Is there any circumstances you would move on from McDermott after 2022?

[Greg S]

49 minutes ago, Buffalosouth said:

I was thinking about this the other day. If they come out and get beat badly on week 1 it's going to be a big hit but not quite enough. If they lose enough games throughout the season from bad coaching the frogs in the water and the stove on. The straw that breaks the camels back for me would be him losing the team. That's what I worry about the most is the message getting old. If the process becomes a problem I wouldn't be too surprised if the Pegulas started having talks. The next question is are Beane and McDermott truly McBeane or would Beane stay? Is he good at drafting for McDermotts system or all around a good talent evaluator? 

 

This is why they need to win. Then I can just think 'Superbowl.'

 

Why would Beane leave if McDermott got fired? He would probably be the one leading the search for the next HC. With that said I don't see either one getting fired anytime soon.

[Johnnycage46]

2 hours ago, dollars 2 donuts said:

 

 

Although we are not of the same thought, please know, Johnny, that I pray for you...every single damn day from here on out.

 

  

 

Hey, if this is my worst sin, I'll take it every day!

[GunnerBill]

21 minutes ago, Greg S said:

 

Why would Beane leave if McDermott got fired? He would probably be the one leading the search for the next HC. With that said I don't see either one getting fired anytime soon.

 

Because this is McDermott's show. He is the boss. Beane serves at his pleasure. 

[K12A17]

Have you seen the coaches we've had since Marv retired, he's better than 90% of the coaches in the league. where do you people come from/

[FilthyBeast]

4 minutes ago, K12A17 said:

Have you seen the coaches we've had since Marv retired, he's better than 90% of the coaches in the league. where do you people come from/

 

If he was better than 90% of the coaches in the league he'd have a SB ring by now considering there is more than 10% of them currently coaching that have at least one.

 

Nobody is debating that he's not a good coach including myself. The question is whether or not he's good enough to take this team to the next level or just another modern day Marty Schotenheimer.

 

Also history is not on McDermott's side in terms of the history of coaches in this league that have won a SB after more than 5 seasons with a team. Ironically his mentor and nemesis Andy Reid is one of the few that have done this but it took landing a generational talent like Mahomes to finally do it.

[Buffalosouth]

53 minutes ago, Greg S said:

 

Why would Beane leave if McDermott got fired? He would probably be the one leading the search for the next HC. With that said I don't see either one getting fired anytime soon.

I think both guys are as safe in their job as it gets. My wondering was more on are they tied together enough that they would be fired together. I'm all about the process to the point I clap non stop coaching my kids flag teams.

[GoBills808]

35 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Because this is McDermott's show. He is the boss. Beane serves at his pleasure. 

I think that’s a very shallow interpretation of the Bills’ front office dynamic.

[The Dean]

42 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I think that’s a very shallow interpretation of the Bills’ front office dynamic.

 

 

IMO, it is an extremely simplistic version of dynamic. And I respect Gunner's opinions more than I respect anyone's on this board. 

 

If McDermott and Beane have a power struggle, then it's Beane who likely goes. That I believe. So in that respect, he does "serve at McD's pleasure" in a way.

 

But to think McDermott micromanages and makes the call on every move Beane makes is complete BS, IMO.  I know Gunner didn't say that, but others have intimated that Beane's decisions are dictated by McD.  That's not the case. McD let's Beane do his job. Beane knows what McD wants and needs and goes from there. He obviously takes input from the coaching staff. 

[Apocalypse Nuts]

On 5/16/2022 at 6:46 PM, FilthyBeast said:

Now that the dust has settled from the draft and we move closer to the 2022 season, was curious what the current pulse is on McDermott. Expectations are obviously sky high in Buffalo and it's truly SB or bust as far as a lot of fans and pundits see it.

 

On one hand the McDermott is still the best HC this franchise has seen since Levy and the 90's, but on the other the stench of playoff loss in KC still looms large and could be an issue in the locker room if this team gets off to a slow start in 2022. I would go as far to say his regular season record against playoff teams and never being able to win a road playoff game is a root cause for serious concern as well.

 

Adding a poll here but personally there are 2 scenarios I would pull the trigger on dumping McDermott after 2022:

 

1) We have a losing season/miss playoffs (with major injuries NOT being a factor in this).

 

2) We lose to KC in the playoffs for a 3rd straight season regardless of round or whether game is in Buffalo/KC.

 

Either of these happen and the Pegulas have to seriously ask themselves where they seem the direction of this team heading under McDermott knowing you are only going to get so many bites at the apple once Allen's contract kicks in similar to Mahomes in KC. Beane cannot show blind loyalty either IMO and look at himself and McDermott as a package deal moving forward.

All due respect,  but you are a total dumb as and I’m immensely happy you are not in charge of this team.  What are you like 15?  

[Doc Brown]

11 hours ago, skibum said:

Any sort of repeat of the 13 seconds shenanigans would make it really hard to argue that McDermott is a guy who can win a title. But it would be very, very difficult to replace what he has brought to the organization. I think it might be more appropriate to give more play calling authority to the coordinators, or something along those lines, if in-game strategy continues to be an issue. 

Nothing’s impossible but it’s as close to impossible as it gets to make such a massive screwup like that again.  Frazier and Daboll called all the plays last year I believe.

3 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

Also history is not on McDermott's side in terms of the history of coaches in this league that have won a SB after more than 5 seasons with a team. Ironically his mentor and nemesis Andy Reid is one of the few that have done this but it took landing a generational talent like Mahomes to finally do it.

Didn’t it take Bill Cowher more than a decade or something to win one?

[Doc Brown]

5 hours ago, Greg S said:

 

Why would Beane leave if McDermott got fired? He would probably be the one leading the search for the next HC. With that said I don't see either one getting fired anytime soon.

Money.  There would be a bidding war for them as a pair and they’d become the highest paid head coach and GM in history.

[eball]

You all gave this  9 pages?

[DapperCam]

Maybe if it is very clear he’s lost the room. Otherwise I think he’s earned quite a bit of slack before his seat gets warm.

[GunnerBill]

7 hours ago, The Dean said:

 

 

IMO, it is an extremely simplistic version of dynamic. And I respect Gunner's opinions more than I respect anyone's on this board. 

 

If McDermott and Beane have a power struggle, then it's Beane who likely goes. That I believe. So in that respect, he does "serve at McD's pleasure" in a way.

 

But to think McDermott micromanages and makes the call on every move Beane makes is complete BS, IMO.  I know Gunner didn't say that, but others have intimated that Beane's decisions are dictated by McD.  That's not the case. McD let's Beane do his job. Beane knows what McD wants and needs and goes from there. He obviously takes input from the coaching staff. 

 

Yea I agree with this. I don't mean McDermott micromanages and makes every decision. They trust each other, they empower each other. But of the two of them the one with the most power in the organisation is Sean. I really struggle to forsee any scenario in which Sean would go and Brandon would stay. 

[Greg S]

14 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Because this is McDermott's show. He is the boss. Beane serves at his pleasure. 

 

I think Terry and Kim Pegula would have something to say about that. Besides GM's and HC's aren't joined at the hip. For example Adam Gase was the one who helped Joe Douglas get the Jets GM job similar to McDermott playing a role to get Beane here. Douglas is still the Jets GM. What happened to Adam Gase?

[GunnerBill]

34 minutes ago, Greg S said:

 

I think Terry and Kim Pegula would have something to say about that. Besides GM's and HC's aren't joined at the hip. For example Adam Gase was the one who helped Joe Douglas get the Jets GM job similar to McDermott playing a role to get Beane here. Douglas is still the Jets GM. What happened to Adam Gase?

 

This example is nothing like the Jets example. They were a dysfunctional mess whereas this is a totally aligned and functional organisation. I still can't conceive any scenario where Beane remains and McDermott goes. McDermott is very much Pegula's guy. 

[Greg S]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

This example is nothing like the Jets example. They were a dysfunctional mess whereas this is a totally aligned and functional organisation. I still can't conceive any scenario where Beane remains and McDermott goes. McDermott is very much Pegula's guy. 

 

For the record I think both will be here a long time. But if McDermott were to get fired that doesn't mean Beane goes as well. Same if Beane were to get canned and McDermott stays.

[GunnerBill]

34 minutes ago, Greg S said:

 

For the record I think both will be here a long time. But if McDermott were to get fired that doesn't mean Beane goes as well. Same if Beane were to get canned and McDermott stays.

 

I can see a route to the second (though narrow), can't see a route to the first. 

[NewEra]

3 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

Like I said. It depends.

 

If they have disappointing playoff outs the next couple years and follow that up with a losing season, your not being realistic if you don’t think McDs job may be in question. 
 

Things change in the NFL pretty damn quick… not sure why fans have a hard time grasping that. 

As a Bills fan, you should know why.  Very good to great coaches don’t grow on trees. If you don’t have one, you usually end up with a new HC every 1-2 years and spin your wheels for a decade+.
 

Otherwise, I agree with your take.  He’s not untouchable until he wins a Super Bowl.  If we don’t make the Super Bowl over the course of the next 2 seasons, it might be time to find someone that can get us there.  We can’t waste 17.
 

If he wins one this I’d give him and Beane another 5 years.  

[BIGFOOTspaceman]

Another playoff flop this year an I would look to see if Wayne Fontes is available to take the reins.

[FilthyBeast]

14 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

Nothing’s impossible but it’s as close to impossible as it gets to make such a massive screwup like that again.  Frazier and Daboll called all the plays last year I believe.

Didn’t it take Bill Cowher more than a decade or something to win one?

 

I think he may also be on that list, but again the point is that it's a very small list of teams/coaches that have accomplished this which is why it's not necessarily a good omen for McDermott.

[boater]

Quote

Nothing. He's my head coach and still want him here no matter what happens in 2022

Glad to see that is by far, the fans choice. It's time to stop knee-jerk firing people. Follow the Steelers model and have the same head coach for 15 years and counting.

 

Fantasy team owners forget it's a two-step process. It's always fun for them to fire someone. But if you fire him, then step 2: who you gonna hire who will be an improvement? I see no one out there who can be an improvement over McDermott.

[NewEra]

18 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

If he was better than 90% of the coaches in the league he'd have a SB ring by now considering there is more than 10% of them currently coaching that have at least one.

 

Nobody is debating that he's not a good coach including myself. The question is whether or not he's good enough to take this team to the next level or just another modern day Marty Schotenheimer.

 

Also history is not on McDermott's side in terms of the history of coaches in this league that have won a SB after more than 5 seasons with a team. Ironically his mentor and nemesis Andy Reid is one of the few that have done this but it took landing a generational talent like Mahomes to finally do it.

This is just dumb.  He’s been a HC as long as McVay, who just won his first SB.  Prior to last season, would McVay have been considered outside of the top 10%?  But it took his GM trading picks at the deadline to get Von Miller to get that SB.  If Beane would have made that trade for Miller, McD probably would’ve won instead.  

 

Took Belichick 7 years.  
Took Landry 12 years 

Took Noll 6 years 

Andy Reid 21 years

Dungy 11 years 

Cowher 14 years 

Vermeil 10 years

 

 

 

 

 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

On 5/16/2022 at 8:34 PM, todd said:

Yeah, fire the best coach since Marv. Great idea! Total coaching staff overhaul that follows would be awesome! What the hell, why not just fire him now? Get a head start on it! 
 

Wasn’t there a similar crusade every week or two during the season? 

 

 

Individuals are often awesome. Groups of people are typically stupid.

 

[FilthyBeast]

1 hour ago, boater said:

Glad to see that is by far, the fans choice. It's time to stop knee-jerk firing people. Follow the Steelers model and have the same head coach for 15 years and counting.

 

Fantasy team owners forget it's a two-step process. It's always fun for them to fire someone. But if you fire him, then step 2: who you gonna hire who will be an improvement? I see no one out there who can be an improvement over McDermott.

 

The steelers model is based on their current head coach getting his team to 3 SB's and winning 2 of them. He's also never had a losing season there which is absurd when you think about it.

 

So yah if McDermott can come close to matching Tomlin's record and accolades in this league why would you even think about firing him?

 

But the crux of the matter and premise of this thread is based on McDermott's current status (3-4 in the playoffs including 4 road losses) and lack of SB appearances/wins and how much longer the Pegulas can be patient if he fails to deliver again this year.

[GoBills808]

6 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I can see a route to the second (though narrow), can't see a route to the first. 

Of course you can. And imo it will happen if the Bills haven't won a Super Bowl by the time they need to start negotiating Allen's next contract.

[frostbitmic]

 12 seconds

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, GoBills808 said:

Of course you can. And imo it will happen if the Bills haven't won a Super Bowl by the time they need to start negotiating Allen's next contract.

 

I agree if that happens McDermott is out. But Beane will be gone with him.

[SCBills]

As of right now, no..

 

This question probably reads to most as "If the Bills don't, at least, make the Super Bowl, would you consider moving on from McDermott?"

 

Of course, if the season goes off the rails, sure.. but we saw today, not one absence from a team event to be there for the community and honor those killed... McDermott is a leader of men, and I'm confident he leads us to Super Bowl win(s).  

[Dopey]

Hopefully he's treated like Mike Tomlin. I believe 15 yrs, 9 playoff appearances, 1 SB title, and not one losing season. After the 💩 show we've produced over the decades, I'll take it.

[Alphadawg7]

15 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea I agree with this. I don't mean McDermott micromanages and makes every decision. They trust each other, they empower each other. But of the two of them the one with the most power in the organisation is Sean. I really struggle to forsee any scenario in which Sean would go and Brandon would stay. 

 

I don't think that is the case though.  First, I think there are both almost equally admired throughout the organization all the way to the top.  I do not think it is it will a "he goes first" situation at all.  I think if there was ever a change made, it will come down to why we are making the change.

 

If the team comes up short continuously in the playoffs and we are getting our coached on the field, McD will be on the hot seat long before Beane.  If we are coming up short in the playoffs because we can't get the right personnel on the field to shore up weaknesess, then Beane will be under more heat than McD.  

 

I certianly do not think either is on any kind of a hot seat and fully expect them both to be hear a long time and have SB wins on their resumes.  But if this team gets bounced early in an upset in the playoffs this season, there is no doubt McD's seat is going to get hotter than Beane's.  GM's who deliver elite franchise QB's, and build super bowl caliber rosters are never the first to go over a coach when that team is under performing.  Beane is already getting praise as the top GM in football in some circles and polls, while McD is still being criticized for how we lost last year, how we looked out coached and classed the year before, and how we shot our selves in the foot the year before that against Houston too many times.  

 

I don't personally put all that on McD, and I feel he is one of the best coaches in football right now.  I don't think there is any way he would lose his job this year.  But, if its an early playoff exit with this roster, with these expectations, then its going to be him who is going to find his seat getting toast before Beane IMHO.  

 

[The Dean]

50 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I agree if that happens McDermott is out. But Beane will be gone with him.

 

Completely agree---if that's the reason McDermott is dismissed. (Which once again, I DO NOT expect to happen for quite some time)

 

BUT the one situation I can see MdD being dismissed and Beane staying, is if McD is fired for some kind or Urban Meyer like scandal. Then I can definately see Beane remaining. But this situation is so far fetched, knowing what I know about McD, it's barely worth discussing. .

[GunnerBill]

10 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

I don't think that is the case though.  First, I think there are both almost equally admired throughout the organization all the way to the top. 

 

From what I am told, by people who would know, that is not true. McDermott is absolutely the prodigal son to the Pegulas.  Look who got the new deal first too. I am told Beane was only being extended on the basis that McDermott signed. That is why it had to be McD first.

[boater]

4 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

how much longer the Pegulas can be patient if he fails to deliver again this year.

Very patient I hope.

[Alphadawg7]

24 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

From what I am told, by people who would know, that is not true. McDermott is absolutely the prodigal son to the Pegulas.  Look who got the new deal first too. I am told Beane was only being extended on the basis that McDermott signed. That is why it had to be McD first.

 

I get that, but thats today...that is not next year after say an early playoff exit again.  We don know how he will be seen if that happens again.  I am definitely skeptical that holds true if we see another early exit this next year or two in the playoffs.  Losing changes peoples opinions real fast, especially once certain expectations are established.  

 

This is now a SB or bust team this year and the next few seasons.  Getting into the playoffs first and second rounds is not an accomplishment now, its a let down.  This team minimal expectation is AFCCG no matter what.  Entering a season with #1 Offense, #1 Defense, and a perennial MVP candidate at QB and the odds on favorite to win the SB.  You enter the season with that and then don't get out of the 2nd round of playoffs again, or even go one and done, then your coaching seat is definitely changing temperatures and getting warm.  

 

We have an early exit this after how we have exited the last few years, I just can't see how he doesn't get more scrutiny and end up with his seat warm heading into the following season.    

 

Don't get me wrong, I love McD and think he is a top 5 coach right now and I have all the confidence in him today moving forward.  Just saying this team was ready to win a SB last year, it looks to be improved even more this year.  Expectations are now high, and coming up short moving forward now will carry a lot more negative weight than what has happened the last 3 playoff exits where we were a team on the rise, not the team to beat per se.  

 

Personally, I think both McD and Beane are safe no matter what 2 more seasons...this one, and next.  But an early exit this year and I definitely think McD enters that following year under some pressure to deliver or his future could be in doubt otherwise.  

Edited May 18, 2022 by Alphadawg7

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Short of dropping a 💩 on Kim or Terrys desk no

[Augie]

2 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

I don't think that is the case though.  First, I think there are both almost equally admired throughout the organization all the way to the top.  I do not think it is it will a "he goes first" situation at all.  I think if there was ever a change made, it will come down to why we are making the change.

 

If the team comes up short continuously in the playoffs and we are getting our coached on the field, McD will be on the hot seat long before Beane.  If we are coming up short in the playoffs because we can't get the right personnel on the field to shore up weaknesess, then Beane will be under more heat than McD.  

 

I certianly do not think either is on any kind of a hot seat and fully expect them both to be hear a long time and have SB wins on their resumes.  But if this team gets bounced early in an upset in the playoffs this season, there is no doubt McD's seat is going to get hotter than Beane's.  GM's who deliver elite franchise QB's, and build super bowl caliber rosters are never the first to go over a coach when that team is under performing.  Beane is already getting praise as the top GM in football in some circles and polls, while McD is still being criticized for how we lost last year, how we looked out coached and classed the year before, and how we shot our selves in the foot the year before that against Houston too many times.  

 

I don't personally put all that on McD, and I feel he is one of the best coaches in football right now.  I don't think there is any way he would lose his job this year.  But, if its an early playoff exit with this roster, with these expectations, then its going to be him who is going to find his seat getting toast before Beane IMHO.  

 

 

Sorry, I have to disagree. IF we flame out in the first round, he’s still safe. VERY safe. It’s very hard to win the Super Bowl, especially coming out of the AFC these days. He’s our guy. He built this culture. I can’t wait to see this team and this group of men out there competing again. 

 

To the OP, under NO realistic circumstances can I see us getting rid of our HC after this season. Period. 

 

Do you think the Eagles might like Andy Reid back? 

 

 

.

Edited May 19, 2022 by Augie

[Alphadawg7]

33 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

Sorry, I have to disagree. IF we flame out in the first round, he’s still safe. VERY safe. It’s very hard to win the Super Bowl, especially coming out of the AFC these days. He’s our guy. He built this culture. I can’t wait to see this team and this group of men out there competing again. 

 

To the OP, under NO realistic circumstances can I see us getting rid of our HC after this season. Period. 

 

Do you think the Eagles might like Andy Reid back? 

 

 

.

 

You misunderstand me Augie...I totally 100% agree McD is safe, and NOT on a hot seat bud.  What I was responding to is who would be the first to be on the hot seat at some point, McD or Beane.  I was saying that if we have a couple of one and done seasons in a row in the playoffs for example, McD would have a hotter seat than Beane IMO.

 

But make no mistake about it, I absolutely have full confidence in McD and Beane, and believe they are the best tandem in the league.  In no way do I think they are on a hot seat now and I do believe they will deliver Buffalo a SB.

 

I was participating in others speculation that if things didn't go as expected, who of the two would face a hot seat first.  

Edited May 19, 2022 by Alphadawg7

[flaz]

Not gonna read 13 pages of post bumping. My option was not in the ABC or D. If there is another meltdown like the 13 seconds, he be gone

 

Edited May 19, 2022 by flaz

[flaz]

So state why you disagree. Or is that just another bump to your count