Bills Fans Are Really Overanalyzing The Loss To The Patriots

[Bangarang]

People love to preach culture then say it’s okay to lose to the team that’s been curb stomping is for the last 2 decades? 
 

it doesn’t matter if the Pats were unlikely to lose to the Dolphins. It’s about showing them that we’re not going to be pushovers happy with moral victories and we can go to their place and kick their ass. You want to change the culture for real and make some noise? Then how about shutting up NE in their house.

[Phil The Thrill]

21 minutes ago, kjack151 said:

Phil, I do see your perspective and I appreciate you being rational about the situation.  

 

 

For so many years we have been out of playoff contention by the second time we played NE, that I can see if those games didn't matter to the players.  In this case, I do think that this would have gone a long ways for their confidence.  Additionally, look at how we lost - couldn't stop the run, couldn't get to Brady - this has happened so many times that I'm sure they wonder if it will ever happen (beating the Patriots).  

You seem to be conflating the players and the fans.  The majority of players on this team are new.  They don’t have a long history of losing to the Patriots.  The fans do!  That’s why I don’t think the game will have effect one way or another.  They had a 92% chance of being the 5 seed either way.   
 

I don’t see a win versus NE suddenly propelling this team to start dominating in the playoffs. 
 

I also don’t see a loss hurt their chances of winning a playoff game either 

3 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

You are engaging in denial or bargaining.

 

This is the third of five stages in the grieving process.

 

Bills fans know this process well. 

 

 

??? This is funny

[row_33]

Sour grapes tells us the game didn’t matter after the Bills lost

 

 

 

Edited December 22, 2019 by row_33

[Phil The Thrill]

1 minute ago, Bangarang said:

People love to preach culture then say it’s okay to lose to the team that’s been curb stomping is for the last 2 decades? 
 

it doesn’t matter if the Pats were unlikely to lose to the Dolphins. It’s about showing them that we’re not going to be pushovers happy with moral victories and we can go to their place and kick their ass. You want to change the culture for real and make some noise? Then how about shutting up NE in their house.

Again, you are overanalyzing this game.  Losing to NE will have no effect, other than it will disappoint fans who want the satisfaction of beating the Patriots in a meaningless end of the season game

1 minute ago, row_33 said:

Sour grapes tells us the game didn’t matter after the Bills lost

 

 

 

Sour grapes....or reality.   A win or loss was unlikely going to chance their playoff standing either way

[TwistofFate]

2 hours ago, Phil The Thrill said:

Of course... but a loss here isn’t as devastating as a lot of fans are making it sound and a win would be pretty much meaningless after a week or week so.  

We lost the division.  It's pretty devastating to people who care.  It wasn't a meaningless game and not one player in that locker room feels that way. 

 

This is a losing mentality. 

[DCbillsfan]

2 hours ago, Boatdrinks said:

I think the effort was there by the players ( not necessarily the execution) but the coaches went 99% simple and vanilla. They knew a win wasn’t going to improve their spot and they need their best defensive work to win in the playoffs. The passive gameplan vs a hobbled and slow Brady said it all. They we’re far from embarrassed , and players got valuable experience vs a top defensive unit. However, they weren’t going to waste their best stuff ( or put new things on film) in this game. If the game was for the AFCE and a bye week, they would have went after Brady relentlessly. His numbers this year when pressured vs not pressured are a stark contrast to previous years. 

It took me a few hours to come to this same conclusion.  The Bills tried to win with a very basic/conservative game plan but didn't execute very well.  If the Bills could have won the division on their own without help from Miami next week, the game plan would have been rather different imo.  Since that wasnt the case, they played very vanilla in many ways.  They didn't want to show anything special to Houston or KC.

[Bangarang]

4 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

Again, you are overanalyzing this game.
 

 

Nah, I don’t think so

 

4 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

Losing to NE will have no effect, other than it will disappoint fans who want the satisfaction of beating the Patriots in a meaningless end of the season game

Losing today doesn’t change our playoff standing but the game itself wasn’t exactly meaningless.

[Phil The Thrill]

Again I get the disappointment from the fan base but let’s call this loss for what it is - a game that likely had no bearing on the playoff round in a few weeks 

 

Don’t pretend that this loss is going to have some sort of negative psychological effect on the players.  It won’t.

 

The Bills lost a heartbreaking game to NE

Then won 3 of the next 4

 

The Bills beat Dallas handedly on the road

Then lost by 1 score to Balimore at home

 

The Bills beat Pittsburgh on the road

Then lost by 1 score on New England

 

My point is that this a resilient, even-keel team and these losses they seem so “devastating” to the fan base, often have little effect on players.

 

On the other hand, big wins are guarantee of momentum.  Just because the Bills beat a good team in Dallas was no guarantee that they would beat a good Ravens teams.

 

And a loss to NE is no future indicator that the team is going to lose in the wildcard card round.  
 

 

8 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

We lost the division.  It's pretty devastating to people who care.  It wasn't a meaningless game and not one player in that locker room feels that way. 

 

This is a losing mentality. 

Right some Bills fans have a “loser” mentality but the players don’t...thank goodness.  
 

You do realize that even after a win, in order to win the division the Patriots had to lose to Miami:  There was an 8% chance of they happening

3 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

 

Nah, I don’t think so

 

Losing today doesn’t change our playoff standing but the game itself wasn’t exactly meaningless.

Ok maybe but I don’t think the outcome will have any kind of effect one way or another on the playoffs.  Fans need to chill 

[TwistofFate]

3 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

 

 

Right some Bills fans have a “loser” mentality but the players don’t...thank goodness.  
 

You do realize that even after a win, in order to win the division the Patriots had to lose to Miami:  There was an 8% chance of they happening

 

8%? Who comes up with that garbage. 

 

Bottom line is we LOST the division tonight.  They clinched it on our backs, not Miami. 

 

Losing it on a ton of tie breakers is one thing, losing it head to head is another. 

 

A bigger kick in the balls would be a Miami upset next week. 

[Boatdrinks]

16 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

We lost the division.  It's pretty devastating to people who care.  It wasn't a meaningless game and not one player in that locker room feels that way. 

 

This is a losing mentality. 

The division was lost when the Bills didn’t beat Cleveland. A win today wouldn’t have given the Bills the division title, no matter how much we’d like to believe Miami could win in NE next week. I’ll concur that no player in the locker room felt this game was meaningless. I also would venture their confidence wasn’t shaken one iota by the result. 

[Phil The Thrill]

6 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

8%? Who comes up with that garbage. 

 

Bottom line is we LOST the division tonight.  They clinched it on our backs, not Miami. 

 

Losing it on a ton of tie breakers is one thing, losing it head to head is another. 

 

A bigger kick in the balls would be a Miami upset next week. 

“they cliched it on our backs?”  What the hell does that mean?

 

Would it be any better if they won the division in the Miami game and not against the Bills?  Who cares?  Who gives a damn?  Silly argument. 
 

So you are saying losing it on a tiebreaker makes a difference?  I thought there were more victories!?!?!?’b

9 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

8%? Who comes up with that garbage. 

 

Bottom line is we LOST the division tonight.  They clinched it on our backs, not Miami. 

 

Losing it on a ton of tie breakers is one thing, losing it head to head is another. 

 

A bigger kick in the balls would be a Miami upset next wee

5 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

The division was lost when the Bills didn’t beat Cleveland. A win today wouldn’t have given the Bills the division title, no matter how much we’d like to believe Miami could win in NE next week. I’ll concur that no player in the locker room felt this game was meaningless. I also would venture their confidence wasn’t shaken one iota by the result. 

 

Ok sure.... I can admit that meaningless was the wrong term.  But this game likely has effect on our playoffs standing.  That was my point

[TwistofFate]

10 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

The division was lost when the Bills didn’t beat Cleveland. A win today wouldn’t have given the Bills the division title, no matter how much we’d like to believe Miami could win in NE next week. I’ll concur that no player in the locker room felt this game was meaningless. I also would venture their confidence wasn’t shaken one iota by the result. 

The division was lost tonight.  What are you talking about?  NE clinched the division because they beat US. 

Edited December 22, 2019 by TwistofFate

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

2 hours ago, Phil The Thrill said:

They should hire you as a special assistant coach.  That would help them cut down on dumb tendencies 

I can tell you with 100% certainty if they hired me to be in charge of clock management, there would be a significant improvement. A 13 year old playing madden knows when to call time outs and when to turn up the urgency at the end of a half or game. We are running the clock out on ourselves when we are losing.

[Phil The Thrill]

2 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

The division was lost tonight.  What are you talking about?  NE clinched the division because they beat US. 

You don’t get it....

[Troll Toll]

2 hours ago, Boatdrinks said:

I think the effort was there by the players ( not necessarily the execution) but the coaches went 99% simple and vanilla. They knew a win wasn’t going to improve their spot and they need their best defensive work to win in the playoffs. The passive gameplan vs a hobbled and slow Brady said it all. They we’re far from embarrassed , and players got valuable experience vs a top defensive unit. However, they weren’t going to waste their best stuff ( or put new things on film) in this game. If the game was for the AFCE and a bye week, they would have went after Brady relentlessly. His numbers this year when pressured vs not pressured are a stark contrast to previous years. 

This guy gets it! No need to give away what you would do in a playoff game from the Bills vantage point. We went super vanilla and went the distance. This was the best possible outcome and a blessing in disguise for most fans. Now Bills can rest players if they want to against the Jets and the Jets won’t have motivation of costing us the division. We can treat Week 17 like a Bye. Our Bye was very early this season and our guys could use a rest. I would hate to exhaust our guys against the Jets, only to have New England squash Miami and take the division anyways.

[Boatdrinks]

3 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

The division was lost tonight.  What are you talking about?  NE clinched the division because they beat US. 

Their records going in were not the same. If the Bills had won in Cleveland ( as they should have) today’s game would have essentially been for the division title. As it stood, a Bills win today would not have given them the division title. It more than likely would have just delayed NE clinching until next week. Pretty simple stuff, really. 

[Nelius]

I'm not disappointed at all. Today was great, the disappointment floor was so much higher since we're already in the playoffs, and then we made it a game in their stadium. I thought this was progression all around. I'm sure this has been said, but when was the last time we made it a 4th quarter game in Foxboro, let alone for a game that mattered? I'd rematch that Pats team any day, how long has it been since you could say that? People are underrating the Pats, which hurts my soul to even type, after a few weeks of down play. It's how the world works now, but make no mistake, the Patriots are still one of the top 2 teams in the AFC.

 

Overall this was an affordable loss in all reality and I liked what I saw from the Bills. Allen throwing 2 TDs and no nterceptions, in their house, in a game that matters in late December, is fantastic.

[TwistofFate]

3 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

Their records going in were not the same. If the Bills had won in Cleveland ( as they should have) today’s game would have essentially been for the division title. As it stood, a Bills win today would not have given them the division title. It more than likely would have just delayed NE clinching until next week. Pretty simple stuff, really. 

Its very simple.  Who cliched the AFC East ?  prior to tonight's game. 

 

Answer - no one

 

If Buffalo won tonight, who clinched the AFC East ?? 

 

Answer - no one

 

It all would have ridden on week 17 to determine the outcome of the division.

 

We lost any chance of winning the East by losing tonight. 

 

No game is a give me and anything can happen in any given week. 

 

NE clinched by defeating US. 

[Nelius]

2 hours ago, Boatdrinks said:

This isn’t the worst Patriots team in 20 years. 

 

Totally agree. Where is this coming from? They've been kind of off their game, for like 3 weeks? They're 12-3 defending champs and people are acting like they're not the same Patriots. I do not understand it, Belichick and his weird kid have been stepping up their psyops apparently.

[JoPoy88]

55 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

People love to preach culture then say it’s okay to lose to the team that’s been curb stomping is for the last 2 decades? 
 

it doesn’t matter if the Pats were unlikely to lose to the Dolphins. It’s about showing them that we’re not going to be pushovers happy with moral victories and we can go to their place and kick their ass. You want to change the culture for real and make some noise? Then how about shutting up NE in their house.

All this. We already scored our moral victory when when played them close earlier this season. I didn’t need another one.

[Process]

Obviously would have been nice to beat the pats. But right, they were never going to win the division. And at least there are a couple positives. Bills can rest starters next week now. And the motivation to prove themselves will still be there going into the playoffs. 

[ticketssince61]

It was an important game

 

1 - the team needs to show itself it can be the top tier teams to have the confidence in the playoffs.

 

2 - important to get the "lose all the time to the Patriots" monkey off our back for next year

 

3-  it is a highly likely but not foregone conclusion that the Pats will beat the Dolphins - there was still a chance for us to win the division and get a first round bye

 

 

[Phil The Thrill]

4 hours ago, ticketssince61 said:

It was an important game

 

1 - the team needs to show itself it can be the top tier teams to have the confidence in the playoffs.

 

2 - important to get the "lose all the time to the Patriots" monkey off our back for next year

 

3-  it is a highly likely but not foregone conclusion that the Pats will beat the Dolphins - there was still a chance for us to win the division and get a first round bye

 

 

You are being bery dramatic.  Like waaaaay too dramatic:

 

1 - the team needs to show itself it can be the top tier teams to have the confidence in the playoffs.

 

2 - important to get the "lose all the time to the Patriots" monkey off our back for next year

 

This is more about YOU than it is about the players.  YOU needed confidence that the team could play good.  YOU wanted to get the monkey off YOUR back to feel better.

 

The players didn’t need this win.  Win or lose - this game has no effect on the 5t

4 hours ago, ticketssince61 said:

It was an important game

 

1 - the team needs to show itself it can be the top tier teams to have the confidence in the playoffs.

 

2 - important to get the "lose all the time to the Patriots" monkey off our back for next year

 

3-  it is a highly likely but not foregone conclusion that the Pats will beat the Dolphins - there was still a chance for us to win the division and get a first round 

5 hours ago, JoPoy88 said:

All this. We already scored our moral victory when when played them close earlier this season. I didn’t need another one.

Ok fine but don’t pretend that this loss was something it wasn’t.  It doesn’t mean they have any less of a chance in the playoffs 

Edited December 22, 2019 by Phil The Thrill

[Doc Brown]

4 hours ago, ticketssince61 said:

It was an important game

 

1 - the team needs to show itself it can be the top tier teams to have the confidence in the playoffs.

 

2 - important to get the "lose all the time to the Patriots" monkey off our back for next year

 

3-  it is a highly likely but not foregone conclusion that the Pats will beat the Dolphins - there was still a chance for us to win the division and get a first round bye

 

 

Pittsburgh was far more important as we had a much higher likelihood of beating them.  As to your points..

 

1.)  Mission accomplished as they were within eight yards of tying a game against the Pats in Foxboro in December.  

2.)  I guess but I don't really see how it impacts them going into the Wild Card Round.  Plus, it makes them hungrier if they get a chance at the Pats again in the playoffs (see the 2010 Jets).

3.)  Too unlikely to take the loss a heart breaker for me like the Cleveland loss.  The Pats beat them 43-0 in Miami.  Something tells me Brady could beat them left handed.

 

I've been told I'm too pragmatic so maybe that's why this game to me was like a glorified preseason game.  I was hoping to put up a good fight (which we did) and not to have a major injury (fingers crossed for Morse).  I hope we get to play these f**kers again in the playoffs for real stakes next time.

[CSBill]

9 hours ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 However, this game needed to be treated like a playoff game.  It wasn't by the players or coaches.

 

REALLY, you know that for sure?

 

To the thread title, we're fans, that's what we do = OVERREACT. And I submit this post as exhibit "A," your Honor.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

9 hours ago, machine gun kelly said:

Phil, you make good points, mine only is we had the best chance in 20 years of beating Brady in Foxborough.  I do hope we don’t rest anyone healthy.  I understand Morse, or anyone else with an injury we don’t know about yet like a hamstring, etc.  We should be focused and I can only imagine McD is thinking we need to go into the Wildcard weekend with momentum and would be nice to have the best record in 20-25 years.

 

 

 

...having to digest "11th straight AFCE title" is one helluva bitter pill ......"play fearless" yet "coach fearful"?.....hmmm.............

[colin]

Josh has plenty of bad habits to get out of a d lots to learn.  Most of all, he needs to learn to calm down at the start of big games.

 

I've come to the conclusion that dabol is a very much old school coach who has a rigid idea of what a good o is and will slam square pegs into round holes until they fit or they break.

 

Josh in a timing pass o is kinda not perfect, our trash rt singled up on long developing plays is bad, gore as a speed/power back is laughable, and our Smurf wrs don't get open vs man enough.

 

He's designed some good plays here and there, but has zero feel and it just seems like our team is playing uphill all the time

[Rochesterfan]

12 hours ago, Tesla03 said:

just think of it this way

 

the best bills team in 20+ years still couldn't beat the worst patriots team in 20 years. 

 

This is total bull and completely irrelevant.  This Bills and Pats team are both nearly equal, but the Pats had a better record against common opponents - so it is no surprise both games were close.

 

This “so called” worst Pats team is the AFC #2 seed and has only lost 3 games to division champs - it is not like they are the Bengals.  They boast a top defense and special teams unit.  They are far from the worst Pats team during this run, but go ahead.

 

 

Edited December 22, 2019 by Rochesterfan

[Camisado]

11 hours ago, Success said:

I dunno.  I'm at a point of psychosis - I'm seriously worried about my mental health. That team has dominated us in a way that  is one-sided to the extreme. I'm really grappling w/ it right now - trying to figure out different rationalizations, or things outside of my "sports fan" life that might make me feel better. 

 

I don't think any fan should have to go through this, though. I don't care how whiny it sounds.  I just want to beat that team.

 

Yeah I was really hoping to have a win against the Patriots this year!  It's been too long and we need to prove we can compete and play with the best of em!  I really wanted to be able to have a win against Brady again before he retires.  Done waiting, the momentum needs to go our way, we need a changing of the guard in our division!

[Hampton Josh fan]

Everything about this game should give Bills fans confidence that this team is on the  come. Josh is a talented, athletic QB, that will get better and win a lot of games. The other sad reality this game showed is that the team is still a draft and free agency away from competing on a championship level. The offensive coaches have lost confidence in the this team playing aggressively in a passing league. Play close to the vest, field position games and hope the defense can allow you to outscore quality offenses. Sadly, the teams that will advance in the playoffs are going to score in the 20s against anybody. 

[SoTier]

12 hours ago, Phil The Thrill said:

And you know this....how?  Because many analysts commented that it felt like a playoff game.

 

The Bills defense didn’t play as well but I don’t question effort on either side of the ball

 

I agree.  My view is that the Patriots are the Patriots.   This is the time of year that they get their collective act together, start making even good defenses look lackluster, and far better offenses than the Bills have look anemic (see Rams in last year's SB).  Every season they conjure up some has-been or never-was to crush other teams' playoff/Super Bowl dreams.  This year, they took somewhat longer than they usually do to get into gear, and that probably gave us  "outsiders" -- other teams, commentators, and fans -- the false idea that they were on death's door.   Apparently the reports of the Patriots' demise were a bit premature.

Edited December 22, 2019 by SoTier

[Boatdrinks]

33 minutes ago, Hampton Josh fan said:

Everything about this game should give Bills fans confidence that this team is on the  come. Josh is a talented, athletic QB, that will get better and win a lot of games. The other sad reality this game showed is that the team is still a draft and free agency away from competing on a championship level. The offensive coaches have lost confidence in the this team playing aggressively in a passing league. Play close to the vest, field position games and hope the defense can allow you to outscore quality offenses. Sadly, the teams that will advance in the playoffs are going to score in the 20s against anybody. 

Can’t disagree, but we already knew this. The Bills roster overhaul is not yet complete. While most of last seasons putrid offense has been replaced, they are still missing a couple of key pieces. They’re better on that side of the ball, but not good enough to carry the team deep into the playoffs. Still, they have a good chance at a WC round win even with a suspect offense. 

40 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

I agree.  My view is that the Patriots are the Patriots.   This is the time of year that they get their collective act together, start making even good defenses look lackluster, and far better offenses than the Bills have look anemic (see Rams in last year's SB).  Every season they conjure up some has-been or never-was to crush other teams' playoff/Super Bowl dreams.  This year, they took somewhat longer than they usually do to get into gear, and that probably gave us  "outsiders" -- other teams, commentators, and fans -- the false idea that they were on death's door.   Apparently the reports of the Patriots' demise were a bit premature.

The Patriots have major issues, and one game hardly means they’ve gotten into gear. They hung on to win at home Vs a questionable Bills offense. These are clearly not the same Patriots. 

[Iron Maiden]

1 hour ago, Boatdrinks said:

Can’t disagree, but we already knew this. The Bills roster overhaul is not yet complete. While most of last seasons putrid offense has been replaced, they are still missing a couple of key pieces. They’re better on that side of the ball, but not good enough to carry the team deep into the playoffs. Still, they have a good chance at a WC round win even with a suspect offense. 

The Patriots have major issues, and one game hardly means they’ve gotten into gear. They hung on to win at home Vs a questionable Bills offense. These are clearly not the same Patriots. 

 

I understand what you mean, and this is not directed at you specifically....but we've been hearing this for a few years now....they are not the same Patriots.....which I assume means they are not as good as last year or a few years ago......but yet, here they are, will end up with a 13-3 record, have a bye week followed by a home playoff game....doesn't it sound familiar ?.....what are you comparing them too ?...The 2007 16-0 team ?....we saw it last year...played just OK during the season and just turned it up 10 fold in the playoffs....and won another SB....

[Albwan]

pats suck... most of the country is dying to see them finished. It will be a big party.

Would have been amazing to have it happen last night.

[wagon127]

Im sick of losing to new england. But maybe we get another shot at them in  a few weeks. 2 out of the last 3 weeks, we were less then 15 yards from tying a great team. And we have 4 tough games coming up to prove we are contenders. Josh Allen had a great second half last night.

[Iron Maiden]

6 minutes ago, Albwan said:

pats suck... most of the country is dying to see them finished. It will be a big party.

Would have been amazing to have it happen last night.

If that is true, what does it say about our team? How come we can't beat them...ever....31-3 when Brady plays.....2-0 this season...again....they are still better than us...and THAT sucks ! We could have put a serious dent in their bye week hopes yesterday....it's frustrating to say the least....

[CheshireCT]

I’m honestly shocked at all the complaining here. This young Bills managed the Patriots quite well yesterday, and Tom Brady is still the best game manager in the NFL. Look, basically no one beats the Pats year in and year out, it just sucks more if you play in the AFC east and have to play them twice every year. This Bills team has exceeded expectations for this season by a long shot, and in the last four games came up with two big wins and two very close losses against the Ravens and Pats. I think next year this team bumps it up agains the Pats.

Edited December 22, 2019 by CheshireCT

[Steptide]

I'm sure the players will move on quickly, but Allen looked like he was post tears in his press conference. This game meant alot to the players even if it means nothing in the long run. My hope is that they learn alot from it and expect more from themselves when it come playoff time 

[row_33]

They wanted to win, they played their best and lost 

 

please stop telling us 20 hours later it didn’t matter anyway!!!!!

 

if you keep doing this you have to show up at 6am tomorrow to run stadium stairs until you vomit and then pass out

 

 

[SoTier]

3 hours ago, Boatdrinks said:

The Patriots have major issues, and one game hardly means they’ve gotten into gear. They hung on to win at home Vs a questionable Bills offense. These are clearly not the same Patriots. 

 

They're never "the same Patriots" but somehow they manage to win games, especially playoff games.  Against a more complete team with more play makers, especially on offense, than the Bills have, they probably aren't "the same Patriots" but the Bills still have a ways to go to compete with the AFC's elite.