RuntheDamnBall Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 I would like to see the numbers, but it seems to me that if Indy doesn't keep Manning, they are going to have a year of incredible salary cap difficulties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 No, they have an owner that hasn't let the bottom line interfere with football operations and that equals a commitment to winning. Hires qualified football men and lets them do their job. Â Do the Bills do that? We already know that answer, don't we? In this new era of the NFL, if you have a good QB in this league, you'll win. If you don't, you'll lose. Look at...the Colts. 10 straight double-digit win seasons under Manning, and without him, the worst team in the league (and a chance to draft another Manning-esque QB, as "Luck" would have it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Would you rather work for Bob Irsay or Ralph Wilson and his people who chop front office types off at the needs? Think about it for a moment. Â As someone noted, Indy isn't moving anywhere, has the #1 pick, the guy has the chance to name his own HC, a new stadium and building something. In Buffalo you're reporting to people setting the team up for sale. Indianapolis may not be a huge market, but the working conditions are better than Buffalo. Â Well, of course you'd rather work for the Colts. You hate the Bills. Â And the Bills have a much better foundation than the Colts. Polian built a one man team that crumbled without one piece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 You're assuming that you can land rg3, most likely a top 5 pick. So now you have about 4 teams you can work a trade with. IF I knew I could get rg3 plus all those picks, I'd agree with you and would trade Luck. But that's ONLY if I knew I could land that QB. Â Every team puts all their eggs in one QB basket btw. Not many backups are leading their teams to SBs. I didn't say backups never do, because we saw first hand that they can, but very unlikely. And by trading manning and getting 2-3 high picks, you're still improving your team across the board, but will get a couple less picks to build from. Hardly putting all your eggs in one basket. I agree with you regarding RG3 and the QB situation. My point is I'd just rather trade the pick and get a huge amount of 1st and 2nd rounders for years. Being an aging team with avhifh cap number it's a way to clean house over a very short period of time while keeping the guys you have in place for the transition. Or if you feel your close with a few players you van get there too. It's all preference and I just prefer going the Route of having tons of future prospects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gobillsinytown Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Agree. It's not going to do much good to have Luck as QB if the O-line can't protect him. There have been many "can't miss" QB prospects that have been ruined by getting pummeled on every pass play. Whomever takes the job has a lot of grunt work to do in trying to manage their bloated cap. Â Â I don't know why people believe Indy is a more attractive franchise than Buffalo. Â Indy is constrained by debt, imminent cap hell, an aging roster with multiple holes, a very expensive quarterback that might play, might not, and a slew of draft picks you have to find money to pay for. What isn't factored into the equation is the considerable debt the team has which constrains spending on the field. You factor in the number of albatross contracts they have, as GM, your ability to make over a roster is severely limited in the short term. Â All in a small market. Indy can't spend like the Jets. Â The Bills have no team debt, no imminent cap hell and a younger roster with less holes. There is surely upside to being a Bills GM over a Colts GM. I don't find the Colts GM job all that attractive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple haze Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) Would you rather work for Bob Irsay or Ralph Wilson and his people who chop front office types off at the needs? Think about it for a moment. Â As someone noted, Indy isn't moving anywhere, has the #1 pick, the guy has the chance to name his own HC, a new stadium and building something. In Buffalo you're reporting to people setting the team up for sale. Indianapolis may not be a huge market, but the working conditions are better than Buffalo. Â Working conditions are better? That's why they just fired their President and GM? Maybe their coach? Their number one pick could tank. Their veteran QB might not play again. Â The Ralph will be renovated and modernized soon enough. If Gailey doesn't produce Whaley's first year as GM might be hiring his own coach. But why would he need to do that if Gailey gets it done. Folks put way too much stock in some of these things. Most GM's are hired as a coach is also fired. The Bills are already in the middle of their rebuild of which Whaley has been a part from year one. I'm sure Whaley would love to keep Gailey because the team has taken the next step in the plan that was set-up when he was brought in. He knows the organization. Also, because his name is on a list doesn't mean he is a legitimate candidate for the job. Call it a "wish" list he's on more than a reality based list. Â Typical Bills fans always go to negative places. The grass is always greener everywhere else. Assume everybody would want to be anywhere else. None of us know Whaley or anyone else. He hasn't resigned so he must be okay with things. The grass is not necessarily greener anywhere else and you shouldn't assume someone feels the same way you do. The Bills organization gave him a promotion and training to achieve his ultimate goal of being a GM. You think he will just walk now? Doubt it. Nix probably is going to step away from being a GM after the draft and become a consultant to football operations. Whaley is the next GM sooner than later. Edited January 4, 2012 by purple haze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Everyone please relax - many of you are not thinking clearly. If Whaley wanted to leave for an opportunity like this, he would've stayed in Pittsburgh and wouldn't have taken the Asst. GM job under Nix to begin with. The tea leaves are all pointing towards the inevitable conclusion, which is that Nix is intending to retire in very short order, with Whaley taking over. Likely right after the draft. If that hadn't been set in motion a year ago, Whaley never would have come here to begin with. He's not going anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haven Moses Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 If Whaley leaves, it would be a good opportunity for Ralphs daughter to move up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Interesting. If I were Whaley, I would bolt. You get the #1 overall pick in the draft, and a chance to hire your own coach and make a mark on the organization. Plus, Indy is a nice city to live in. Â It's a GM dream job. If you're a farmer, yeah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 If Whaley leaves, it would be a good opportunity for Ralphs daughter to move up. That daughter died a few years ago. The other who is involved with the Bills is in marketing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bladiebla Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Great... That'll be our luck, snatched before he even takes over from Nix and then having Nix retire leaving a huge gap in the scouting and GM department... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRH Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 If Whaley leaves despite all that has reportedly been done to clear his way to the top job here, then he's not the guy I want running my team anyway. Nix made a commitment to him. Whaley can either honor that by keeping his own commitment, or he can leave. Either way, I'll be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Well, of course you'd rather work for the Colts. You hate the Bills. Â And the Bills have a much better foundation than the Colts. Polian built a one man team that crumbled without one piece. Â Correction: I, along with others here, hate the way the Bills are run. I hate the results, now having lost 60% of their games going back to 2001. Â And I love this myth being perpetuated that Indianapolis was a 1 man team and everyone else was a retread. Apparently people forget that Dwight Freeney, Reggie Wayne, Robert Mathis, Dallas Clark, Jeff Saturday, and Pierre Garcon play for this team. No, it was one guy who got them 10+ wins for 10 seasons in a row. Just one and no one else. Couldn't be the coach, whose college record at Wake Forest was horrible, wasn't at fault. Nope, couldn't be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRH Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 And the conditions in Indianapolis -- decade-long playoff run, new stadium, etc etc -- were created by Bill Polian and Peyton Manning. One is gone and the other will soon be gone, leaving what was in Indianapolis prior to their arrival: a 2-14 team with a batshit owner and no guarantee of future success, Luck or no Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Senator Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 That daughter died a few years ago. The other who is involved with the Bills is in marketing. Actually, I believe RW's niece - Mary Owen, VP Strategic Planning - is his only relative in the Bills front office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Correction: I, along with others here, hate the way the Bills are run. I hate the results, now having lost 60% of their games going back to 2001. Â And I love this myth being perpetuated that Indianapolis was a 1 man team and everyone else was a retread. Apparently people forget that Dwight Freeney, Reggie Wayne, Robert Mathis, Dallas Clark, Jeff Saturday, and Pierre Garcon play for this team. No, it was one guy who got them 10+ wins for 10 seasons in a row. Just one and no one else. Couldn't be the coach, whose college record at Wake Forest was horrible, wasn't at fault. Nope, couldn't be it. Â It's funny that all those players you mentioned played for this Colts this year and they struggled to win 2 games. The Bills, who have been awful, won 7 games with Trent Edwards and JP Losman. Curtis Painter is really that much worse than those 2? Â Poliam built a one man team and got a free 10 year ride. If the Bills had Manning, even with all their bad personnel moves, do you think they are looking at a 12 year playoff drought? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRH Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Apparently people forget that Dwight Freeney, Reggie Wayne, Robert Mathis, Dallas Clark, Jeff Saturday, and Pierre Garcon play for this team. No, it was one guy who got them 10+ wins for 10 seasons in a row. Â Ages of five of the six players you cited, upon entering the 2012 season: Â Jeff Saturday: 38 Reggie Wayne: 34 Dwight Freeney: 32 Robert Mathis: 31 Dallas Clark: 33 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Senator Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 A local sports reporter here in Indianapolis (Bob Kravitz) mentions 3 possible candidates that are supposedly on Colts' owner Jim Irsay's "short list" to replace the recently fired Polians:  1. Tom Ciskowski (Dallas) 2. Doug Whaley (Buffalo) 3. Reggie McKenzie (Green Bay)  Amazingly, we may be seeing a case of 'history repeating itself' here -  Indy columnist suggests Polian’s rudeness played role in firing  I believe it was Polian's rudeness and foul language that got him fired here in Buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted January 4, 2012 Author Share Posted January 4, 2012 I would like to see the numbers, but it seems to me that if Indy doesn't keep Manning, they are going to have a year of incredible salary cap difficulties. Â If they want to keep Peyton, they have to pay him $28M on March 1 to pick up his option - otherwise, he becomes a free agent, with no (or at least minimal) affect on the salary cap. Â Indy does have other contracts to deal with that will be more problematic - Reggie Wayne, Robert Mathis, and I think Joseph Addai and Dallas Clark all will be free agents this off-season. Yikes! (Also their MLB, Gary Brackett). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) Amazingly, we may be seeing a case of 'history repeating itself' here -  Indy columnist suggests Polian’s rudeness played role in firing  I believe it was Polian's rudeness and foul language that got him fired here in Buffalo. Indy Colts Blog  Wow, is Jerry Sullivan moonlighting for beer money?  Polian disrespected the fans for questioning the infamous Jets sitdown decision in 2009, when he alone (I believe) decided at 14-0 that perfection was a meaningless pursuit, that crossed a line. Don’t insult the people who have spent so much money to give you such a great life.  PTR Edited January 4, 2012 by PromoTheRobot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcbillsfan Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Oh wait. Now we have to lock up Doug Whaley. Typical Bills to let such an up-and-coming talent walk out the door. I mean just yesterday they were going to promote that loser Doug Whaley from within the organization to take over for Buddy Nix when he retires. Â PTR lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HurlyBurly51 Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 "Indianapolis is a nice place to live?" That is the first time that has ever been said. Â Now that was funny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 What if Andrew Luck pulls a power play on the Colts like John Elway did, and they have to pay Manning all that money, not knowing if he will be 100%? Indy doesn't look like such a great gig, although they would get a boatload in return for Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 In this new era of the NFL, if you have a good QB in this league, you'll win. If you don't, you'll lose. Look at...the Colts. 10 straight double-digit win seasons under Manning, and without him, the worst team in the league (and a chance to draft another Manning-esque QB, as "Luck" would have it). Â The Colts situation this year w/o Manning uniquely underscores the point you're making in a dramatic way. But you most certainly need more than just a good QB to win on a consistent basis as a playoff/SB contender. It's an oversimplification to say that's all that is required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) Colts were horrible until they hired Polian Drafted Manning and then made the playoffs from 2002 to 2010 after he turned the franchise around. After all this one bad season gets him fired? Particularity when the result of the bad season resulted in the ability to draft Andrew Luck? Hopefully Whaley stays right here. Fixed it What more did Polian do for them besides having Manning fall into his lap? During his tenure as the GM in Indy, they have 1 superbowl win, thats the only one Saint Polian has, and that was with one of the best QB's to ever play the game. The Indy gig should have been one of the easiest job to GM for in the NFL, the Pats continued to win the year Brady went down. The Colts were never a team to go out and sign big name Free Agents, they relied on drafting, and their drafts over the last decade have been mediocre AT BEST. The only reason the Colts are considered one of the better teams in the league was Manning, and one season where he can't play they go from playoff lock to 1st overall pick. Without manning, the Colts are a mess. Theres all these posts saying that Irsay isn't meddling, or that he would be better to work for, yet he cleaned house of the Saint polians after 1 horrible season, and rumors that they would want to trade Manning away and draft Luck, but the owner wants to keep Manning. Our GM comes out and says he has talked Ralph out of spending more money for players in FA, and he is still viewed as cheap and that Nix is just covering.  And why does everyone think Manning is going anywhere? Is it possible they work something out to restructure his deal, and set things up so that Luck can come in and sit behind Manning for a few seasons before being given the team? it worked fine in GB with Favre and Rogers, and I don't see Mannings having the same kinda ego as Favre ever had that he couldn't deal with having some behind him to teach. Edited January 4, 2012 by apuszczalowski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Fixed it  What more did Polian do for them besides having Manning fall into his lap? During his tenure as the GM in Indy, they have 1 superbowl win, thats the only one Saint Polian has, and that was with one of the best QB's to ever play the game. The Indy gig should have been one of the easiest job to GM for in the NFL, the Pats continued to win the year Brady went down. The Colts were never a team to go out and sign big name Free Agents, they relied on drafting, and their drafts over the last decade have been mediocre AT BEST. The only reason the Colts are considered one of the better teams in the league was Manning, and one season where he can't play they go from playoff lock to 1st overall pick. Without manning, the Colts are a mess. Theres all these posts saying that Irsay isn't meddling, or that he would be better to work for, yet he cleaned house of the Saint polians after 1 horrible season, and rumors that they would want to trade Manning away and draft Luck, but the owner wants to keep Manning. Our GM comes out and says he has talked Ralph out of spending more money for players in FA, and he is still viewed as cheap and that Nix is just covering.  And why does everyone think Manning is going anywhere? Is it possible they work something out to restructure his deal, and set things up so that Luck can come in and sit behind Manning for a few seasons before being given the team? it worked fine in GB with Favre and Rogers, and I don't see Mannings having the same kinda ego as Favre ever had that he couldn't deal with having some behind him to teach.  That's certainly possible and the new CBA prevents the kind of rookie contract that would hamper that IF Manning agrees to restructure. Like you imply restructuring will be key to any scenario of Manning and Luck on the same team. If he doesn't restructure I believe that means over $50m guaranteed to the QB position. Ouch. And that would really hamper the ability to rebuild around EITHER QB.  GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Whaley is not going anywhere. Â Buddy Nix brought him in to take over as GM. This was clear to everyone in the NFL including Whaley. Â The Bills could not clean house, including Whaley. Â The Fans may want to clean house but it "ain't gonna happen" Â Whaley was a bit of coup to bring in house. Whaley is looked at as one of the up and coming executives in the NFL. His mark was placed on the Bills 2011 draft. Â If the organization's decision is lose Whaley or keep Nix. Nix actually will be retiring; like the rumor mill that is swirling is saying. Â Whaley spent years in Pittsburgh, so he is not clamoring for life in the big city. He just bought a nice house by Delaware Park. I don't think he is trying to leave. I think he knows the plan is for him to take over and he will live up to the plan. Nix isn't getting any younger and they probably already discussed the timeline for the transition. "Indianapolis is a nice place to live?" That is the first time that has ever been said. It is called Napianapolis as in ZZzZZZZZ there is nothing to do but take a Nap. Â But yes Whaley could take the bird in hand rather than a bird in the bush, but I'd be surprised if the Bills grant permission for an interview. They can't let Whaley go. It would be a death-nail type of brain drain, He would take his team with him and the Bills would essentially be rebuilding again. Agreed. Â guess it ain't Toronto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Fixed it  What more did Polian do for them besides having Manning fall into his lap? During his tenure as the GM in Indy, they have 1 superbowl win, thats the only one Saint Polian has, and that was with one of the best QB's to ever play the game. The Indy gig should have been one of the easiest job to GM for in the NFL, the Pats continued to win the year Brady went down. The Colts were never a team to go out and sign big name Free Agents, they relied on drafting, and their drafts over the last decade have been mediocre AT BEST. The only reason the Colts are considered one of the better teams in the league was Manning, and one season where he can't play they go from playoff lock to 1st overall pick. Without manning, the Colts are a mess. Theres all these posts saying that Irsay isn't meddling, or that he would be better to work for, yet he cleaned house of the Saint polians after 1 horrible season, and rumors that they would want to trade Manning away and draft Luck, but the owner wants to keep Manning. Our GM comes out and says he has talked Ralph out of spending more money for players in FA, and he is still viewed as cheap and that Nix is just covering.  And why does everyone think Manning is going anywhere? Is it possible they work something out to restructure his deal, and set things up so that Luck can come in and sit behind Manning for a few seasons before being given the team? it worked fine in GB with Favre and Rogers, and I don't see Mannings having the same kinda ego as Favre ever had that he couldn't deal with having some behind him to teach. Are really that unfamiliar with the top guys drafted to the Colts over Polian's tenure? How is that possible? Wayne, Clark, James, Mathis, Sanders, Freeney?  Anyway, the pats continued to win after Brady went down because they had the best coaching in the league and a solid backup in Cassell. The Colts have an awful coaching staff and Painter as their backup. Someone finally decided to call Orlovski off of his couch and the guy strolls in and immediately wins 2 out of 3. I bet Orlovski paired with a competent staff could have won 7 or 8. But then they wouldn't be picking Luck next spring... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Aaron Schatz for Buffalo GM if Doug bolts to the Colts He wrote a book on football but would that make him qualified to run a team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Correction: I, along with others here, hate the way the Bills are run. I hate the results, now having lost 60% of their games going back to 2001. Â And I love this myth being perpetuated that Indianapolis was a 1 man team and everyone else was a retread. Apparently people forget that Dwight Freeney, Reggie Wayne, Robert Mathis, Dallas Clark, Jeff Saturday, and Pierre Garcon play for this team. No, it was one guy who got them 10+ wins for 10 seasons in a row. Just one and no one else. Couldn't be the coach, whose college record at Wake Forest was horrible, wasn't at fault. Nope, couldn't be it. Â LOL @ Pierre Garcon being remotely relevant without Manning. Â And just what kind of numbers do you think Wayne and Clark would have put up with Fitz at the helm? I'm curious. Â Also, we've seen other Colts quarterbacks play behind that offensive line, and anyone not named Manning made them look...well...offensive. And yes, those ensembles included Jeff "nobody drafted me and even the first team to pick me up cut me and I spent my first year on the bench, but that was almost 15 years ago so nobody remembers, oh did I mention I turn 37 in June" Saturday. Â But to your point, yes 2 DE's, both over 30, should have been more than enough talent to carry the Colts this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Are really that unfamiliar with the top guys drafted to the Colts over Polian's tenure? How is that possible? Wayne, Clark, James, Mathis, Sanders, Freeney?  Anyway, the pats continued to win after Brady went down because they had the best coaching in the league and a solid backup in Cassell. The Colts have an awful coaching staff and Painter as their backup. Someone finally decided to call Orlovski off of his couch and the guy strolls in and immediately wins 2 out of 3. I bet Orlovski paired with a competent staff could have won 7 or 8. But then they wouldn't be picking Luck next spring... And whos job is it to put that coaching staff in place and to have a backup QB behind Manning? Guess Saint Polians only job is to draft the good players years ago? If Polian was any good at his job right now, they wouldn't be desperate for Luck as their new saviour right now. Think Green Bays GM was hoping Favre could tank a season so they could get the #1 pick to draft their new saviour? How about the Pats? They keep bringing in no name backups and drafted a potential starter in the middle rounds of the draft this year.  I bet you could come up with a comparible list of good draft picks for any GM that has been in one place for as long as Polian has been in Indy. But during his tenure in Indy with one of the best QBs to play the game, he has managed to build a team that has won ONE Super Bowl, and appear in one other. The "team" he built went from one of the top to worst just by losing Manning  LOL @ Pierre Garcon being remotely relevant without Manning.  And just what kind of numbers do you think Wayne and Clark would have put up with Fitz at the helm? I'm curious.  Also, we've seen other Colts quarterbacks play behind that offensive line, and anyone not named Manning made them look...well...offensive. And yes, those ensembles included Jeff "nobody drafted me and even the first team to pick me up cut me and I spent my first year on the bench, but that was almost 15 years ago so nobody remembers, oh did I mention I turn 37 in June" Saturday.  But to your point, yes 2 DE's, both over 30, should have been more than enough talent to carry the Colts this year. Results with Manning and those picks = Playoffs from 2002 to 2010 Results without Manning but with those picks = Picking #1 overall in the draft  Guess the other posters are right, the Colts are more then a one man team, and Saint Polian has done an incredible job making sure they can succeed if he goes down.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 And whos job is it to put that coaching staff in place and to have a backup QB behind Manning? Guess Saint Polians only job is to draft the good players years ago? If Polian was any good at his job right now, they wouldn't be desperate for Luck as their new saviour right now. Think Green Bays GM was hoping Favre could tank a season so they could get the #1 pick to draft their new saviour? How about the Pats? They keep bringing in no name backups and drafted a potential starter in the middle rounds of the draft this year.  I bet you could come up with a comparible list of good draft picks for any GM that has been in one place for as long as Polian has been in Indy. But during his tenure in Indy with one of the best QBs to play the game, he has managed to build a team that has won ONE Super Bowl, and appear in one other. The "team" he built went from one of the top to worst just by losing Manning   Results with Manning and those picks = Playoffs from 2002 to 2010 Results without Manning but with those picks = Picking #1 overall in the draft  Guess the other posters are right, the Colts are more then a one man team, and Saint Polian has done an incredible job making sure they can succeed if he goes down..........  Hey man, you're talking to the guy who has said (half-jokingly (...HALF)) that Peyton Manning should be in consideration for 2011 NFL MVP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 And whos job is it to put that coaching staff in place and to have a backup QB behind Manning? Guess Saint Polians only job is to draft the good players years ago? If Polian was any good at his job right now, they wouldn't be desperate for Luck as their new saviour right now. Think Green Bays GM was hoping Favre could tank a season so they could get the #1 pick to draft their new saviour? How about the Pats? They keep bringing in no name backups and drafted a potential starter in the middle rounds of the draft this year.  I bet you could come up with a comparible list of good draft picks for any GM that has been in one place for as long as Polian has been in Indy. But during his tenure in Indy with one of the best QBs to play the game, he has managed to build a team that has won ONE Super Bowl, and appear in one other. The "team" he built went from one of the top to worst just by losing Manning   Results with Manning and those picks = Playoffs from 2002 to 2010 Results without Manning but with those picks = Picking #1 overall in the draft  Guess the other posters are right, the Colts are more then a one man team, and Saint Polian has done an incredible job making sure they can succeed if he goes down..........   Seriously. How much worse is Curtis Painter than JP Losman and Trent Edwards? A lot of posters whine about how bad the Bills are. Yet, we still won 7 games with guys who are backup Qbs at best. The Colts lose one player and struggle to win 2 games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 The Colts situation this year w/o Manning uniquely underscores the point you're making in a dramatic way. But you most certainly need more than just a good QB to win on a consistent basis as a playoff/SB contender. It's an oversimplification to say that's all that is required. Obviously it's not all that's required, but it's a huge part. It's now a QB-driven league. The Bills haven't found a good/consistent one yet. Â What I'd like to see is how Indy does next year, if Manning returns. If they do well again, it was all him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Hearing that the Bears are targeting Bill Polian as their new GM. Will be interesting, as whoever takes that job will have to be committed to Lovie Smith as their coach, for at least a season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) Not sure where all this Indy bashing is coming from. All I said was that it was a nice place to live. Â Can you guys say with a straight face that Buffalo is a better city to live in than Indianapolis? I've spent considerable time in Indy, including living there for about a 3-month stretch. It's not a great city. But it's new, clean, has solid suburbs, good economy, less snow, and super low cost of living. If you're a family man that wants an easy commute to work, live in the burbs, and eat at chain restaurants, it's probably a nicer option than Buffalo. Â (I will agree with Ryan C above, that it's a weak football city). No bashing, you and I have a different opinion. Now i was born in Buffalo and although left a long time ago, I too travel a lot. I went to a certain auto race in Indy 3 years in a row. of course that was awhile ago. I also have had business meetings in Indy and have stayed up to 4 days at a time. if you want to say Indy is a better place than Buffalo, thats your opinion and I'm fine with it. Personally the lake, and river waterfront are pretty nice places in the summer Buffalo last summer was awesome. We spent 4 weeks there.. Unless the Bills are playing in Buffalo in January, I never go to Buffalo unless for family business The winters are dismal. From what I hear though its been pretty mild so far. I am a Buffalo booster. Â Indy is not a place I would live. Maybe raising a family there is better than what? Okay you love it. its yours. here's a little Indy 500 story as our supplies ran low a member of our party made a beer run(in the 90's)he was promptly robbed at gunpoint, of course he had no idea where he was, but did say it was a place(neighborhood) he would never go back to. Yep, it happens every day in every city. But I have zero warm and fuzzy feelings about Indy or Indiana for the matter. But that just me. Your mileage may vary. Edited January 4, 2012 by Best Player Available Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 The problem with the Colts was that their coaching staff this season was historically bad. Peyton was their OC, so they lost both a top-notch QB and a top-notch OC when he got hurt. There's talent on that team, but the coaches are too dumb to make anything of it. Â The biggest problem in Indy was Jim Caldwell. What exactly did he do to deserve a coaching job besides be Tony Dungy's little butt buddy? His hire was one of the biggest examples of blatant cronyism i've ever seen. Caldwell might be one of the worst coaches in history. He's rich kotite bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Indy Colts Blog  Wow, is Jerry Sullivan moonlighting for beer money?    PTR  PTR, heard Mortenson, IIRC (or perhaps Schefter) kind of say the same thing...Indy owner was kind of feeling like Polian was getting a little "too comfortable" as king of the castle, wasn't particularly pleasent toward the owner. Whoever it was, (Mort or Schefter) kind of compared the situation to Bowlan and Shannahan in Denver...the team was kind of bottoming out, and the owner just said "okay, I want my team back". Also heard tha Polian was saying things to the media, about Manning, that weren't true...issues such as failing a physical, and talking with Manning about how he would feel about the Colts drafting Luck...Payton denies that he took a physical, and is confident he would pass one (fwiw), and also says he and Polian never spoke about drafting Luck, or any other QB for that matter. I am not clear as to whether Polian was leaing toward keeping, or letting Manning go.  I suppose, at 2-14, with the first pick in the draft, it would be as good a time as there would be, to make a change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABills08 Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 I hear both sides of the Doug Whaley argument, but we're talking about the opportunity for him to be GM next season, on a franchise that is well positioned for a new GM to take over and make his mark. This is the real world, if he has the choice between waiting until Nix retires or becoming a GM immediately (and taking the salary that comes with it), why would he hold off? Â It also leads me to ask----Why the hell did the Bills not just appoint him GM outright? Why give the reigns to Nix? Its not like Nix had prior GM experience either. But whatever. I need to stop trying to understand why the Bills do certain things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1B4IDie Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 I hear both sides of the Doug Whaley argument, but we're talking about the opportunity for him to be GM next season, on a franchise that is well positioned for a new GM to take over and make his mark. This is the real world, if he has the choice between waiting until Nix retires or becoming a GM immediately (and taking the salary that comes with it), why would he hold off? Â It also leads me to ask----Why the hell did the Bills not just appoint him GM outright? Why give the reigns to Nix? Its not like Nix had prior GM experience either. But whatever. I need to stop trying to understand why the Bills do certain things. Â It's real simple to imagine "the plan". This plan can be imagined and vaguely makes sense it could also be just complete fallacy. Â The story put together by Bills' fans is something like this: Â Wilson knows Nix from way back. Wilson knew his house was a mess and he had no football people in it anymore. He went and got a football person he trusts, and asked him to find a guy that is a football guy that can take over as GM. Â Nix recruited Whaley, again, a bit of coup as Whaley was looked at in the small circle of NFL executives as an up and comer. Nix is re-orging the mess in the executive suite at One Bills Drive as close to what the other 31 teams have in place as he can. Then will step down to the heir apparent. Â Wilson needed help connecting the dots from football people in 1990 to football people in 2011 and Nix was the man for the job. Â Again I think that narrative that is pretty easy to piece together but who knows if its true. I for one can see some merit to the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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