RD 3, Pick 96: TE Dawson Knox, Ole Miss

[nbbillsfan]

A couple things:

 

1. He looks surprisingly quick, fluid, fast. Anyone know why he didn’t run the 40 at the combine?

 

2. We know Beane and Co spent A Lot if time watching DK Metcalf and AJ Brown,  obviously Knox caught there eye. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

3 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Ole Miss needs to be investigated again for not using this guy more.  His tape is filthy. 

 

...or incorrectly.....weren't there some knocks about Oliver NOT being used correctly in college?....guess I should be explicitly concerned with a player's collegiate past as my sole guidance......which then means I need to resign myself to the fact that Josh will NEVER make it in the NFL, right?....

[C.Biscuit97]

3 minutes ago, nbbillsfan said:

A couple things:

 

1. He looks surprisingly quick, fluid, fast. Anyone know why he didn’t run the 40 at the combine?

 

2. We know Beane and Co spent A Lot if time watching DK Metcalf and AJ Brown,  obviously Knox caught there eye. 

So instead of getting one of their stud receivers, we got the TE who was so talented they didn’t throw to him!  Just kidding (sort of).  He has a good name. 

[starrymessenger]

7 minutes ago, nbbillsfan said:

A couple things:

 

1. He looks surprisingly quick, fluid, fast. Anyone know why he didn’t run the 40 at the combine?

 

2. We know Beane and Co spent A Lot if time watching DK Metcalf and AJ Brown,  obviously Knox caught there eye. 

Sports hernia. Fully recovered by pro day. Hence 5.7 and 5.1.

[Kelly the Dog]

12 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I like the potential in Knox measurables but I see people saying he is "everything you want in a TE prospect"........and I am not sure he's really even a classic receiving TE.

 

He is stiff as a board............I mean if there is tape on him where he turns his hips I haven't seen it..........he turns his entire body to get around to the ball and that effectively shortens his frame and arms as a target.

 

The tape measure says he's got the minimum frame for a TE but he looks kinda' Hbacky due to that stiffness.  Weird that he was a QB and doesn't seem to be able to rotate his hips.  

 

 That will likely limit his catch radius sorta like it does for a guy like Nick O'Leary(Nick has short arms to boot so it's worse but you get the jist).    

 

That stiff back and core area might make him a stouter blocker though and it looked like Ole Miss liked to use him to lead block some so DiMarco might be out of work soon.

 

That may be a way to keep four active running backs on game day. 

Be nice to have a threat to block or catch the ball and/or beat a LB down the sideline. 

[The Frankish Reich]

5 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

So instead of getting one of their stud receivers, we got the TE who was so talented they didn’t throw to him!  Just kidding (sort of).  He has a good name. 

? And yes, Dawson Knox sounds like the name of an esteemed Professor of Classics Emeritus. All it needs is one of those ever popular Roman numerals after it. Add a middle initial and we're in Gilligan's Island territory.

[XABI64]

Dawson Knox sounds like a typical Bills player that we will forget about in 3 years 

 

don't understand why we didn't trade back into the 2nd round to grab a WR bc there were plenty of big names left. 

Edited April 27, 2019 by XABI64

[YoloinOhio]

 

[Rocky Landing]

5 hours ago, CSBill said:

 

Not sure it's high risk at all.

The injury history is a concern, but mostly the lack of experience at the position makes it a risky trade. But, when I say "high risk, high reward," I'm using that in the business sense. In other words, just using the pick we had would be the standard risk. Trading away other draft capital is adding risk, regardless of who we pick. And, to be clear, I think it was a worthy investment.

 

[YoloinOhio]

 

[Magox]

I love the enthusiasm and a player that is embracing the fans, but this has to be it.  No more.  Beane I'm sure will say something to him For this.

[starrymessenger]

14 minutes ago, XABI64 said:

Dawson Knox sounds like a typical Bills player that we will forget about in 3 years 

 

don't understand why we didn't trade back into the 2nd round to grab a WR bc there were plenty of big names left. 

 

This is not a great WR draft IMO (or RBs either for that matter). Not to say terrible, some guys project as # 2s, #3s but no clear #1 prospects. Thing is, except for AJ Brown (who I like a lot), they are all probably years away from being consistent and productive players assuming they ever get there ( with possible exception for guys drafted into perfect schemes like Isabella in Zona). Looks to me that the Bills figured out a long time ago that they were not prioritizing that position in the draft. They went with proven quality NFL receivers in FA instead to complement the best of what they already have on the roster.

[starrymessenger]

6 minutes ago, Magox said:

I love the enthusiasm and a player that is embracing the fans, but this has to be it.  No more.  Beane I'm sure will say something to him For this.

Yeah no kidding. He's supposed to be a mature, level headed guy. He's a professional now, not a college kid, and he needs to act like it. Maybe Lorax or Frank Gore should kick his a$$.

[boater]

I agree with the posters that allude to New England wanting Knox.

 

We jumped ahead of NE by trade, took their man, then NE traded down -- that's how I think it rolled.

 

I like the process. It's big & nasty and has got juice (I'm out of recent cliches).

[C.Biscuit97]

I’ll go on record and would have rather had Hakeem Butler.  

 

Butler instead of Knox and Love in the 4th instead of DS would make this an amazing draft IMo.  Hope I’m wrong. 

[MrEpsYtown]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I like the potential in Knox measurables but I see people saying he is "everything you want in a TE prospect"........and I am not sure he's really even a classic receiving TE.

 

He is stiff as a board............I mean if there is tape on him where he turns his hips I haven't seen it..........he turns his entire body to get around to the ball and that effectively shortens his frame and arms as a target.

 

The tape measure says he's got the minimum frame for a TE but he looks kinda' Hbacky due to that stiffness.  Weird that he was a QB and doesn't seem to be able to rotate his hips.  

 

 That will likely limit his catch radius sorta like it does for a guy like Nick O'Leary(Nick has short arms to boot so it's worse but you get the jist).    

 

That stiff back and core area might make him a stouter blocker though and it looked like Ole Miss liked to use him to lead block some so DiMarco might be out of work soon.

 

 

I think they see a guy with a lot of athletic upside and a projectable frame. I feel like just has not been coached to this point. There is no refinement in his game. If he went to Iowa, or Wisconsin or something where they really train their tight ends, I think he would have been a first round pick. I think they see a moldable piece. 

[sven233]

I take it all back.....  I am more than fine spending both 4th rounders on this guy!  With friends like these, you can't go wrong!  Let's go!!!!!!

 

 

Edited April 27, 2019 by sven233

[YoloinOhio]

42 minutes ago, XABI64 said:

Dawson Knox sounds like a typical Bills player that we will forget about in 3 years 

 

don't understand why we didn't trade back into the 2nd round to grab a WR bc there were plenty of big names left. 

Maybe they didn’t have the “big names” enough ahead of him on their board enough to give up that much capital to get into the 2nd

Edited April 27, 2019 by YoloinOhio

[BuffaloBob]

23 minutes ago, Magox said:

I love the enthusiasm and a player that is embracing the fans, but this has to be it.  No more.  Beane I'm sure will say something to him For this.

I think i was awesome. ?

[Logic]

This just goes to show you that the Bills can have a draft in which they get great value at every single pick, attack positions of need, and get universally praised by national analysts....

And there will STILL be a bunch of whiners and complainers acting like they know better and griping about the picks just because it's not exactly who THEY wanted.

And here's the real crux of it all: Many posters were just fully attached to the idea that they wanted the Bills to draft WRs. The fact that the Bills didn't do so is pretty much the entire reason for their anger. 

It's beyond silly.

[K-9]

2 minutes ago, BuffaloBob said:

I think i was awesome. ?

You was awesome, alright!

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

8 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Maybe they didn’t have the “big names” enough ahead of him on their board enough to give up that much capital to get into the 2nd

 

...yet in typical TBD pundit fashion, the kid is ALREADY a probable bust before walking down the pigeon stained "red carpet"...go figure....

[WideNine]

Saw some posts and comments that we had a player that was pretty close to Hockenson's level.

That is the case when you are just looking at the fact that they are both red-shirt JRs, and their combine numbers are very close (don't think Knox did the 40, but I am sure he made that up in his pro-day or private workouts - assume that it is not terrible) then pretty good value where we selected him.

 

I don't see the same level of blocking, route-running/catching, or productivity, BUT Iowa coaches up and uses their TEs far more than Mississippi and Ol' Miss had a lot more receiving weapons to choose from. One cannot overlook that they also play in a tougher conference.

After my hissy-fit last night at what I felt was a reach for a RB that I know very little about.... I am warming up to let's see what Knox can bring to our team and trust the process.

 

 

 

[MrEpsYtown]

4 minutes ago, Logic said:

This just goes to show you that the Bills can have a draft in which they get great value at every single pick, attack positions of need, and get universally praised by national analysts....

And there will STILL be a bunch of whiners and complainers acting like they know better and griping about the picks just because it's not exactly who THEY wanted.

And here's the real crux of it all: Many posters were just fully attached to the idea that they wanted the Bills to draft WRs. The fact that the Bills didn't do so is pretty much the entire reason for their anger. 

It's beyond silly.

 

I do think it's funny that people always say we need to go BPA and then complain when we don't draft for need. Beane said these guys were his BPA. That's good enough for me. 

[C.Biscuit97]

7 minutes ago, Logic said:

This just goes to show you that the Bills can have a draft in which they get great value at every single pick, attack positions of need, and get universally praised by national analysts....

And there will STILL be a bunch of whiners and complainers acting like they know better and griping about the picks just because it's not exactly who THEY wanted.

And here's the real crux of it all: Many posters were just fully attached to the idea that they wanted the Bills to draft WRs. The fact that the Bills didn't do so is pretty much the entire reason for their anger. 

It's beyond silly.

Conversely, if you don’t like the pick, it doesn’t make you a whiner.  It’s a message board not a cult.  You don’t have to give back your Bills fandom if you disagree with something.  And if the national media didn’t like the pick, the “homers” would trash their opinion and say how dumb they are. 

 

Its beyond silly.

Edited April 27, 2019 by C.Biscuit97

[MrEpsYtown]

3 minutes ago, WideNine said:

Saw some posts and comments that we had a player that was pretty close to Hockenson's level.

That is the case when you are just looking at the fact that they are both red-shirt JRs, and their combine numbers are very close (don't think Knox did the 40, but I am sure he made that up in his pro-day or private workouts - assume that it is not terrible) then pretty good value where we selected him.

 

I don't see the same level of blocking, route-running/catching, or productivity, BUT Iowa coaches up and uses their TEs far more than Mississippi and Ol' Miss had a lot more receiving weapons to choose from. One cannot overlook that they also play in a tougher conference.

After my hissy-fit last night at what I felt was a reach for a RB that I know very little about.... I am warming up to let's see what Knox can bring to our team and trust the process.

 

 

 

 

His forty was reported as 4.54...I saw 4.57 somewhere too. But that's really good. 

[Kelly the Dog]

3 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

I do think it's funny that people always say we need to go BPA and then complain when we don't draft for need. Beane said these guys were his BPA. That's good enough for me. 

They were all positions of need, especially the #1 pick. RB is not immediate need in 2019 but a huge need for a complete team including the future. He didn't pick any QB, LB, S, C, WR, which are the only positions we have clear starters (excluding aforementioned RB).

[MrEpsYtown]

3 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

They were all positions of need, especially the #1 pick. RB is not immediate need in 2019 but a huge need for a complete team including the future. He didn't pick any QB, LB, S, C, WR, which are the only positions we have clear starters (excluding aforementioned RB).

 

I still think he was drafting BPA though. And I think the Singeltary pick is a clear indication of that. It may not have been our BPA here, but I do believe it wa theirs. 

Edited April 27, 2019 by MrEpsYtown

[WideNine]

8 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

His forty was reported as 4.54...I saw 4.57 somewhere too. But that's really good. 

 

The film I had looking at the kid he just looked a bit hesitant and lost out there... one of those cases where I was wondering if they just didn't know how to use him or if it was a case of an average to poor QB who rarely targets you (probably both).

 

The main thing that drove him down my list and off my radar was the whole 15 catches on 28 targets in 2018 as I was pulling together my list of TEs and WRs with a heavy focus on "less drops".

 

Still, there are enough unknowns and a high enough ceiling where I can see if we can coach this kid up to be a solid weapon for Allen.

 

 

Edited April 27, 2019 by WideNine

[Logic]

8 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Conversely, if you don’t like the pick, it doesn’t make you a whiner.  It’s a message board not a cult.  You don’t have to give back your Bills fandom if you disagree with something.  And if the national media didn’t like the pick, the “homers” would trash their opinion and say how dumb they are. 

 

Its beyond silly.

You're right, and not all fans who don't like picks would be lumped into the "whiners" group for me. But there absolutely ARE a sub-set of unhappy people who go overboard or who act like what Beane is doing constitutes roster malpractice. It's one thing to disagree with a pick or reserve judgement or prefer that a different position be taken, it's quite another to outright badmouth a GM or say we're having a terrible draft or whatever just because Beane picked a different position or player than a fan may have liked.

There are reasonable ways to differ with a team's direction and there are immature, silly ways to do it. Sometimes, it feels like there are more of the latter than the former on this board.

[Kelly the Dog]

Just now, MrEpsYtown said:

 

I still think he was drafting BPA though. And I think the Singeltary pick is a clear indication of that. 

They all just happened to be BPA in four positions and none of the six positions happened to be BPA? That is quite a coinkidink, which seems to happen every round every year.

[RocCityRoller]

I still feel like this is Logan Thomas 2.0 a guy trying to convert to TE.

 

I wish him well.

[tcampbell104]

3 minutes ago, RocCityRoller said:

I still feel like this is Logan Thomas 2.0 a guy trying to convert to TE.

 

I wish him well.

this guy convertsd to te in college so hopefully he is ahead of thomas

[starrymessenger]

3 minutes ago, RocCityRoller said:

I still feel like this is Logan Thomas 2.0 a guy trying to convert to TE.

 

I wish him well.

He was a WR before he was a QB before he was a TE. From what little we get to see he looks to have soft hands that he actually uses to catch the ball. Don't know where people are seeing a stiff player. Looks to me to be pretty fluid and flexible. 

[twist_to_open]

14 hours ago, BigDingus said:

0 TD's in his entire career at Ole Miss?

That's an interesting player to trade up for...

How can you accurately access a player if you have no tape of his touchdown celebrations?

[Kelly the Dog]

1 minute ago, twist_to_open said:

How can you accurately access a player if you have no tape of his touchdown celebrations?

That is why you send scouts to his college practices, dummy.

[LSHMEAB]

21 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Conversely, if you don’t like the pick, it doesn’t make you a whiner.  It’s a message board not a cult.  You don’t have to give back your Bills fandom if you disagree with something.  And if the national media didn’t like the pick, the “homers” would trash their opinion and say how dumb they are. 

 

Its beyond silly.

Right. I loved the first two picks. At first glance, I'm not a fan of what they did in round 3. Knox is a nice athlete, but he's never done much on the field. Singletary was ultra productive against non elite competition, but the size/speed/lack of receptions IS a concern.

 

Chiming in with reasonable opinions does not equal whining in any, way, shape or form.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

24 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

I do think it's funny that people always say we need to go BPA and then complain when we don't draft for need. Beane said these guys were his BPA. That's good enough for me. 

...funny how that bi-polar "on the wagon off the wagon" crap works.....how many said "no way" to Mahomes because he was a product of the leper like Air Raid, bolstered by "NO QB from the Air Raid EVER makes it in the NFL", but are now on the "rip Whaley" bandwagon for screwing up the pick?...great posting safety from under one's desk....sad....

[MrEpsYtown]

12 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

They all just happened to be BPA in four positions and none of the six positions happened to be BPA? That is quite a coinkidink, which seems to happen every round every year.

 

I think this a great point. But I do think it was BPA for reals. Oliver was clearly BPA on everyone's board and a huge need as well. They had their choice of a number of RT but Ford was the guy they wanted. They tried to trade back into the first for him and passed on other players at the same position. I believe he was BPA. Singeltary is a running back, not really a need, and there were a bunch of players of positions of need in the board at the time. And finally, he traded up for Knox as well, and a whole bunch of tight ends have been drafted since then. I don't think he would have been there in the 4th. He targeted guys and grabbed them. 

 

So Oliver and Singeltary had to be BPAs, and he went and got Ford and Knox. 

2 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

...funny how that bi-polar "on the wagon off the wagon" crap works.....how many said "no way" to Mahomes because he was a product of the leper like Air Raid, bolstered by "NO QB from the Air Raid EVER makes it in the NFL", but are now on the "rip Whaley" bandwagon for screwing up the pick?...great posting safety from under one's desk....sad....

 

Yeah I remember arguing that air raid quarterbacks were reading a lot of coverages and making NFL level throws and that whole thing was a misconception. 

[nbbillsfan]

2 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

So instead of getting one of their stud receivers, we got the TE who was so talented they didn’t throw to him!  Just kidding (sort of).  He has a good name. 

 

Obviously our scouts didn’t think they were studs.