Doc Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 It's interesting that he's from Missouri and didn't care enough to keep them there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanC883 Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 (edited) I don't understand your logic; what difference would two more losing years make to Pegula? Bills fans have been supporting a loser for 15 years, you think that's going to suddenly evaporate if we have another couple 7-9 years? Exactly. And now that the Bills future in Buffalo is secure, out of town fans such as myself are much more likely to "invest" in the team by buying more apperal and going to more games. The Bills have the best fans in the NFL. It's not really close. In fact, I'd say the best fans in all pro sports. What other team could miss the post-season this long and continually have the game-day attendance the Bills have? That said, I do expect a new stadium. But no way the Bills move. Pegs saw the backlash against Bon Jovi. Imagine if he moved the team. The city and the teams supporters would go full-out boycott mode. Yes. I think more future losing seasons would severely affect ticket sales, decreasing revenue and then the pressure will be on for the Bills to do something, which could be a move. There's some over confidence here that what was, will be. Supporting losers for 15 years: nothing goes on forever. Generation Z is the future fan base. Marketers find Gen Z has less loyalty compared to previous generations (result: they won't invest in a losing record). But Gen Z will invest in a good value (meaning a winning record) The ticket buying fan base will be reduced by aging. Buffalo has the third oldest population in the country Much of the fan base is leaving WNY If the Bills win = the future WNY fans will support them If they lose = they won't be supported as well as they are today...and the NFL pressure will be on for some kind of change On the flip side. I don't see any other city that would be better than Buffalo. I think the two teams in LA will be a fail. go to a Bills game. Many of the fans in attendance were born AFTER the 4 super bowl runs. Out of town Bills fans are often nearby where the economey is better (Pennsylvania, etc.). I can get to and from a Bills game in a day and often do. Don't expect to stop doing that. Loosing will cause the Pegs to clean house, not move the team. Edited January 24, 2016 by RyanC883 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Remember that Katy Couric story on Buffalo recently? I have friends and clients around the country tell me "Wow, Buffalo looks like it's really taking off." I mean completely out of the blue and unsolicited. (They know I'm from here.) This kind of positive press really seems to be having an impact on the rest of the country. (Canalside looks fun on TV.) There's no need to be gloomy and pessimistic about the city anymore. (It's not perfect but no place is.) But old habits die hard. Maybe what we need are a few Super Bowl wins and Stanley Cups to give us confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFunPolice Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 the idea that Terry Pegula would move the Bills shows one of two things: 1) complete and total ignorance 2) a desire to bring people down Maybe it's both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 the idea that Terry Pegula would move the Bills shows one of two things: 1) complete and total ignorance 2) a desire to bring people down Maybe it's both. More like: 3) trying to generate clicks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFunPolice Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Seriously, how miserable do you have to be to try to ruin on Buffalo sports fans' "parade" that the teams are secure and that there IS a future to be excited about? I say "parade" because all of our excitement is about the future at this point! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Yes. I think more future losing seasons would severely affect ticket sales, decreasing revenue and then the pressure will be on for the Bills to do something, which could be a move. There's some over confidence here that what was, will be. Supporting losers for 15 years: nothing goes on forever. Generation Z is the future fan base. Marketers find Gen Z has less loyalty compared to previous generations (result: they won't invest in a losing record). But Gen Z will invest in a good value (meaning a winning record) The ticket buying fan base will be reduced by aging. Buffalo has the third oldest population in the country Much of the fan base is leaving WNY If the Bills win = the future WNY fans will support them If they lose = they won't be supported as well as they are today...and the NFL pressure will be on for some kind of change On the flip side. I don't see any other city that would be better than Buffalo. I think the two teams in LA will be a fail. You are all over the lot. Fans have been supporting the Bills for 50+ years despite having had about 12 good seasons. Your theory that a couple more bad years is suddenly going to kill the fan base is absurd. Population loss has slowed to near zero and will likely see gains in the future as people seek out more affordable areas. And there is absolutely no correlation between the Rams move and the Bills' future. If anything it makes them more secure in Buffalo. The sooner these dinosaurs with their pessimistic, "woe is us" defeatist "because Buffalo" attitudes retire and stop printing this crap the better. Of course as the OP shows, there's always a next generation to carry on the tradition, just as most of the next generation will continue supporting the Bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Horseheads Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 This is similar to another story The Buffalo News has run in the past few weeks by a female. I think it's their typical hate on the Pegula agenda because they don't kiss their ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 This is similar to another story The Buffalo News has run in the past few weeks by a female. I think it's their typical hate on the Pegula agenda because they don't kiss their ass. Yup. I was just going to post it. It was this past Monday and got way more comments than Esmonde's on the News website, because I think people didn't feel like writing the exact same thing for the exact same article: http://www.buffalonews.com/columns/denise-jewell-gee/moving-of-st-louis-rams-is-cautionary-tale-for-bills-fans-20160117 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Horseheads Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Yup. I was just going to post it. It was this past Monday and got way more comments than Esmonde's on the News website, because I think people didn't feel like writing the exact same thing for the exact same article: http://www.buffalonews.com/columns/denise-jewell-gee/moving-of-st-louis-rams-is-cautionary-tale-for-bills-fans-20160117 Thanks BBB! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillnutinHouston Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Exactly. And now that the Bills future in Buffalo is secure, out of town fans such as myself are much more likely to "invest" in the team by buying more apperal and going to more games. I'm the opposite of this. I bought seasons and club seats while out of town to support the team and, in a small way, help keep it viable. But now that Pegula is locked in, I'm going to drop my clubs when my 3 year commitment expires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Thanks BBB! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boater Posted January 24, 2016 Author Share Posted January 24, 2016 So the team has missed the playoffs the past 16 seasons and still been supported, but the next 2 years are critical and if they continue to lose will lose support? How do you figure? And how do you figure they'll never make the playoffs again? OK. The next four years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 OK. The next four years. Ok then, let's bet. And Kroenke shows that just because you have no debt on a team (and what's worse, ties to the area and gobs of money) your team still isn't safe from moving. The Bills were lucky to have Ralph all those years, and now the Pegulas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12Kachy Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 http://www.theofficialreview.com/nfl-cross-ownership-rules/ Check this out. Pegula would have to sell, transfer, or move the Sabres will the Bills to relocate. Both Terry and Kim own the Bills so he couldnt do the old transfer ownership to his wife in order to move. Pegula will keep the Bills in western NY and most likely try to go downtown IMO. He would be smart to build a dome stadium near the Falls which could be used for multiple events over the year. Maybe even connect a casino to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 OK. The next four years. Explain how winning percentage determines whether or not a team moves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 The general senses of paranoia and malaise that come with being a Western New Yorker and a Bills fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 It's interesting that he's from Missouri and didn't care enough to keep them there. greed. plus many big business people have no loyalty and is why they easily ship our jobs overseas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Remember that Katy Couric story on Buffalo recently? I have friends and clients around the country tell me "Wow, Buffalo looks like it's really taking off." I mean completely out of the blue and unsolicited. (They know I'm from here.) This kind of positive press really seems to be having an impact on the rest of the country. (Canalside looks fun on TV.) There's no need to be gloomy and pessimistic about the city anymore. (It's not perfect but no place is.) But old habits die hard. Maybe what we need are a few Super Bowl wins and Stanley Cups to give us confidence. championships are good enough fro me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 More like: 3) trying to generate clicks at least come up with a "Story" that is plausible. Losing seasons is laughable considering our playoff draught. CJ Anderson, you really were worth that second round pick in fantasy!! wrong thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 wrong thread? Yup! LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Yup! LOL thought so lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boater Posted January 24, 2016 Author Share Posted January 24, 2016 (edited) Explain how winning percentage determines whether or not a team moves. Imagine if the 2019 Bills have missed the playoffs again for X straight years. I'd say the fan base is dead, the cash flow is dead, and the Bills are gone. You explain otherwise. (X years.. would that be 20? .. it's to depressing to think about) Edited January 24, 2016 by boater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Imagine if the 2019 Bills have missed the playoffs again for X straight years. I'd say the fan base is dead, the cash flow is dead, and the Bills are gone. You explain otherwise. (X years.. would that be 20? .. it's to depressing to think about) And how often does it happen that a team moves because attendance is poor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 Keep wishing that. I agree with you for the next year or so.. then all bets are off. Your not serious about this No....for several different reasons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 If they start out 2-4 or worse next year watch for moving trux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 ..is the Don Esmonde lede I agree with most of what he says at http://www.buffalonews.com/columns/donn-esmonde/nfl-abandonment-of-st-louis-ups-the-ante-in-buffalo-20160123 Including the open ended statement: "Buffalo will thankfully be spared St. Louis’ fate. But in the game of stadium checkers, the pressure is on to keep up with the Kroenkes." I think the current pressure to move is "low" ... but if the Bills lose the next two seasons, the pressure is a red hot blowout to move. Opinion. Opinion - you already expect the Bills to leave so get on the boat out of town now! Fans are not dumb you take any Cowboys fan or fan in one of these multi billion dollar play pens and bring them to a Buffalo Game day experience and they will tell you hands down what happens here and places like Greenbay and K.C. is special. Most feel that what happens here is fun and what a real game day experience should be about. So stand up and be proud. I for one am thankful for a awesome game day experience and how close the stands are to the field and the whole atmosphere out at the Ralph. There is no place on game day I would rather be then right there. When it's too small and doesn't make enough money for Jerry Jones it's Just right for us. Boy Marv Levi would be proud. GO BILLS I agree about the game day experience vs commercial but they are far too many drunks and anti-social people at the games. There are people so drunk they can barely walk in stadium. It is a good game day experience which could be great. This is similar to another story The Buffalo News has run in the past few weeks by a female. I think it's their typical hate on the Pegula agenda because they don't kiss their ass. When they remodel the stadium they should put the press box above the sewage tank. http://www.theofficialreview.com/nfl-cross-ownership-rules/ Check this out. Pegula would have to sell, transfer, or move the Sabres will the Bills to relocate. Both Terry and Kim own the Bills so he couldnt do the old transfer ownership to his wife in order to move. Pegula will keep the Bills in western NY and most likely try to go downtown IMO. He would be smart to build a dome stadium near the Falls which could be used for multiple events over the year. Maybe even connect a casino to it. They could do the divorce with each taking an asset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drinkTHEkoolaid Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 I have like 0 respect for anything buffalo news, except Tyler Dunne. The bills aren't going anywhere, at least in the next 5 years. Only way I remotely see it happening is if the Ralph has extreme deteoriation and cannot be used and there is no corporate welfare/public assistance for a new downtown stadium and the bills essentially become homeless without a new stadium. That's the only logical way I could see a move happen, to a city like San antonio/austin, orlando, las Vegas or portland owned by pegula, or sold off and moved wherever. This is dumb. And for the first time in my adult life I feel like the bills have a secure future. Thank you pegula family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 (edited) Imagine if the 2019 Bills have missed the playoffs again for X straight years. I'd say the fan base is dead, the cash flow is dead, and the Bills are gone. You explain otherwise. (X years.. would that be 20? .. it's to depressing to think about) What is the difference between 16 and 20? Fans are suddenly going to come to their senses? I'm still wondering how if we go with your theory that greed is the main factor here, why winning within 2 years would make Pegula change his mind about moving? It is clearly more profitable in places like LA. Why does winning change his greed? You think he would get swept up in the glory of winning? I just don't get it. Moving doesn't mean he will win more so.... Also the idea that a new generation of Bills fans that won't accept losing won't buy tickets, and they are replacing the ones that will (16 years) within even the next 5 years is ridiculous. I understand you think it makes sense in your head, but it just doesn't work like that, and as others have said, ticket sales are a small part of the equation. Edited January 25, 2016 by What a Tuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 I have like 0 respect for anything buffalo news, except Tyler Dunne. The bills aren't going anywhere, at least in the next 5 years. Only way I remotely see it happening is if the Ralph has extreme deteoriation and cannot be used and there is no corporate welfare/public assistance for a new downtown stadium and the bills essentially become homeless without a new stadium. That's the only logical way I could see a move happen, to a city like San antonio/austin, orlando, las Vegas or portland owned by pegula, or sold off and moved wherever. This is dumb. And for the first time in my adult life I feel like the bills have a secure future. Thank you pegula family. I'd put money on them not leaving while Kim or Terry are still alive. And since Kim is my age, that means they should be staying in Buffalo for the rest of my life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 the idea that Terry Pegula would move the Bills shows one of two things: 1) complete and total ignorance 2) a desire to bring people down Maybe it's both. More like: 3) trying to generate clicks Is it too late to point out that the article is not about the Pegulas moving the Bills to LA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 So in other words, doomed? Apparently... We just can't seem to escape the doom... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 Is it too late to point out that the article is not about the Pegulas moving the Bills to LA? Maybe not LA. But what do Kroenke, STL, and the Rams have to do with the Pegulas, Buffalo, and the Bills? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 http://www.theofficialreview.com/nfl-cross-ownership-rules/ Check this out. Pegula would have to sell, transfer, or move the Sabres will the Bills to relocate. Both Terry and Kim own the Bills so he couldnt do the old transfer ownership to his wife in order to move. Pegula will keep the Bills in western NY and most likely try to go downtown IMO. He would be smart to build a dome stadium near the Falls which could be used for multiple events over the year. Maybe even connect a casino to it. I doubt the NFL would go for that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That's No Moon Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 I doubt the NFL would go for that There is a casino on the Hollywood Park site that Kroenke is building on. It was part of the former horse track on that site. It's currently undergoing renovation and the casino's own website mentions a two year plan to "evolve and grow into our new home". There will absolutely be a casino on that property if not directly connected to the stadium. There's no way the casino operators would pull an approved, operating, casino out of the middle of LA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 The pro leagues are starting to embrace gambling now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 http://www.theofficialreview.com/nfl-cross-ownership-rules/ Check this out. Pegula would have to sell, transfer, or move the Sabres will the Bills to relocate. Both Terry and Kim own the Bills so he couldnt do the old transfer ownership to his wife in order to move. Pegula will keep the Bills in western NY and most likely try to go downtown IMO. He would be smart to build a dome stadium near the Falls which could be used for multiple events over the year. Maybe even connect a casino to it. The Bills in a dome feels very wrong to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boater Posted January 25, 2016 Author Share Posted January 25, 2016 Is it too late to point out that the article is not about the Pegulas moving the Bills to LA? No it's not too late. The message I took from the article: the Bills are in a Pegs honeymoon period, but will be under increasing pressure to make some money for mothership NFL. The way to provide the NFL more money could mean moving. or it could mean a new stadium. I hope Pegs straight-arms the league and sits tight. That will be easy to do if they are winning on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 I doubt the NFL would go for that This is the NFL's stand on gambling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 No it's not too late. The message I took from the article: the Bills are in a Pegs honeymoon period, but will be under increasing pressure to make some money for mothership NFL. The way to provide the NFL more money could mean moving. or it could mean a new stadium. I hope Pegs straight-arms the league and sits tight. That will be easy to do if they are winning on the field. When has that not been the case for any team that's not maximizing its potential revenues? Jax is a bit of a different case because NFL is using Khan as the spearhead for London expansion. A new stadium is a near certainty. The only thing that's still to be determined is how it's going to be financed. That's what the other article referenced, which is slightly different than Esmonde's piece. Her concern was using large taxpayer contributions for the stadium, and she's right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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