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The Bills did some odd tinkering with the D vs Colts


YoloinOhio

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https://www.buffalorumblings.com/2018/10/23/18012496/buffalo-bills-snap-counts-indianapolis-colts-derek-anderson-tredavious-white-zay-jones-matt-milano

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Interestingly, the Bills’ inability to stop the Colts might have been the result of some tinkering this week. Only two players of the 100% club stayed on the field the entire time. Tremaine Edmunds and Jordan Poyer are usually joined by Tre’Davious WhiteMicah Hyde, and Phillip GainesMatt Milano looked to join the ranks recently. Milano came closest this week, missing only one snap. Curiously though; White, Micah Hyde and Gaines all saw reduced playing time. White and Gaines appear to have had playing time taken by [checks notes] Dontae Johnson.

The defensive line has typically aimed for a two-thirds to one-third split between starters and depth players. For some reason this week, none of the starters broke 55%. The shift to a roughly 50/50 split is a significant deviation from the usual defensive plan.

Similarly, Taron Johnson saw a small reduction in playing time compared to last week, while Rafael Bush’s time increased. This likely means the Bills attempted to play more “big nickel” defense this week.

 

big nickel has not worked well at times this season 

Edited by YoloinOhio
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The defense has looked pretty good, especially for having as bad an offense as we’ve had. Really strange to see us handicapping our defense by limiting play time of our best players. 

 

McBeane definitely have a plan for this season, and I don’t like it

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2 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Seens like the game plan was bad and backfired. I’d be interested in hearing the reasons behind the tinkering though.

 

daboll’s knowledge and experience with the Pats should be helpful this week.

Hope this is sarcasm

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When did the “tinkering” take place? I’d like to know when these players started seeing less snaps than usual. If it was when the game was out of hand, then it would make sense that certain, key players were taken off the field in favor of getting them some rest and other players some experience. 

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Just now, K-9 said:

When did the “tinkering” take place? I’d like to know when these players started seeing less snaps than usual. If it was when the game was out of hand, then it would make sense that certain, key players were taken off the field in favor of getting them some rest and other players some experience. 

Good point, they don’t mention that 

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If they tinkered and it backfired why weren't adjustments made on the fly in the 2nd Q? I know the offense put the D in a bad position on multiple occasions but the D looked really bad on  plays that led to scores. There were a few 3rd down conversions and plays that just killed the Bills and McD and co had no answers. Bad coaching to tinker with what worked and even worse coaching to not adjust out of it!

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Just now, YoloinOhio said:

He is going away from it, no? 

 

Isn't "big nickel" his scheme?  FWIW, the BN was a Fritz Shurmur invention.  He passed it to Jim Johnson who didn't use it as much, but McDermott used it a lot in Carolina.  

 

"This likely means the Bills attempted to play more “big nickel” defense this week."

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6 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Good point, they don’t mention that 

Well, that’s kind of critical to the point the article tries to make. Until I know when and in what situations White, Hyde, Gaines, etc. were taken out, it’s just more analysis in a vacuum. 

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The changes could have been a result of them getting blown out and trying to adjust on the fly because what they were doing was not working. It isn't necessarily what the game plan was going in. Could have been, but might not have been.

32 minutes ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

I don’t see why people think this defense is good.. maybe I’m wrong but they either play well or give up 400+ yards and 30+ points regularly 

 

They were good because they were top 5 in the league in stopping offenses and generating turnovers. They also got consistent pressure on the QB. What do you not understand about that?

 

I'm assuming that they aren't top 5 now after a blowout loss.

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42 minutes ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

I don’t see why people think this defense is good.. maybe I’m wrong but they either play well or give up 400+ yards and 30+ points regularly 

The theme is, they get torched by excellent QBs, who take advantage of the  Bills aggressive gambling defense.  

Edited by PlayoffsPlease
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1 hour ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

I don’t see why people think this defense is good.. maybe I’m wrong but they either play well or give up 400+ yards and 30+ points regularly 

 

 

A lot of Bills fans think going with the 1970s strategy of winning 10-7 by way of great D and running the ball 40 times is going to work in 2018.

 

They probably wear bell bottomed jeans with cuffs 2 feet in diameter as well

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53 minutes ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

I don’t see why people think this defense is good.. maybe I’m wrong but they either play well or give up 400+ yards and 30+ points regularly 

Ravens: 47

Chargers: 31

Vikings: 6

Packers: 22

Titans: 12

Texans: 20 (7 were the result of a defensive touchdown)

Colts: 37

 

The defense has given up 30+ points 3 out of 7 games. 

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56 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Seens like the game plan was bad and backfired. I’d be interested in hearing the reasons behind the tinkering though.

 

daboll’s knowledge and experience with the Pats should be helpful this week.

Helpful for whom?

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1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Only 18 Lorax snaps... wonder if that’s normal.  guess he’s out in the Nickel? 

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1 hour ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

I don’t see why people think this defense is good.. maybe I’m wrong but they either play well or give up 400+ yards and 30+ points regularly 

Their stats are surprisingly good.   They're fourth in yards per game, even though the offense has serious trouble staying on the field. 

 

More amazing is that they're 16th in points per game, even though they've had games where the opponents seemed to be scoring in the NBA-range.  

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51 minutes ago, Mark Vader said:

Ravens: 47

Chargers: 31

Vikings: 6

Packers: 22

Titans: 12

Texans: 20 (7 were the result of a defensive touchdown)

Colts: 37

 

The defense has given up 30+ points 3 out of 7 games. 

There you go again using facts!!!    B-)

44 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Nickel less, blitz more

It worked against Minnesota and Houston. 

I was working great in the 1st QTR too. 

 

then they stopped 

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1 hour ago, K-9 said:

When did the “tinkering” take place? I’d like to know when these players started seeing less snaps than usual. If it was when the game was out of hand, then it would make sense that certain, key players were taken off the field in favor of getting them some rest and other players some experience. 

Yeah, how was that not part of the article? It means a lot if it's early, it means zero if it's late. How is there not context here?

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37 minutes ago, Madd Charlie said:

Think about how much the defensive starters have been on the field this year with the horrible offence. Also consider that the Bills were well aware that they play the Pats at home on Monday and i'm sure they wanted to give their best players a little bit of a break.

I think this could be part of it. They weren’t going to win the game so he was getting vontae Johnson some reps and not overextending the DL

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2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

Seens like the game plan was bad and backfired. I’d be interested in hearing the reasons behind the tinkering though.

 

daboll’s knowledge and experience with the Pats should be helpful this week.

I would have to think they knew they needed to create some turnovers to have a chance to win the game.

 

It didn't work, but that would be my guess.

1 hour ago, Shaw66 said:

Their stats are surprisingly good.   They're fourth in yards per game, even though the offense has serious trouble staying on the field. 

 

More amazing is that they're 16th in points per game, even though they've had games where the opponents seemed to be scoring in the NBA-range.  

Don't you think you attribute some of that to our offense not scoring?

 

The Colts could have racked up 600+ yards if they needed to.

 

The defense is definitely feast or famine.

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Just now, Houston's #1 Bills Fan said:

Yeah, too me, that makes no friggin' sense. He's one of the reasons why the defense started getting better. Why limit him? Just as crazy as having Hughes drop in coverage.

He’s been really good this year. Only thing I can think of is matchups or the game was out of hand so they preserved him 

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6 minutes ago, freddyjj said:

White and Hyde (both nicked coming in) were rested late in game opening the door for Dontae Johnson and Rafael Bush to get more snaps

I think that’s probably the right explanation, not knowing when they were and weren’t playing. I don’t plan to rewatch the game to find out that’s for sure. Once was more than enough :(

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4 hours ago, K-9 said:

When did the “tinkering” take place? I’d like to know when these players started seeing less snaps than usual. If it was when the game was out of hand, then it would make sense that certain, key players were taken off the field in favor of getting them some rest and other players some experience. 

Makes tremendous sense to consider this context - would be nice to confirm. Either way, if they tinker during garbage time I'm fine with it. To be honest, the rest of the season is all but garbage time right now, so I'm more amenable to tinkering to see what works and what doesn't for given scenarios. Maybe even try new coverages/disguised coverage schemes. If our offense isn't going anywhere, might as well use the season to really find out what this D is made of, as well as develop our rookies on both sides of the ball.

Edited by ctk232
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