John from Riverside Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Why do people keep comparing everything to Sammy..... Sammy has not shown the ability to stay healthy and was going to want STUPID money. He was not resigning with us. Lets not shy away from every quality wideout because of what happened with Sammy Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonborn10 Posted September 13, 2017 Author Share Posted September 13, 2017 OP YOUknow Luck didn't play last week. ???? Yes that is my point and the premise why they are in rebuild mode. Their season is lost. He is nowhere near coming back to play. He hasn't even practiced. Add the fact their defense is terrible, their o-line is terrible, and their HC is terrible. That leave Luck and a WR. The WR can be moved for picks to rebuild around Luck If you are asking me would I rather have TY Hilton at $11m a year with 3 years left on his contract with his history of production than Sammy with one year left, with not the same level of production at what surely is going to command $15m + All day every day. I would trade a 2nd and a 4th for him Yes that is my thought as well Trading Sammy does not equate into they do not want talented even high priced WRs. They moved Sammy because he was never going to sign here long term. They got value for a guy that was going to be gone. Beane said no big trades / FA Acquisitions, build through draft so no. When did he say that? No GM can solely build through the draft. That is a moronic statement if he said it. They just added 30 new players to the roster and only 7 came via the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Sure, if you can go 3-1, I would entertain that. But I think they're trying to get away from the strategy of bolting on players as a quick fix. And being able to manage the cap effectively for the next 2-3 years. I don't see the Bills going after any FA at this time. They are on the hook to pay soon for Preston Brown, Starting QB (Whoever that is), McCoy or his replacement, Kyle Williams (or his replacement) that can be signficant cap hits. They will roll the dice with their own draft picks which will be cheaper and cap friendly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsGospel Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Luck has been taking a beating and now the Colts will just give away his #1 option? Please put the controllers down and eject the Madden game, it's not happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cage Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 They have no interest in adding receivers. Not high priced elite ones. This is a running team. Assets will be invested into the run game not the passing game. I have no idea if the Colts would trade Hilton, but he would be great to get under current contract. Run sets up the pass. In the first half of Jets game we saw that work beautifully. As the running game worked, play action became deadly to Clay/Jones/Matthews, all 20+yd pass plays. Hilton would fit w/ Tyrod beautifully. Hilton + Gaines + Matthews + 3rd for Sammy + Darby... I think most us would be happy about that deal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 His cap hits are $10m, $13m, $15m, $14.5m. I really do not see the Bills going that road. It doesn't fit the Carolina cash distribution model to pay wide receivers. If they are looking for a speedster it will be a cheap role player like the deal they took Ginn back to Carolina on in 2015 $2.5m per year for 2 years. I like TY and if you get 3 years then sure I would do it but I don't like giving up our 2018 2nd round pick. We might need all that ammunition to get up for a Quarterback. I might offer one of our 2018 3rd rounders, plus a 2019 2nd rounder and whatever that 2019 pick we got for Ragland was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 (edited) For this season the Bills are ok at WR . Adding a high priced one at this stage of rebuild would strain cap space . Find out this season which positions are glaring needs to fill in this system. I want to see how the Bills do in the next draft . Zay Jones 6'2 4.45 should progress Edited September 13, 2017 by ALF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 TY Hilton is coming off a 91 catch and league leading 1448 yard season. The Bills are going to use an early pick on WR next year. They are not good there and Matthews is a FA. They may be adding 2. If you can get a surefire #1 for a 2nd you do it all day long. With that being said I don't see the Colts trading him for any reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 TY Hilton is coming off a 91 catch and league leading 1448 yard season. The Bills are going to use an early pick on WR next year. They are not good there and Matthews is a FA. They may be adding 2. If you can get a surefire #1 for a 2nd you do it all day long. With that being said I don't see the Colts trading him for any reason. I agree with the principle but the priority with that ammunition (especially in the 1st and 2nd round) in 2018 is Quarterback. I don't want to give any of it up. If they'd take a 2019 2nd something in the 3rd or later in 2018 and maybe a low round pick elsewhere then you do it. I doubt they take that and as I say I doubt the Bills offer it. I don't think that is the McDermott / Beane plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 I agree with the principle but the priority with that ammunition (especially in the 1st and 2nd round) in 2018 is Quarterback. I don't want to give any of it up. If they'd take a 2019 2nd something in the 3rd or later in 2018 and maybe a low round pick elsewhere then you do it. I doubt they take that and as I say I doubt the Bills offer it. I don't think that is the McDermott / Beane plan. I largely agree pretty much if everything you said here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 I agree with the principle but the priority with that ammunition (especially in the 1st and 2nd round) in 2018 is Quarterback. I don't want to give any of it up. If they'd take a 2019 2nd something in the 3rd or later in 2018 and maybe a low round pick elsewhere then you do it. I doubt they take that and as I say I doubt the Bills offer it. I don't think that is the McDermott / Beane plan. Do you see the Bills using both 1sts and both 2nds on a QB next year? I don't. They may move up using some of that but with the apparent depth of the class so far I don't see them selling their soul to move up. They still probably have a top 10 pick. WR may be their next biggest need. They have no depth and lack talent. I have no idea why the Colts would be interested but that would be a steal. Brandin Cooks got a late first and has never accomplished what TY has. You wouldn't get him for a 2nd but you'd do it in an instant. While QB is the focus you still need to fill out your roster. DB seems to be the first area that they tackled. So far so good on that front. Outside of Shady they remade the backfield as well. The jury is out there. They changed the entire receiving corp and that doesn't look good at the moment. It's early but the Bills will have a bunch of needs going into next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webster Guy Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Seemed to me our guys were getting open. If we need anything it's help on the right side of the Oline Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 (edited) Seemed to me our guys were getting open. If we need anything it's help on the right side of the OlineAccording to those that watched the All-22 they weren't getting open. I didn't go back and watch it but KTD did for one. No spearation and a lack of explosion isn't a good combination. With that being said I think Zay will get better. Edited September 13, 2017 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Do you see the Bills using both 1sts and both 2nds on a QB next year? I don't. They may move up using some of that but with the apparent depth of the class so far I don't see them selling their soul to move up. They still probably have a top 10 pick. Maybe not. But I don't want to be sitting in another 10 years thinking "if we had just given up a little bit more..." in the way we do with the aborted Big Ben trade back in 2004. Belt and braces, take no chances, keep your ammunition for the Quarterback in the 2018 draft. Once you have secured him then whether you want to trade remaining assets for proven players or trade down and get more draft picks or trade up to take the top WR on your board.... I can take any of those arguments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Colts are probably only a few weeks away from shutting down Luck for the year. Pagano should not have been brought back and the Colts will be in full rebuild mode by week 6 if they are not there already. TY Hilton has elite speed. He is under contract for three more years. $11 million in salary next year, 8 million this year. Would you trade a second in 2018 for TY this year to improve the WR group? A third and Mills, when Henderson is ready to come off suspension?? I wouldn't make a move yet but if they start 3-1 with no credible deep threat emerging, I would be tempted... I can see the Bills doing this ... and their loyal, brainwashed fans applauding the genius of it: let a speedy young WR walk away in FA, trade away a fast, sure-handed young WR, and then turn around and trade for a speedy, older WR who makes more $$$. I'm sure that the Bills brain trust have concluded that Hilton will fit the Bills' "culture" even before he's on the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillyG Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Why are they trading him...? Irsay is a known alcoholic. Heck he gave up a 1st for Trent Richardson. If we catch him at the right time we may be able to get Hilton for a pack of smokes and a trip to one of Buffalo's fine gentlemen's clubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Irsay is a known alcoholic. Heck he gave up a 1st for Trent Richardson. If we catch him at the right time we may be able to get Hilton for a pack of smokes and a trip to one of Buffalo's fine gentlemen's clubs. I don't think he has any say while Chris Ballard is his GM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokestradamus Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 I don't think he has any say while Chris Ballard is his GM. It's going to take some people a while to catch up to the fact that the Colts aren't being run by a moron anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 It's going to take some people a while to catch up to the fact that the Colts aren't being run by a moron anymore. Maybe they will trade Ballard for Grigson? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Maybe not. But I don't want to be sitting in another 10 years thinking "if we had just given up a little bit more..." in the way we do with the aborted Big Ben trade back in 2004. Belt and braces, take no chances, keep your ammunition for the Quarterback in the 2018 draft. Once you have secured him then whether you want to trade remaining assets for proven players or trade down and get more draft picks or trade up to take the top WR on your board.... I can take any of those arguments. I agree with your general position. I also agree with those who are making the assessment that our receiving corps is lacking. It is. But that doesn't mean that this organization should so quickly deviate from the roadmap they established when they took over. An incomplete team is not going to be made whole in one year. Being expedient for short term gain is the mentality that has derailed this franchise for more than a generation. The Bills have a plan and shouldn't abandon it after the first game against the worst team in the NFL. The posters who are recommending trading a second for Hylton are impulsively reacting as if this is a playoff team. I wish people would get off that major delusion. The first priority for this team is acquiring a top shelf qb prospect in next year's draft. Giving away chips to accomplish that task is foolish. The Bills are in a rebuild while trying to stay competitive. They have two picks in each of the first three rounds. This franchise is in a good position to get a stock of players and bolster this thin roster. Their primary strategy was to build through the draft; and they need to resolutely stick to the plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonCents Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 I see the need but I don't see the fit. TY's weakness is blocking in the run game and being physical. If they do get a smaller WR I'd expect it fits the Carolina mold, a cheaper Ted Ginn or even a guy like Phillip Dorsett. I don't see McBeane paying serious money to a smaller WR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Maybe they will trade Ballard for Grigson? ....Grigson has moved on to "assist" in Cleveland (COUGH)............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 ....Grigson has moved on to "assist" in Cleveland (COUGH)............. Assist. That's like the opposite of Elitist, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddog69 Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 I'd do a 2nd for him yesterday. His contract is fine and he would add quite a bit. You would be getting Gaines and Hilton for Sammy. TY is a legit #1. agreed. You'd also get a player under contract for multiple years vs Sammy who was going to be very difficult to re-sign Definitely an interesting situation to ponder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HT02 Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Not if the guy you are going to acquire has a better track record and longer term on their deal. I don't know his contract situation but that would be a valid point however I think Watkins is a more talented player Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watkins101 Posted September 14, 2017 Share Posted September 14, 2017 Here's an interesting thought, next year, right before the draft, we trade a first, dareus, and Tyrod(maybe another second?) for luck and Ty Hilton. Our next picks we pick a mlb, Ot, and Dt. I think if we did this, we could be an instant contender, however, I do not see this happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 14, 2017 Share Posted September 14, 2017 Here's an interesting thought, next year, right before the draft, we trade a first, dareus, and Tyrod(maybe another second?) for luck and Ty Hilton. Our next picks we pick a mlb, Ot, and Dt. I think if we did this, we could be an instant contender, however, I do not see this happening. Vlad Ducasse for Conor McDavid is another trade I do not see happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I know that we traded Sammy for a 2nd and that was great for next year. Right now, if the Colts would do it, I'd give them a 2nd for TY right now. That would be our deep threat, #1, everything we need while it seem like we might actually be contending. He's still young and better value than I think we would pull in with our 2nd round pick. Plus, with the way the Qb's are playing right now and how certain teams aren't tanking, I don't see QB's going 1, 2, 3 like we previously thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 How did this idea ever come about? Anything credible? A rumor? Or just Bills fans hoping for this with nothing behind it? In any case, I'll play along. I'd be willing to trade a 2nd and a 4th for him. He's young, speedy and has been very productive throughout his career. Now he's worthy of top 10 WR money! If not more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mat68 Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 We have a bye so bringing in outside help would be for Tampa not really Cincy. I think it is going to come down to what the time table is with Matthews. If he is only going to miss a few weeks I dont expect them to make a move. If its a month or more than I can see them targeting a Wr on a different roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 How did this idea ever come about? Anything credible? A rumor? Or just Bills fans hoping for this with nothing behind it? In any case, I'll play along. I'd be willing to trade a 2nd and a 4th for him. He's young, speedy and has been very productive throughout his career. Now he's worthy of top 10 WR money! If not more. I don't know about TY specifically but I know that the Bills are actively trying to acquire someone with speed. They haven't been thrilled with the receiver production and now Matthews is out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I don't know about TY specifically but I know that the Bills are actively trying to acquire someone with speed. They haven't been thrilled with the receiver production and now Matthews is out. John Brown is being under-utilized in Arizona with only 17 targets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I don't know about TY specifically but I know that the Bills are actively trying to acquire someone with speed. They haven't been thrilled with the receiver production and now Matthews is out. I've heard the same from sources I trust. If they make a trade, I wouldn't expect it this week. Next week however... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I think anything is on the table. The Colts are in need of depth and its a fair trade. Hilton isnt getting them over the hump. I dont believe there was substantial evidence to create this though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I've heard the same from sources I trust. If they make a trade, I wouldn't expect it this week. Next week however...from what I understand of the office they run now the wait until such and such is not what they're about. This is my opinion. But, I have heard from a friend who heard it from a friend who heard it from another you've been messing around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I don't know about TY specifically but I know that the Bills are actively trying to acquire someone with speed. They haven't been thrilled with the receiver production and now Matthews is out. When you say actively trying to acquire someone with speed, is this from what you are hearing from around the way or something you read? or? I think anything is on the table. The Colts are in need of depth and its a fair trade. Hilton isnt getting them over the hump. I dont believe there was substantial evidence to create this though Luck is set to come back. Luck and Hilton have had great chemistry, I just have a hard time believing they'd split that up. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see it happening, I just don't believe it would. John Brown is being under-utilized in Arizona with only 17 targets. I'd be down with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo86 Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I wouldn't be opposed to the Bills signing Brandon Coleman after the season when he's a FA. John Brown is being under-utilized in Arizona with only 17 targets. He's appropriately-utilized because he can never stay healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herb62 Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Don't panic give Reily and Shorts a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 Don't panic give Reily and Shorts a chance. Yesi love this. A guy who had been on our PS who hasn't gone to any other team is our savior Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 I betcha the Bills make a big push for Landry in the off season. I'll be shocked if he re-signs there or the Dolphins tagging him. The Bills will have cap space aplenty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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