For all who want to trade up so bad

[SoTier]

42 minutes ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

 

The Rams and Eagles say otherwise.  You get your QB when you can.

 

With that said this is a deep QB class and who knows what can happen.

 

41 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

There are far more examples disproving the “gotta draft a franchise qb high at any cost to win” mantra thanthere is validating it. 

 

the giants are the only team I can think of that can say it worked for them. 

 

The only trade ups for QBs that have worked for more than a single season is the Giants trading for Eli. 

 

Philly might be another team to have success based on their miraculous 2018 season, but there's no denying that they have one of the most talented teams in the NFL AND one of the most innovative coaching staffs.

 

The Rams might be a third successful trade up story but one great season from Goff doesn't make him a great QB.  Lots of QBs had one great season before flaming out, including Josh Freeman, Colin Kaepernick, Brock Osweiler, Nick Foles, and RG III.

 

All the other times teams traded up to grab first round QBs, the trades produced busts.  That includes JP Losman in 2004, Jason Campbell in 2005, Mark Sanchez and Josh Freeman in 2009, and Robert Griffin III in 2012.

 

20 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

Watch Mike White be the best quarterback to come out of this draft. That would be funny. Especially if we stay put at 12 and 22 and keep our extra 2nd and 3rd.

 

  It would be hilarious ... and sadly, entirely possible.  The first round rated QBs in this class seem to be more pretenders than real deals. 

 

As more college teams abandon pro-style offenses, it gets harder to judge just what prospects can do.  That makes first rounders riskier, and 2nd and 3rd rounders more likely to be hits if they're given the opportunity to play.  Derek Carr is easily the best QB from the 2014 QB class.  Mike Glennon is better than either of the 2013 QBs taken before him (Manuel and Geno).  Russell Wilson is easily the best QB from 2012, and even Kirk Cousins has developed into at least as good a QB as Andrew Luck, who may have the most talent but hasn't developed as a pro as well as Wilson or Cousins.

[cd1]

1 hour ago, Bangarang said:

I don’t think the Jets or their fans will care too long about what they gave up if it means they have a legit franchise QB for the next 10-15 years. 

 

Funny thing is... One becomes a "Franchise QB" because someone caught the balls he threw because he did not get sacked or chased all over kingdom come. Having a good running game also helps keep the defense at bay.

 

In other words - no one becomes the "franchise guy" without having a good supporting cast.

Edited March 18, 2018 by cd1

[CuddyDark]

3 minutes ago, terrytate said:

 

Of course they did, but there was not a lot of tape on him.  Good lord are you joking with me.  Darnold has been discussed as the first overall pick all year.  Mayock said in that article that "he may be a first rounder"

And I said Darnold is the only one as talented. He still has bigger issues than all three you listed. He's only a sophomore. He has bad mechanics. He's refused to workout and throw. He's roughly 20? You have to project him more than Wentz as a player and as a person. Will he continue to grow? You can't know any of the answers on Darnold. But again I would take him first overall in this draft. In the draft with Wentz and Goff I'd take Darnold 3rd behind those two.

[stinky finger]

49 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

Watch Mike White be the best quarterback to come out of this draft. That would be funny. Especially if we stay put at 12 and 22 and keep our extra 2nd and 3rd.

Come on. Pick up a newspaper. If we don't take one of the Fab 4 we're doomed.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

2 minutes ago, terrytate said:

you knwo what i mean, RG3 had a lot more wrong with him than just his knee.  

 

Sure. Just referencing that may cite RG3 knee as the Turing pint in an otherwise the promising looking career of a second overall QB. And Wentzs knee is reportedly severely jacked up. 

 

Wentz looked way better than RG ever did. Wasn’t suggesting otherwise. 

 

 

[WideRightRevenge]

Wentz College Stats (remember d2) .. funny as I have been pouring over the same stats from the top 6 in this draft ... but with all the Wentz commentary in this thread ... I went back and grabbed his ... these numbers don't blow you away.  4 years declining completion percentage ... but he obviously panned out ... my point is I was down on Allen for below .. but maybe he just needs to be put in the right system ... ala Wentz with Doug "the QB" whisperer Peterson ... problem is ... not sure Daboll or McD is that person.

 

Josh Allen College Stats

						Passing
Year	School	Conf	Class	Pos	G	Cmp	Att	Pct	Yds	Y/A	AY/A	TD	Int	Rate
2015	Wyoming	MWC	SO	QB	2	4	6	66.7	51	8.5	8.5	0	0	138.1
*2016	Wyoming	MWC	SO	QB	14	209	373	56.0	3203	8.6	8.3	28	15	144.9
*2017	Wyoming	MWC	JR	QB	11	152	270	56.3	1812	6.7	6.9	16	6	127.8

 

 

Carson Wentz College Stats

						Passing
Year	School	Conf	Class	Pos	G	Cmp	Att	Pct	Yds	Y/A	AY/A	TD	Int	Rate
2012	North Dakota State	MVC	FR	QB	8	12	16	75.0	144	9.0	11.5	2	0	191.9
2013	North Dakota State	MVC	SO	QB	11	22	30	73.3	209	7.0	7.6	1	0	142.9
2014	North Dakota State	MVC	JR	QB	16	228	358	63.7	3111	8.7	8.8	25	10	154.1
2015	North Dakota State	MVC	SR	QB	7	130	208	62.5	1651	7.9	8.7	17	4	152.3

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

8 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Agree except for Jackson better than Vick.

 

I don't think they are even close.

 

Which way? 

[Solicurance]

Stack the OL and give AJ some time in the pocket for him and it will create bigger holes for McCoy... enough said... AJ could prove himself to be a great QB...

[Mr. WEO]

8 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

Can’t. It’s to be determined. His contribution to the eagles success is entirely debatable and the impact of the picks they surrendered won’t be determined until they sustain success with him underpinning it. 

 

But at least he bolstered your probowl percentage with a sympathy nod despite being on crutches ?

 

That's an entirely unique take.  Who else besides you is debating that premise?

 

5 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

Sure. Just referencing that may cite RG3 knee as the Turing pint in an otherwise the promising looking career of a second overall QB. And Wentzs knee is reportedly severely jacked up. 

 

Wentz looked way better than RG ever did. Wasn’t suggesting otherwise. 

 

 

 

RG3 recovered from his injury.  HE was just not a good NFL QB.  He and Wentz share nothing in common.

[Bangarang]

13 minutes ago, inaugural balls said:

Where would he be acceptable?

 

2nd round

10 minutes ago, cd1 said:

 

Funny thing is... One becomes a "Franchise QB" because someone caught the balls he threw because he did not get sacked or chased all over kingdom come. Having a good running game also helps keep the defense at bay.

 

In other words - no one becomes the "franchise guy" without having a good supporting cast.

 

Finding the guy who can turn into a franchise guy is a lot harder than finding quality o lineman and good receivers. If you have the chance to get one then I’m fine with it

[terrytate]

15 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

Sure. Just referencing that may cite RG3 knee as the Turing pint in an otherwise the promising looking career of a second overall QB. And Wentzs knee is reportedly severely jacked up. 

 

Wentz looked way better than RG ever did. Wasn’t suggesting otherwise. 

 

 

 

That rg3 rookie year was all smoke and mirros.  Shanahan was unbelievable that year. 

[Victory Formation]

1 hour ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

 

The Rams and Eagles say otherwise.  You get your QB when you can.

 

With that said this is a deep QB class and who knows what can happen.

The Bills didn't beat up on the Dolphins in the 90s because Kelly was a better QB than Marino. We beat up on the Dolphins because we had the superior team.

 

We have the opportunity to build a powerhouse. We could walk away with an elite LB, DT, C and add a speedy WR plus depth at OT and CB.

 

The Jets will have the better QB for sure, but we will have the better team 10x over. 

[WideRightRevenge]

1 minute ago, NewDayBills said:

The Bills didn't beat up on the Dolphins in the 90s because Kelly was a better QB than Marino. We beat up on the Dolphins because we had the superior team.

 

We have the opportunity to build a powerhouse. We could walk away with an elite LB, DT, C and add a speedy WR plus depth at OT and CB.

 

The Jets will have the better QB for sure, but we will have the better team 10x over. 

 

Great Point

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

9 minutes ago, NewDayBills said:

The Bills didn't beat up on the Dolphins in the 90s because Kelly was a better QB than Marino. We beat up on the Dolphins because we had the superior team.

 

We have the opportunity to build a powerhouse. We could walk away with an elite LB, DT, C and add a speedy WR plus depth at OT and CB.

 

The Jets will have the better prospect at QB for sure, but we will have the better team 10x over. 

Love this point with one minor tweak.

 

if Rosen get concussed out in year 2 week 5 because of his Bledsoe’s like mobility and concussion history, well I like our guy over a 54 year old McCown 

24 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

That's an entirely unique take.  Who else besides you is debating that premise?

 

Nick Foles and the Super Bowl mvp selection committee.

 

Am I still harping on results as if that’s what counts?  

Edited March 18, 2018 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

1 hour ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

 

The Rams and Eagles say otherwise.  You get your QB when you can.

 

With that said this is a deep QB class and who knows what can happen.

Their is no Wentz or Goff in this draft, the only QB worth trading up for is Mayfield. After rewatching a ton of college football games I think the two QB's that end up being good starters will be Baker Mayfield and Luke Falk.

[SoTier]

34 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

You didn't answer my question.  You keep restating the result we all saw.

 

Foles isn't a guy off the street by the way.  He had success with a very different Eagles teams several years ago.

 

He had ONE.GOOD.YEAR.  Chip Kelly came into the NFL in 2013 and was supposed to be the best thing since white bread, and Nick Foles came out of nowhere as a sophomore to be his poster boy ... until the DCs around the league figured out what Kelly was doing and how to stop it.  Foles was lousy in Philly in 2014 as Kelly's smoke and mirrors game was stifled.  He was traded to St Louis as part of the Sam Bradford trade and sucked.  He turned up in KC in 2016 as a backup, and signed with Philly in 2017 as a backup.

 

Foles has only had success in a certain kind of offense, one that features lots of read/pass options.  In order for him to have success with Philly after Wentz went down, the coaches had to install and use plays that suited his style.  That suggests he's probably unlikely to have long term success in the NFL as a starter.  He is what he is: a good backup QB.

 

30 minutes ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

There are so many ways to fill out a roster and we have so many dead drafts where we have nothing to show. I really can’t understand why people over value draft picks the way they do. It wouldn’t take our whole draft to move to 1, but just to show the extreme. If we traded our ENTIRE draft for  #1 and took Darnold, we would still be fine. And better off today then we were at any point in recent memory. The QB is just a different thing all together. The Jets will be fine and we will look terrible if they get one of the 2 very good QBs. We have plenty of picks. Trading up was the only way to go IMO. If we arent going up, why were we so quick to move all those good players last year? We did that to get the best qb. Not the best guy left after the good ones are gone.

 

What IF the QB they choose is a bust?  The last time the Jests traded up into the top 5 to grab a "franchise QB" they picked Mark "Butt Fumble" Sanchez on whom they wasted about 6 years before they realized the dud they had.  The Bills wasted 4 years on JP Losman and the opportunity to draft Aaron Rodgers while the Packers drafting at #24 the next year had him fall into their laps.  What did Washington's trade up for RG III net them after 2012?  Zilch.  Good thing they spent that fourth rounder on a backup QB named Cousins or they'd really be up the creek.

 

It's less about where a team drafts than about the team's staff being smart enough to "know when to hold 'em and when to fold 'em".

 

20 minutes ago, Putin said:

He was a going for MVP before getting hurt , 

and BTW I’m pretty sure we’d give up 3 maybe even more 1st round picks for another  Carson Wentz 

 

Except, a team has to know if they're actually getting Carson Wentz 2.0 or just Mark Sanchez 2.0 in a Carson Wentz mask.

 

15 minutes ago, inaugural balls said:

Where would he be acceptable?

 

Rudolph in the 2nd round seems about right.

 

 

 

[The_Dude]

If they don’t credibly fix the QB position this year I’m done. I’m done. I’m 33 and I’m done wasting my time on this ****. 

[Success]

After seeing what we need to trade to get to 2, I’m praying we don’t.

 

2 months ago, many felt that Darnold should absolutely stay another year.  Rosen and Mayfield have their own question marks.  There is no Luck or Manning in this draft.

 

Stay put, draft Jackson if he’s there, and build a team.

[SoTier]

14 minutes ago, NewDayBills said:

The Bills didn't beat up on the Dolphins in the 90s because Kelly was a better QB than Marino. We beat up on the Dolphins because we had the superior team.

 

We have the opportunity to build a powerhouse. We could walk away with an elite LB, DT, C and add a speedy WR plus depth at OT and CB.

 

The Jets will have the better QB for sure, but we will have the better team 10x over. 

 

The Jests MIGHT have the better QB.  Historically, most draft classes have yielded 1 quality starting QB with occasional classes yielding a second decent starter.  Most starting QBs, even supposed franchise QBs, resemble Jay Cutler, Andy Dalton, Joe Flacco or Ryan Tannehill more than they do future HOFers like Brees, Rivers or Rodgers. 

 

Obviously, a lot of Bills fans, especially the advocates of trading up at any cost, have failed to consider that about half of all first round QB prospects are more likely to bust than become franchise QBs by any reasonable definition. 

10 minutes ago, The_Dude said:

If they don’t credibly fix the QB position this year I’m done. I’m done. I’m 33 and I’m done wasting my time on this ****. 

 

Adios.  Arrividerci.  Au revoir.  Sayonara.

[Victory Formation]

19 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

It's less about where a team drafts than about the team's staff being smart enough to "know when to hold 'em and when to fold 'em".

This x10.

 

Don't draft a QB just to draft one, if the top 4 are gone by 12, move on and draft Vita Vea or Roquan Smith imo.

[Reed83HOF]

2 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

Rams exited the playoffs immediately and the eagles QB  was sidelined since 12/11. 

 

Try again 

This is a very poor take

[Young34]

2 hours ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

 

The Rams and Eagles say otherwise.  You get your QB when you can.

 

With that said this is a deep QB class and who knows what can happen.

You literally just cherry picked two instances. Statistics, on the other hand, show that there are way more misses than hits in the 1st round for QB's.

 

"For every successful first-round quarterback pick in recent years, there are almost twice as many failures. A conclusion can be drawn with 19 of the first-round picks. Only seven, or 36.8 percent, arguably could be considered a success."

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/agents-take-recent-draft-history-shows-first-round-qbs-are-more-likely-to-fail/

[Boatdrinks]

The Jets overpaid , but it doesn't mean they will have a terrible roster. Their FO and coach are on thin ice, it's not surprising they did everything in their power to get a QB. They were trading from a stronger position than their division rival Bills, and the Bills intent to move up was the worst kept secret in the NFL. It was either pay the ransom or the Bills would jump ahead of them at 3, leaving the Jets high and dry. Their FO had no choice, theyd be fired if they don't get a QB just as easily as if the pick doesn't pan out. The Bills don't have a high pick to offer in a pickswap situation, so another team beating them out was always a huge possibility. They have other options, but the cost just went up more. IF they can find a willing trade partner, and that's a big if right now. It's not as easy as just throwing a few more picks on the pile. Teams don't like risk, so a move down of less draft spots will always be more attractive to them. 

[CuddyDark]

1 hour ago, WideRightRevenge said:

Wentz College Stats (remember d2) .. funny as I have been pouring over the same stats from the top 6 in this draft ... but with all the Wentz commentary in this thread ... I went back and grabbed his ... these numbers don't blow you away.  4 years declining completion percentage ... but he obviously panned out ... my point is I was down on Allen for below .. but maybe he just needs to be put in the right system ... ala Wentz with Doug "the QB" whisperer Peterson ... problem is ... not sure Daboll or McD is that person.

 

Josh Allen College Stats

						Passing
Year	School	Conf	Class	Pos	G	Cmp	Att	Pct	Yds	Y/A	AY/A	TD	Int	Rate
2015	Wyoming	MWC	SO	QB	2	4	6	66.7	51	8.5	8.5	0	0	138.1
*2016	Wyoming	MWC	SO	QB	14	209	373	56.0	3203	8.6	8.3	28	15	144.9
*2017	Wyoming	MWC	JR	QB	11	152	270	56.3	1812	6.7	6.9	16	6	127.8

 

 

Carson Wentz College Stats

						Passing
Year	School	Conf	Class	Pos	G	Cmp	Att	Pct	Yds	Y/A	AY/A	TD	Int	Rate
2012	North Dakota State	MVC	FR	QB	8	12	16	75.0	144	9.0	11.5	2	0	191.9
2013	North Dakota State	MVC	SO	QB	11	22	30	73.3	209	7.0	7.6	1	0	142.9
2014	North Dakota State	MVC	JR	QB	16	228	358	63.7	3111	8.7	8.8	25	10	154.1
2015	North Dakota State	MVC	SR	QB	7	130	208	62.5	1651	7.9	8.7	17	4	152.3

QBs have a decline in completion percentage as they get more attempts. The problem with Allen is even with less attempts he has a horrible completion percentage.  

[Pete]

Let's examine what the Jets have done-

2nd round pick Hackenberg 16

4th round pick Petty 15

2nd round pick Geno 13

1st pick 2009 Sanchez 5th overall

and now they just traded three #2s to move up 3 spots

 

Let the Jets keep being fools.  That is one less team to worry about.  Stack this roster with the picks, and let the QB come to you. 

 

And once again to hammer home my point about BPA and not getting robbed trading up- these are the QB'S drafted in the 1st round the past decade.  With a few exceptions, what a bunch of ****!

2016:

1. Jared Goff, California, Rams

2. Carson Wentz, North Dakota State, Eagles

26. Paxton Lynch, Memphis, Broncos

___

2015:

1. Jameis Winston, Florida State, Buccaneers

2. Marcus Mariota, Oregon, Titans

___

2014:

3. Blake Bortles, Central Florida, Jaguars

22. Johnny Manziel, Texas A&M, Browns

32. Teddy Bridgewater, Louisville, Vikings

___

2013:

16. EJ Manuel, Florida State, Bills

___

2012:

1. Andrew Luck, Stanford, Colts

2. Robert Griffin III, Baylor, Redskins

8. Ryan Tannehill, Texas A&M, Dolphins

22. Brandon Weeden, Oklahoma State, Browns

___

2011:

1. Cam Newton, Auburn, Panthers

8. Jake Locker, Washington, Titans

10. Blaine Gabbert, Missouri, Jaguars

12. Christian Ponder, Florida State, Vikings

___

2010:

1. Sam Bradford, Oklahoma, Rams

25. Tim Tebow, Florida, Broncos

___

2009:

1. Matthew Stafford, Georgia, Lions

5. Mark Sanchez, USC, Jets

17. Josh Freeman, Kansas State, Buccaneers

___

2008:

3. Matt Ryan, Boston College, Falcons

18. Joe Flacco, Delaware, Ravens

___

2007:

1. JaMarcus Russell, LSU, Raiders

22. Brady Quinn, Notre Dame, Browns

___

2006:

3. Vince Young, Texas, Titans

10. Matt Leinart, USC, Cardinals

11. Jay Cutler, Vanderbilt, Broncos

___

2005:

1. Alex Smith, Utah, 49ers

24. Aaron Rodgers, Cal, Packers

25. Jason Campbell, Auburn, Redskins

___

2004:

1. Eli Manning, Mississippi, Chargers

4. Philip Rivers, North Carolina State, Giants

11. Ben Roethlisberger, Miami (Ohio), Steelers

22. J.P. Losman, Tulane, Bills

___

2003:

1. Carson Palmer, USC, Bengals

7. Byron Leftwich, Marshall, Jaguars

19. Kyle Boller, Cal, Ravens

22. Rex Grossman, Florida, Bears

___

2002:

1. David Carr, Fresno State, Texans

3. Joey Harrington, Oregon, Lions

32. Patrick Ramsey, Tulane, Redskins

___

2001:

1. Michael Vick, Virginia Tech, Falcons

___

2000:

18. Chad Pennington, Marshall, Jets

Edited March 18, 2018 by Pete

[RochesterRob]

2 hours ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

 

The Rams and Eagles say otherwise.  You get your QB when you can.

 

With that said this is a deep QB class and who knows what can happen.

  There was some team building in each case with the Eagles far along when they did make their move.  We have a lot of building yet to do.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

3 hours ago, RPbillsfan said:

The majority of posters seem to want to employ a strategy of trading most of our picks for the right to draft "a franchise QB".

 

The Jets just made a move that almost ensures additional years of losing football with a young QB playing short handed with a weak roster and all the expectations in the world.  No offensive weapons to use, poor offensive line, holes all over the front 7 on defense.

 

The Bills are now in a position to do the opposite, draft to fill the roster with young cost-controlled players to add to the talent base they have.

 

Six picks in the first 96. Chance to get QB, LB, CB, DT, OL and WR.  Why would you choose the pathway the Jets are taking which pretty much ensures competition with the Dolphins for last place in the AFC East.

 

Love to read your thoughts on this.

 

 

...quite elementary my dear Watson.....pick you QB that comes with a warranty, money back guarantee and full refund of ALL draft capital expended to get 'em if he busts.....oh wait.....

[billsredneck1]

1 hour ago, WideRightRevenge said:

 

Dead nuts on ... agree with this analogy in terms of the QB depth .. don't mortgage the farm

i agree also although i'd rather put rudolph a bit ahead of tannehil because he had a ton more college experience and the johnny unitas award.

[Paul Costa]

3 hours ago, RPbillsfan said:

The majority of posters seem to want to employ a strategy of trading most of our picks for the right to draft "a franchise QB".

 

The Jets just made a move that almost ensures additional years of losing football with a young QB playing short handed with a weak roster and all the expectations in the world.  No offensive weapons to use, poor offensive line, holes all over the front 7 on defense.

 

The Bills are now in a position to do the opposite, draft to fill the roster with young cost-controlled players to add to the talent base they have.

 

Six picks in the first 96. Chance to get QB, LB, CB, DT, OL and WR.  Why would you choose the pathway the Jets are taking which pretty much ensures competition with the Dolphins for last place in the AFC East.

 

Love to read your thoughts on this.

This?

[mannc]

3 hours ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

 

The Rams and Eagles say otherwise.  You get your QB when you can.

 

With that said this is a deep QB class and who knows what can happen.

The Eagles were able to turn around and get back the picks they gave up by trading Bradford to the desperate Vikings.  Not a good comparison.  Plus, Foles won them the Lombardi, not Wentz.  

 

And the Rams really haven’t done much, despite having a very talented roster. 

[RochesterRob]

1 hour ago, NewDayBills said:

The Bills didn't beat up on the Dolphins in the 90s because Kelly was a better QB than Marino. We beat up on the Dolphins because we had the superior team.

 

We have the opportunity to build a powerhouse. We could walk away with an elite LB, DT, C and add a speedy WR plus depth at OT and CB.

 

The Jets will have the better QB for sure, but we will have the better team 10x over. 

  Spot on.  I can't think of a Dolphins back that was on par with Kenny Davis never mind Thurman Thomas during those times.

2 hours ago, Wayne Arnold said:

Watch Mike White be the best quarterback to come out of this draft. That would be funny. Especially if we stay put at 12 and 22 and keep our extra 2nd and 3rd.

  I would not mind White as a guy that will sit the coming season versus expecting to start at some point in September.

[Pete]

Good QB's are found throughout the draft.  To think that a QB will be better because we drafted him in a higher draft slot.  That is akin to thinking  "this costs more, so it must be better"

And when we are winning by 4 in a playoff game, and it is 4th and 2 for opponent with 1:00 left- it sure would be nice to have a stud LB in there to help preserve victory.  Allen/Darnold/Rosen/Mayfield can't help you there

[RochesterRob]

3 hours ago, Bangarang said:

I don’t think the Jets or their fans will care too long about what they gave up if it means they have a legit franchise QB for the next 10-15 years. 

  In the modern era it is fairly uncommon to hang onto a QB for 10-15 years.  I don't think that even if a QB's health and production  never waivers that most teams can expect to hold a QB that long.  Kelly stayed because the area grew on him but we can not count on that happening on a regular basis.  There are too many lures such as big market teams, teams that may be more SB ready, preferred climate and weather, etc.. to know we have a guy locked in that long. I hate to say it as a person from WNY but the most likely scenario is we keep the guy for his rookie deal and maybe a franchise tag.  After that it is just good luck versus something to be expected.

[JohnnyK]

3 hours ago, N.Y. Orangeman said:

 

This really isn't that difficult...

 

The top 3 QBs this year are not in the can't miss class, its not like other years IMO!

Look at 1983 and how the QBs ended up that is how this year seems to me! it will be a great draft and exciting year of 20/20 hind-sight and talked about for years to come

lets hope the Bills get it right

 

[DrDawkinstein]

3 hours ago, RPbillsfan said:

The majority of posters seem to want to employ a strategy of trading most of our picks for the right to draft "a franchise QB".

 

The Jets just made a move that almost ensures additional years of losing football with a young QB playing short handed with a weak roster and all the expectations in the world.  No offensive weapons to use, poor offensive line, holes all over the front 7 on defense.

 

The Bills are now in a position to do the opposite, draft to fill the roster with young cost-controlled players to add to the talent base they have.

 

Six picks in the first 96. Chance to get QB, LB, CB, DT, OL and WR.  Why would you choose the pathway the Jets are taking which pretty much ensures competition with the Dolphins for last place in the AFC East.

 

Love to read your thoughts on this.

 

Very simple:  You could have all-pros at all the bolded positions, and it still doesnt matter if you dont have a Franchise QB.

 

This is exactly what the Bills have proven over the last 20 year experiment.

 

 

14 minutes ago, RochesterRob said:

  In the modern era it is fairly uncommon to hang onto a QB for 10-15 years.  I don't think that even if a QB's health and production  never waivers that most teams can expect to hold a QB that long.  Kelly stayed because the area grew on him but we can not count on that happening on a regular basis.  There are too many lures such as big market teams, teams that may be more SB ready, preferred climate and weather, etc.. to know we have a guy locked in that long. I hate to say it as a person from WNY but the most likely scenario is we keep the guy for his rookie deal and maybe a franchise tag.  After that it is just good luck versus something to be expected.

 

Matt Ryan, Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Philip Rivers, Ben Rothlisberger, Eli Manning...

 

All are the Franchise QBs from 10-15 years ago. All are with their long time teams. Only Brees moved, ONCE, and that was the team decision.

 

All the more recent guys like Newton, Wilson, Wentz, etc will all re-sign with their teams.

 

The only one to really leave has been Cousins, and that is because the Redskins FO will screw up anything.

 

When you have a Franchise QB, they stay on the roster.

Edited March 18, 2018 by DrDawkinstein

[Lurker]

4 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Very simple:  You could have all-pros at all the bolded positions, and it still doesnt matter if you dont have a Franchise QB.

 

This is exactly what the Bills have proven over the last 20 year experiment.

 

And yet, name a team with a great QB and mediocre supporting cast that has done anything either.   Manning got only one ring in Indy because he had a meh supporting cast and meh coaching.    You could almost say his career was wasted .   And none of the QBs in this class are anywhere near his talent...

[Pete]

13 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Very simple:  You could have all-pros at all the bolded positions, and it still doesnt matter if you dont have a Franchise QB.

 

 

Trent Dilfer, Doug Williams, Jim McMahon, Jeff Hostleter, Brad Johnson all strongly disagree

[BillsFan4]

As I said in another thread, whether we trade up or not Beane and mcdermott have us in a great position to take a gamble on a QB high in the draft this year. 

 

Having two 1sts, 2nds, 3rds and 5ths makes it a lot easier to take a shot on a QB in the 1st. 

 

 

Instead of trading up, What if the plan plan is to draft 2 QBs this year to increase their odds of hitting on one? 

 

This is comsidered a very deep QB draft. Maybe they take 1 in the 1st, and another in the 3rd? (or something like that).

 

Just a thought... (I doubt it though, since I think they still like Peterman a lot and it would be hard to develop 3 young QBs all at once). 

[Reed83HOF]

1 hour ago, Pete said:

Let's examine what the Jets have done-

2nd round pick Hackenberg 16

4th round pick Petty 15

2nd round pick Geno 13

1st pick 2009 Sanchez 5th overall

and now they just traded three #2s to move up 3 spots

 

Let the Jets keep being fools.  That is one less team to worry about.  Stack this roster with the picks, and let the QB come to you. 

 

And once again to hammer home my point about BPA and not getting robbed trading up- these are the QB'S drafted in the 1st round the past decade.  With a few exceptions, what a bunch of ****!

2016:

1. Jared Goff, California, Rams

2. Carson Wentz, North Dakota State, Eagles

26. Paxton Lynch, Memphis, Broncos

___

2015:

1. Jameis Winston, Florida State, Buccaneers

2. Marcus Mariota, Oregon, Titans

___

2014:

3. Blake Bortles, Central Florida, Jaguars

22. Johnny Manziel, Texas A&M, Browns

32. Teddy Bridgewater, Louisville, Vikings

___

2013:

16. EJ Manuel, Florida State, Bills

___

2012:

1. Andrew Luck, Stanford, Colts

2. Robert Griffin III, Baylor, Redskins

8. Ryan Tannehill, Texas A&M, Dolphins

22. Brandon Weeden, Oklahoma State, Browns

___

2011:

1. Cam Newton, Auburn, Panthers

8. Jake Locker, Washington, Titans

10. Blaine Gabbert, Missouri, Jaguars

12. Christian Ponder, Florida State, Vikings

___

2010:

1. Sam Bradford, Oklahoma, Rams

25. Tim Tebow, Florida, Broncos

___

2009:

1. Matthew Stafford, Georgia, Lions

5. Mark Sanchez, USC, Jets

17. Josh Freeman, Kansas State, Buccaneers

___

2008:

3. Matt Ryan, Boston College, Falcons

18. Joe Flacco, Delaware, Ravens

___

2007:

1. JaMarcus Russell, LSU, Raiders

22. Brady Quinn, Notre Dame, Browns

___

2006:

3. Vince Young, Texas, Titans

10. Matt Leinart, USC, Cardinals

11. Jay Cutler, Vanderbilt, Broncos

___

2005:

1. Alex Smith, Utah, 49ers

24. Aaron Rodgers, Cal, Packers

25. Jason Campbell, Auburn, Redskins

___

2004:

1. Eli Manning, Mississippi, Chargers

4. Philip Rivers, North Carolina State, Giants

11. Ben Roethlisberger, Miami (Ohio), Steelers

22. J.P. Losman, Tulane, Bills

___

2003:

1. Carson Palmer, USC, Bengals

7. Byron Leftwich, Marshall, Jaguars

19. Kyle Boller, Cal, Ravens

22. Rex Grossman, Florida, Bears

___

2002:

1. David Carr, Fresno State, Texans

3. Joey Harrington, Oregon, Lions

32. Patrick Ramsey, Tulane, Redskins

___

2001:

1. Michael Vick, Virginia Tech, Falcons

___

2000:

18. Chad Pennington, Marshall, Jets

So we better get lucky in the top 5 picks or so or we are screwed....After the top couple, the rest are hot garbage

Edited March 18, 2018 by Reed83HOF

[Pete]

8 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

So we better get lucky in the top 5 picks or so or we are screwed....After the top couple, the rest are hot garbage

Or draft Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Kirk Cousins, Dak Prescott, Russel Wilson, Nick Foles, Jimmy Garroppolo, etc outside round 1