BuffaloHokie13 Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 13 minutes ago, musichunch said: Bledsoe was a top 8-12 QB when we had him. Orton was a solid middle of the road guy. Flutie was magic. Rob Johnson had potential but injuries, sacks, and Flutie looking over his shoulder ruined him. Fitz wasn't bad at all. It was Losman, Edwards, and Manuel more than anything that led to our bad teams. That, and Ralph Wilson. No, he really wasn't. You could try to argue it for 2002, but he was nowhere close in 2003 or 2004. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToGoGo Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 3 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said: No, he really wasn't. You could try to argue it for 2002, but he was nowhere close in 2003 or 2004. Precisely what I'm arguing. He was a very good QB at the tail end of his prime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 Just now, musichunch said: Precisely what I'm arguing. He was a very good QB at the tail end of his prime. Maybe you misread. Bledsoe was absolutely NOT a top 8-12 QB when we had him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 Just now, BuffaloHokie13 said: Maybe you misread. Bledsoe was absolutely NOT a top 8-12 QB when we had him. He had 8 good weeks and then had a losing record, 195 yards a game and 1:1 TD to INT. Bledsoe was pretty much awful after 8 games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 16 minutes ago, LaDexter said: Rob Johnson reminds me of Josh Allen -tons of physical talent, but "happy feet" and a bit off on reads and accuracy Interesting take Lets see how it works out for you cotten 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freddie's Dead Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 21 minutes ago, musichunch said: Bledsoe was a top 8-12 QB when we had him. Orton was a solid middle of the road guy kitty. Flutie was magic. Rob Johnson had potential but injuries, sacks, and Flutie looking over his shoulder ruined him. Fitz wasn't bad at all. It was Losman, Edwards, and Manuel more than anything that led to our bad teams. That, and Ralph Wilson. FTFY. !@#$ Orton, 3rd and kitty mother!@#$er. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaDexter Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 1 minute ago, BuffaloHokie13 said: Bledsoe was absolutely NOT a top 8-12 QB when we had him There is undoubtedly some "guru" site that "ranked" him that high... which is "proof" to those who do not understand the football they actually watch.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 ....well, he did last 21 days....so maybe they sign EJ back......stay tuned......never know with Chuckie.............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 3 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: He had 8 good weeks and then had a losing record, 195 yards a game and 1:1 TD to INT. Bledsoe was pretty much awful after 8 games. But didn’t he have an amazing game with like 560 yards passing? That’s a whole month these days! What an crazy drop off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaDexter Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 Anyone who actually watched Hackenberg at Penn State and gave him something other than an UNDRAFTED GRADE is a completely incompetent football scout... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 1 hour ago, Gugny said: Wow. EJ must be really, really good now! EJ Da Great!!! He also beat out Connor Cook, a former board favorite here last year!!! Dear Lord, Hackenberg must really suck. A guy who looks the part of a franchise qb who never really had the ability. It’s hilarious that people tried to blame James Franklin for his failings. 2 minutes ago, LaDexter said: Anyone who actually watched Hackenberg at Penn State and gave him something other than an UNDRAFTED GRADE is a completely incompetent football scout... They blamed everyone else at PSU for his failings. Thankfully, we won’t draft someone like that!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 Christian Hackenberg has plenty of similarities as a prospect to Josh Allen. Pros - big, strong, mobile, "looks" like a QB, good intangibles, smart Cons - questionable accuracy, poor game film, poor pocket presence Hopefully Allen is a lot better, but it shows how low the floor is for boom or bust prospects like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 12 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ....well, he did last 21 days....so maybe they sign EJ back......stay tuned......never know with Chuckie.............. EJ was already signed back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 I am eternally grateful for each and every draft blunder by our AFCE opponents. This is a biggie! THANK YOU! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said: EJ was already signed back. ...so no wonder Hack became expendable...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 On 5/23/2018 at 12:04 PM, prissythecat said: EJ's stats in Oakland: 2 games 24/43 = 55% completion percentage. 265 yards (132.5 yards/game) . 6.2 Y/A. 1 TD 1 INT. 72.3 QB rating. A continuation of the mediocrity he showed in Buff. Not sure how one can conclude he is a fine backup? Holds clipboard well? Can wear headphones if required? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 Just now, Ridgewaycynic2013 said: Holds clipboard well? Can wear headphones if required? ...and no "bring him in" threads yet either...baffling.... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuddyDark Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, jrober38 said: Christian Hackenberg has plenty of similarities as a prospect to Josh Allen. Pros - big, strong, mobile, "looks" like a QB, good intangibles, smart Cons - questionable accuracy, poor game film, poor pocket presence Hopefully Allen is a lot better, but it shows how low the floor is for boom or bust prospects like this. I thought the knock on Hackenberg was he's dumb? Wasn't that his issue? He could not read defenses. Didn't he have a low wonderlic too? Edited June 12, 2018 by CuddyDark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 1 hour ago, CuddyDark said: I thought the knock on Hackenberg was he's dumb? Wasn't that his issue? He could not read defenses. Didn't he have a low wonderlic too? Unremarkable Wonderlic. 24. Neither high nor WTF? low Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimBob2232 Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 Sad story. Think the kid got ruined when Bill O'Brien left Penn State. He had it all. Good O-Line, Good WRs, Good Coach. Then in 2013 O'Brien left and his WRs (Allen Robinson) and several OL went to the NFL. Sanctions decimated them at OL. Kid got crushed. In 2013 and 2014 he had as many sacks per game as Drew Bledsoe did in 2005 (3.4/game). He physically seemed to be able to take the abuse, but it was clear he was thrown off his game. It threw him off and he never recovered. He is one of the main guys who kept penn state together through the sanctions, and i will never forget him for that...but sadly, i think he is done here. Hope to see him get another chance, but i think time has run out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 4 hours ago, LaDexter said: We have a thread about Christian Sack-of-@@@@enberg.... and EJ Manuel.... and we wonder why we haven't had a good QB since Jim.... “We”???? Get lost, Chefs fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 On 5/22/2018 at 4:35 PM, whatdrought said: Conditional 7th round sounds like they might not get anything for him. Awhile back a poster mentioned that a friend who works in an NFL FO told him that sometimes teams will make a trade like this as a favor. Team A trades a relatively highly drafted player who busted to Team B for a conditional pick. Team B then cuts the player. This is just a way to avoid the headline of the Jets cutting Hackenburg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RocCityRoller Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 On 5/22/2018 at 4:35 PM, whatdrought said: lol. I hope he turns into a hall of famer for the raiders. just like EJ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 8 minutes ago, BarleyNY said: Awhile back a poster mentioned that a friend who works in an NFL FO told him that sometimes teams will make a trade like this as a favor. Team A trades a relatively highly drafted player who busted to Team B for a conditional pick. Team B then cuts the player. This is just a way to avoid the headline of the Jets cutting Hackenburg. Welp then I guess Maccagnan owes McKensie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 8 hours ago, BarleyNY said: Awhile back a poster mentioned that a friend who works in an NFL FO told him that sometimes teams will make a trade like this as a favor. Team A trades a relatively highly drafted player who busted to Team B for a conditional pick. Team B then cuts the player. This is just a way to avoid the headline of the Jets cutting Hackenburg. http://draftanalyst.com/shrine-game-monday-night-notes it was an article by Tony Pauline back in January and he was spot on 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said: http://draftanalyst.com/shrine-game-monday-night-notes it was an article by Tony Pauline back in January and he was spot on Drat! I was sure it was more 'dots to follow' from Dunkirk Dave... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 On 5/22/2018 at 4:35 PM, whatdrought said: lol. I hope he turns into a hall of famer for the raiders. Is that the condition for the Jets to get that 7th? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: Is that the condition for the Jets to get that 7th? Judging from Jets front office (mis)management, they would forget about the compensatory pick by the time they were measuring for the jacket. Edited June 13, 2018 by Ridgewaycynic2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 15 hours ago, CuddyDark said: I thought the knock on Hackenberg was he's dumb? Wasn't that his issue? He could not read defenses. Didn't he have a low wonderlic too? There's little correlation between wonderlic score and reading a defense. Hackenberg's biggest flaw was his horrendous accuracy and poor pocket presence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 11 minutes ago, jrober38 said: There's little correlation between wonderlic score and reading a defense. Hackenberg's biggest flaw was his horrendous accuracy and poor pocket presence. I thought 'pocket presence' was what the creepy guy would try to entice the unknowing into checking his pants for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 I’ll go on record that Hackenberg is the worst QB ever. The combination of hype/draft position/success makes him the worst. Other guys may have failed more but never has a guy that was thought of so highly been so bad. He was talked about as a potential #1 overall pick and he couldn’t dress. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Like A Mofo Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 Just think: Matt Leinart had a more productive career as a Buffalo Bill then Hackenberg did as an Oakland Raider. At Least Leinart completed 2 passes and 3 to the Lions. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 5 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: I’ll go on record that Hackenberg is the worst QB ever. The combination of hype/draft position/success makes him the worst. Other guys may have failed more but never has a guy that was thought of so highly been so bad. He was talked about as a potential #1 overall pick and he couldn’t dress. To be fair he was talked about as a possible number 1 pick two years before he came out. The book was out on him by the time he appeared out of college. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Who Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 Given draft position and expectations, I would guess that Ryan Leaf or Jamarcus Russell would probably rank as a bigger bust than Hackenberg, who certainly cannot play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soda Popinski Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 At least we're not the only team that has made huge mistakes on 2nd round picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 44 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: To be fair he was talked about as a possible number 1 pick two years before he came out. The book was out on him by the time he appeared out of college. Even still someone wasted a 2nd on him. Other guys like Logan Thomas or Jevan Snead that were talked about as potential #1 overall picks plummeted. Jimmy Clausen is probably the best comparison in terms of draft status. Clausen has kicked around and had a few decent games. Hackenberg was picked 51st overall and has as many career attempts as I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuddyDark Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 2 hours ago, jrober38 said: There's little correlation between wonderlic score and reading a defense. Hackenberg's biggest flaw was his horrendous accuracy and poor pocket presence. I thought it was he's dumb. That he held the ball too long because he couldn't see the field. That he took Rob Johnson style sacks. I know he had the accuracy and pocket issues as well but I thought the reason many hated him was because he was dumb as rocks and couldn't read defenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuddyDark Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 (edited) 17 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Unremarkable Wonderlic. 24. Neither high nor WTF? low Better than I thought. I thought it was in the teens. Isn't there an above 25 standard for QBs? Edited June 13, 2018 by CuddyDark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryPinC Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 20 minutes ago, CuddyDark said: I thought it was he's dumb. That he held the ball too long because he couldn't see the field. That he took Rob Johnson style sacks. I know he had the accuracy and pocket issues as well but I thought the reason many hated him was because he was dumb as rocks and couldn't read defenses. I watched him at Penn State and he definitely couldn't read the field and make any kind of complex decision. Glad the Jets thought so highly of him! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 7 minutes ago, CuddyDark said: Better than I thought. I thought it was in the teens. Isn't there an above 25 standard for QBs? There's the "26-27-60" rule (26 on Wonderlic, 27 games started, 60% completion) but I'm not aware of it as a "standard" - just a rule of thumb frequently broken I'm not sure the Wonderlic is a good predictor for QB success though. I thought I heard that Hackenberg's thing was struggling to read defenses on the field and react appropriately. In theory, a guy could have a 40 Wonderlic and not be able to read a defense under time pressure. 2 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: I’ll go on record that Hackenberg is the worst QB ever. The combination of hype/draft position/success makes him the worst. Other guys may have failed more but never has a guy that was thought of so highly been so bad. He was talked about as a potential #1 overall pick and he couldn’t dress. Jabustus Russell says Hi. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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