delayed slant toward the middle of the field so that he wouldn’t infringe on Brown’s area and bring another defender with him, while also giving Beasley enough room to run his inside-out route. Beasley’s executed his route well against Marlon Humphrey. Beasley got Humphrey moving toward the middle, stuck his foot in the ground and cut back outside, giving him 2-3 yards of separation. Even though Allen thought he’d be under duress, more poise in that situation could have helped him get the first down, at least. If Allen sees he has time, spots Brown’s lack of separation and gets to his second read, an on-target throw likely has Beasley running into the end zone and a game heading into overtime. It was a massive opportunity for the Bills and they didn’t get the job done.

3) The unsung hero of the Bills defense vs. Lamar Jackson

But one defender who made a ton of impact plays went relatively unnoticed. Cornerback Levi Wallace — and his run support, tackling and pass coverage — was one of the many reasons the Bills were able to limit Jackson’s impact.

...

 

Some of his best plays were a result of his body positioning and taking away Jackson’s outside lane. While Jackson does his most damage as a rusher from the edge, Wallace helped redirect the quarterback inside to his teammates and limit the quarterback’s rushing yards.

 

In pass coverage, Wallace didn’t fall for the receivers’ traps, even going move-for-move with Seth Roberts (sixth play in the video).

4) In one area, the Bills need more from Tre’Davious White

the Bills needed more out of him in run support. There were too many instances when the Ravens got the ball to the edge and White effectively gave himself up to the blocking wide receiver. On a handful of those plays, White squared up against the blocker 15-to-20 yards down the field and didn’t make an over-the-top effort to get off the block or push the receiver back into the oncoming runner.

...

To be a complete cornerback, especially in coach Sean McDermott’s scheme, White needs to pitch in on run support. Against Baltimore, he didn’t follow through on that defensive principle.

5) Dawkins’ season has been an overwhelming success

The 2019 season is now 14 weeks old, giving us enough of a sample size to determine who is and isn’t having a good season. Through 13 games, we’re past the point of qualifying statements for left tackle Dion Dawkins, who’s completely turned around his career trajectory in his third year. 

...

On Sunday, he limited Matt Judon’s impact with his one-on-one blocking. The Bills feel comfortable enough with him in those situations that they can send help elsewhere. As a run blocker, Dawkins continues to show the ability to turn his opponent, which has led to some substantial gains on the ground. Dawkins will be entering the final year of his rookie contract next year, and with nearly a full season of assessment, the Bills shouldn’t delay. They should reward his great season with a long-term extension to make him the left tackle of the foreseeable future.

Edited December 11, 2019 by transplantbillsfan

[ILBillsfan]

I did se Beasley on the final play coming open but Josh had already made the decision to go to Brown.  I agree whole heartedly with that analysis of the final play.  Beasley would of had the first and possibly a TD as well still not sure why he has not become the number one place to look for when Josh needs critical yardage the guy gets open because Brown is drawing the top DB as team are really focusing on eliminating him form Buffalo's passing game imo.

[Codyny13]

Good analysis. Josh def made the decision to go to JB before he even snapped the ball. I agree that smoke’s route was lacking, he never flashed Peters outside or anything and made it easy to decipher what he was doing. It wasn’t Josh’s best game, the nonstop blitzing paired with routes that seemed too long to develop really set us back early.  I understand the blitzing on the part of the Ravens leaves them open for shots on the back end, a few plays were def left on the field, but our short passing game always seems to be there for the taking. Brady has made a career of this, and although i still want the Bills to take advantage of Allen’s arm, we need to sustain these drives and score points. I hope we can adjust this weekend so we can get this W and rest easy the last 2 weeks.

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

11 minutes ago, ILBillsfan said:

I did se Beasley on the final play coming open but Josh had already made the decision to go to Brown.  I agree whole heartedly with that analysis of the final play.  Beasley would of had the first and possibly a TD as well still not sure why he has not become the number one place to look for when Josh needs critical yardage the guy gets open because Brown is drawing the top DB as team are really focusing on eliminating him form Buffalo's passing game imo.

 

They ran the same play earlier.  Josh was sacked waiting for Beasley to get open. Brown was wide open.  This time Josh went to Brown, it just didn't work out. 

[Locomark]

13 minutes ago, ILBillsfan said:

I did se Beasley on the final play coming open but Josh had already made the decision to go to Brown.  I agree whole heartedly with that analysis of the final play.  Beasley would of had the first and possibly a TD as well still not sure why he has not become the number one place to look for when Josh needs critical yardage the guy gets open because Brown is drawing the top DB as team are really focusing on eliminating him form Buffalo's passing game imo.

Sorry but Josh had no time all game so he should have sat there and assumed he would have 4 seconds against a blitz so Beasley could do his usual 3 moves to get open? Sorry I stand by his decision that the best WR is supposed to win 1 on 1. He didn’t and that is why the play didn’t work. We need a real WR1 and that showed on that play. I like Beasley but anything beyond 5 yards usually takes him 3 seconds to swirl loose and that’s not a good route for an all out blitz. 

[GG]

2 minutes ago, Locomark said:

Sorry but Josh had no time all game so he should have sat there and assumed he would have 4 seconds against a blitz so Beasley could do his usual 3 moves to get open? Sorry I stand by his decision that the best WR is supposed to win 1 on 1. He didn’t and that is why the play didn’t work. We need a real WR1 and that showed on that play. I like Beasley but anything beyond 5 yards usually takes him 3 seconds to swirl loose and that’s not a good route for an all out blitz. 

 

Hyperbole much?   Beasley made one great move and had clear separation.  But that wasn't the point of his piece.

 

Joe B wasn't faulting Allen.  He's rightly calling out Brown's feeble triple step in his pattern as the primary culprit.  If Brown ran a better pattern, it's a TD.   

 

Joe's commentary on Allen was that with more seasoning, Allen would recognize that the rush wasn't severe, Brown is covered well and he should progress to his next read.

[ILBillsfan]

12 minutes ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said:

 

They ran the same play earlier.  Josh was sacked waiting for Beasley to get open. Brown was wide open.  This time Josh went to Brown, it just didn't work out. 

Brown was not wide open Peters never bit on the move and played the slant perfectly.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

6 minutes ago, ILBillsfan said:

Brown was not wide open Peters never bit on the move and played the slant perfectly.

 

Brown was open on the previous one where he waited for beasley to uncover.  It was a sack.

[The Jokeman]

Dawkins got praise? Is this sarcasm? Judon was all over Allen in that game and made two or three key hits in the backfield. 

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

11 minutes ago, ILBillsfan said:

Brown was not wide open Peters never bit on the move and played the slant perfectly.

 

I am talking about the previous time the Bills ran that play, when Beasley did not get open and Josh took a sack. 

2 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

Dawkins got praise? Is this sarcasm? Judon was all over Allen in that game and made two or three key hits in the backfield. 

 

Wasn't one of Judon's sacks against Knox? 

[colin]

the thing that keeps getting hammered into my brain as i read these and watch the film is that our O is needlessly at a higher level of difficulty.

 

our RT is TRASH wrt consistency.  he will just randomly miss a block in pass pro or the run game (remember the stretch run to the right that had mad daylight but he just straight went the wrong way and blocked a blade of grass?  yeah, that kinda stuff) our qb is (and obviously so) jittery at times and has been cheeks on the long ball, our WRs are smurfs who have trouble getting open vs m2m w pressure.  Oh, and we only have 2 actual wr's and our TE will drop random passes.

 

this isn't to say these guys aren't good at all, but these are the limitations we are working with, so why on earth are we trying to beat a top 3 D's cover zero blitz with these precise deeper passes so often?  we clearly didn't practice any formations or combos that would good at beating these, or the coach just didn't want to call them.

 

the one screen to roberts went for a mile AND WAS NEVER SEEN BEFORE OR AFTER.

 

i dunno, i just think the d has the philosophy of don't think too much, play fast and hard, while our o seems to think "always be clever and drop back 50 times vs baltimore".

[DrDawkinstein]

43 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

Dawkins got praise? Is this sarcasm? Judon was all over Allen in that game and made two or three key hits in the backfield. 

 

Two hits in the backfield, one against Knox. So one against Dawkins all day. Yeah, Dawkins gets praise.

[BringBackFlutie]

19 minutes ago, colin said:

the thing that keeps getting hammered into my brain as i read these and watch the film is that our O is needlessly at a higher level of difficulty.

 

our RT is TRASH wrt consistency.  he will just randomly miss a block in pass pro or the run game (remember the stretch run to the right that had mad daylight but he just straight went the wrong way and blocked a blade of grass?  yeah, that kinda stuff) our qb is (and obviously so) jittery at times and has been cheeks on the long ball, our WRs are smurfs who have trouble getting open vs m2m w pressure.  Oh, and we only have 2 actual wr's and our TE will drop random passes.

 

this isn't to say these guys aren't good at all, but these are the limitations we are working with, so why on earth are we trying to beat a top 3 D's cover zero blitz with these precise deeper passes so often?  we clearly didn't practice any formations or combos that would good at beating these, or the coach just didn't want to call them.

 

the one screen to roberts went for a mile AND WAS NEVER SEEN BEFORE OR AFTER.

 

i dunno, i just think the d has the philosophy of don't think too much, play fast and hard, while our o seems to think "always be clever and drop back 50 times vs baltimore".

Yeah.  This is obvious to me.  However, I'm torn between fixing it to win now, or continuing it to teach our young QB.  I suppose there's an argument for, "continue to teach our young QB while making things a bit easier on him, and thus winning more games," but the idea of throwing a Tom Brady-level offense at him every week until he gets it is somehow tantalizing to me.

[The Jokeman]

5 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Two hits in the backfield, one against Knox. So one against Dawkins all day. Yeah, Dawkins gets praise.

Fair enough I usually don't focus on one on one battles live in game so trust those that analyzed it. Yet his slow gallup in to the line of scrimmage in the 4th quarter was the only memorable thing for me. Granted I never fault a guy for injury but man I wonder how things be different if he was at the line and Josh wasn't force to wait for him. 

[colin]

34 minutes ago, BringBackFlutie said:

Yeah.  This is obvious to me.  However, I'm torn between fixing it to win now, or continuing it to teach our young QB.  I suppose there's an argument for, "continue to teach our young QB while making things a bit easier on him, and thus winning more games," but the idea of throwing a Tom Brady-level offense at him every week until he gets it is somehow tantalizing to me.

 

i hear you, but the thing is tom brady's O of old was never high difficulty.  lots of screens, short passes, pre snap reads, and well designed runs.  they usually made it easy and always reduced pressure.

 

our O just assumes to have Ford block blitzers while our four foot WRs go deep over the top of cover 0.  I don't think there is any need for the O to be so silly hard.

 

 

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, GG said:

 

Hyperbole much?   Beasley made one great move and had clear separation.  But that wasn't the point of his piece.

 

Joe B wasn't faulting Allen.  He's rightly calling out Brown's feeble triple step in his pattern as the primary culprit.  If Brown ran a better pattern, it's a TD.   

 

Joe's commentary on Allen was that with more seasoning, Allen would recognize that the rush wasn't severe, Brown is covered well and he should progress to his next read.

My issue with your take and with Joe B's is that it doesn't factor in the quality of the CB. Marcus Peters is really, really good. As I've said elsewhere, there's a reason why good organizations covet him despite the fact that he's one of the biggest a-holes in the league.

1 hour ago, The Jokeman said:

Dawkins got praise? Is this sarcasm? Judon was all over Allen in that game and made two or three key hits in the backfield. 

I think you're confusing Knox with Dawkins.

[Boatdrinks]

I think Joe B assumes a lot watching the slowed down all 22. There is pressure bearing down on the 4th down play that’s about to break through and force Josh out of the pocket. He wasn’t going to risk waiting for Beasley to make a move and having the ball batted down , getting hit etc. He decided to throw to Brown on the slant and Brown didn’t do much to get open. He still probably should have caught the ball as it hit him in the hands. A more physical WR makes that play a good percentage of the time. The Bills offense has very limited weapons in its arsenal when trying to beat a high caliber defensive unit like Baltimore. I didn’t like the play selection by Daboll in that final sequence. First and ten at the 18 with plenty of time and an opportunity to get another first down is a good situation. I want my OC to have an answer there, and he didn’t. The db was waiting on the slant, and the Bills don’t have superior athletes that can just make a play even when you know what’s coming. 

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

Not that it's a big deal but Tyler Krofts grade was missing, and wasn't listed as players under the min snap count to be rated number either.  I was looking for him as was curious as to how many snaps he actually took, but wasn't listed anywhere.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Brown is the best Bills route runner since Stevie? 

 

C’mon now. Woods? Sammy? 

 

Then also I remember Stevie didn’t run routes that well at all. He’d toast guys like Revis because no one knew what the hell he was gonna do.  

 

Then washed out of the league because neither did the coaches or QBs.  Fitz was the only guy on earth that could figure out what he was gonna do. 

 

 

[GG]

2 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

My issue with your take and with Joe B's is that it doesn't factor in the quality of the CB. Marcus Peters is really, really good. As I've said elsewhere, there's a reason why good organizations covet him despite the fact that he's one of the biggest a-holes in the league.

 

 

I'm sure that was part of Allen's presnap decisions.  But if you look at the totality of options on that play, all Brown has to do is run a better route, and it's a virtual tie game. 

[eball]

If cover1 (erik turner) is praising Martindale's scheme and talking about how hard it was to diagnose where the blitz was coming from, that's good enough for me.  4th quarter Josh turned it on again, just a tad too late.  All of these experiences are helping him grow as a QB -- and just wait until we get a couple more weapons in the offseason.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

4 hours ago, ILBillsfan said:

I did see Beasley on the final play coming open but Josh had already made the decision to go to Brown.  I agree whole heartedly with that analysis of the final play.  Beasley would of had the first and possibly a TD as well still not sure why he has not become the number one place to look for when Josh needs critical yardage the guy gets open because Brown is drawing the top DB as team are really focusing on eliminating him form Buffalo's passing game imo.

 

If you look very carefully at the all-22 (and someone posted this totally cool graphic off Yards Per Pass twitter) Beasley had only just started his break and it's not clear whether he'll get separation at the point where Josh threw to Brown.  He has plenty of time in that throw, but from how the defenders are moving I rate it as "not proven" whether he'd have had the extra second or two to get it to Beasley on that particular play.

 

The thing is, it's total hindsight second guessing for Joe B; he calls Smoke's 3 stutter steps unconvincing, and they were,  but the fact is Smoke ran the route fast enough to be open and let Josh make a throw before the pressure got to him.  If they want Beasley to be an option for Josh on those routes, he needs to somehow speed up his routes a bit, but he "sold" his route so well because he gave it time to develop.  I am not a WR guru but I believe Smoke might have been able to move so as to "box out" Peters - this is actually something Duke Williams is good at, subtly using his body to shield the catch from the DB (but DOWN BOYS Duke doesn't have the speed to get down there and get open on that route in the first place).

 

 

[ngbills]

Allen goes to Beasley and it is short of the first then we have issues. I think we should have ran the 4th down play on downs 1-3 and gone to Beasley on it. Its a hard play to defend when your trying to protect from the TD. All game should have run more quick pick routes and thrown the short pass. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

38 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Brown is the best Bills route runner since Stevie? 

C’mon now. Woods? Sammy? 

Then also I remember Stevie didn’t run routes that well at all. He’d toast guys like Revis because no one knew what the hell he was gonna do.  

Then washed out of the league because neither did the coaches or QBs.  Fitz was the only guy on earth that could figure out what he was gonna do.

 

Yep.  Stevie got open because he worked in Chan Gailey's "beat your man, get to the spot" system.  In systems where he was expected to run a precise route to a precise spot, not so much.  And an undisclosed number of Fitz' picks on throws to Stevie were because Stevie wasn't where Fitz expected him to be, so even Fitzy couldn't figure it out with 100% success.

 

Brown is a very good route runner, but if he wants to be a #1 WR he has to figure out how to make those contested catches and how to play against a physical handsy DB.  You can't just stand in the locker room post-game and complain that the defense was getting away with stuff.  The defense always gets away with stuff.  If he wants to live up to the "Smoke is Dangerous" hype and do the pro-bowl thing, he needs to take a step with his contested catch abilities.

 

2 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

My issue with your take and with Joe B's is that it doesn't factor in the quality of the CB. Marcus Peters is really, really good. As I've said elsewhere, there's a reason why good organizations covet him despite the fact that he's one of the biggest a-holes in the league.

I think you're confusing Knox with Dawkins.

 

It was clearly Knox who got pwned on the strip sack that gave the Ravens the ball at the 24, and that was a blindside speed rush that 9 out of 10 QB cough up the ball under.

[dave mcbride]

18 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

If you look very carefully at the all-22 (and someone posted this totally cool graphic off Yards Per Pass twitter) Beasley had only just started his break and it's not clear whether he'll get separation at the point where Josh threw to Brown.  He has plenty of time in that throw, but from how the defenders are moving I rate it as "not proven" whether he'd have had the extra second or two to get it to Beasley on that particular play.

 

The thing is, it's total hindsight second guessing for Joe B; he calls Smoke's 3 stutter steps unconvincing, and they were,  but the fact is Smoke ran the route fast enough to be open and let Josh make a throw before the pressure got to him.  If they want Beasley to be an option for Josh on those routes, he needs to somehow speed up his routes a bit, but he "sold" his route so well because he gave it time to develop.  I am not a WR guru but I believe Smoke might have been able to move so as to "box out" Peters - this is actually something Duke Williams is good at, subtly using his body to shield the catch from the DB (but DOWN BOYS Duke doesn't have the speed to get down there and get open on that route in the first place).

 

 

Plus the fact that the majority of passing plays that took any amount of time had resulted in jailbreaks during that part of the game meant that he KNEW he had to sling it. Can't risk another sack there. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

5 hours ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said:

 

I am talking about the previous time the Bills ran that play, when Beasley did not get open and Josh took a sack. 

 

Wasn't one of Judon's sacks against Knox? 

 

Against is a generous way of describing it.

[ILBillsfan]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

If you look very carefully at the all-22 (and someone posted this totally cool graphic off Yards Per Pass twitter) Beasley had only just started his break and it's not clear whether he'll get separation at the point where Josh threw to Brown.  He has plenty of time in that throw, but from how the defenders are moving I rate it as "not proven" whether he'd have had the extra second or two to get it to Beasley on that particular play.

 

The thing is, it's total hindsight second guessing for Joe B; he calls Smoke's 3 stutter steps unconvincing, and they were,  but the fact is Smoke ran the route fast enough to be open and let Josh make a throw before the pressure got to him.  If they want Beasley to be an option for Josh on those routes, he needs to somehow speed up his routes a bit, but he "sold" his route so well because he gave it time to develop.  I am not a WR guru but I believe Smoke might have been able to move so as to "box out" Peters - this is actually something Duke Williams is good at, subtly using his body to shield the catch from the DB (but DOWN BOYS Duke doesn't have the speed to get down there and get open on that route in the first place).

 

 

Taster talked about this w Chris brown on the Murphy show and Tasker still felt Peters red the play correctly in the slant that it would not of mattered.  Also mentioned his speed is so lacking they are rolling with speed.  
 

adding wants to that big body guy w speed WR that will help in some 50/50 balls imo 

 

bte I had no issues w Josh going to Brown.  After Josh hurt his foot/ankle the ravens really came after him knowing his mobility was limited hence he only had three or four rushes so getting the call out quick became priority 

[CincyBillsFan]

I have a couple of issues with Joe B's analysis here:

 

*  I disagree that Allen was off for 3 quarters.  He was off in the 1st half but in the 3rd  quarter he was actually doing well and the Bill's scoring was hurt by a couple of huge drops and the failure of the refs to throw a flag on the deep shot to Foster.  If Knox & Beasley hold on to their passes the Bills likely have 7 - 10 more points on the board going into the 4th quarter.  To claim that the game was lost because Allen was off through the first 3 quarters is FALSE.  The game was lost IMO because our receivers didn't make plays on at least four passes in the 3rd quarter.

 

* On the Bills last play you want your QB throwing an accurate pass to your #1 WR in the end zone when he has single coverage.  EVERY SINGLE TIME.  This is exactly what Allen did.  The pass was released quickly and was on the money.  A great defensive play by the Ravens CB (they get paid to play football to) and less then stellar pattern by Brown meant that the pass fell incomplete.  The notion that Allen should have been checking down to his #2 or #3 read in that situation is ludicrous.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 11, 2019 by CincyBillsFan

[transplantbillsfan]

6 hours ago, GG said:

 

Hyperbole much?   Beasley made one great move and had clear separation.  But that wasn't the point of his piece.

 

Joe B wasn't faulting Allen.  He's rightly calling out Brown's feeble triple step in his pattern as the primary culprit.  If Brown ran a better pattern, it's a TD.   

 

Joe's commentary on Allen was that with more seasoning, Allen would recognize that the rush wasn't severe, Brown is covered well and he should progress to his next read.

 

There have been a couple of those plays this year where Brown looked just lackadaisical on that exact pattern.  I can't remember which games exactly, but it was like that exact same play we ran to John Brown and the DB did the exact same thing.  I know I shouldn't read into body language or anything, but it also just looked like Brown didn't give a *****... he's been very good for us this year so I don't think it's fair to overly criticize him, but on that particular play and a couple early in the season running the exact same route, something is seriously missing.

 

Those are the plays that make me desperately want a big WR and that make me wish we'd just have Duke Williams activated... I feel like he'd at least make an effort to reach out and grab the ball in mid-air.

Edited December 11, 2019 by transplantbillsfan

[mjt328]

7 hours ago, ILBillsfan said:

I did se Beasley on the final play coming open but Josh had already made the decision to go to Brown.  I agree whole heartedly with that analysis of the final play.  Beasley would of had the first and possibly a TD as well still not sure why he has not become the number one place to look for when Josh needs critical yardage the guy gets open because Brown is drawing the top DB as team are really focusing on eliminating him form Buffalo's passing game imo.

 

This is what happens when the blocking has been terrible ALL GAME, and the quarterback knows he's got one last chance to make a play.

 

He knew Brown got open on a similar route earlier in the game, and hoped he could do it again.  He didn't.

 

[dave mcbride]

2 hours ago, CincyBillsFan said:

I have a couple of issues with Joe B's analysis here:

 

*  I disagree that Allen was off for 3 quarters.  He was off in the 1st half but in the 3rd  quarter he was actually doing well and the Bill's scoring was hurt by a couple of huge drops and the failure of the refs to throw a flag on the deep shot to Foster.  If Knox & Beasley hold on to their passes the Bills likely have 7 - 10 more points on the board going into the 4th quarter.  To claim that the game was lost because Allen was off through the first 3 quarters is FALSE.  The game was lost IMO because our receivers didn't make plays on at least four passes in the 3rd quarter.

 

* On the Bills last play you want your QB throwing an accurate pass to your #1 WR in the end zone when he has single coverage.  EVERY SINGLE TIME.  This is exactly what Allen did.  The pass was released quickly and was on the money.  A great defensive play by the Ravens CB (they get paid to play football to) and less then stellar pattern by Brown meant that the pass fell incomplete.  The notion that Allen should have been checking down to his #2 or #3 read in that situation is ludicrous.

 

 

 

 

The deep shot to Foster was interference, but it wasn't a good throw. It was a desperation heave. 

[warrior9]

5 hours ago, Boatdrinks said:

I think Joe B assumes a lot watching the slowed down all 22. There is pressure bearing down on the 4th down play that’s about to break through and force Josh out of the pocket. He wasn’t going to risk waiting for Beasley to make a move and having the ball batted down , getting hit etc. He decided to throw to Brown on the slant and Brown didn’t do much to get open. He still probably should have caught the ball as it hit him in the hands. A more physical WR makes that play a good percentage of the time. The Bills offense has very limited weapons in its arsenal when trying to beat a high caliber defensive unit like Baltimore. I didn’t like the play selection by Daboll in that final sequence. First and ten at the 18 with plenty of time and an opportunity to get another first down is a good situation. I want my OC to have an answer there, and he didn’t. The db was waiting on the slant, and the Bills don’t have superior athletes that can just make a play even when you know what’s coming. 

No receiver is making that catch. That was absolutely picture perfect coverage. Was truly a great play by Peters.

If I had to guess, that was a pre-determined throw from Daboll to get Brown one-on-one on the inside post. Josh looked no where else. We went to Brown at the end of the Cleveland game too. 

 

I would like Knox to get to the point where we have him flanked out on a slant on 3/4th down and 6+ to rely on. He is so athletic and such a physical freak. We just need him to become more sure handed.

 

[CincyBillsFan]

1 hour ago, dave mcbride said:

The deep shot to Foster was interference, but it wasn't a good throw. It was a desperation heave. 

 

What do you describe as a "good throw"?  If the interference doesn't happen Foster catches the ball, yes?  That seems like a good throw to me.

 

On deep throws accuracy is a bit different then 10 yard slant passes.   Have you watched how KC's T. Hill tracks down and catches a deep ball?

 

The throw by Allen on that play was a fantastic deep pass that was on target where it could only be caught by a Bills player or draw a PI by the Ravens player.  The fact the dirty ref didn't throw the flag is simply a comment on the crappy officiating that we put up with in the NFL.

 

 

[Rc2catch]

1 hour ago, warrior9 said:

No receiver is making that catch. That was absolutely picture perfect coverage. Was truly a great play by Peters.

If I had to guess, that was a pre-determined throw from Daboll to get Brown one-on-one on the inside post. Josh looked no where else. 

It was excellent coverage. I would of preferred brown go get the ball though in that case as opposed to waiting for it to get through. It was a rough play. Gotta give peters his credit for playing the route and ball as good as it can be. 

[GunnerBill]

I don't really blame Josh on the final play. Yes the ball could have been thrown an inch or so more precise and yes if he held onto it maybe he sees Beasley open. But it was a throw that could have been caught. Peters played it well but Brown had a chance to make a play and that is all you can ask for in that situation.

 

On Dawkins I am with Joe B. I was for moving on at LT after 4 games. Since then Dawkins has been lights out one of our best players. He is the future at LT.

4 hours ago, CincyBillsFan said:

 

* On the Bills last play you want your QB throwing an accurate pass to your #1 WR in the end zone when he has single coverage.  EVERY SINGLE TIME.  This is exactly what Allen did.  The pass was released quickly and was on the money.  A great defensive play by the Ravens CB (they get paid to play football to) and less then stellar pattern by Brown meant that the pass fell incomplete.  The notion that Allen should have been checking down to his #2 or #3 read in that situation is ludicrous.

 

 

I think "on the money" is an exaggeration. It was good enough to be caught though, without doubt. And I agree that it was just a great play by the DB and that Allen was right to go there with the ball rather than wait on a 2nd option. 

.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 hours ago, ILBillsfan said:

Taster talked about this w Chris brown on the Murphy show and Tasker still felt Peters red the play correctly in the slant that it would not of mattered.  Also mentioned his speed is so lacking they are rolling with speed.  
 

adding wants to that big body guy w speed WR that will help in some 50/50 balls imo 

 

bte I had no issues w Josh going to Brown.  After Josh hurt his foot/ankle the ravens really came after him knowing his mobility was limited hence he only had three or four rushes so getting the call out quick became priority 

 

I'm not sure I follow this - could you expand a little, maybe change word choice?  What does this mean? 

"Tasker still felt Peters red the play correctly in the slant that it would not of mattered.  Also mentioned his speed is so lacking they are rolling with speed"

[ILBillsfan]

3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I'm not sure I follow this - could you expand a little, maybe change word choice?  What does this mean? 

"Tasker still felt Peters red the play correctly in the slant that it would not of mattered.  Also mentioned his speed is so lacking they are rolling with speed"

Sorry he was referring if Duke Williams would of been the target there he could of shielded Peters more from breaking up that play

[Locomark]

On 12/11/2019 at 7:54 AM, GG said:

 

Hyperbole much?   Beasley made one great move and had clear separation.  But that wasn't the point of his piece.

 

Joe B wasn't faulting Allen.  He's rightly calling out Brown's feeble triple step in his pattern as the primary culprit.  If Brown ran a better pattern, it's a TD.   

 

Joe's commentary on Allen was that with more seasoning, Allen would recognize that the rush wasn't severe, Brown is covered well and he should progress to his next read.

I watched that play multiple times. That read was a 1 read play. I was disputing your assertion that Beasley was open QUICKLY which he almost never is. It needed to be a bang bang play because of the day it had been for the O Line. You are right in the future Josh will have more patience but also in the future maybe the coordinator will design a play where there a 2 quick read routes. That offense is failing in lots of ways. 

[Scott7975]

2 hours ago, Locomark said:

I watched that play multiple times. That read was a 1 read play. I was disputing your assertion that Beasley was open QUICKLY which he almost never is. It needed to be a bang bang play because of the day it had been for the O Line. You are right in the future Josh will have more patience but also in the future maybe the coordinator will design a play where there a 2 quick read routes. That offense is failing in lots of ways. 

 

Yes I watched that play a million times as well.  First of all the Ravens brought 8 guys on the blitz on that play.  It was 2 seconds into the play that Beasley gets open.  Allen did what I would want him to do.  On 4th and game he threw to his #1 receiver, who is in man coverage, to try and win a football game.  8 guys coming.  He has a clock and is not holding the ball to see if someone 2 yards away is getting open.  By that time, if there was a window to throw to Brown, it would be long closed.  People would be screaming he holds the ball too long yadda yadda yadda.  Allen absolutely did the right thing.  It just didn't work out.

Edited December 12, 2019 by Scott7975

[GG]

2 hours ago, Locomark said:

I watched that play multiple times. That read was a 1 read play. I was disputing your assertion that Beasley was open QUICKLY which he almost never is. It needed to be a bang bang play because of the day it had been for the O Line. You are right in the future Josh will have more patience but also in the future maybe the coordinator will design a play where there a 2 quick read routes. That offense is failing in lots of ways. 

You made the assertion that Allen had to wait for  Beasley to make his usual 3 step move, which wasn't the case.   

 

The play dictated 1st read.  If Beas was that first read, the play would have worked, because at the same time Allen releases to Brown, Beasley is open.