Hogan will be gone?

[Houston's #1 Bills Fan]

17 hours ago, Aussie Joe said:

All they need is Edelman

And, somewhere near MIT, a team is perfecting the human cloning process.....

[Mr. WEO]

4 hours ago, Marv's Neighbor said:

Maybe he owns a motorcycle, like a TR-6?

 

[C.Biscuit97]

15 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

?

Haha, I respect you not giving into your terrible take my friend.  If only Hogan could have had D’Rick Rogers’ natural talent.  

 

Hogan made a great career for himself.  Respect.  He played lacrosse in college too.

13 hours ago, Augie said:

 

The Hogan aspect of this is the least important takeaway. Brady’s arm is declining? Hmmmm....... Do say...... 

Can someone please bump the Pats are done mid season thread again???

[Kirby Jackson]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Haha, I respect you not giving into your terrible take my friend.  If only Hogan could have had D’Rick Rogers’ natural talent.  

Honestly in a lot of ways I feel emboldened by that at the moment. Hogan has been the product of opportunity. He’s just like any other bottom of the roster scrub. He has averaged 2.2 catches per game in his career and less than 30 yards. I firmly believe, given the same opportunity, Rogers would have had a better career.

 

I don’t really want to head down that road again but I will take talent 100% of the time. You can throw a rock and find a Chris Hogan. Robert Foster is WAY better and he was an undrafted rookie. 

[C.Biscuit97]

3 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Honestly in a lot of ways I feel emboldened by that at the moment. Hogan has been the product of opportunity. He’s just like any other bottom of the roster scrub. He has averaged 2.2 catches per game in his career and less than 30 yards. I firmly believe, given the same opportunity, Rogers would have had a better career.

 

I don’t really want to head down that road again but I will take talent 100% of the time. You can throw a rock and find a Chris Hogan. Robert Foster is WAY better and he was an undrafted rookie. 

This is the most wrong you have ever been here but I still respect your wrongness. ?

[Chris66]

1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Honestly in a lot of ways I feel emboldened by that at the moment. Hogan has been the product of opportunity. He’s just like any other bottom of the roster scrub. He has averaged 2.2 catches per game in his career and less than 30 yards. I firmly believe, given the same opportunity, Rogers would have had a better career.

 

I don’t really want to head down that road again but I will take talent 100% of the time. You can throw a rock and find a Chris Hogan. Robert Foster is WAY better and he was an undrafted rookie. 

 

Thats where BB differs from a lot of coaches. He wants football iq over raw talent. He wants smart guys that can do multiple things. Thats what allows him to switch things up on the fly.

 

Look at the roster. I would bet talent wise it probably isnt top 10

[Kirby Jackson]

32 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

This is the most wrong you have ever been here but I still respect your wrongness. ?

Is it though? The guy catches 35 balls a year. He’s firmly an NFL player at this point but he’s no different than a lot of guys (like Foster) that almost never got an opportunity. He was given an opportunity and end up being a functioning back of the depth chart WR. He’s the Trevor Siemian of wide receivers.

32 minutes ago, Chris66 said:

 

Thats where BB differs from a lot of coaches. He wants football iq over raw talent. He wants smart guys that can do multiple things. Thats what allows him to switch things up on the fly.

 

Look at the roster. I would bet talent wise it probably isnt top 10

At the same time, Hogan produced the same in Buffalo as he did in New England. He is a smart guy and a good blocker. He gets no separation (at all) and is just okay because of it. He had 6 targets and as many catches as me on Sunday. He just isn’t any good. He’s Andre Holmes without the ST ability.

[C.Biscuit97]

39 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Is it though? The guy catches 35 balls a year. He’s firmly an NFL player at this point but he’s no different than a lot of guys (like Foster) that almost never got an opportunity. He was given an opportunity and end up being a functioning back of the depth chart WR. He’s the Trevor Siemian of wide receivers.

At the same time, Hogan produced the same in Buffalo as he did in New England. He is a smart guy and a good blocker. He gets no separation (at all) and is just okay because of it. He had 6 targets and as many catches as me on Sunday. He just isn’t any good. He’s Andre Holmes without the ST ability.

He started on multiple SB teams. Come Kirby.  You’re wrong brother.  Like frozen, let it go! ☃️

[Kirby Jackson]

20 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

He started on multiple SB teams. Come Kirby.  You’re wrong brother.  Like frozen, let it go! ☃️

That does nothing for me. My buddy started on multiple Super Bowl teams and he sits in a cubicle now. He’s not good. Hogan’s heroes will take him to the grave. The reality is he an absolute JAG that catches 2 balls a game. He’s a product of opportunity (and intelligence). A lot of guys could have produced his career with his opportunity. 

Edited February 6, 2019 by Kirby Jackson

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

15 hours ago, Augie said:

 

The Hogan aspect of this is the least important takeaway. Brady’s arm is declining? Hmmmm....... Do say...... 

 

Romo said the same during the SB. Aside from floating occasional jump balls outside to gronk I certainly can’t poont to a lot of eveidence to the contrary  

[C.Biscuit97]

20 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

That does nothing for me. My buddy started on multiple Super Bowl teams and he sits in a cubicle now. He’s not good. Hogan’s heroes will take him to the grave. The reality is he an absolute JAG that catches 2 balls a game. He’s a product of opportunity (and intelligence). A lot of guys could have produced his career with his opportunity. 

Only 2,500 more yards and 16 tds and D’Rick will be there!

 

personally, I’d struggle to bash a guy who started for the best team in nfl history for multiple seasons when I wanted him cut for a guy who had 3 career nfl catches.  You know you’re one of my favorite posters but this is kinda petty.  Hogan isn’t a star but he’s a better career than the vast majority of more talented receivers.  I’d love to have his resume. 

[Chicken Boo]

20 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Then he would immediately become a #3 with this crew on the Bills.

 

 

After the Bills draft D.K. he'll be shuffled back to #4.

[Augie]

6 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

Romo said the same during the SB. Aside from floating occasional jump balls outside to gronk I certainly can’t poont to a lot of eveidence to the contrary  

I saw a few Peterman-esque type throws during the year, but wasn’t sure how much I was hoping and praying it was the beginning of the end. The mind does funny things....

 

But the arm does NOT last forever. I remember when Kelly lost it, and it was not pretty there for a while. I can’t wait for it to be obvious for Tommy, and hope it’s early in a season so I can watch the rest of the year. ? 

[C.Biscuit97]

1 minute ago, Augie said:

I saw a few Peterman-esque type throws during the year, but wasn’t sure how much I was hoping and praying it was the beginning of the end. The mind does funny things....

 

But the arm does NOT last forever. I remember when Kelly lost it, and it was not pretty there for a while. I can’t wait for it to be obvious for Tommy, and hope it’s early in a season so I can watch the rest of the year. ? 

Yeah, I know he gets type cast, but Hogan is a pretty good vertical threat.  

[Augie]

5 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Only 2,500 more yards and 16 tds and D’Rick will be there!

 

personally, I’d struggle to bash a guy who started for the best team in nfl history for multiple seasons when I wanted him cut for a guy who had 3 career nfl catches.  You know you’re one of my favorite posters but this is kinda petty.  Hogan isn’t a star but he’s a better career than the vast majority of more talented receivers.  I’d love to have his resume. 

 

I’d rather have his bank account!!!

[dave mcbride]

6 minutes ago, Augie said:

I saw a few Peterman-esque type throws during the year, but wasn’t sure how much I was hoping and praying it was the beginning of the end. The mind does funny things....

 

But the arm does NOT last forever. I remember when Kelly lost it, and it was not pretty there for a while. I can’t wait for it to be obvious for Tommy, and hope it’s early in a season so I can watch the rest of the year. ? 

True, but Brady has never had a serious arm injury. Kelly did - he ruptured the bursa sac in the elbow of his throwing arm 2/3 of the way through the 1992 season, and he was never the same afterward. 

Edited February 6, 2019 by dave mcbride

[Aussie Joe]

2 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

I’d rather have his bank account!!!

 

I don't think Hogan will need to demean himself by "sitting in a cubicle" like some of us other poor saps!!

 

Actually.. what am I saying.. I would love to sit in a cubicle... I have to hot desk in an open plan these days..

[Augie]

5 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

True, but Brady has never had a serious arm injury. Kelly did - he ruptured the bursa sac in the elbow of his throwing arm 2/3 of the way through the 1992 season, and he was never the same afterward. 

 

I have no idea when Brady will start to visibly decline, but I know things fall apart more in your 40’s than they do in your 20’s or 30’s. I learned that the hard way! I also know he’ll get by longer than most because he’s just so smart out there. 

[row_33]

18 hours ago, Baba Booey said:

He wont though , not when you take PED’s during the off-season. 

 

As opppsed to whom?

 

[Success]

I don’t dislike Hogan, but he is one of the most overhyped players of all time.  A very average receiver.  If we picked him up, my most enthusiastic reaction would be a barely perceptible shrug.

[Augie]

1 minute ago, Success said:

I don’t dislike Hogan, but he is one of the most overhyped players of all time.  A very average receiver.  If we picked him up, my most enthusiastic reaction would be a barely perceptible shrug.

 

Is he the best lacrosse player in the NFL since Jim Brown? That’s lofty territory! 

 

?

[Mr. WEO]

19 hours ago, Utah John said:

I don't think so.  Edelman was superb in this year's SB.  Two years ago Hogan was superb.  They all fall off a cliff about now.  

 

Gronk is beat up.  I don't know if he's finished or not.  He can still play but the wear and tear have taken their toll.  If he retires and Hogan is cut, Edelman will not be sufficient.  He can be contained if the defense doesn't need to respect anyone else.  Josh Gordon might not be back.  If the only serious WR threat the Pats have is Edelman, he can be covered.  Of course, Belichick will figure something out as he always does, but the solution will have to be more than Edelman.

 

I like Hogan, but he's not been anywhere near the same caliber as Edelman, ever.  No one could stop him.  Gronk or no Gronk.  Gordon?? He's been gone for weeks and was never a threat.

 

Edelman is NE's only "WR threat"....

[Big Turk]

21 hours ago, Georgia Bill said:

He was targeted 6 times and caught 0.  On the last one you could see Brady look right at him and let out an expletive.  I thought then that he's not going to throw to him again.   His contract is up, and he only caught 35 passes in the regular season.  While he was surprisingly important in last years Super Bowl and made a fantastic one hand grab against KC, I'm still thinking when you disappoint in the Super Bowl, Belichick (and Brady) are going to remember it.   If I recall on most of those targets he was thoroughly blanketed - and the passes weren't all that great, but I suspect he's going to bear the brunt of it and be somewhere else next year.

His last 2 seasons with the Pats were basically the exact same season he had his last year in Buffalo as well...dude is an average NFL receiver that works hard but just isn't that good.

Edited February 6, 2019 by matter2003

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

10 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

2016 with the Pats 58 targets for 38 catches

2017 with the Pats 59 targets for 34 catches

2018 with the Pats 55 targets for 35 catches

 

He's doing what they want. 35 is plenty, or they'd have gotten rid of him before. They don't throw a lot to their outside guys. He isn't making a ton. They might keep him or let him go but it won't be because he suddenly hasn't been doing enough.

 

 

...good work bud......gonna send the stat rats into a frenzy......plenty of rants about what the Pats paid him as well.....just doing his job.....we have this guy who gets paid a big buck while quietly going about his job and never appearing in the "Monday Stat Headlines"......sound familiar??........

[StHustle]

Im sure they'll just replace him with Cole Beasley

[LABILLBACKER]

22 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

I don’t think they will bring him back 

He's done in NE and that was obvious Sunday. At least he got a couple rings out of it to show his grandchildren. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

2 hours ago, Augie said:

I saw a few Peterman-esque type throws during the year, but wasn’t sure how much I was hoping and praying it was the beginning of the end. The mind does funny things....

 

But the arm does NOT last forever. I remember when Kelly lost it, and it was not pretty there for a while. I can’t wait for it to be obvious for Tommy, and hope it’s early in a season so I can watch the rest of the year. ? 

 

If anyone can hide him though... hoodie

[Mango]

19 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said:

Hogan has always been so overrated. But he did not get a single clean catchable ball in the SuperBowl.  Maybe that was him not getting separation, but Brady did him no favors either.  For as awful as Goff was, Brady was not much better.  The seam pass to Gronk was a good ball but even that one hung a little.  He put a few passes in the turf and the INT was a misread.

 

I thought so too, especially the last 3rd of the game or so. 

 

I am willing to give Brady some benefit of the doubt because of his career. But I am hoping it’s a sign that next year he struggles mightily. 

 

I don’t want Brady to ride off into the sunset. I want him to have a terrible season where his body fails him. Where the heir apparent takes the reigns and Brady gets benched because of struggles. We deserve that in Buffalo. If that means he wins the Super Bowl in 2019/20, so be it. But I want that season. 

[YoloinOhio]

20 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

He's done in NE and that was obvious Sunday. At least he got a couple rings out of it to show his grandchildren. 

Maybe he can go back to Miami, full circle from where he started. They just hired the Pats longtime WR coach as OC. 

[Chris66]

I think they resign him on a 2 year 5 mil contract. With a million signing bonus. His blocking skills are worth that.

[BillsfaninChicago]

He had that pretty awesome catch that put us in a position to win again the Vikings back in 2014 but beyond that he was not really all that memorable when he was with us.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Can we get Edelman??

 

Not against Hogan but not for him either. If we sign him great , which means McBeane likes him, if not oh well.

 

 

[Buffalo Barbarian]

On 2/5/2019 at 8:01 PM, ROCBillsBeliever said:

 

There, I fixed it for you. 

 

PEDS do a body good 

 

 

On 2/5/2019 at 11:16 PM, Ethan in Portland said:

Hogan has always been so overrated. But he did not get a single clean catchable ball in the SuperBowl.  Maybe that was him not getting separation, but Brady did him no favors either.  For as awful as Goff was, Brady was not much better.  The seam pass to Gronk was a good ball but even that one hung a little.  He put a few passes in the turf and the INT was a misread.

 

TB 12 needs to hit the weights, he is looking weak and frail. Might be time to eat real food again and get off the anorexia diet.

 

 

[Hebert19]

Who cares.  He was remarkably average here and was the same there.  People expected him to turn into wes Welker but hes just not that good. 

[Kirby Jackson]

18 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Only 2,500 more yards and 16 tds and D’Rick will be there!

 

personally, I’d struggle to bash a guy who started for the best team in nfl history for multiple seasons when I wanted him cut for a guy who had 3 career nfl catches.  You know you’re one of my favorite posters but this is kinda petty.  Hogan isn’t a star but he’s a better career than the vast majority of more talented receivers.  I’d love to have his resume. 

He has a better resume. We are in agreement. My point is that a zillion guys could have produced his resume given his opportunity. He’s a total JAG that is a product of opportunity. 

 

I argued in that thread, and have in a million others that I will ALWAYS take talent at the bottom of my roster. You can cycle through guys until one hits. I’d never protect guys that are going to be 2 catch a game guys. I can find guys on the street like that all day long. I’ll take the guys with the physical skills and hope that they hit. Once in a while you get Jason Peters but normally you get Mike Jasper. I’d take 1 Jason Peters and 5 Mike Jaspers over 6 Andre Holmes’. Hogan’s 35 catches a year aren’t changing my mind on that. I said that 5 years ago (or whenever it was) and still believe that now.

[dave mcbride]

14 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

He has a better resume. We are in agreement. My point is that a zillion guys could have produced his resume given his opportunity. He’s a total JAG that is a product of opportunity. 

 

I argued in that thread, and have in a million others that I will ALWAYS take talent at the bottom of my roster. You can cycle through guys until one hits. I’d never protect guys that are going to be 2 catch a game guys. I can find guys on the street like that all day long. I’ll take the guys with the physical skills and hope that they hit. Once in a while you get Jason Peters but normally you get Mike Jasper. I’d take 1 Jason Peters and 5 Mike Jaspers over 6 Andre Holmes’. Hogan’s 35 catches a year aren’t changing my mind on that. I said that 5 years ago (or whenever it was) and still believe that now.

Kirby: If what you're saying is true, why does he almost always lead the skill players in snaps for that team? I'm not saying he's super-talented - he obviously isn't - but in the NE system an ability to do multiple things and consistently (dare I say it) "do your job" from play to play is regarded as a huge asset. Belichick's basic view is that winning revolves around making fewer mistakes than the opponent, and the league is filled with coaches who are dumber than NE's coaches and players who are just one step above a box of rocks on the dumb scale.  With regard to the Pats, I always go back to Michael Floyd (an idiot as a player): the Pats picked him up late in 2016 because he was super-talented, and then in his first or second game he ran a lazy route where he went to far and rounded it rather than running a crisp, short square in. The ball was picked, Brady was clearly pissed, and I don't think he ever saw another reception opportunity again after that play. 

 

Frankly, I think you overestimate high-physical talent guys vis-a-vis guys like Hogan. Ideally, you want guys who are physically talented AND smart-on-the-field players. There's a reason guys like Tyler Lockett excel despite not being nearly the physical speciman that Floyd was. Brains, discipline, and consistency matter so much in a game where mistake-proneness is the surest way to lose games. (Don't get me wrong; Lockett is definitely talented enough, but he is small.)

Edited February 7, 2019 by dave mcbride

[Kirby Jackson]

1 hour ago, dave mcbride said:

Kirby: If what you're saying is true, why does he almost always lead the skill players in snaps for that team? I'm not saying he's super-talented - he obviously isn't - but in the NE system an ability to do multiple things and consistently (dare I say it) "do your job" from play to play is regarded as a huge asset. Belichick's basic view is that winning revolves around making fewer mistakes than the opponent, and the league is filled with coaches who are dumber than NE's coaches and players who are just one step above a box of rocks on the dumb scale.  With regard to the Pats, I always go back to Michael Floyd (an idiot as a player): the Pats picked him up late in 2016 because he was super-talented, and then in his first or second game he ran a lazy route where he went to far and rounded it rather than running a crisp, short square in. The ball was picked, Brady was clearly pissed, and I don't think he ever saw another reception opportunity again after that play. 

 

Frankly, I think you overestimate high-physical talent guys vis-a-vis guys like Hogan. Ideally, you want guys who are physically talented AND smart-on-the-field players. There's a reason guys like Tyler Lockett excel despite not being nearly the physical speciman that Floyd was. Brains, discipline, and consistency matter so much in a game where mistake-proneness is the surest way to lose games. (Don't get me wrong; Lockett is definitely talented enough, but he is small.)

There is certainly something to be said for Hogan’s intelligence and toughness. That’s why he fits in New England. That doesn’t change the fact that he doesn’t get separation and has been the same guy his whole career. He is an okay, back of the depth chart option. He plays more in New England because their receivers stink (outside of Edelman). That’s why they rolled the dice on Gordon. 

 

Maybe I do overrate physical ability but that’s how you end up with guys like Foster. He was a 5-star that was a part-time player at Alabama. He was part-time because of the other talent. He still has that raw physical ability. He easily could have been nothing but he also could easily, consistently, be 1,000 yard receiver. I’d keep cycling through guys until I found guys with that potential. 

 

In in terms of Lockett he was an All-American at K-State. His dad played in the league (at a high level).  He’s a technician, with a pedigree and production. He was a relatively safe pick for all of those reasons. 

 

Again, I know I’m on a bit of an island here but it’s what I believe. I’d have never signed a guy like Vlad Ducasse because I knew who he was. I would keep throwing rocks at the Wyatt Teller’s of the world in hopes of finding a player. If not you can always get a Vlad off the street. 

[Lurker]

On 2/5/2019 at 9:23 PM, dave mcbride said:

I rewatched the game. He was blanketed three times (the INT play and 2 deep throws where Peters covered him), one pass was tipped and behind him (bad decision to throw into what looked like triple coverage), one was a one hopper across the middle where he was open (bad throw), and one was a drop on a not particularly well thrown ball that would have resulted in precisely zero yards if caught. Brady yelled at himself on the one hopper, not Hogan. To be fair, Brady was pressured on that throw and didn’t really step into it.

 

The narrative that he had some sort of bad game because he screwed up is flawed. He’s a great blocker and played almost every snap. That said, I suspect he’s gone.

 

Don't bring facts into the discussion.   Many of the posters here think the German's are still bombing Pearl Harbor...

[Lurker]

21 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

He’s a product of opportunity (and intelligence).

 

The same could be said for 50% of the Pats roster over the last decade.    IMO, Hogan does exactly what Belichick wants--work hard, prepare hard, be smart and step up when called upon (i.e., the Kansas City game).   

 

He may be JAG, but he's a Belichik guy through and through.   And that usually gets you a ring (or two)...

[Kirby Jackson]

2 hours ago, Lurker said:

 

The same could be said for 50% of the Pats roster over the last decade.    IMO, Hogan does exactly what Belichick wants--work hard, prepare hard, be smart and step up when called upon (i.e., the Kansas City game).   

 

He may be JAG, but he's a Belichik guy through and through.   And that usually gets you a ring (or two)...

100% agree

 

Thats my point. My buddy was the same way and has a ring and a Super Bowl loss. He stuck 6 or 7 years there for that reason. He ended up in Jacksonville and Cleveland after and didn’t stick. Those teams were terrible but wanted cheaper, young guys than a 31 year-Old JAG. The Bills have played in one playoff game in forever. They don’t need JAGs imo. They need to roll the dice and try to hit some home runs. They may have done that with Wallace and Foster. They took talented guys and gave them the chance.

Edited February 7, 2019 by Kirby Jackson