Buffalo716 Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 (edited) With the season coming to a close I have decided to re watch every Allen play and reevaluate him. What I have loved is his decisiveness since coming back from injury.. Whether it is tucking and running or passing he looks a lot more comfortable NEGATIVES -too much hero ball at times -Doesn’t secure the ball when scrambling up through pocket - can still find some touch on shorter throws -consistent footwork still work in progress -needs to take less hits -inconsistent ball placement at times - can work on decision making when scrambling -needs to find checkdown occasionally POSITIVES - a TD threat every single play - Truly Big Time arm. Howitzer. Can drop a football anywhere on the field -Decisive and dangerous runner - High end mobility - Escape Artist -Opens up playbook -Threat on bootlegs -Threat to Run/Pass in man -Reading zones is improving -Fired up game personality -Throws intermediate routes on frozen rope -Quick learner -good quick out -sells good play fake -makes players better -great deep curl CONCLUSION I would have been the first one to say that Allen needed a year on the bench. We didn’t surround him with great talent or veteran leadership He has taken the bull by the horns . He has become a leader by example before our eyes and is making young inexperienced players around him better, like Foster and Mckenzie He has some inconsistencies he needs to clean up but otherwise I am very pleased and somewhat shocked how well he has played Stats can Be misleading and his play and demeanor tell a different story. He is arguably the best player on our offense now and giving him some lineman and receivers and a TE should be priority Edited December 20, 2018 by Buffalo716 7 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 seems to be way more positives than negatives. Next year should be fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Madness Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 13 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said: seems to be way more positives than negatives. Next year should be fun. Many of the points are repetitive...makes me itchy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Joshin' Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 Thanks for the write-up. So to sum it up, he is a rookie who needs to continue improving and has potential to be a franchise guy....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomeDudeAtHome Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 I agree with everything you said. I think some of the negatives will work themselves out because he's proven he's ABLE to learn. Some QB's say the right thing about their mistakes but he shows he's able to fix them. For example I doubt we'll see him fumble another ball while running up the middle unless the defense makes some great play on it. The carelessness with the ball will go away. Also, I think he'll learn to develop that "touch" for the shorter throws which should also help the receivers catch some of those lasers that get dropped. The future is very exciting with Allen that's for sure! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 There is definitely a lot to like about Allen. His arm and athleticism are things you can't teach. When he sets his feet correctly then you see the accuracy. I'd like to see him hit a few more of those deep passes. He has missed some wide open guys this year. Hopefully a full offseason of work helps him to become more decisive as well. We need to help him by upgrading the talent around him, particularly on the OL and with the WR group. He looks the part considering he's just a rookie and there is a lot to be encouraged about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted December 20, 2018 Author Share Posted December 20, 2018 1 minute ago, Westside Madness said: Many of the points are repetitive...makes me itchy. Some may seem “repetitive” but high end mobility and escape artist are different the former is how well he moves around. Latter is how well he shrugs off pressure Decisive and dangerous runner obviously coincides with threat on bootleg. But bootleg denotes 1 thing. Same with threat to Pass/Run in man... it’s explicitly MAN . He doesnt take off as much in zone.. they are slightly different but thank you for commenting 6 minutes ago, Just Joshin' said: Thanks for the write-up. So to sum it up, he is a rookie who needs to continue improving and has potential to be a franchise guy....... Every QB in the league has to keep improving daily. If you aren’t improving you are regressing in the NFL If you made me a betting man and said does Josh get us to the playoffs over 6 Times in his career I’d say Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 I actually think he has been pretty good at not taking hits....he takes MORE hits when he stays in the pocket. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted December 20, 2018 Author Share Posted December 20, 2018 Just now, John from Riverside said: I actually think he has been pretty good at not taking hits....he takes MORE hits when he stays in the pocket. No you are right 100% . He takes vicious hit in the pocket , worse than outside but he still lowers his shoulder against 250 pound linebackers. Time and place for that 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaBu Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said: No you are right 100% . He takes vicious hit in the pocket , worse than outside but he still lowers his shoulder against 250 pound linebackers.... ...when he's not hurtling them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 11 minutes ago, jabu said: ...when he's not hurtling them. And I agree that some linebackers get up slow after being hit by JA but all it takes is 1 to the knee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billspro Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 2 hours ago, Buffalo716 said: With the season coming to a close I have decided to re watch every Allen play and reevaluate him. What I have loved is his decisiveness since coming back from injury.. Whether it is tucking and running or passing he looks a lot more comfortable NEGATIVES -too much hero ball at times -Doesn’t secure the ball when scrambling up through pocket - can still find some touch on shorter throws -consistent footwork still work in progress -needs to take less hits -inconsistent ball placement at times - can work on decision making when scrambling -needs to find checkdown occasionally POSITIVES - a TD threat every single play - Truly Big Time arm. Howitzer. Can drop a football anywhere on the field -Decisive and dangerous runner - High end mobility - Escape Artist -Opens up playbook -Threat on bootlegs -Threat to Run/Pass in man -Reading zones is improving -Fired up game personality -Throws intermediate routes on frozen rope -Quick learner -good quick out -sells good play fake -makes players better -great deep curl CONCLUSION I would have been the first one to say that Allen needed a year on the bench. We didn’t surround him with great talent or veteran leadership He has taken the bull by the horns . He has become a leader by example before our eyes and is making young inexperienced players around him better, like Foster and Mckenzie He has some inconsistencies he needs to clean up but otherwise I am very pleased and somewhat shocked how well he has played Stats can Be misleading and his play and demeanor tell a different story. He is arguably the best player on our offense now and giving him some lineman and receivers and a TE should be priority I always enjoy reading your takes. I know we had some discussions on him predraft and I believe he exceeded both of our expectations. I have been very impressed with his rookie season. Especially in the accuracy and reading defence categories. He still has a long ways to go but I think he is going to get there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan_34 Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 2 hours ago, Westside Madness said: Many of the points are repetitive...makes me itchy. Want some benadryl cream? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boca BIlls Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 No such thing as too much hero ball... that is stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17islongenough Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, Boca BIlls said: No such thing as too much hero ball... that is stupid. I think he is talking about when he scrambles and then throws the ball in traffic instead of throwing it away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 Just now, 17islongenough said: I think he is talking about when he scrambles and then throws the ball in traffic instead of throwing it away I think asking for clarification is a better approach than calling it “stupid”, but maybe that’s just me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boca BIlls Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, 17islongenough said: I think he is talking about when he scrambles and then throws the ball in traffic instead of throwing it away That isnt hero ball... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubbaT Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 I look forward to what the Bills offense looks like when they have an actual legitimate running game to go with Allen. I think all kinds of things will open up. Being totally dependent on Allen's running to have any semblance of balance and for his contributions running near the goal line to have any kind of a red zone running threat is a lot to put on him. It's a heavy lift for him every game. I admire his efforts every week. The more talent they put around him the better he'll be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Formation Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said: And I agree that some linebackers get up slow after being hit by JA but all it takes is 1 to the knee That can happen to him in the pocket too. Ideally you'd like to see Allen grow into a pocket QB and I do think we'll see that next year. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 1 minute ago, NewDayBills said: That can happen to him in the pocket too. Ideally you'd like to see Allen grow into a pocket QB and I do think we'll see that next year. It can happen anywhere. i didn’t explicitly state that he needed to get hit less inside or outside the pocket, just hit less His dual threat capabilities are what makes him so hard to contain rn though 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 You left out one of his most important traits. LEADER. This dude, for better or worse, has put this team on his back and become a leader of men. He has the respect and trust of both the offense and defense, and that is not an easy thing to do this early in his career. Additionally his intelligence, work ethic, competitive fire, and determination have all been on full display in his short career. And those things are the fuel behind his growth and will continue to be. Its one of the reasons I have so much confidence in his future. The amount of strides he has made in short periods of time are impressive. This goes back to the end of College Football season. The leaps he made in short period of time working with Palmer was incredible, and one of things that made me go from a guy who wanted nothing to do with him, to a guy who had him ranked just behind Mayfield as the #2 QB prospect on draft night. Seeing him go from 3rd string to almost winning the job outright in preseason was another big burst. Seeing him go from Chargers game to Vikes game was another big stride. Seeing how much he grew in his absence in his first game back against Jax was another big stride. And even the growth he has shown in key areas over the last 4 weeks. I mean this kid just keeps getting better in short windows. Now think about him using all those traits bolded above while having an entire offseason as the #1 QB, all the extra reps, having most of a season of film to study, and getting some better help around him. This kids arrow is pointing real high right now. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 13 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said: You left out one of his most important traits. LEADER. This dude, for better or worse, has put this team on his back and become a leader of men. He has the respect and trust of both the offense and defense, and that is not an easy thing to do this early in his career. Additionally his intelligence, work ethic, competitive fire, and determination have all been on full display in his short career. And those things are the fuel behind his growth and will continue to be. Its one of the reasons I have so much confidence in his future. The amount of strides he has made in short periods of time are impressive. This goes back to the end of College Football season. The leaps he made in short period of time working with Palmer was incredible, and one of things that made me go from a guy who wanted nothing to do with him, to a guy who had him ranked just behind Mayfield as the #2 QB prospect on draft night. Seeing him go from 3rd string to almost winning the job outright in preseason was another big burst. Seeing him go from Chargers game to Vikes game was another big stride. Seeing how much he grew in his absence in his first game back against Jax was another big stride. And even the growth he has shown in key areas over the last 4 weeks. I mean this kid just keeps getting better in short windows. Now think about him using all those traits bolded above while having an entire offseason as the #1 QB, all the extra reps, having most of a season of film to study, and getting some better help around him. This kids arrow is pointing real high right now. I mentioned his leadership in the breakdown just not when I bulleted them And I did mention his competitive fire as well ?? arrow definitely pointing up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyWhiteShows Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 5 hours ago, Buffalo716 said: With the season coming to a close I have decided to re watch every Allen play and reevaluate him. What I have loved is his decisiveness since coming back from injury.. Whether it is tucking and running or passing he looks a lot more comfortable NEGATIVES -too much hero ball at times -Doesn’t secure the ball when scrambling up through pocket - can still find some touch on shorter throws -consistent footwork still work in progress -needs to take less hits -inconsistent ball placement at times - can work on decision making when scrambling -needs to find checkdown occasionally POSITIVES - a TD threat every single play - Truly Big Time arm. Howitzer. Can drop a football anywhere on the field -Decisive and dangerous runner - High end mobility - Escape Artist -Opens up playbook -Threat on bootlegs -Threat to Run/Pass in man -Reading zones is improving -Fired up game personality -Throws intermediate routes on frozen rope -Quick learner -good quick out -sells good play fake -makes players better -great deep curl CONCLUSION I would have been the first one to say that Allen needed a year on the bench. We didn’t surround him with great talent or veteran leadership He has taken the bull by the horns . He has become a leader by example before our eyes and is making young inexperienced players around him better, like Foster and Mckenzie He has some inconsistencies he needs to clean up but otherwise I am very pleased and somewhat shocked how well he has played Stats can Be misleading and his play and demeanor tell a different story. He is arguably the best player on our offense now and giving him some lineman and receivers and a TE should be priority What is your experience scouting NFL QB’s? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 6 minutes ago, BillyWhiteShows said: What is your experience scouting NFL QB’s? Ive been around the game my whole life . Grew up on a football field... Some people arithmetic came easy, for me it was football knowledge I was drawing up plays for my HS coach. I have coached and scouted And I break down the top 5-8 Draft eligible QBs every year after watching every snap for a long time 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProcessAccepted Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 This may be the first time I've read a post on this board where the knock on the QB is he needs to find the check down occasionally ? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerJ Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 2 hours ago, Boca BIlls said: No such thing as too much hero ball... that is stupid. Trying to make a big play when it just isn't there - forcing a pass into coverage when nobody is open. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 39 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: I mentioned his leadership in the breakdown just not when I bulleted them And I did mention his competitive fire as well ?? arrow definitely pointing up Sorry, missed that, good write up though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyWhiteShows Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 8 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: Ive been around the game my whole life . Grew up on a football field... Some people arithmetic came easy, for me it was football knowledge I was drawing up plays for my HS coach. I have coached and scouted And I break down the top 5-8 Draft eligible QBs every year after watching every snap for a long time Ok just wondering. I’m only a fan but what you said made a lot sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 1 minute ago, BillyWhiteShows said: Ok just wondering. I’m only a fan but what you said made a lot sense Thank you. I have put a lot of time and effort into the game and consider myself a student of it I have coached QBs before 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ocemur Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 Allen was getting what, maybe 1/3 or 1/2 the first team reps through August and September? Because he wasn't supposed to start. That certainly stunted his learning early in the season. He actually overcame quite a bit being thrown in there while not being fully prepared. We'll never see a less experienced Josh Allen and hopefully never see him play with a less talented offense. It's gonna be Christmas in August when the preseason kicks off. I also think Allen may be the hook to bring in Free Agents on offense. Nobody was looking at any of our previous QBs that way over the last ten years. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenhigh Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 14 hours ago, TigerJ said: Trying to make a big play when it just isn't there - forcing a pass into coverage when nobody is open. The definition of hero ball seems to have different meanings, depending on who you are talking to. Some folks think it means thinking (erroneously) that you're the guy who should have the ball when a big play is needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsSB2020 Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 I don't understand all this kerfuffle about hero ball. I understand Josh ideally stays in the pocket but he has no choice. As to the hero ball, Buffalo has needed a hero for nearly 20 plus years. It's high time the naysayers get on board. I don't listen to popular music but I know there was a recent song about I need a hero. Well Buffalo finally has one and some people seem to prefer mediocre at best. It'll be fine by me if my grandchildren grow up with a football hero and that man is Josh Allen. Plain as day if you watched the Miced up segment from this board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenhigh Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, BillsSB2020 said: I don't listen to popular music but I know there was a recent song about I need a hero. You talkin' bout Bonnie Tyler? Edited December 21, 2018 by Tenhigh 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.Y. Orangeman Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 14 hours ago, Buffalo716 said: Thank you. I have put a lot of time and effort into the game and consider myself a student of it I have coached QBs before Great Xmas present, 716. Thank you How would you rank the rookies now on your own hypothetical board? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 7 minutes ago, Tenhigh said: The definition of hero ball seems to have different meanings, depending on who you are talking to. Some folks think it means thinking (erroneously) that you're the guy who should have the ball when a big play is needed. 4 minutes ago, BillsSB2020 said: I don't understand all this kerfuffle about hero ball. I understand Josh ideally stays in the pocket but he has no choice. As to the hero ball, Buffalo has needed a hero for nearly 20 plus years. It's high time the naysayers get on board. I don't listen to popular music but I know there was a recent song about I need a hero. Well Buffalo finally has one and some people seem to prefer mediocre at best. It'll be fine by me if my grandchildren grow up with a football hero and that man is Josh Allen. Plain as day if you watched the Miced up segment from this board. Hero ball refers to when Josh or ANY QB adlibs On a play when they should live for another down its not a scramble or an actual play call where positive yards are to be had its when Josh leaves the pocket and should throw the ball away but he forces it downfield into an interception Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longtimebillsfan Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 20 hours ago, Buffalo716 said: With the season coming to a close I have decided to re watch every Allen play and reevaluate him. What I have loved is his decisiveness since coming back from injury.. Whether it is tucking and running or passing he looks a lot more comfortable NEGATIVES -too much hero ball at times -Doesn’t secure the ball when scrambling up through pocket - can still find some touch on shorter throws -consistent footwork still work in progress -needs to take less hits -inconsistent ball placement at times - can work on decision making when scrambling -needs to find checkdown occasionally POSITIVES - a TD threat every single play - Truly Big Time arm. Howitzer. Can drop a football anywhere on the field -Decisive and dangerous runner - High end mobility - Escape Artist -Opens up playbook -Threat on bootlegs -Threat to Run/Pass in man -Reading zones is improving -Fired up game personality -Throws intermediate routes on frozen rope -Quick learner -good quick out -sells good play fake -makes players better -great deep curl CONCLUSION I would have been the first one to say that Allen needed a year on the bench. We didn’t surround him with great talent or veteran leadership He has taken the bull by the horns . He has become a leader by example before our eyes and is making young inexperienced players around him better, like Foster and Mckenzie He has some inconsistencies he needs to clean up but otherwise I am very pleased and somewhat shocked how well he has played Stats can Be misleading and his play and demeanor tell a different story. He is arguably the best player on our offense now and giving him some lineman and receivers and a TE should be priority Great analysis. I would add tremendous work ethic and a leader of men. He inspires others around him to raise their level of play. He is the real deal. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenhigh Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said: Hero ball refers to when Josh or ANY QB adlibs On a play when they should live for another down its not a scramble or an actual play call where positive yards are to be had its when Josh leaves the pocket and should throw the ball away but he forces it downfield into an interception Oh, I get what YOU mean, just saying that the few different interpretations of the term are causing confusion for folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsSB2020 Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said: Hero ball refers to when Josh or ANY QB adlibs On a play when they should live for another down its not a scramble or an actual play call where positive yards are to be had its when Josh leaves the pocket and should throw the ball away but he forces it downfield into an interception Do you not want to see the young man try to make a play? I understand that none of want to see him injured, but I didn't see Brett Favre throwing balls away very often and it turned out pretty well for him career AND longeivity wise.Maybe it's just me, but I like a gunslinger mentality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 Just now, N.Y. Orangeman said: Great Xmas present, 716. Thank you How would you rank the rookies now on your own hypothetical board? 1) Baker 2) Allen 3) Darnold 4) Jackson/ Rosen 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 I have waited so long for a Buffalo Bills QB who wants to be a hero on every play -- since '96, to be exact. This is long overdue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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