McDermott on no trades: "There have been too many years of irresponsible decision-making, let's just put it that way."

[Blank Stare]

Someone may have already made this point, but I took the comments as not only directed toward previous Bills regimes, but also as more of a macro level comment and an indictment on the moves made by the rest of the league. People get wild and crazy with the compensation for some of these players around the league (e.g., Tunsil, Clowney, Ramsey). 

Edited October 30, 2019 by TheProcess

[BringBackOrton]

3 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

You can die on this hill if you want to. I'm gonna back out.

It’s just kinda funny. Watson was a projected top 10 pick. How hard would it have been to pick him? No GM in the NFL had Watson as a Brian Brohm 6th rounder. No one would say, “McD reached on a 4th round pick at #10!” That’s not with the benefit of hindsight, that’s a fact at the time. The Texans going to get Watson 2 picks later was not bashed. Watson had the pedigree, the big game experience.

 

I actually accept your argument for Mahomes. Not Watson.

 

 

Edited October 30, 2019 by BringBackOrton

[billsfan_34]

1 hour ago, Gugny said:

 

I respectfully disagree.

 

Classy would have not been saying anything at all.

 

What he did was kind of slimy, in my opinion.

Agree to disagree- Go Bills

[HappyDays]

6 minutes ago, GG said:

 

Every team scouts the top QBs.  Do you wonder why Beane had his eye on Josh Allen since his sophomore season?

 

Beane wasn't here.

[GG]

Just now, HappyDays said:

 

Beane wasn't here.

 

He was in Carolina and was scouting Josh

[Kelly the Dog]

1 minute ago, BringBackOrton said:

Just like in the real world, if being so afraid of making a wrong decision prevents you from making the right decision, you are useless.

I agree with Mr. McBride that the two or two of the three best offensive minds in the game were all over Mahomes in the draft. But he was FAR from a lock or automatic choice. McD is a conservative guy by nature, so he decided to go for the QB in the following year, which was already known to be loaded, as well as pick up a starting CB who turned into a stud. That is not a stupid choice or decision. Yes, he could have chosen Mahomes. And Mahomes would have got MURDERED last year on the Bills.

[HappyDays]

Just now, BringBackOrton said:

It’s just kinda funny. Watson was a projected top 10 pick. How hard would it have been to pick him? No GM in the NFL had Watson as a Brian Brohm 6th rounder. No one would say, “McD reached on a 4th round pick at #10!” That’s not with the benefit of hindsight, that’s a fact at the time. The Texans going to get Watson 2 picks later was not bashed.

 

 

 

This is completely ignorant of how NFL teams work. No one looks at mock drafts or online scouting reports. They are doing a year of researching. Watching film, talking to coaches, meeting people in their community. This is Madden level thinking.

[billsfanmiami(oh)]

11 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Drafting the right QB makes and breaks careers. This is entirely hindsight. There isn't a single person in the NFL that would picked a QB there with that timing.

 

if anything, it bought him an extra year. 

[GG]

4 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

not surprised by this lamest of takes.

 

 

At this point, this is the defining moment of McDermott's career as a Bills' coach.  His future rests on Josh Allen becoming a real NFL QB.

 

Like it or not, but he will always be compared to the two stars who he passed on. 

[C.Biscuit97]

2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Yup. McCoy. Terrible trade. Jerry Hughes. So bad. Stanley Cup champion and playoff champ O’Reilly. What a joke.  Vezina finalist Robin Lehner. What a joke!  30 goal scorer Kane! Hilarious.

 

we need to make better decisions like trading up for Zay; passing on Mahomes; 2 picks for KB; and trading for Jordan Matthews!

[billsfan1959]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

This is completely ignorant of how NFL teams work. No one looks at mock drafts or online scouting reports. They are doing a year of researching. Watching film, talking to coaches, meeting people in their community. This is Madden level thinking.

Save your breath. Some people just want to live in the past and be miserable...

[DrDawkinstein]

Seems like a cop-out response to not getting anything done before the deadline.

 

It's vague and passive aggressive. Which is typical for coach-speak.

 

6 minutes ago, TheProcess said:

Someone may have already made this point, but I took the comments as not only directed toward previous Bills regimes, but also as more of a macro level comment and an indictment on the moves made by the rest of the league. People get wild and crazy with the compensation for some of these players around the league (e.g., Tunsil, Clowney, Ramsey). 

 

If that is what he meant, he should have referenced the entire league.

[BringBackOrton]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

This is completely ignorant of how NFL teams work. No one looks at mock drafts or online scouting reports. They are doing a year of researching. Watching film, talking to coaches, meeting people in their community. This is Madden level thinking.

Right. And even teams like Carolina look at the top QB’s in the draft. To pretend like no one in Carolina looked at Watson after a down Cam Newton year is ignorant.

 

I’m talking about the make and break career part. NOBODY would have reacted to the Bills taking Watson like the Giants taking Jones this year. Nobody.

[billsfan1959]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Yup. McCoy. Terrible trade. Jerry Hughes. So bad. Stanley Cup champion and playoff champ O’Reilly. What a joke.  Vezina finalist Robin Lehner. What a joke!  30 goal scorer Kane! Hilarious.

 

we need to make better decisions like trading up for Zay; passing on Mahomes; 2 picks for KB; and trading for Jordan Matthews!

Talk about cherry picking things to support one's point.... You should be better than that.

[C.Biscuit97]

Just now, billsfan1959 said:

Talk about cherry picking things to support one's point.... You should be better than that.

He tried to laugh at Whaley and Murray. They made some awesome trades. 

[Blank Stare]

Just now, DrDawkinstein said:

Seems like a cop-out response to not getting anything done before the deadline.

 

It's vague and passive aggressive. Which is typical for coach-speak.

 

 

If that is what he meant, he should have referenced the entire league.

Oh, I agree, but when have you ever known McD to say anything about anything.  His pressers are filled with coach speak and largely a waste of time. He’s perfected saying nothing. 

[billsfan1959]

Just now, C.Biscuit97 said:

He tried to laugh at Whaley and Murray. They made some awesome trades. 

They did do some good things. They also did some boneheaded things. The same with McDermott and Beane. That was my point. 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

What a stupid thing to say from a guy that started Nate Peterman and passed on Mahomes. 

Jerry Hughes was a great trade. KB was a bad trade.  

How about trades that gave up picks for a MLB that lacks instincts and a WR that couldn't catch a football?

 

 

[C.Biscuit97]

Just now, billsfan1959 said:

They did do some good things. They also did some boneheaded things. The same with McDermott and Beane. That was my point. 

I still think minus the qb position (and Tyrod was serviceable), those Whaley were some of the most talented teams of the last 20 years.

 

i think we’re in the exact same place with this team now. If Allen progresses, we’ll be awesome. If not, it will be the same old.  

3 minutes ago, TheProcess said:

Oh, I agree, but when have you ever known McD to say anything about anything.  His pressers are filled with coach speak and largely a waste of time. He’s perfected saying nothing. 

Yeah, coach press conferences are a giant waste of time.  

[billsfan_34]

1 hour ago, Kelly the Dog said:

No burn bridges or throw anyone under the bus would be to say, "We like the guys we have. We made and received calls trying to improve our team but the prices were too high for us to make a deal."

Great point

[US Egg]

20 minutes ago, GG said:

Everything about the 2017 draft screams that McD was in full control. If he didn't do his due diligence on the top 3 QB prospects, that's all on him.

Not to mention his mentor, Reid, threw him a bone him then smoked him.

[Bill from NYC]

2 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said:

So he either bad-mouthed previous administrations, or Brandon Beane and himself, or both. Not sure that was necessary. 

Maybe not but he sure is correct. Whaley, Rex, Levy/Jauron, Brandon......how many horror shows should we fans be forced to endure? If this administration chooses not to toss around picks like amateurish, inept drunken sailors (ala Whaley), then more power to them. If they saw no bargains and stayed home, good for them!!!!!.

 

I just gained a substantial amount respect for McDermott. We don't need more clowns in our organization.

[DrDawkinstein]

30 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I'm sorry but that's absurd. QBs are scouted over the course of at least a year, typically longer. Who do you hold responsible, McDermott? It's not the head coach's job to draft a QB. Beane? He wasn't here yet. If you want to blame someone blame Pegula. You can trace that failure back to Rex Ryan getting hired. There was zero chance we were drafting this regime's hand picked franchise QB in year one. The timing was all off.

 

This!

 

The lack of QB drafted in 2017 lies solely on the Pegulas' shoulders.

 

They should have fired Whaley and staff immediately following the season. Instead, they did yet another back-asswards move and hired a Head Coach, then decided they didnt like the GM, and let the Head Coach hire the GM.

 

No way was McD going to tie his HC career, and the career of his incoming GM, to a QB scouted and graded by Whaley and Co.

 

He happily used their info on CB (White) and LB (Milano). The WR and LT turned out "about right" for Whaley's scouting as well. Zay sucked, and Dawkins has been... ok.

 

But no way do you use him for QB.

[NoSaint]

2 hours ago, Gugny said:

He didn't say anything.  If he had balls, he'd have either said, "this team was set behind years by the previous GM and HC," or said, "Brandon Beane and I have already made bad decisions and we're trying to avoid making more," or both.

 

But he said neither.

 

His wording is cryptic and weak, if you ask me.

I think you are largely right. Either own it, or assign responsibility but ambiguous negative comments aren’t my favorite 

[BringBackOrton]

Just now, DrDawkinstein said:

 

This!

 

The lack of QB drafted in 2017 lies solely on the Pegulas' shoulders.

 

They should have fired Whaley and staff immediately following the season. Instead, they did yet another back-asswards move and hired a Head Coach, then decided they didnt like the GM, and let the Head Coach hire the GM.

 

No way was McD going to tie his HC career, and the career of his incoming GM, to a QB scouted and graded by Whaley and Co.

 

He happily used their info on CB (White) and LB (Milano). The WR and LT turned out "about right" for Whaley's scouting as well. Zay sucked, and Dawkins has been... ok.

 

But no way do you use him for QB.

Lol, I guess if Whaley thought EJ and TT were franchise, you might pick the QB he liked least.

[C.Biscuit97]

1 minute ago, Bill from NYC said:

Maybe not but he sure is correct. Whaley, Rex, Levy/Jauron, Brandon......how many horror shows should we fans be forced to endure? If this administration chooses not to toss around picks like amateurish, inept drunken sailors (ala Whaley), then more power to them. If they saw no bargains and stayed home, good for them!!!!!.

 

I just gained a substantial amount respect for McDermott. We don't need more clowns in our organization.

Whaley isn’t close to as bad as you make him out to be.  Compare this roster with the 2015 one.  That was an awesome team. 

[Kelly the Dog]

2 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

Maybe not but he sure is correct. Whaley, Rex, Levy/Jauron, Brandon......how many horror shows should we fans be forced to endure? If this administration chooses not to toss around picks like amateurish, inept drunken sailors (ala Whaley), then more power to them. If they saw no bargains and stayed home, good for them!!!!!.

 

I just gained a substantial amount respect for McDermott. We don't need more clowns in our organization.

You're talking about a guy who drafted and then started Nathan Freakin' Peterman twice!

[billsfan1959]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I still think minus the qb position (and Tyrod was serviceable), those Whaley were some of the most talented teams of the last 20 years.

 

I think Whaley took, and continues to take a lot of unwarranted criticism. I think there were two primary issues that caused him problems. First, he was tasked with finding players for differing philosophies under coaching changes. The second has nothing to do with finding talent; however, I am convinced his lack of skills as a public speaker brought about a very unfavorable perception of him and his abilities. 

 

I agree with you, I thought Whaley was a very good talent evaluator.

[BillsVet]

1 hour ago, One Buffalo said:

 "The process" has changed over so many times since McD (the real power at OBD) took over almost 3 years ago it's hard to make sense of this sentiment.  Why does Beane go after Antonio Brown after Buffalo had made a practice of finding guys who'd buy in to McD's "process?"  

 

I'm beginning to see that McD's words at the combine 8 months ago were nothing more than rhetoric to appease though who saw a terrible offense in year 2 of "the process."  He went so far as to say they needed to score 21 points per.  Or, how they didn't want to be a team that grinded things out.  After almost half of season 3, it sure seems like "the process" is really all about playing tough D, being a ball-control offense, and not taking risks.  It's similar to what previous coaches have attempted. 

 

3 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

You're talking about a guy who drafted and then started Nathan Freakin' Peterman twice!

 

And who traded down with his first pick to draft a...DB!

[DrDawkinstein]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Whaley isn’t close to as bad as you make him out to be.  Compare this roster with the 2015 one.  That was an awesome team. 

 

The 2014 Bills would be 6-1 playing this year's schedule, would probably end up 13-3, and they would have MUD STOMPED the Dolphins if not the Jets, Giants, and Bengals too.

[C.Biscuit97]

Just now, billsfan1959 said:

 

I think Whaley took, and continues to take a lot of unwarranted criticism. I think there were two primary issues that caused him problems. First, he was tasked with finding players for differing philosophies under coaching changes. The second has nothing to do with finding talent; however, I am convinced his lack of skills as a public speaker brought about a very unfavorable perception of him and his abilities. 

 

I agree with you, I thought Whaley was a very good talent evaluator.

Excellent post and I agree with you.  Beane is a much better public speaker than Whaley.  I think Whaley would have been awesome with McDermott given some of the offensive talent he found. 

[The Jokeman]

2 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

Whaley's trades for players:

 

Kelvin Sheppard for Jerry Hughes

Kiko Alonso for Lesean McCoy

A fifth and a seventh for Matt Cassel and a sixth

 

Trade deadline trades: I'm fairly certain the number under Whaley was zero. 

 

I think you forgot a few. 

 

Whaley also traded

A sixth for Mike Williams

A fourth for Bryce Brown

A seventh for Lerentee McCray

Edited October 30, 2019 by The Jokeman

[DrDawkinstein]

1 minute ago, The Jokeman said:

I think you forgot a few. 

 

Whaley also traded

A sixth for Mike Williams

A fourth for Bryce Brown

A seventh for Lerentee McCray

 

So, super low value picks for guys who might be able to make an offensive splash? I dont see the issue there.

 

Not like it was a 2nd for Mike Williams.

[Bill from NYC]

1 minute ago, Kelly the Dog said:

You're talking about a guy who drafted and then started Nathan Freakin' Peterman twice!

Absolutely. Can you imagine how pissed off I was when he traded down, passed on 2 QBs, and drafted a corner? I mean really.  (And btw I wanted Watson and don't claim to have wanted Mahomes)

Still, he kept enough draft capital to grab a QB at #7 and grab other players that he wanted. The Bills should be in a position to draft a superb receiver no matter where they pick in 2020. Oh, and we are 5-2.

Your fine articles would indicate that the Bills are finally going in the right direction. I agree!!!

 

 

[dave mcbride]

3 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

I think you forgot a few. 

 

Whaley also traded

A sixth for Mike Williams

A fourth for Bryce Brown

A seventh for Lerentee McCray

Yeah, I mentioned Brown in a subsequent post. I was unaware of the other two, but now that you mention it, I recall Mike Williams. Never heard of Lerentee McCrary! 

Edited October 30, 2019 by dave mcbride

[The Jokeman]

Just now, DrDawkinstein said:

 

So, super low value picks for guys who might be able to make an offensive splash? I dont see the issue there.

 

Not like it was a 2nd for Mike Williams.

Valid yet none of them turned out to be anything but depth players, who's to say we couldn't have used those picks to unearth a good player like a Milano etc. 

[Happy]

2 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

I think Whaley took, and continues to take a lot of unwarranted criticism. I think there were two primary issues that caused him problems. First, he was tasked with finding players for differing philosophies under coaching changes. The second has nothing to do with finding talent; however, I am convinced his lack of skills as a public speaker brought about a very unfavorable perception of him and his abilities. 

 

I agree with you, I thought Whaley was a very good talent evaluator.

 

Good post and it is lost on many around here.  It is too bad that Whaley's lack of  public speaking skills brought about an unfavorable perception because it should have been Terry Pegula talking about the Rex firing, not Whaley given how the organization hierarchy is configured.  Terry can't talk in public, nor did he want to give that press statement; anyone who has ever listened to him speak will arrive at that conclusion.

 

If somehow we could have Whaley's pro personnel talent evaluation coupled with Beane's drafting, we would be all set personnel wise.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

2 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

PS - Bryce Brown is who you're thinking of.  They did give up a 4th. He didn't work out. 

 

Rex refused to remember his name 

[billsfan1959]

1 minute ago, BillsVet said:

 "The process" has changed over so many times since McD (the real power at OBD) took over almost 3 years ago it's hard to make sense of this sentiment.  Why does Beane go after Antonio Brown after Buffalo had made a practice of finding guys who'd buy in to McD's "process?"  

 

I'm beginning to see that McD's words at the combine 8 months ago were nothing more than rhetoric to appease though who saw a terrible offense in year 2 of "the process."  He went so far as to say they needed to score 21 points per.  Or, how they didn't want to be a team that grinded things out.  After almost half of season 3, it sure seems like "the process" is really all about playing tough D, being a ball-control offense, and not taking risks.  It's similar to what previous coaches have attempted. 

 

None of this is even true. Beane looked into Antonio Brown (This was before all of the issues really started) and decided it wasn't worth it. I call that due diligence. Also, in case you haven't noticed, this has become a pass first offense - almost to the detriment of the running game, and Mc Dermott has taken risks when warranted. The fact that they haven't scored a lot of points is not a result of being a conservative, ball-control offense, as much as it has been because of drive killing mistakes, penalties, and turnovers.

[Mc1320]

To all the haters out there, no team makes the right decision all the time.  Beane got a draft pick from Cheatin' Bill for Bodine at the end of camp and Bill cut him two weeks later.

 

How soon we forget how completely incompetent Whaley and that fat gas bag Rex were....and Nix, and Marrone and Juron, ect.  Just be thankful we don't have Dan Snyder and Bruce Allen running the show.

 

By the way, John Gruden loves him some Peterman too.....