Could Dawson Knox be more of a gadget guy?

[Ethan in Cleveland]

1 minute ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

Knox is still likely one of the best pass catching, blocking TE's in the league.  Depending on what the Bills still do at WR and how much they may trust a rookie early on, maybe they will go back to more 12 personal this year like they started with last year.  In that role Knox could be valuable as he's a good enough pass catcher to keep teams honest.

 

As far as Kincaid blocking, lets see how he does as a 2nd year player before saying he can't block anyone.  Likely in college he was hardly ever asked to.

Agree! But looking at Kincaid's frame I don't see a TE that can do everything like Gronk or Kelce. Doesn't mean he won't be an elite player though. 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

22 hours ago, Toyo321 said:

I see Dawson as potential trade bait to get our #1 WR in this years draft.

22 hours ago, Virgil said:

I can’t imagine Josh signing off on that.  They are genuine bffs

 

Is that what we want though?

 

Is Josh going to be Aaron Rogers now. Dictating the personnel? 

 

I'm not sure the GOAT ever actually had BFF's in New England. It was all business. At a minimum, Bill wouldn't have given two cents about player relationships. 

[BarleyNY]

22 hours ago, Toyo321 said:

I see Dawson as potential trade bait to get our #1 WR in this years draft.

 

Knox can’t be traded at this time due to the cap hit. His cap hit would INCREASE by $9.8M if traded by 6/1. Plus the contract of the player replacing him would have to be added. 

[Nuncha]

20 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

His YAC is 4 steps 

4 micrometers

[CaptnCoke11]

20 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

His YAC is 4 steps 

Then trips over his own feet 

[0017]

On 4/6/2024 at 9:40 AM, Toyo321 said:

I see Dawson as potential trade bait to get our #1 WR in this years draft.

Maybe the Bears want some more of our players 🤔 

[518Buffalo]

On 4/6/2024 at 12:40 PM, Toyo321 said:

I see Dawson as potential trade bait to get our #1 WR in this years draft.

 

Not saying it makes him worth his contract but I think Knox's leadership and locker room fit will be crucial this season with so many captains leaving. I could even see Dawson wearing a C next year. Also Joe Marino speculated that one reason Knox reworked his contract was to get less money but more security, partly yeah so he wouldn't get cut but also because he loves Buffalo. If that's the case then I doubt they'd do him dirty like that after he helped the team's cap situation

 

As for his play on the field, well it seems like really leaning into 12 personnel and being creative with getting Knox looks will be important because he'll be one of the 5 or 6 best pass catchers on the team next year. I agree with OP that he's shown great powerful YAC ability so I do like the thought of using him creatively and getting him the ball in space

Edited April 7 by 518Buffalo

[Eastport bills]

I like Knox, but he’s got to show some pride and become a factor after being extended. Kincaid has become a top tier TE after his rookie year. Knox has speed, size and toughness but he has not established himself as a productive option. This is the year, when Diggs’s targets are gone and the TEs will be a bigger part of the offense. Time to show up.

[That's No Moon]

6 hours ago, HaldimandBills said:

Outside the very best of the best of the best. That is exactly how Tight Ends are used. Knox is an above avg. blocking Tight End in the NFL of guys who can actually go out and run routes. Is he a Lee Smith? No. But teams also know Lee Smith isn't a threat in any other way. 

He gets paid like one of the best of the best. He's not a good blocker and his receiving role has been supplanted by Kincaid. You don't need to pay a guy that much to chip DEs.

[That's No Moon]

9 hours ago, Virgil said:

What would you call it?

You can't give Knox a 1 v 1 blocking assignment consistently and expect him to win.  This is a problem for your #2 TE.  You can have 1 TE like that.  You can't have 2 because then it forces you to carry a third that only blocks or to use an offensive lineman in that role who obviously doesn't run routes and it makes your offense predictable.  

 

They drafted Kincaid to do what they paid Knox to do which made Knox irrelevant.  This would be fine if his salary weren't what it is or if his contract weren't structured the way it is.  As it stands Knox about 3 quarters of Knox's salary is dead money.

[billsfan89]

I think there is a lot of room to use Knox as a full back in addition to a TE. Lots of ways to get him used in a more versatile manner 

[HaldimandBills]

23 minutes ago, That's No Moon said:

He gets paid like one of the best of the best. He's not a good blocker and his receiving role has been supplanted by Kincaid. You don't need to pay a guy that much to chip DEs.

Look im far from a Dawson Knox supporter. I wouldn't overly care if was released tomorrow. The fact is, is he does a heck of a lot more than just chip block as you call it. The guy is one of the better blocking athletic tight ends in the NFL. 

 

He already took a pay cut. If he has another season like last year production wise he will take another one as the writing will be on the wall. Either way Kincaid isn't even in the same stratosphere as a blocker as Knox and until he is id prefer to have Knox around.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

17 hours ago, HaldimandBills said:

Look im far from a Dawson Knox supporter. I wouldn't overly care if was released tomorrow. The fact is, is he does a heck of a lot more than just chip block as you call it. The guy is one of the better blocking athletic tight ends in the NFL. 

 

He already took a pay cut. If he has another season like last year production wise he will take another one as the writing will be on the wall. Either way Kincaid isn't even in the same stratosphere as a blocker as Knox and until he is id prefer to have Knox around.

 

Bad season, and injuries in 2023.  His previous 2 seasons he was very good - Catch% in the 70s, 15 TDs across 100 catches or so with about 100 yards.  He also has been a very good playoff performer - 70% catch %, 6 TDs and 19 1st downs on 28 catches.  

 

His first appearance on the injury report was against the giants, and he went on IR 4 weeks later with the same injury.  

 

Things i dont like - drops have been an issue, he has never developed into a field stretcher.

Things i like - he is a much better blocker than he was, and he is a physical player.  Not sure how many times this guy has bullied his way into the end zone or first down, but its an attribute that goes under the radar sometimes.  Also has a knack for making plays in the red zone in general. 

[Buffalo03]

Hell yeah, hand him the ball on some jet sweeps and watch that mother f*cker gooooo

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

18 hours ago, That's No Moon said:

He gets paid like one of the best of the best. He's not a good blocker and his receiving role has been supplanted by Kincaid. You don't need to pay a guy that much to chip DEs.

 

He has the 13th highest AAV on his contract.  He's pretty firmly in the 2nd/3rd tier of TE contracts with players like Henry, Higbee, and Fant.  

 

Tier 1 - 14-17M AAV - Kittle, Kelce, Goedert, Andrews, Hockenson, Waller

Tier 2 - 12-14M AAV - Engram, Njoku, Kmet, Schultz

[That's No Moon]

4 hours ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:

 

He has the 13th highest AAV on his contract.  He's pretty firmly in the 2nd/3rd tier of TE contracts with players like Henry, Higbee, and Fant.  

 

Tier 1 - 14-17M AAV - Kittle, Kelce, Goedert, Andrews, Hockenson, Waller

Tier 2 - 12-14M AAV - Engram, Njoku, Kmet, Schultz

Keep arguing. He's paid like a top half TE1 with a TE2 role.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

5 minutes ago, That's No Moon said:

Keep arguing. He's paid like a top half TE1 with a TE2 role.

 

I don't disagree on his being overpaid, just that i don't believe he's paid as even a top 10 TE.  And beyond that, he mostly sucked last year.  I think injuries derailed him quite a bit too though.  His hands were never particularly consistent, but he'd made strides the last 2 seasons before the wrist injury last year. 

 

You definitely bring in other options and improve the WR room - but there's a potentially larger role to carve out than he's ever had before with that many targets becoming available.  

[T master]

He is another weapon in the Bills arsenal and i believe Knox would be up to being used in what ever way he could help the team is a Bills type player i just hope they do not not utalize him .

 

I can see him coming up big in some really big games just because of the fact that they will probably throw like they did last year to others more & then when other teams slide the protections to the main targets Brady could put it on Knox for some unsuspecting huge plays .

 

And he should be in on every goal line snap he's big and can out jump a lot of players & frankly he's proven that he can be that guy when needed . 

[colin]

has potential, but gets hurt too much and has bad hands.

 

been the same player since his rookie year.  i'd love him to break out, but he hasn't done so yet

[Maine-iac]

I can't think of a player not named Allen who is more physical than Knox.  He'll truck a guy or out jump him and we don't have many players left who do that.  They over paid him and that's his biggest crime and the reason I'd question his roster spot.

[Captain Hindsight]

On 4/6/2024 at 12:43 PM, Virgil said:

I can’t imagine Josh signing off on that.  They are genuine bffs

Josh could make friends with a rabid weasel. He gets along with everyone 

 

Except Britt apparently 

[Lost]

On 4/8/2024 at 8:19 PM, Captain Hindsight said:

Josh could make friends with a rabid weasel. He gets along with everyone 

 

Except Britt apparently 

 

And Diggs

[SirAndrew]

Sure, if dropped passes were a cool gadget. 

Edited April 10 by SirAndrew

[WEATHER DOT COM]

Turn this guy into Charles Clay

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

I have wanted to make him a FB/Hback for years. The guy is dangerous with the ball in his hands but struggles to catch it. I think handing it to him or using him on quick out of the backfield stuff can be dangerous. I’d use him like the 49ers use Juszczyk…but that’s me.

[Sweats]

I don't know how it's all going to turn out, however, Knox had some angry runs, boy......when he was "on", he was "on"......when he was "off", well......

[billsfan_34]

On 4/6/2024 at 12:36 PM, akcash said:

Maybe he could be kind of like the TE version of what Cordarrelle Patterson?

I’d like to see if Joe can find more creative ways to get the ball in Knox’s hands so he can  show some of that RAC ability and power. 

 

I think the way to do that is line him up in the backfield more. He’d be an effective weapon catching passes out of the backfield and this is just my opinion, but I would like to see what he could do with some traditional carries.

 

Not saying he wouldn’t still be a top 2 inline tight end for the most part as I think he’s one of the better blocking tight ends in the league. 
 

To me it seems he just has a lot of wasted movement in his routes and I think it’s easy for DBs to cover.  On the flip-side though he has  so much playmaking ability with ball in his hands.

 

 

 

 

Ive heard it all now… 

11 hours ago, SirAndrew said:

Sure, if dropped passes were a cool gadget. 

And slowness…

[Bruffalo]

I'm way higher on Knox than most people on this board, and I think he's gotten a bit of a bum rap because of injuries and the fact that he constantly needed to assist the subpar O-Line with blocking. I think he's a good player with a lot of upside and a contract that he hasn't lived up to, but I don't know that it's 100% his fault. 

 

I don't think Knox is a gadget guy, but I do like the idea of being even more creative in the playcalling.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

Just now, Bruffalo said:

I'm way higher on Knox than most people on this board, and I think he's gotten a bit of a bum rap because of injuries and the fact that he constantly needed to assist the subpar O-Line with blocking. I think he's a good player with a lot of upside and a contract that he hasn't lived up to, but I don't know that it's 100% his fault. 

 

I don't think Knox is a gadget guy, but I do like the idea of being even more creative in the playcalling.

 

He sucked last year - plain and simple.  Injuries definitely played a part - he tried to play with a broken wrist for a few weeks.

 

At the same time, he was actually pretty solid the previous 2 seasons so I'm not worried that he's "lost a step".  He's always had issues with drops so thats probably never going away, but the guy can play and he's probably our best redzone weapon at this point.  If we're going to play a more physical brand of football with him and kincaid as pass catchers, you can do a LOT worse at TE2. 

[Bruffalo]

5 minutes ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:

 

He sucked last year - plain and simple.  Injuries definitely played a part - he tried to play with a broken wrist for a few weeks.

 

At the same time, he was actually pretty solid the previous 2 seasons so I'm not worried that he's "lost a step".  He's always had issues with drops so thats probably never going away, but the guy can play and he's probably our best redzone weapon at this point.  If we're going to play a more physical brand of football with him and kincaid as pass catchers, you can do a LOT worse at TE2. 

I think the drops can be mitigated. He's basically 2-3 years behind his contemporaries because of injuries and the fact that he was never used as a pass catcher in college. He's an athlete though and a stellar red zone target, and I think you're right, we can do much worse as TE2. 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

58 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

I think the drops can be mitigated. He's basically 2-3 years behind his contemporaries because of injuries and the fact that he was never used as a pass catcher in college. He's an athlete though and a stellar red zone target, and I think you're right, we can do much worse as TE2. 

 

His drops last year were some pretty rough ones.  But i love his physicality.  Combine that with similar aggressive run after catch ability you see from kincaid, and you can make it really tough on another teams secondary by forcing them to shed blocks and tackle these big dudes.  

[BillsFanForever19]

A "gadget" guy to me implies a guy you put all over the field. TE, Slot WR, in the backfield, etc. to get the ball in his hands in space. This kind of role goes to very athletic, slippery, generally speed guys. Dawson Knox does not have that kind of athleticism. Occasionally, you could split him out wide in the middle. But he's not a "gadget guy".

[akcash]

18 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

A "gadget" guy to me implies a guy you put all over the field. TE, Slot WR, in the backfield, etc. to get the ball in his hands in space. This kind of role goes to very athletic, slippery, generally speed guys. Dawson Knox does not have that kind of athleticism. Occasionally, you could split him out wide in the middle. But he's not a "gadget guy".

I agree gadget guy is usually viewed as a speed guy. I think what I meant is more of a swiss army knife like a taysom hill minus the passing. I think we should see what he can do with some power running carries and and some plays where hes in the back field blocking and leaks put or just passes out of the backfield. We all know hes got some juice/power when he has the ball on his hands.