Training Camp - 8/10 - 9:45am - Final day at Fisher (No Pads)

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

 

Recall that Wyatt Teller as a rookie couldn't even beat out Vlad Ducasse until midway through the season.

 

In fairness that may have had more to do with either 1) Vlad Ducasse being "coach's pet" to Juan Castillo in terms of specific technique 2) Ducasse having compromising pictures of Castillo

 

Or both.

 

But it's noteworthy that Teller started the following season as a backup guard in Cleveland, and didn't start until Week 8 so (inconceivable, I know) it may be that in 2018 and 2019 he just needed development still, and was not All That and a Bag of Chips as the narrative "he went to Cleveland and became an instant all-pro" would suggest

 

Anyway, to your point: it's not uncommon for an OLman who becomes great, to take some time to become a starter.

 

23 minutes ago, eball said:

 

[To Einstein]: Do you enjoy just being completely wrong about everything?

 

Edited August 10, 2023 by Beck Water

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, HappyDays said:

 

Quote

2. Terrel Bernard leaves practice

Bernard entered the medical tent before team drills started and never returned to the practice field. The Bills haven’t provided an update on the injury. With Bernard out, A.J. Klein stepped into the MLB spot with the second team and Baylon Spector worked in there throughout practice. The timing of a potential Bernard injury couldn’t be worse for the second-year linebacker with the preseason about to begin. If he isn’t able to play, expect Spector to go in at the Mike linebacker spot after Tyrel Dodson.

 

Soooooooo..... on the 'depth chart', we see Baylon Spector ahead of Klein?Matakevich, and indeed wonder "are the Bills gonna move on from Klein?"

Then Bernard goes down, and Klein steps on up with cameos from Spector.

 

I think that testifies to the weight that should be given to said depth chart at this juncture.

[Einstein]

10 minutes ago, eball said:

 

Do you enjoy just being completely wrong about everything?

 

 

"When you're not in full pads, technique, fundamentals, eye discipline, knowing what your body is supposed to do, how you're breathing out there, that all matters" - NFL Coach Jonathan Gannon

“... when you finally do get the opportunity to put the pads on and practice, you’ve already worked through technique multiple times beforehand so that you’re ready to go once the pads go on.” - NFL linemen Ben Bredeson

"Communication and assignment is a huge thing for us with no pads, obviously in the technique. You go out there every day and you try to focus on the technique." - Offensive coordinator Mick Lombardi

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, Einstein said:

Kincaid's hands are like magnets.

The anti-Gabe Davis.

 

From Matt Parrino report:

Quote

5. Gabe Davis & Dalton Kincaid shine

Davis has quieted any doubts about his role in the offense throughout the summer. He’s been a consistent target and showed off reliable hands, quickness in his routes, and great chemistry with Josh Allen throughout camp. He had about six catches on the day and had one big play against cornerback Taron Johnson. Dalton Kincaid took over in the red zone drill, catching two touchdowns in the final period. The first came in a rep against linebacker Matt Milano and the second was a tipped ball drill.

 

Edited August 10, 2023 by Beck Water

[Don Otreply]

4 hours ago, Captain_Quint said:

 

You know nothing of Tuco 

[Einstein]

21 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

But it's noteworthy that Teller started the following season as a backup guard in Cleveland, and didn't start until Week 8 so (inconceivable, I know) ....  as the narrative "he went to Cleveland and became an instant all-pro" would suggest

 

8 weeks after being traded to the team is fairly "instant". 

 

He was traded on August 29th and was playing by October 27th.

 

That's only 59 days.

 

In the NFL, that's about as instant as it gets.

 

It's going to take several weeks just to learn a whole new playbook.

[Royale with Cheese]

22 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

"When you're not in full pads, technique, fundamentals, eye discipline, knowing what your body is supposed to do, how you're breathing out there, that all matters" - NFL Coach Jonathan Gannon

“... when you finally do get the opportunity to put the pads on and practice, you’ve already worked through technique multiple times beforehand so that you’re ready to go once the pads go on.” - NFL linemen Ben Bredeson

"Communication and assignment is a huge thing for us with no pads, obviously in the technique. You go out there every day and you try to focus on the technique." - Offensive coordinator Mick Lombardi

 

Geezus dude.  Yes, it forces you to use more technique but that doesn't mean the DL doesn't have the advantage lol.  

When the corner puts on the oven mitts, you're forced to use more technique because you have nothing to grab.  Does that mean the WR doesn't have the advantage?

Edited August 10, 2023 by Royale with Cheese

[DJB]

2 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

I suspect the offensive line woes will rear its ugly head at some point during the season… specifically if Torrence can’t get on the field and Browns struggles continue. 

Im still going to continue to beat the drum we need to go WR or oline next year round 1.
 

We need a long term solution post Diggs annd or a replacement for Davis and obviously the line still has many questions. Can’t ever have too many good oline man

Edited August 10, 2023 by DJB

[Don Otreply]

3 hours ago, muppy said:

no just slapping hands you cynic you 🙂

@Airsevenpuking on he being such a nice guy? Gotcha. geesh

Yup, he can be a piece of work at times, I think he dislikes it when nice things happen… 😁

[Warriorspikes51]

4 hours ago, The Wiz said:

He even catches batted balls.

 

 

 

 

This is the kind of annoying play where Kelce is always there........

[Don Otreply]

3 hours ago, BigAl2526 said:

I wondered why it was Dorsey getting after Elam about it rather than Butler, his position coach.

KD was likely making a point of accidental injury type of thing, but who knows, maybe he was encouraging him so his boys get better at countering holding in games, ya never know…. 

[The Wiz]

Just now, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

This is the kind of annoying play where Kelce is always there........

I reminds me of the play against Baltimore last year where we missed the pick by Milano bobbling the ball, only to fall right to Andrews (I believe) for a 1st down.

[Warriorspikes51]

1 hour ago, The Wiz said:

Might be a 1 horse race now for MLB.

 

 

 

 

Beane should be looking to acquire a veteran LB

[NewEra]

9 minutes ago, DJB said:

Im still going to continue to beat the drum we need to go WR or oline next year round 1.
 

We need a long term solution post Diggs annd or a replacement for Davis and obviously the line still has many questions. Can’t ever have too many good oline man

No need to bang any drum.  The 2023 season hasn’t even started yet.  Why don’t we let the season unfold and then start banging about what positions we should draft?

 

what if brown turns out to be the answer @ RT and Dawkins plays well?  What if the IOL shows lots of improvement?  What if gabe steps up and is resigned while Harty/Sherfield/shakir play the perfect compliment to Kincaid?  
 

I agree- WR and OL could be our priority in the draft next season….. IF the current options fail.  We might need a pass rusher/DT, MLB or safety.  BPA at a position of relative need.  
 

I just don’t see why anyone would be banging on anything regarding next years draft on august 10th

[Einstein]

5 hours ago, The Wiz said:

He even catches batted balls.

 

 

 

 

Kincaid is the real deal. His awareness level is top-notch and his hands are magnets. He also shows great balance, which is something you see with great Tight Ends like Kelce. I place his chance-of-bust percentage at approximately 1%.

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

3 hours ago, BigAl2526 said:

I wondered why it was Dorsey getting after Elam about it rather than Butler, his position coach.

 

8 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

KD was likely making a point of accidental injury type of thing, but who knows, maybe he was encouraging him so his boys get better at countering holding in games, ya never know…. 

 

 

 I saw a tweet earlier saying both Ken Dorsey & Diggs went after Elam for being really "handsy" in today's practice.

 

 

 

[NewEra]

8 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

Beane should be looking to acquire a veteran LB

And a RT.  And an OG.  And a WR2.  And a Backup QB. 
 

But Beane isn’t playing madden so we’ll be playing the guys that we have. 

[Buffalo716]

3 minutes ago, NewEra said:

And a RT.  And an OG.  And a WR2.  And a Backup QB. 
 

But Beane isn’t playing madden so we’ll be playing the guys that we have. 

Most contenders don't have a great backup

 

If you have a great backup you probably don't have a great starter... Kyle Allen's career passer rating is 10 points higher than Blaine gabbard the Chiefs backup

[Don Otreply]

1 hour ago, HereComesTheReignAgain said:

Even when challenged to find something good, you have to throw in a negative. 

The negativity is a defense mechanism, one sees this in folk who never actually learned to socialize with their peers growing up. 

[NewEra]

6 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Most contenders don't have a great backup

 

If you have a great backup you probably don't have a great starter... Kyle Allen's career passer rating is 10 points higher than Blaine gabbard the Chiefs backup

Yeah I know…. It was a sarcastic post

[buffaloboyinATL]

4 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Most contenders don't have a great backup

 

If you have a great backup you probably don't have a great starter... Kyle Allen's career passer rating is 10 points higher than Blaine gabbard the Chiefs backup

I am surprised we haven't kicked the tires on Carson Wentz. 

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, NewEra said:

Yeah I know…. It was a sarcastic post

Sorry sarcasm doesn't always come thru the Internet 

[Don Otreply]

17 minutes ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

 

 

 

 I saw a tweet earlier saying both Ken Dorsey & Diggs went after Elam for being really "handsy" in today's practice.

 

 

 

Yup,  but Elam for the most part should ignore them, if it’s not about letting them run plays so they get the timing down etc, outside of that he should do what he’s doing, he’s not there to let receivers catch the ball, 

[eball]

6 minutes ago, buffaloboyinATL said:

I am surprised we haven't kicked the tires on Carson Wentz. 

 

Because they would fall off.

 

[78thealltimegreat]

I think we are at the point where Beane is going to have to use a 4th or 5th round pick project kinda qb behind Josh.

 

We really can’t pay big money for a quality backup and let’s face it if he goes down this team is looking at being in the Marvin Harrison Jr sweepstakes with the dropoff in talent. 

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

1 minute ago, Don Otreply said:

Yup,  but Elam for the most part should ignore them, if it’s not about letting them run plays so they get the timing down etc, outside of that he should do what he’s doing, he’s not there to let receivers catch the ball, 

 

 So at that point, where the holding has gotten so bad the OC & #1 WR are going directly up to the CB and complaining, what does McDermott do? On one hand HC McDermott should probably put a stop to it, but on the other hand DC McDermott is probably loving it.

 

 

 

 

[Don Otreply]

6 minutes ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

 

 So at that point, where the holding has gotten so bad the OC & #1 WR are going directly up to the CB and complaining, what does McDermott do? On one hand HC McDermott should probably put a stop to it, but on the other hand DC McDermott is probably loving it.

 

 

 

 

Elam’s number one priority, like all CBs is to prevent WRs from catching the ball, like I said in previous posts in this thread, unless it’s a point of the offense getting their timing down, he should ignore both the OC & WR #1, their priorities are not Elam’s priorities. 

[Warcodered]

 

[DJB]

1 hour ago, NewEra said:

No need to bang any drum.  The 2023 season hasn’t even started yet.  Why don’t we let the season unfold and then start banging about what positions we should draft?

 

what if brown turns out to be the answer @ RT and Dawkins plays well?  What if the IOL shows lots of improvement?  What if gabe steps up and is resigned while Harty/Sherfield/shakir play the perfect compliment to Kincaid?  
 

I agree- WR and OL could be our priority in the draft next season….. IF the current options fail.  We might need a pass rusher/DT, MLB or safety.  BPA at a position of relative need.  
 

I just don’t see why anyone would be banging on anything regarding next years draft on august 10th

It seems like the most obvious positions that need an injection of high end talent and youth that’s why. And I’m confident that both will be big needs come draft time 

Edited August 10, 2023 by DJB

[NewEra]

6 minutes ago, DJB said:

It seems like the most obvious positions that need an injection of high end talent and youth that’s why. And I’m confident that both will be big needs come draft time 

Could be-  I hope you’re wrong. I’m sure you hope the same.  
 

I just don’t understand why we’re already talking about banging the table for certain positions in next years draft.  We don’t even know which prospects we’ll be looking at.  

[DJB]

15 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Could be-  I hope you’re wrong. I’m sure you hope the same.  
 

I just don’t understand why we’re already talking about banging the table for certain positions in next years draft.  We don’t even know which prospects we’ll be looking at.  

Last time I checked this is a message board no? 

[muppy]

2 hours ago, Don Otreply said:

You know nothing of Tuco 

oh  but I do @Tuco he's a member of TBD and Legit poster too just sayin. Hey Tuco! Sup homey? m

[HappyDays]

 

[Brand J]

Besides our own Dalton Kincaid, has anyone heard of any other standout rookies from NFL camps? 

[bourbonboy]

1 hour ago, Don Otreply said:

Elam’s number one priority, like all CBs is to prevent WRs from catching the ball, like I said in previous posts in this thread, unless it’s a point of the offense getting their timing down, he should ignore both the OC & WR #1, their priorities are not Elam’s priorities. 

 

The OC and WR1 are trying to help Elam - not sure why the DB coach is not - but if Elam gets called for PI and keeps our O off the field, its every bit as much of an issue as the drops we saw from l'il dirty and gabe last year that drove us all nuts. Just saying.

[John from Riverside]

1 hour ago, Warcodered said:

 

Regarding Kyle Allen
 

He’s telling you what’s going on right here. The office is complicated. He’s new to it.

 

Let’s give him a chance to see if he can get better at it

[BillsSbSoon]

1 hour ago, Don Otreply said:

Yup,  but Elam for the most part should ignore them, if it’s not about letting them run plays so they get the timing down etc, outside of that he should do what he’s doing, he’s not there to let receivers catch the ball, 

That’s what im saying too. The more physicality the better. You don’t want take that away from him

[Patrick Duffy]

35 minutes ago, DJB said:

Last time I checked this is a message board no? 

 

Yeah, but still sometimes certain things can be kinda pointless to discuss lol

[bourbonboy]

1 minute ago, BillsSbSoon said:

That’s what im saying too. The more physicality the better. You don’t want take that away from him

 

There is aggressive play, and stupid play.....Elam has mad skills, but he can't be giving up the first down before the ball comes close to the WR. 

[John from Riverside]

2 minutes ago, bourbonboy said:

 

There is aggressive play, and stupid play.....Elam has mad skills, but he can't be giving up the first down before the ball comes close to the WR. 

So the only thing I’m gonna say on this is I don’t remember seeing Elam getting flagged for penalties whenever he was in the games last year sure does he need to work on his holding yes but the NFL allows a ton of holding if they didn’t allow holding sauce. Gardner wouldn’t be the player that is.