Odds are WR position after draft will still be more of question then the answer desired

[corta765]

Mock drafts, media analysis, bills fans, etc.. everyone has the Bills doing things to address the WR position with Diggs leaving and the larger hole that is now created. Realistically outside of a trade for a Aiyuk or Tee Higgins type player where it is established WR with a track record of production, the WR position will be a question and probably still an area of concern. Even if the Bills move up to draft one of the big three WRs there will be a question of immediate production and adjustment to the NFL. If the Bills move back and draft 2 WRs in rounds 2-3 your at least initially expectation wise at a lower starting point compared to one of the big three guys. The production Diggs had given even with the drop the back half of the season and the now loss of him and Davis production also is going to be a question for everyone and those stepping in. 

 

Is there a scenario for you that makes you comfortable with the position moving forward?

[SoonerBillsFan]

I am good moving forward.  1) they have to be schemed open better and 1a) Josh has to now step up and make who he has better.

[TYSONKO1]

Propofol

[Goin Breakdown]

Yeah they already needed to fill Gabe's "spot". Now Diggs' spot. Idk how many WRs they will draft but those are two holes. Even with those two still on the team they needed a true #1 so I think it will

still be a need after the draft. 

[SoonerBillsFan]

15 minutes ago, TYSONKO1 said:

Propofol

I love me some Propofol.  I get some next Thursday to put me out before my 4 hour lumbar fusion.

10 minutes ago, Goin Breakdown said:

Yeah they already needed to fill Gabe's "spot". Now Diggs' spot. Idk how many WRs they will draft but those are two holes. Even with those two still on the team they needed a true #1 so I think it will

still be a need after the draft. 

I am really thinking they take 2. I bet it's Franklin and Tez Walker.  As much research as they have done on them, I wouldn't be shocked if we took both.

[Malazan]

You just figured out that a draft pick isn't going to 'answer' the position before ever taking a snap in the NFL?

[Fleezoid]

They need a 1 and a 2. Both those spots are not getting filled in the draft. Whether or not Shakir is elevated, I believe the logical conclusion is we need at least one guy that's "proven." Who that might be is anybody's (everybody's) guess. 

[somnus00]

There are few members on TSW who supported Diggs last season more than I. But even I can say that the doom and gloom over his trade is over-blown.

 

Diggs was never a dominant, "take over the game" type of receiver. He was a great route runner who, seemingly, gave up on his team the second half of the season and produced very little during that span.

 

He took himself out of the games, and was rarely double covered. He was good at what he did, but his production isn't impossible to reproduce with other players. And rookie receivers don't take 3 years to develop like they have in the past. They can make an impact right away.

 

And don't give me the echo chamber stuff about McD not playing rookies. He has since he got here. Especially first rounders.

[BuffaloBillyG]

56 minutes ago, corta765 said:

Mock drafts, media analysis, bills fans, etc.. everyone has the Bills doing things to address the WR position with Diggs leaving and the larger hole that is now created. Realistically outside of a trade for a Aiyuk or Tee Higgins type player where it is established WR with a track record of production, the WR position will be a question and probably still an area of concern. Even if the Bills move up to draft one of the big three WRs there will be a question of immediate production and adjustment to the NFL. If the Bills move back and draft 2 WRs in rounds 2-3 your at least initially expectation wise at a lower starting point compared to one of the big three guys. The production Diggs had given even with the drop the back half of the season and the now loss of him and Davis production also is going to be a question for everyone and those stepping in. 

 

Is there a scenario for you that makes you comfortable with the position moving forward?

The team that won the last 2 Super Bowls did it with a FedEx driver, plumber and my daughter's gym coach at WR. 

 

With a step forward from Kincaid and a step forward from Shakir, the scenario that makes me comfortable is that Joe Brady gets to cook with players he has a plan for. That combined with the running game with Cook and Josh Allen being really good at football make me believe we'll be able to score points and move the football.

[BarleyNY]

42 minutes ago, Goin Breakdown said:

Yeah they already needed to fill Gabe's "spot". Now Diggs' spot. Idk how many WRs they will draft but those are two holes. Even with those two still on the team they needed a true #1 so I think it will

still be a need after the draft. 

 

Samuel was signed to fill Diggs’ spot. I’m not saying that he will be as productive as Diggs was, but he’s a similar type of player. I think we also will draft a player on day 3 to groom behind him. Ofc that’s in addition to an X WR early in the draft. 

[ControllerOfPlanetX]

Just need to perfect this:

 

[Einstein's Dog]

I'm hoping these are the two major avenues being explored:

 

1.  The exciting option of bringing in of two fairly highly rated rookies slotted for the spots vacated by Diggs and Gabe.  This would complete a transition to a young, Josh lead offensive team.  It would downgrade our odds for 2024 though but would be thrilling to watch unfold.

 

2. Upgrade from last year at WR.  Trade for one of J Jeff/B Aiyuk/T Higgins/D Adams/C Lamb/DHop as an upgrade on Diggs.  Draft a WR fairly high (first two rounds) as an upgrade to G Davis.  This would be more costly but would keep us as a top 5 contender status for 2024.

[SoonerBillsFan]

24 minutes ago, ControllerOfPlanetX said:

Just need to perfect this:

 

I'm telling you, get the FSU full back in the draft and a bigger RB and let's triple option this ****.  🤣

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

2 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

I am good moving forward.  1) they have to be schemed open better and 1a) Josh has to now step up and make who he has better.

Good luck with 1a

[Beck Water]

2 hours ago, corta765 said:

Mock drafts, media analysis, bills fans, etc.. everyone has the Bills doing things to address the WR position with Diggs leaving and the larger hole that is now created. Realistically outside of a trade for a Aiyuk or Tee Higgins type player where it is established WR with a track record of production, the WR position will be a question and probably still an area of concern. Even if the Bills move up to draft one of the big three WRs there will be a question of immediate production and adjustment to the NFL. If the Bills move back and draft 2 WRs in rounds 2-3 your at least initially expectation wise at a lower starting point compared to one of the big three guys. The production Diggs had given even with the drop the back half of the season and the now loss of him and Davis production also is going to be a question for everyone and those stepping in. 

 

Is there a scenario for you that makes you comfortable with the position moving forward?

 

I would like to see the Bills take at least a couple flyers on FA through training camp.

 

I'm making my way through the list of FA WR still available.  I'd like to see us try out a younger guy (27-29) who has had at least 1 - 1000+ yd season in his past, and who has quite possibly been hampered by living through poor QB play.

 

Anyone stand out to you?  I'm kind of interested in DJ Chark, though I don't have the whole scoop on his injury history and why he fell off

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/all/wide-receiver/available/

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

The team that won the last 2 Super Bowls did it with a FedEx driver, plumber and my daughter's gym coach at WR. 

 

With a step forward from Kincaid and a step forward from Shakir, the scenario that makes me comfortable is that Joe Brady gets to cook with players he has a plan for. That combined with the running game with Cook and Josh Allen being really good at football make me believe we'll be able to score points and move the football.

 

The team that won the 2022 Superbowl did so with a top-10 vet receiver who happens to play TE, a 26 year old (former 1400 yd) #2 WR who was drafted in the 2nd, their own 2022 and 2019 2nd round picks, and your daughter's gym coach who used to play for the Packers. 

2023 Superbowl, make it a vet receiver who happens to play TE and is starting to slow down, their own 2023 2nd round pick who looks like the best WR of the 1st 2 rounds, their own 2022 and 2019 2nd round picks, your daughter's gym coach who used to play for the Packers, and the hindrance supplied by the Giants.
 

The Cinncinnati Bengals WR corps, they ain't.  But KC made a significant draft and FA investment in WR, some of which didn't work out as they planned.  But, they took their shots, 3 out of the last 5 years 2nd round picks.

 

That seems to be a lot more investment than the Bills have tried on, until Kincaid last season (since I'm counting him as a TE)

[bigK14094]

Shakir was a 5th I recall.  Look for the Bills to draft a second wr late on day 3.

[smward8]

I'm curious how Shorter and Hamlet figure into the mix.  Shorter is kind of like Davis, and Hamler, when he isn't injured, is a speed guy who can stretch the field.

[90sBills]

1 hour ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Good luck with 1a

This will be an interesting season for him. He has the opportunity to unequivocally say he makes the receivers not the other way around. I hope Bills don’t over reach for a big free agent like Higgins or Aiyuk. Draft a couple of receivers and let Allen elevate them. That’s what elite QBs do. He can be a force multiplier. 

[Neo]

3 hours ago, ControllerOfPlanetX said:

Just need to perfect this:

 

Hornung and Kramer …

 

 

 

 

[SoonerBillsFan]

2 hours ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Good luck with 1a

I believe he will deliver.

[MJS]

I'll be comfortable with them bringing in young receivers and rolling with them. Does that mean there will be growing pains? Probably. But I am comfortable with that. Draft a guy high. Draft a guy later, too, then roll with the rookies, Samuel, Shakir, and whoever else we have. Get the rookies playing time and let them work through the mistakes.

 

That means the position is not going to be ideal this year, but it wasn't last year either. Diggs had his huge drop off. Davis was invisible in most games. Harty and Sherfield were irrelevant. Only Shakir was consistent down the stretch, and he is still here and has another year under his belt.

2 hours ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Good luck with 1a

Nearly every receiver to come through here had their best seasons with Josh throwing them the ball, so why do you doubt that he elevates them?

[stinky finger]

1 hour ago, smward8 said:

I'm curious how Shorter and Hamlet figure into the mix.  Shorter is kind of like Davis, and Hamler, when he isn't injured, is a speed guy who can stretch the field.

I'd prefer my WRs NOT be like Gabe Davis.

[GASabresIUFan]

Whomever the Bills draft won’t have to be the “savior.”  Between Kincaid, Cook, Samuel and Shakir, the Bills already have 4 good targets.  Plus Knox and Hollins, who, while not primary targets, are perfectly capable of making 20-30 catches (or more in Knox’s case) next season.  This means the cupboard is by no means bare.  If the rookie WR proves capable, then so much the better.  
 

Right now we can put in ink Shakir, Samuel and Hollins as part of the WR room next season.  This leaves 2-3 open jobs.  I suspect Beane will carry 6 wideouts next season vs the 5 from last year.  One job will go to the early rd WR pick.  The other job(s) will go to whomever management likes between Shorter, (hopefully) another draft pick, Hamler, and/or Isabella.  
 

 

[Dr. K]

Having given it some thought and listened to various suggestions, I think the Bills should not try to move up into the top ten for a receiver. Too many draft choices would need to be expended when the team has a number of holes to fill, and needs to get younger in a lot of places. There's no guarantee that a WR drafted in the top ten, even one who is called a "can't miss," won't miss. Every year there are names hyped up to the skies, as if they will be instant saviors who don't pan out. It's happened too many times. Often receivers taken later in the first or in the 2nd, 3rd or 4th rounds prove superior.

 

Justin Jefferson >>> Sammy Watkins

 

I wouldn't mind them moving up a few spaces if the cost is not prohibitive. But generally I think they should draft two or even three WR over the course of the draft, taking the Green Bay method. 

 

I also don't like them trading for a big name receiver, a Tee Higgins. 

 

I'm not sure the Bills will be a better team by acquiring somebody they will feel forced to feed the ball to. 

 

 

[Breakout Squad]

6 hours ago, BarleyNY said:

 

Samuel was signed to fill Diggs’ spot. I’m not saying that he will be as productive as Diggs was, but he’s a similar type of player. I think we also will draft a player on day 3 to groom behind him. Ofc that’s in addition to an X WR early in the draft. 

I don’t see Samuel as a Diggs replacement. They’re not even that similar as players. Why do you think they are similar?

[Thurman#1]

I'm good.

 

Probably not perfectly satisfied, but that's not Beane's job. His job is to handle things as well as he can with the limited resources he's got.

 

KC has won titles with some very good WRs, and won another last year with a very motley group indeed.

 

Beane will bring in two to five more WRs, including some camp bodies who have tiny chances of showing themselves good enough to compete for a roster spot.

 

Might it be a question? Sure. Most teams have questions that might or not be answered as they draft, as they bring in FAs and as guys on the roster develop.

[Thurman#1]

5 hours ago, stinky finger said:

I'd prefer my WRs NOT be like Gabe Davis.

 

 

Fair enough, but he was really productive for his time here. It's not a mistake that some team is paying him $13M a year.

 

A fourth rounder.

 

 

3 hours ago, GASabresIUFan said:

Whomever the Bills draft won’t have to be the “savior.”  Between Kincaid, Cook, Samuel and Shakir, the Bills already have 4 good targets.  Plus Knox and Hollins, who, while not primary targets, are perfectly capable of making 20-30 catches (or more in Knox’s case) next season.  This means the cupboard is by no means bare.  If the rookie WR proves capable, then so much the better.  
 

Right now we can put in ink Shakir, Samuel and Hollins as part of the WR room next season.  This leaves 2-3 open jobs.  I suspect Beane will carry 6 wideouts next season vs the 5 from last year.  One job will go to the early rd WR pick.  The other job(s) will go to whomever management likes between Shorter, (hopefully) another draft pick, Hamler, and/or Isabella.  
 

 

 

 

Yes, this. Limiting expectations, especially for the first year, often means improving production as there isn't major pressure for immediate production.

 

 

Edited April 11 by Thurman#1

[Thrivefourfive]

We are going to know from camp reports if a draftee is looking the part.

[Thrivefourfive]

People, please stop comparing to the Chiefs. They have a masterful play designer/caller and a much much much better defense. Allen and Mahomes is the fair comparison. I believe that Allen will be A okay without Diggs.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

8 hours ago, MJS said:

 

Nearly every receiver to come through here had their best seasons with Josh throwing them the ball, so why do you doubt that he elevates them?

Can't make chicken salad from chicken *****.

5 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

I'm good.

 

Probably not perfectly satisfied, but that's not Beane's job. His job is to handle things as well as he can with the limited resources he's got.

 

KC has won titles with some very good WRs, and won another last year with a very motley group indeed.

 

Beane will bring in two to five more WRs, including some camp bodies who have tiny chances of showing themselves good enough to compete for a roster spot.

 

Might it be a question? Sure. Most teams have questions that might or not be answered as they draft, as they bring in FAs and as guys on the roster develop.

KC has an all time great at TE and Andy Reid at HC.

 

The bills....do not 

Edited April 11 by Pine Barrens Mafia

[Sweats]

I think this is the year where we finally have a competitive O......we're going to throw the ole "**** around and find out" at the entire league.

[Billy Claude]

11 hours ago, smward8 said:

I'm curious how Shorter and Hamlet figure into the mix.  Shorter is kind of like Davis, and Hamler, when he isn't injured, is a speed guy who can stretch the field.

 

I would be extremely happy and very shocked if Shorter gets anywhere close to Gabe Davis production levels.   I don't remember hearing anything good out of him in rookie camp, mini-camp, or training camp and that's the time you usually get  stories about how players like Isaiah Hodgins, Brandon Riley, and Austin Poehl might be a poor man's Jerry Rice.

 

People rag on Gabe Davis but he was productive in his role as evident, from the contract he got from the Jaguars.

 

 

 

Edited April 11 by Billy Claude

[Thurman#1]

3 hours ago, Thrivefourfive said:

People, please stop comparing to the Chiefs. They have a masterful play designer/caller and a much much much better defense. Allen and Mahomes is the fair comparison. I believe that Allen will be A okay without Diggs.

 

 

Nah.

 

Until our waves of defensive injuries our D was just as good.

 

The game itself was extremely close, and for good reason. It came down to 1 or 2 plays despite out ravaged D. It's a totally fair comparison between the two teams.

[Thurman#1]

1 hour ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

KC has an all time great at TE and Andy Reid at HC.

 

The bills....do not 

 

 

Correct. It's not wrong. It shows nothing particular, but certainly both statements are correct.

 

The Bills have an excellent TE on the way up and the Chiefs have a HOF TE on the way down. The HOF managed 983 yards TE while Kincaid put up 673 as a rookie. Every chance Kincaid this year equals Kelce's 2023.

 

Andy Reid is an excellent head coach. McDermott is also a very good head coach though he certainly has more to prove than Reid does. Reid won his first Super Bowl championship in his 21st year as a head coach. Impossible to say what will happen to McDermott if he reaches 21 years. He may well last that long even if it's not in Buffalo. McDermott was two years older when he got his start at HC. Ought to be an interesting comparison down the road.

 

1 hour ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

Can't make chicken salad from chicken *****

 

 

Again, true, but shows nothing. Lousy analogy, and doesn't begin to address his contention that there's every reason to think that Allen gets the best out of his receivers as he so far has.

 

We don't know what our WR room will look like, but it's very reasonable to think that it could be a decent to good group. Throw in Cook and Kincaid and we should have a pass catching group every bit as good as the Chiefs last year and perhaps better.

 

And of course Allen will make them look better than they are. He always does.

 

Losing Diggs, Morse, the safeties, Tre and others will hurt. Absolutely. But we still have Allen and our OC is now going into his second year and his first full year where he will write the playbook and adjust the scheme. We're likely to be very competitive again. Hard to say what will happen beyond that, but this roster isn't finished by a long shot.

 

 

[st pete gogolak]

14 hours ago, ControllerOfPlanetX said:

Just need to perfect this:

 

Do you mean “you have to create a seal HERE and a seal HERE and run up the alley”?

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

People need to come to the realization that the days of the Bills offense running through a WR that gets 140+ targets is over. Diggs got that and then some during his time as a Bill, 160+ targets per year on average. Look for the Bills to feature 4-5 players all in the 80 -110 target range. 

[NewEra]

15 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

I love me some Propofol.  I get some next Thursday to put me out before my 4 hour lumbar fusion.

I am really thinking they take 2. I bet it's Franklin and Tez Walker.  As much research as they have done on them, I wouldn't be shocked if we took both.

If we draft 2, I’m thinking it’s Ladd Mcconkey and Tez Walker.  Franklin has the visits, so I see why you’d correlate him, but mcconkey is the best at getting open imo.

 

i know you’re a big fan of him too.  Just have a feeling it’s Franklin based on visits?  I’d be fine with him, but if we took Tez in rd 2, I’d much rather have Ladd in rd 1

[NewEra]

6 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Fair enough, but he was really productive for his time here. It's not a mistake that some team is paying him $13M a year.

 

A fourth rounder.

 

 

 

 

Yes, this. Limiting expectations, especially for the first year, often means improving production as there isn't major pressure for immediate production.

 

 

It’s not only a major mistake, but it’s a major mistake.  He’s not worth even close to that amount of money. 

2 hours ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Can't make chicken salad from chicken *****.

KC has an all time great at TE and Andy Reid at HC.

 

The bills....do not 

See Gabe Davis

[ddaryl]

I fail to see Gabe Davis being a hole...  Diggs vet experience at the #1 position will be missed but with Josh and the way he distributed the ball late last season gives me hope